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LoZoccolo

(29,393 posts)
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 02:54 PM Jan 2012

Dennis Kucinich said all these nice things about Ron Paul.



People are like "oh, why do you keep attacking Dennis Kucinich, you're supposed to be for the Democrats and he's a Democrat"; this is true but he engages in things which hurt Democrats in general, or lower his credibility when he criticizes other Democrats, like deliver ultimatums such as the one on the health care bill, or enter the Democratic primary and debates knowing that he's not going to win, while criticizing the other candidates for not doing the things he's not going to have to deliver because he's not going to win.

This thing about Ron Paul is one more of those things where it is hard to take him seriously; he later criticized the president for not putting enough in the health care bill after he himself talked about putting a libertarian in the VP slot.
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Dennis Kucinich said all these nice things about Ron Paul. (Original Post) LoZoccolo Jan 2012 OP
Old vid. From Dec 15, 2007. tawadi Jan 2012 #1
Ron Paul hasn't changed surfdog Jan 2012 #2
If anything, Paul has whitewashed himself even more lately. TheWraith Jan 2012 #32
Doesn't matter Gman Jan 2012 #6
LOL- they're friends! right on maude... Jan 2012 #50
Really? He's not talking about friendship he's talking about putting him on the ticket as grantcart Jan 2012 #58
What does it tell you, though? right on maude... Jan 2012 #88
'is more liberal than even he lets on' is dellusional beyond belief. grantcart Jan 2012 #91
What's the problem? earthside Jan 2012 #3
You're right, he a Smiling Racist Homophobe. Ikonoklast Jan 2012 #5
Hah! Good one, Ikonoklast! BlueCaliDem Jan 2012 #41
Ron Paul is wrong about absolutely everything.. Fumesucker Jan 2012 #4
Because we all know compromise and crossing the aisle are verbotten nadinbrzezinski Jan 2012 #7
"Compromise" and "Crossing the aisle" are only "verbotten" when it's Pres. Obama. Tarheel_Dem Jan 2012 #9
Thanks for making my point as to where the DLC stands nadinbrzezinski Jan 2012 #10
Not sure where the DLC stands, but moderates have an aversion to zealotry. Tarheel_Dem Jan 2012 #27
Moderates these days read as center right, nadinbrzezinski Jan 2012 #30
"Moderates" these days, is where the actual work gets done, not on the extremes. Tarheel_Dem Jan 2012 #31
Of course as we can see in DC how well this is working. nadinbrzezinski Jan 2012 #38
Well said Aerows Jan 2012 #42
Please point out to me where I stated that "dysfunctional government working" or.... Tarheel_Dem Jan 2012 #46
And I am telling you the "moderates" are center right, to right nadinbrzezinski Jan 2012 #49
* ronnie624 Jan 2012 #79
You're not going to convince a mind that's already made up, TD. BlueCaliDem Jan 2012 #53
Tell me exactly where I have supported Paul nadinbrzezinski Jan 2012 #60
Likewise, where do I claim I'm against compromise? I support Obama for chrissakes! BlueCaliDem Jan 2012 #61
You may want to read what I wrote about the negotiating skills nadinbrzezinski Jan 2012 #62
Your post is awesome. And this gets right to the nub of the issue....... Tarheel_Dem Jan 2012 #63
So you are accusing people of racism nadinbrzezinski Jan 2012 #67
Hey, accusations of some sort of "ism" or "phobia" are flung around this place on a daily basis. Tarheel_Dem Jan 2012 #69
No that is your opinion nadinbrzezinski Jan 2012 #72
You were "done" before you ever got started. But, don't go away mad! Tarheel_Dem Jan 2012 #73
I would say that there's at least some white priviledge involved. LoZoccolo Jan 2012 #71
So tell me, what is my income? nadinbrzezinski Jan 2012 #74
It is funny actually. Rex Jan 2012 #84
Exactly. They don't seem to mind hurting the very people they "claim" to be fighting for. Tarheel_Dem Jan 2012 #75
Except in surrogates such as McClurkin, or in their language on 'Sanctity' and all of Bluenorthwest Jan 2012 #40
Way better than the Nader ultimatum did. LoZoccolo Jan 2012 #11
