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Wed Feb 19, 2020, 11:17 AM

Maddow said something that caught my attention.

During her show the other day she said this, The very small amount of information about Trumps taxes, financial records that have been found, reported, they showed fraud, corruption, crimes.

Common sense tells us, when we get to see all of Trumps tax returns, financial records, they will be full of fraud, corruption, crimes. If this is true, then I will want this question answered.

Who at the IRS has been protecting Trump over the decades?

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Arrow 48 replies Author Time Post
Reply Maddow said something that caught my attention. (Original post)
shockey80 Feb 2020 OP
Eyeball_Kid Feb 2020 #1
soldierant Feb 2020 #44
Hoyt Feb 2020 #2
Wounded Bear Feb 2020 #4
NewJeffCT Feb 2020 #9
Hoyt Feb 2020 #10
NewJeffCT Feb 2020 #11
Laura PourMeADrink Feb 2020 #14
BruceWane Feb 2020 #16
lagomorph777 Feb 2020 #23
monmouth4 Feb 2020 #25
lapfog_1 Feb 2020 #30
TommyCelt Feb 2020 #33
Farmer-Rick Feb 2020 #40
Hoyt Feb 2020 #41
uponit7771 Feb 2020 #46
Scotch-Irish Feb 2020 #3
Whiskeytide Feb 2020 #5
joost5 Feb 2020 #6
MartyTheGreek Feb 2020 #17
joost5 Feb 2020 #48
yaesu Feb 2020 #7
LiberalArkie Feb 2020 #8
aggiesal Feb 2020 #12
gordianot Feb 2020 #13
Laura PourMeADrink Feb 2020 #15
dalton99a Feb 2020 #18
Botany Feb 2020 #21
dalton99a Feb 2020 #22
Botany Feb 2020 #27
MartyTheGreek Feb 2020 #19
Under The Radar Feb 2020 #20
Viz Feb 2020 #28
Baked Potato Feb 2020 #24
no_hypocrisy Feb 2020 #26
calimary Feb 2020 #29
Javaman Feb 2020 #31
Maribelle Feb 2020 #32
SWBTATTReg Feb 2020 #34
Midnight Writer Feb 2020 #35
blakstoneranger Feb 2020 #36
bucolic_frolic Feb 2020 #37
Meowmee Feb 2020 #38
rickyhall Feb 2020 #39
Joinfortmill Feb 2020 #42
BigmanPigman Feb 2020 #43
kwijybo Feb 2020 #45
SylviaD Feb 2020 #47

Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 11:28 AM

1. Trump's first impulse is to throw his money around. So it's a good question.

Trump MUST be paying someone in Treasury, and he's had to have been doing so well before his campaign began. He's a financial circus and a mess that can only be hidden by corruption.

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Response to Eyeball_Kid (Reply #1)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 10:41 PM

44. Not necessarily.

The IRS has been kept so understaffed (not to mention so bullied by Republicans for so long) that it can't even do its job the way it wants to, let alone the way we want it to.

This is only one aspect of the problem:

https://www.propublica.org/article/irs-sorry-but-its-just-easier-and-cheaper-to-audit-the-poor

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Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 11:35 AM

2. I doubt tax returns show fraud. Now, if someone has access to all the data that produces

those few lines and schedules in a tax return, that likely will show fraud, or at least questionable dealings.

trump's tax returns will likely show he's not worth anywhere near what he claims. So, I suppose that is sort of fraud.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #2)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 11:37 AM

4. That's why it's not just the returns we need...

We need to see all of his financials.

ALL. OF. THEM.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #2)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 12:38 PM

9. The tax returns for Trump and the Trump organization

are likely hundreds of pages long - it's not just a few lines and schedules.

My tax return is just my wife's job and my job and a tiny part time job as a realtor and it's 30 pages long with the various schedules and investments and the HSA account, and that doesn't include supporting documentation.