Truly I do not want any of what you are smoking nadinbrzezinski Jan 2012 #14
You're complaining about lack of compromise in DC? TheWraith Jan 2012 #33
Compromise and consensus are essential nadinbrzezinski Jan 2012 #34
Precisely Aerows Jan 2012 #44
Correction, he's a real democrat beardown Jan 2012 #8
? Tarheel_Dem Jan 2012 #26
The New-Democrats are looking forward to a one big party system. rhett o rick Jan 2012 #12
There are moderate RepubliCONS? BlueCaliDem Jan 2012 #54
Of course you are looking at politicians. The moderate politicans are hiding, not wanting rhett o rick Jan 2012 #59
Why are you attacking a Democrat on a Democratic board? Warren Stupidity Jan 2012 #13
This message was self-deleted by its author LoZoccolo Jan 2012 #15
Make up your mind. Warren Stupidity Jan 2012 #18
Really? He has his own rules? Rex Jan 2012 #86
Are you familiar at all with the op's many utterances here? Warren Stupidity Jan 2012 #87
Animal Farm comes to mind nadinbrzezinski Jan 2012 #16
If that were against the rules, the Obama haters would have been gone long ago Major Nikon Jan 2012 #25
+1000. Tarheel_Dem Jan 2012 #28
It is against the op's rules. Warren Stupidity Jan 2012 #29
This message was self-deleted by its author LoZoccolo Jan 2012 #37
How does it make you feel knowing that I have a copy of your rulez? Warren Stupidity Jan 2012 #39
Ted Kennedy said nice things about Ron Paul as well. PA Democrat Jan 2012 #17
Did he say that he should be the vice president and then maybe the president? LoZoccolo Jan 2012 #20
Ever hear the phrase "tilting at windmills?" PA Democrat Jan 2012 #24
Checkmate. Good one, LoZoccolo. eom BlueCaliDem Jan 2012 #55
LOL. You defeated that windmill, I mean giant. PA Democrat Jan 2012 #56
So did the head of his local NAACP. So did Cynthia McKinney. So did the ACLU. Puregonzo1188 Jan 2012 #19
Cynthia McKinney? LoZoccolo Jan 2012 #23
You I included her in that list just to see you if you would pounce on her and ignore all the others Puregonzo1188 Jan 2012 #36
I'm certain Kucinich's opinion on this has evolved. Like his abortion stance. Robb Jan 2012 #21
Some people do. Union Scribe Jan 2012 #52
If it helps his reelection chances, expect "evolution" REP Jan 2012 #82
I think Bush** wore nice suits. ClassWarrior Jan 2012 #22
I might be mistaken surfdog Jan 2012 #35
I could understand Kucinich appointing Ron Paul as Secretary of State Boojatta Jan 2012 #43
Ron Paul and the President are opposed to marriage equality. They both speak of Bluenorthwest Jan 2012 #45
I might comment on this thread... Eliminator Jan 2012 #47
This was the event that pushed me from sorta being annoyed by DK to... PeaceNikki Jan 2012 #48
If DK is speaking the truth BlueCaliDem Jan 2012 #57
So lemme get this straight: right on maude... Jan 2012 #51
And Obama said all these nice things about Reagan MadHound Jan 2012 #64
Probably because he said that Ron Paul should be the vice president. LoZoccolo Jan 2012 #65
No, actually Kucinich said that he would consider Paul for VP MadHound Jan 2012 #66
That sounds better. n/t LoZoccolo Jan 2012 #70
Paul is for a number of things I believe in G_j Jan 2012 #68
Well this is a first nadinbrzezinski Jan 2012 #76
My opponents are very aggressive. LoZoccolo Jan 2012 #77
Agressive, in this place? nadinbrzezinski Jan 2012 #81
Heck, that's nothin'! Obama appointed POS Bush War Criminal and PNAC author Philip Zelikow Zorra Jan 2012 #78
it just goes to show that even someone who is right on almost every issue can still be wrong on Douglas Carpenter Jan 2012 #80
Knock yourself out, Loco. bvar22 Jan 2012 #83
Some people blame congress for perceived shortcomings of the president whatchamacallit Jan 2012 #90
President Obama says "nice things" about Reagan and Republicans and "their good ideas" all the time. bvar22 Jan 2012 #85
They may have different opinions loyalsister Jan 2012 #89
"People are like "oh, why do you keep attacking (him), you're supposed to be for the Democrat..." Marr Jan 2012 #92
I believe you have your ultimatums backwards. mmonk Jan 2012 #93
 

surfdog

(624 posts)
2. Ron Paul hasn't changed
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 03:07 PM
Jan 2012

So we can assume Dennis Kucinich's views haven't changed

Never did like Dennis that much, seems his ego got in the wAy all the time

TheWraith

(24,331 posts)
32. If anything, Paul has whitewashed himself even more lately.
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 04:50 PM
Jan 2012

He was a lot less subtle in the past about his insanity.

Gman

(24,780 posts)
6. Doesn't matter
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 03:18 PM
Jan 2012

It could be 1987. He hasn't changed one bit. Paul's views have been well known for many years.

 
50. LOL- they're friends!
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 05:35 PM
Jan 2012

I mean, deal with it. This bizarre campaign to make Ron Paul the most evil man in America is an epic fail and this is one huge reason why. There is no way Kucinich would have anything to do with Ronnie if he were as horrific as youse people claim he is. Give it a rest.

grantcart

(53,061 posts)
58. Really? He's not talking about friendship he's talking about putting him on the ticket as
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 06:15 PM
Jan 2012

Vice President.

Bizzare is a charitable way to explain that friendship.

 
88. What does it tell you, though?
Sun Jan 8, 2012, 02:52 PM
Jan 2012

Does it suggest that perhaps Paul is more liberal (gasp!) than even he lets on? The point is that Kucinch knows how this man thinks. Kucinich isn't a racist, isn't a warmonger and seems to be comfortable calling Paul a friend.

grantcart

(53,061 posts)
91. 'is more liberal than even he lets on' is dellusional beyond belief.
Mon Jan 9, 2012, 01:15 AM
Jan 2012

I respect Paulf for one thing; he is absolutely honest about exactly how far out he is. He would radically restructure the government starting with the Fed, and then stripping anything out of the government that isn't in the original 18th century version, including NASA, CDC, etc. He has said that in the first year alone he is going to take out one Trillion dollars;


9:29 p.m. | Updated LAS VEGAS — Representative Ron Paul on Monday unveiled an aggressive budget plan that would greatly shrink the federal government that he is seeking to run, eliminating the agency that oversees airport security, the Departments of Energy and Education and three others, while cutting all war financing.

Providing a stark vision of what a libertarian takeover of the White House would look like, the plan would slash the federal budget by $1 trillion in a single year and, Mr. Paul said, bring the budget into balance within three.

The federal work force would be cut by 10 percent across the board. Aid to foreign nations would stop flowing altogether. And, reflecting the way Mr. Paul would shrink the very job he seeks, the president’s annual salary would be reduced to $39,336 from $400,000.



What it tells us is that Kucinich is the flakey one and it is no accident that Kucinich is soon to be an ex member of congress because he doesn't have a very good grasp of the realities of the politics.

earthside

(6,960 posts)
3. What's the problem?
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 03:12 PM
Jan 2012

I find nothing wrong with what Kucinich says here.

It is true ... Ron Paul and Walter Jones have been two House Republicans who have indeed gone across the aisle to work with progressives on anti-Iraq-War issues. Despite all of Paul's problems, he does show what we need more of from House and Senate Repuglicans: a willingness to not be so rabidly partisan that they cannot find common ground at least on specific issues.

For all of Ron Paul's ideological faults, in my opinion, he has struck me as a civil and congenial member of Congress; in other words a better man that Eric Cantor any day of the week.

Fumesucker

(45,851 posts)
4. Ron Paul is wrong about absolutely everything..
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 03:13 PM
Jan 2012

Which is why we need more wars and we need to double down on the drug war and actually win the damn thing.

ETA: Perhaps we should be more like Singapore, execute anyone failing a drug test and we could be done with the drug war PDQ.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
7. Because we all know compromise and crossing the aisle are verbotten
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 03:20 PM
Jan 2012

How's that working for the country lozo?

Tarheel_Dem

(31,443 posts)
9. "Compromise" and "Crossing the aisle" are only "verbotten" when it's Pres. Obama.
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 03:27 PM
Jan 2012

It's only "caving", when it's Obama. It's only "Compromiser In Chief", when it's Obama. I think the o.p.'s point is that Kucinich gets a pass.

Some on the left have gone so far ideologically that they've blurred the lines between liberalism and libertarianism, and it ain't pretty.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
38. Of course as we can see in DC how well this is working.
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 05:03 PM
Jan 2012

Right?????

If you call a completely dysfunctional government working, you are welcomed to it. If you consider right wing policies mainstream when polling tells us otherwise, you are welcomed to that too.

There is a reason why people vote in such low numbers by any advanced economy standard. But it works for you, so have at it.

 

Aerows

(39,961 posts)
42. Well said
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 05:14 PM
Jan 2012

It's working REALLY well in DC.

It's helping push the agenda as far to the right as they can get away with while profiting handsomely. The ONLY way a person would want to push the agenda further right is because of profit, because most of what they stand for is so detrimental to society, liberty and humanity.

Tarheel_Dem

(31,443 posts)
46. Please point out to me where I stated that "dysfunctional government working" or....
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 05:23 PM
Jan 2012

Last edited Sat Jan 7, 2012, 11:26 PM - Edit history (1)

"right wing policies mainstream". I spoke out in favor of "reaching across the aisle", you didn't seem to think it was a bad thing when it was Kucinich. I was just pointing out the hypocrisy of some Kooch's most ardent supporters.

Kooch "reaching across the aisle" = Good

Obama, doing the same = Bad

We've seen where extremism has gotten us; total & complete gridlock. I'm surprised our current Congress can name a fucking post office. So, no you won't hear me jumping down anyone's throat for "reaching across the aisle" in furtherance of legislation that actually helps. But the president's critics can't have it both ways. Most in Washington are scared shitless that if they are seen working together, some blogger, opinion journalist, or radio shock jock will scream "Unclean", and the headlines go out that they "CAVED". The dysfunction has more to do with the so-called professionals who opine on politics, rather than actual legislation.