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Response to NewJeffCT (Reply #9)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 12:41 PM

10. Still, there is no schedule or line-item for Fraud. A complete tax return is only a starting point,

at best. Without backup reams of financial data, it is worthless for detecting Fraud.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #10)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 12:44 PM

11. agree on that part

Money Laundering is often very hard to prove beyond a reasonable doubt as well.

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Response to NewJeffCT (Reply #9)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 12:48 PM

14. Exactly. Have said before, it's not like he's gonna have a line

Item on his schedule L that says " due to Russia - payment for election interference".

Obviously Trump's an expert at hiding. IRS didn't nail him. To get a full picture it will take a full team of expert forensic accountants plus whistleblowers from the trump side and all financial documents.

PS IRS!!! How are those yearly audits going ?

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #2)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 12:51 PM

16. Not exactly; not all by themselves.

From what I've seen, there are significant discrepancies when comparing asset valuations between Trump organization tax statements and loan applications - for example property A is stated to be worth $500K for property tax purposes, but then stated to be worth $1.5 million when being used as collateral for a loan. So either the tax declaration is false, or the loan application is false, and both actions are illegal.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #2)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 01:09 PM

23. The tax returns (when compared with loan applications) will definitely show fraud.

His net worth and income will be higher on the loan applications than on the tax returns. We already know some of that has been uncovered.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #2)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 01:14 PM

25. Bill Barr's daughter has quite the job at Treasury, I'm sure she's on it..n/t

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #2)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 01:23 PM

30. if someone compares his tax returns to his statement of income and assests on bank loan

documention (signed under penalty of perjury)...

They would show massive fraud and likely money laundering and/or tax evasion.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #2)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 01:38 PM

33. And the public know that he's not nearly as rich as he claims...

..is what this trump dreads more than ANYTHING.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #2)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 06:52 PM

40. That is such BS

Last edited Thu Feb 20, 2020, 11:34 AM - Edit history (1)

Of course his tax returns show fraud but eversince Raygun, the IRS has been directed to ignore fraud in the filthy rich. But if the poor dare to do the samething then all hell breaks lose.

My Grandfather who barely made $30,00 a year had been audited by the IRS for 5 years straight. Then my mother filed a harassment complaint...because what are they looking for on such a poor guy? They finally backed off. No joke. The IRS is used as a political bludgeon at times.

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Response to Farmer-Rick (Reply #40)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 06:59 PM

41. No, tax returns aren't likely to show fraud unless you have access to all

the transactions affecting the income and expenses reflected on the return.

If you have all that backup information, then you can tell whether they underreported income or overstated deductions. But, that would take a lot of auditing time.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #41)

Thu Feb 20, 2020, 07:35 AM

46. Yes they are I know someone who works for the IRS they do correspondence audits

... and there are ranges for incomes on tax returns that are flagged when out of range deductions or assessments are taken

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Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 11:35 AM

3. ...AND how much were they being paid or promised to keep them protected?

 

Quid pro quo seems to be trump's SOP.

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Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 11:46 AM

5. His returns don't "show" fraud. There's not ...

... a line for “amount laundered for Russian oligarchs” on the returns.

They may show over or under valuation of assets, or sketchy claims for deductions, but there won’t be any obvious fraud. He’s been audited long before he ran in 2015.

What they WILL show is that he’s a third rate businessman whose net worth is an illusion. He’s not a billionaire. He’s probably not much of a millionaire. He’s a TV personality who is probably worth about as much as Bill O’Reilly.

The returns are simply embarrassing. And they would negatively impact his image. It’s that simple.

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Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 12:22 PM

6. They'll show he was money laundering for Russian oligarchs

in Panama, in NYC, in ... How is it that so many super rich people from Russia bought so many overpriced units in Trump Panama? We need to know how far this corruption goes, and if his brood is a part of it. Ivanka "grifter barbie" definitely is the face of it.

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Response to joost5 (Reply #6)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 12:56 PM

17. Now I wonder if the Panama Papers triggered all of this...

going back to pre 2016, if I recall. Haven't seen much in the news about this as it seemed to fade away. Have you seen any news on this? Thanks!