"Bring Back Moderation, and Screw The Overpaid Pundits" should be a bumpersticker.

:edited for typo

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
49. And I am telling you the "moderates" are center right, to right
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 05:33 PM
Jan 2012

They are no moderates. This is why we have no compromise.

I have no issues with it but when the negotiating position starts fairly close to the "left" of the Republican party and not where the country is...that's what annoys people.

This is not compromise, and in fact has encouraged worst behaviors from republicans and is a leading cause to the current dysfunction. The other leading cause is the hard core republican know nothing hard headeness. Who is ahead on this really does not matter... They are both responsible.

Sorry if I do not see this as sports and cannot reach for pom poms.

Now in the very recent past, now that far right aides have left, and real pressure from the streets is coming, we are seeing them pull left...question is if our center right so-called moderates will follow? Regardless, it is too late for compromise this session...hopefully next congress will get that lesson, and the POTUS gets a class on negotiating 101.

If not...well, let the dysfunction continue...it's not unusual in failing empires anyway. It's just regular folk who get to suffer. And on this department the problem is when both parties are coopted by business interests. But the R's still get the lions share. But both share in the dysfunction.

Look I despise Ron with the rest of them, but compromise should be encouraged...why a few of us take issue with the daily attack on dems by the op, and in this case for something that is essential. Boggles the mind.

BlueCaliDem

(15,438 posts)
53. You're not going to convince a mind that's already made up, TD.
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 05:44 PM
Jan 2012

They're blind when it comes to the fact Ron Paul is THE most conservative Republican since 1937, based on his voting record - more to the right than even Dick Cheney and Dubya Bush, and that's scary.

They're blind that he not only signed the Aghanistan AUMF, he also drafted and presented the 2001 Marque and Reprisal Act that gave Bush UNprecedented war powers to assassinate all those dark skinned Muslims, but they say he's had a change of heart and mind and he's anti-war. They're blind to the fact that he's a John Birch Society fanatic and that he continues to side with the Republicans on all the votes that matter, but he's more liberal than Obama. They're blind to his racist newsletters, and believe him on his word he didn't write them (right), and are appalled if you call him a racist and homophobe.

But on the other hand . . .

Obama is dragged over the coals for a helluva lot less by not making ACA progressive enough. That he's signed the NDAA into law - that does NOT expand powers since that already happened under the AUMF and Paul's Marque and Reprisal act, and I've come to believe, just like that black community and what's being discussed by the Nation, that the white progressives are all anti-Obama not for his policies (being that he's been the most progressive Democratic President since LBJ) but because of his skin color. And each day I see how they excoriate the president while turning a blind eye to Ron Pauls overt racism, anti-womanism, anti-Americanism, pro-States Rights, and pro-Big Businessism, and it only solidifies that ugly picture.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
60. Tell me exactly where I have supported Paul
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 06:40 PM
Jan 2012

I think I will wait until the cows come home.

So to make it clear to you...Paul is building a proto fascist movement...is that supporting him?

Otoh these attacks on dems, or on compromise, our daily five minutes of hate, do boggle the mind. And as to compromise even the lion of the Senate had nice things to say about Paul...I stand with Ted Kennedy and Denis Kucinich in that. After all, we know compromise is bad... Just ask Mitch, and John and Eric. They will agree with you.

BlueCaliDem

(15,438 posts)
61. Likewise, where do I claim I'm against compromise? I support Obama for chrissakes!
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 11:16 PM
Jan 2012

And whenever he has to compromise to get anything through, I read endless headlines and threads that "he's caved again!", or "he's a closeted RepubliCON", or "Capitulator in Chief", or other crap like that.

Your comparison between what Ted Kennedy and DK has said has already been negated by LZ because it's already been pointed out Ted never rose (or fell) to that level in his praise for Paul. DK has gone so far as to want Paul as his VP running mate while *knowing* first hand about Paul's status as the most conservative RepubliCON U.S. Representative since 1937 - even MORE conservative than Bush or Cheney ( http://www.voteview.com/is_john_kerry_a_liberal.htm ).

But thank you for clearing up for me you understand where Paul is trying to take this country.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
62. You may want to read what I wrote about the negotiating skills
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 11:21 PM
Jan 2012

in DC. To be honest, it is not Obama... it is systemic.

But when you start a negotiation close to what the other side wants, that is bad negotiating practice. Any B average business student, at a State College no less, knows that.

So tell me, why did they not start negotiating on Health Care from where MOST AMERICANS want it to be? And that is one of many examples. Don't give me the it is not politically feasible... it is something that FDR and LBJ would have done... even Clinton... it is negotiating 101.

And that my dear is the problem some of us have.

When he gets reelected he needs to take two weeks off and go to camp david and get a graduate seminar on negotiating techniques. I am sure a few people in the top colleges in the nation would love to teach him that.

Tarheel_Dem

(31,443 posts)
63. Your post is awesome. And this gets right to the nub of the issue.......
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 11:42 PM
Jan 2012
"that the white progressives are all anti-Obama not for his policies (being that he's been the most progressive Democratic President since LBJ) but because of his skin color. And each day I see how they excoriate the president while turning a blind eye to Ron Pauls overt racism, anti-womanism, anti-Americanism, pro-States Rights, and pro-Big Businessism, and it only solidifies that ugly picture."


Whether they'll wittingly admit it or not, some white liberals liked the idea of Obama until he actually became POTUS. I'm convinced that some of them will never forgive him for actually getting elected, and would feel much more comfortable with a white man in the Oval Office. ANY WHITE MAN. EVEN RON PAUL'S CRAZY RACIST ASS. I think all will be right in their world as soon as that happens.

Who couldn't see this coming? What has really amazed me is how this new liberal/libertarian hybrid has been able to diminish any of this president's accomplishments, while exaggerating any "perceived" shortcomings. They get to have it both ways.
 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
67. So you are accusing people of racism
Sun Jan 8, 2012, 12:18 AM
Jan 2012

AWESOME!

I love you too.

I mean this is idiotic, but fits with the OP.

I will add, this makes ignoring any criticism easy. I mean they are just a bunch of LIBERAL, UNINFORMED RACISTS.

AWESOME.

Yup some of us still vote democratic IN SPITE of your best efforts to drive people away.

Tarheel_Dem

(31,443 posts)
69. Hey, accusations of some sort of "ism" or "phobia" are flung around this place on a daily basis.
Sun Jan 8, 2012, 12:42 AM
Jan 2012

Last edited Sun Jan 8, 2012, 01:15 AM - Edit history (1)

Take a look in Help & Meta. Or better yet, think back to the primaries of '08. To my shock & horror, a lot of longtime "liberal" posters let their true colors (no pun intended) rise to the surface, and some were shown the door. So yes, Virginia, there are racists among us. Quelle Surprise!


How the hell could I "drive people away"? Oh, the drama! I'm not campaigning or canvassing at DU. DU has two camps, and neither is going to move the other. If people care enough to spend as much time as we do on sites like this, then I think our minds are pretty much made up. I'm not here to convince you of anything, and you'll certainly never convince me, so why the drama?

And ignoring even the possibility of racism is what would make you "a bunch of LIBERAL, UNIIFORMED RACISTS". Your words not mine.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
72. No that is your opinion
Sun Jan 8, 2012, 12:59 AM
Jan 2012

you see this as some sort of sport. It is not sport, and yes Presidents, even THIS PRESIDENT, can be criticized without people being racists.

Have a good day.

Oh and here...



We are done.

 

LoZoccolo

(29,393 posts)
71. I would say that there's at least some white priviledge involved.
Sun Jan 8, 2012, 12:57 AM
Jan 2012

White, upper-middle-class people in this "progressive" chattering class don't have as much at stake in the issues tackled by the Obama presidency and can thus disregard them as trivial.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
74. So tell me, what is my income?
Sun Jan 8, 2012, 01:10 AM
Jan 2012

because that is some fascinating piece of fiction you are spouting there pal.

By the way, here is more, you think OWS is happening because the rich are happy with DC? On the bright side this is not just the President, it is systemic.

I have one word for you at this point... ostrich.

Upper Middle class... now that is fascinating piece of fantasy there pal... really fascinating.

Tarheel_Dem

(31,443 posts)
75. Exactly. They don't seem to mind hurting the very people they "claim" to be fighting for.
Sun Jan 8, 2012, 01:10 AM
Jan 2012

Like you say, there's a certain "privelege" involved.

 

Bluenorthwest

(45,319 posts)
40. Except in surrogates such as McClurkin, or in their language on 'Sanctity' and all of
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 05:06 PM
Jan 2012

that zealous ardor for faith and defense of Sacraments and all. I mean, face it, the President and Ron Paul oppose marriage equality for religious reasons. Zealous moderates in agreement with Paul!

 

LoZoccolo

(29,393 posts)
11. Way better than the Nader ultimatum did.
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 04:05 PM
Jan 2012

The one that most of its proponents didn't care to repeat in 2004.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
14. Truly I do not want any of what you are smoking
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 04:11 PM
Jan 2012

If you think this lack of compromise in dc is good for the country. That is some strong drugs there buddy, and it puts you in bed with Mitch and john and Eric. I really don't think you truly mean it, but if you do, that company you keep is really strange.

TheWraith

(24,331 posts)
33. You're complaining about lack of compromise in DC?
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 04:55 PM
Jan 2012

Compromise of any kind, on anything is the entire thing the angry left is screaming at Obama about.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
34. Compromise and consensus are essential
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 04:59 PM
Jan 2012

Starting any negotiations from right of center is stupid, like conveniently never talk of single payer when there is supermajority support among the population. We are not talking of he same thing exactly. But I guess compromise and consensus does not mean the same thing to you as it does to me. But then again I don't look at politics as sport either

 

Aerows

(39,961 posts)
44. Precisely
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 05:15 PM
Jan 2012

Starting right of center only results in a hard shift to the right. If people in the true middle and the left are upset about that, it shouldn't come as a huge surprise. One whiff of being called "left" and many in Washington fall all over themselves to go to the right.

It's political cowardice.

beardown

(363 posts)
8. Correction, he's a real democrat
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 03:21 PM
Jan 2012

DLC and vote for the lessor of evils, but against your own interests democracts don't like him.

Better to attack a true democrat than admit you've been snookered once again into voting for more corporate power and a more powerful military industrial complex and a longer war on some drugs, but hey, at least you voted for a 'democrat'.

The 'democrats' hurt themselves 100 times worse than anything Kucinich has ever done by turning their backs on the progressive voters that put them into office to clean up the corporate power mess and then found they were merely kinder, gentler corporate enablers and puppets.

Tarheel_Dem

(31,443 posts)
26. ?
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 04:32 PM
Jan 2012


"Despite Republican and progressive talking points that Obama is losing his base, his approval is highest among 18-29 year olds, at 52%. He maintains the support of 80% of Democrats, 73% of liberals, 88% of African-Americans, and 60% of Hispanics."


Poll shows Washington state voters don't want Dennis Kucinich to run there

"The survey of 1,098 Washington voters taken from May 12 to 15 found that just 12 percent of voters think Kucinich should seek office there, while 39 percent think he should not. More than 50 percent of those surveyed were not familiar with him, despite his presidential campaigns."

http://www.cleveland.com/open/index.ssf/2011/05/poll_shows_washington_state_vo.html


Ohio voters not happy with Reps. Dennis Kucinich or John Boehner, poll finds

"Kucinich, who won 53 percent of the 2010 vote in his western Cuyahoga County district, has a 27 percent favorability rating statewide, and is viewed unfavorably by 40 percent of voters, the pollsters found. In 2012, Kucinich will likely face voters outside his home base because of redistricting."

http://www.cleveland.com/open/index.ssf/2011/03/ohio_voters_not_happy_with_rep.html


New congressional district map looks like the route to Kucinich's exit: Brent Larkin

"Outwitting opponents used to be a Kucinich strength -- but only if the math made sense.
And in the new 9th, the numbers just don't add up for him.

So, how is it that, in the span of just three months, the legislature dragged Kucinich from the political penthouse to the outhouse?

Kaptur will raise and spend more money than Kucinich. And her record of delivering for her district is one no Democratic incumbent in the state can come close to matching.

A ninth term now looks pretty elusive. Kucinich no longer spends enough time here. He seems more interested in saving the world than in saving Cleveland. And, frankly, I suspect that what was once a world-class political instinct has lost its edge."

http://www.cleveland.com/opinion/index.ssf/2012/01/map_shows_the_route_to_kucinic.html


The media will be much more interested in Kucinich once he's out of office than they ever were while he was in it. He'll form a PAC, and buy a bus (ala Sarah Palin & Herman Cain), and continue to make a living. Kucinich, like Ron Paul, has very limited appeal, but very devoted followers.




 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
12. The New-Democrats are looking forward to a one big party system.
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 04:08 PM
Jan 2012

The New-Democrats plus the Moderate Republicons will make up the New-Democratic Party. The Republicon Party will be a small group of wacko clowns. And the left, of course will be out in the cold again.

BlueCaliDem

(15,438 posts)
54. There are moderate RepubliCONS?
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 05:48 PM
Jan 2012

That's news to me. They're all rightwing neocons. I don't see a Nixon among them. Not one.

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
59. Of course you are looking at politicians. The moderate politicans are hiding, not wanting
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 06:26 PM
Jan 2012

to be associated with the rightwing clowns. But there are many grassroots republicans that will vote for Obama over one of the crazy clowns. Some of them even have switched parties and are now helping move the Democratic party to the right.
and there are a number of Democrats in Congress that walk, talk and vote like republicans.

Response to Warren Stupidity (Reply #13)

 

Warren Stupidity

(48,181 posts)
18. Make up your mind.
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 04:16 PM
Jan 2012

"People are like "oh, why do you keep attacking Dennis Kucinich, you're supposed to be for the Democrats and he's a Democrat"; this is true but he engages in things which hurt Democrats".

You are attacking a Democrat on a Democratic board, and according to your rules that puts you into some sort of stealth troll category. Your rules Loz. Not this boards.

Oh and since when is it wrong to run in the primaries if you can't win? What sort of idiocy is that?

Major Nikon

(36,911 posts)
25. If that were against the rules, the Obama haters would have been gone long ago
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 04:30 PM
Jan 2012

I believe the rules simply state that you can't be a wingnut and you must vote for Democrats. Attacking Kucinich for advocating someone for the executive branch that is a bigot who wants to tear down every single social safety net seems to be well within the rules.

 

Warren Stupidity

(48,181 posts)
29. It is against the op's rules.
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 04:46 PM
Jan 2012

Also the op tosses in the weird attack that it was wrong for Kucinich to run in 2008. 'plain that one.

Response to Warren Stupidity (Reply #29)

PA Democrat

(13,343 posts)
24. Ever hear the phrase "tilting at windmills?"
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 04:26 PM
Jan 2012

Poor Don Quixote wasted his life fighting imaginary giants when there were real dangers to fear.

PA Democrat

(13,343 posts)
56. LOL. You defeated that windmill, I mean giant.
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 06:00 PM
Jan 2012

Dennis Kucnich, the biggest threat to America. Any videos of Kucinich campaigning for Paul? How about something more recent than, when was that video done, 2007?

Have at it guys. I guess windmills look frightening to some people.

Puregonzo1188

(1,948 posts)
19. So did the head of his local NAACP. So did Cynthia McKinney. So did the ACLU.
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 04:18 PM
Jan 2012

All only in reference to certain issues, of course, but nice things nonetheless in those regards.


What is your point?

 

LoZoccolo

(29,393 posts)
23. Cynthia McKinney?
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 04:23 PM
Jan 2012

I might have to rethink this.



(Was it before or after she joined the Green Party?)

Puregonzo1188

(1,948 posts)
36. You I included her in that list just to see you if you would pounce on her and ignore all the others
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 05:02 PM
Jan 2012

Apparently my predictions your intellectual dishonesty were fairly apt.

 

surfdog

(624 posts)
35. I might be mistaken
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 04:59 PM
Jan 2012

But wasn't Dennis Kucinich against a nationwide amber alert system ?

Dennis is good and crazy himself

 

Boojatta

(12,231 posts)
43. I could understand Kucinich appointing Ron Paul as Secretary of State
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 05:15 PM
Jan 2012

However, if Kucinich were actually elected as President Kucinich, and President Kucinich suffered a medical emergency, then wouldn't fate be elevating Vice President Ron Paul to President Ron Paul, and why should fate be given such power when Kucinich and Ron Paul have -- as Kucinich acknowledges -- such big differences of opinion on domestic issues?

Why should fate be given the power to make such a major bait and switch trick on the voters? Does Kucinich consider himself to be a world leader who pays more attention to the rest of the world than to the USA? Maybe Kucinich should consider looking for a job at the UN if he really feels that way, and I mean that seriously, not as an insult to Kucinich or his supporters.

 

Bluenorthwest

(45,319 posts)
45. Ron Paul and the President are opposed to marriage equality. They both speak of
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 05:22 PM
Jan 2012

religion and State's Rights when they speak of their mutual opposition. Kucinich supports equal rights for all, unlike Paul, the President and the entire GOP field of potential nominees.

PeaceNikki

(27,985 posts)
48. This was the event that pushed me from sorta being annoyed by DK to...
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 05:26 PM
Jan 2012

knowing he cannot be taken seriously. I personally asked DK about this ridiculous notion of picking Paul as a running mate. He was on At Issue with Ben Merens on Wisconsin Public Radio in December of 2007.
He said

"Of course that's not gonna happen" and then said "his position on international matters, particularly with respect to avoiding war as an instrument of policy has been identical to mine and we salute him for that. Imagine that, Ron Paul, if he was the nominee of the party and if we nominated anyone other than myself, it would be Ron Paul that would stand out there as the one who wanted to get us out of Iraq and not a democratic nominee. So we made the point about Ron Paul's real singular opposition to the war inside the Republican party. but, of course if I was to pick a running mate, it would NOT be Ron Paul. It would have to be someone who is a member of the Democratic party and it would be someone who is very close to the way I look at the world."

Uh, no, Mr. Kucinich. Or at least I hope not. Paul's position on international matters is fucking terrifying.

BlueCaliDem

(15,438 posts)
57. If DK is speaking the truth
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 06:14 PM
Jan 2012

how does he explain Ron Paul not appearing to vote on a time table to withdraw from Iraq back in 7/2007?

 
51. So lemme get this straight:
Sat Jan 7, 2012, 05:39 PM
Jan 2012

When he talks about churches paying for people's operations (which made me cringe), Paul is heartless and out of touch with reality. When he wants MORE MONEY put into healthcare, he's inconsistent?

Paul accepted earmarks for his constituents and was called out on it by a conservative host (Hannity, I believe). He simply replied that while he didn't ask for those funds, he felt an obligation to accept them on behalf of those he serves. Contrast that with Rick Scott, the penis tip governor of Flori-DUH, who REFUSED funds for high-speed rail in his state!

Note: This is NOT a defense, endorsement or otherwise fan boi post for Ron Paul but just me pointing out the facts.

 

MadHound

(34,179 posts)
66. No, actually Kucinich said that he would consider Paul for VP
Sun Jan 8, 2012, 12:14 AM
Jan 2012

He also said there are a number of Democrats he would consider as well.

Please try to keep your attempted smears straight.

Meanwhile we had an admirer of Reagan running a center-right WH in office right now. Not some phantom menace strawman that you built just so you could knock it down.

G_j

(40,434 posts)
68. Paul is for a number of things I believe in
Sun Jan 8, 2012, 12:25 AM
Jan 2012

but, apparently for all the wrong reasons. He has not at all convinced me that his world view is rooted in compassion. Kucinich, however is a genuine peace maker.

 

LoZoccolo

(29,393 posts)
77. My opponents are very aggressive.
Sun Jan 8, 2012, 01:29 AM
Jan 2012

I had to make sure that they wouldn't use the thread as an in to say I was promoting Ron Paul.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
81. Agressive, in this place?
Sun Jan 8, 2012, 01:52 AM
Jan 2012

Try the streets... that is agressive.

Now those people are committed. Here... it's not really nice.

As to you supporting Ron Paul... not likely... I mean you only support one type of democrat. That is the pro-corporate agenda dem, the third way dem, the DLC dem... all the same.

Zorra

(27,670 posts)
78. Heck, that's nothin'! Obama appointed POS Bush War Criminal and PNAC author Philip Zelikow
Sun Jan 8, 2012, 01:40 AM
Jan 2012

to his Intelligence Advisory Board. Zelikow is a total fascist.

Zelikow Appointed to Obama's Intelligence Advisory Board

http://www.virginia.edu/uvatoday/newsRelease.php?id=15988

Best to let this pointless flamebait thread just sink like a stone now, don't you think, LZ?

Douglas Carpenter

(20,226 posts)
80. it just goes to show that even someone who is right on almost every issue can still be wrong on
Sun Jan 8, 2012, 01:51 AM
Jan 2012

something so important. To be fair, Mr. Kucinich actually said that he would consider Ron Paul along with a number of others as a possible running mate. Still I think it was a very silly thing to even suggest as a possibility. I'll still give him credit though for being right on almost everything else - almost all the time. Nobody is perfect - as they say.

bvar22

(39,909 posts)
83. Knock yourself out, Loco.
Sun Jan 8, 2012, 12:24 PM
Jan 2012

Not very many of us are THAT shallow, THAT constipated, and THAT logically "challenged".
To many of us, ISSUES MATTER.




Many of us have concluded that IF we want a government that is NOT owned by the 1%,
we must elect representatives who are NOT owned by the 1%.
DUH!




[font color=firebrick][center]”Unlike the other candidates, I am not funded by those corporate interests.
I owe them no loyalty, and they have no influence over me or my policies.”

---Dennis Kucinich, 2008 [/font]

[/center]


whatchamacallit

(15,558 posts)
90. Some people blame congress for perceived shortcomings of the president
Sun Jan 8, 2012, 03:28 PM
Jan 2012

They admonish "if you're not satisfied with the rate or quality of change, work to elect more liberals to congress!". Those same people trash every politician, left of center-right.

bvar22

(39,909 posts)
85. President Obama says "nice things" about Reagan and Republicans and "their good ideas" all the time.
Sun Jan 8, 2012, 01:11 PM
Jan 2012

He even worked WITH Bush-the-Lesser & The Republicans from 2004 to 2008 to help implement much of the Republican agenda,
including Telecom Immunity and the Great Bailout.

Should we be worried?



[font size=5 color=green][center]Solidarity99![/font][font size=2 color=green]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------[/center]




loyalsister

(13,390 posts)
89. They may have different opinions
Sun Jan 8, 2012, 03:17 PM
Jan 2012

But their goals are similar. They are true believers who want to shake things up. I can see how they may have a mutual respect.

 

Marr

(20,317 posts)
92. "People are like "oh, why do you keep attacking (him), you're supposed to be for the Democrat..."
Mon Jan 9, 2012, 01:23 AM
Jan 2012

Amazing how you can see that point when the subject is someone like Kucinich, but change it to Obama or some other "moderate" Democrat and you just can't wrap the old bean around it.

mmonk

(52,589 posts)
93. I believe you have your ultimatums backwards.
Mon Jan 9, 2012, 05:06 AM
Jan 2012

I decide to come back and peruse what was going on here. About time to skip out again.

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