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Response to MartyTheGreek (Reply #17)

Thu Feb 20, 2020, 12:42 PM

48. Here are a few videos that help explain the connection.

I get it. It's a fire hose of corruption with Trump so it's hard to stay focused on just one thing.









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Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 12:24 PM

7. The tax returns are fraudulent but will not show fraud unless they are compared to his financial

statements and that is the problem, getting those records.

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Response to shockey80 (Original post)


Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 12:46 PM

12. Probably some paid off IRS flunkie in the NY office. ...

I didn't know Pendejo45 could spell IRS.

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Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 12:47 PM

13. Who in New York State and or City?

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Response to gordianot (Reply #13)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 12:50 PM

15. Probably both.

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Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 12:58 PM

18. What Trump is really afraid of is people finding out he is a fake billionaire.

Many financial experts already know he is



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Response to dalton99a (Reply #18)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 01:03 PM

21. If he was a real billionaire then he wouldn't have needed to take a salary for "The Apprentice"

BTW Russian money was behind "The Apprentice" in order to sell the idea Trump was really rich and
smart to a % of dumb ass Americans.

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Response to Botany (Reply #21)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 01:09 PM

22. +1. And scam people using a fake university

and steal from his "charity"


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Response to dalton99a (Reply #22)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 01:16 PM

27. Or charge the secret service for golf carts when they are protecting him on his golf courses

n/t

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Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 12:59 PM

19. Red Don's US banking boycott began decades ago...

So how much could the IRS have? My thoughts are all off shore with all the other oligarchs.

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Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 12:59 PM

20. Bank documents show Oligarchs guaranteeing Trump Loans.

That was Reported by Laurence O’Donnell then retracted due to not enough confirming sources.
[link:https://www.nytimes.com/2019/08/28/business/media/lawrence-odonnell-trump-claims.html|

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Response to Under The Radar (Reply #20)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 01:18 PM

28. Loan Documents

are where the proof lies> who or which entity undersigned his loans.

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Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 01:10 PM

24. They are protecting *everyone*... if Trump falls, they ALL do.

Trump will narc them all out.

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Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 01:15 PM

26. IF Trump's returns showed fraud and corruption ,

it would be indirectly and there'd be extrapolation/connect the dots action from the information garnered.

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Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 01:20 PM

29. A VERY worthy and relevant question.

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Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 01:35 PM

31. there was a great article in the times about daddio trump and how he had certain people at the IRS

that would "look the other way".

they are all corrupt.

I'll see if I can find the article, it was great.

On edit:

here it is...

Trump Engaged in Suspect Tax Schemes
as He Reaped Riches From His Father

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/10/02/us/politics/donald-trump-tax-schemes-fred-trump.html

doesn't appear to be behind a pay wall.

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Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 01:35 PM

32. I doubt the IRS protects Trump. Trump loves litigation to wiggle around serious financial charges

There was a book last year "Plaintiff in Chief: A Portrait of Donald Trump in 3,500 Lawsuits". In it the author writes of Trumps addiction to law suits both for him and against him.

Litigation can take one to two years. Then he will always appeal, taking up another two or more years. On and On. Then he might settle out of court after years of litigation.


https://www.newsweek.com/trump-sue-didnt-pay-lawyers-author-new-claims-1460828


So, on top of his numerous court cases, he is the biggest liar and cheat that ever held the office of president.

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Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 02:36 PM

34. Good question! I always wondered this, and how he's been able to get away w/ the fraud...

he's been pulling over everyone's eyes. I noticed too, that there was a DU post stating that he's took almost two million dollars out of his campaign coffers to his personal accounts, a clear violation. Why isn't he being allowed off the hook for this too?

One thing I want to do when we throw this bum out of office, is to severely enhance the enforcement provisions of the laws against interference in elections, or dirty money, or money laundering, or buying votes, interfering clearly with voters' registrations thus causing fewer voters to vote, the whole mess of things republicans are known to do in order to try and retain their feeble hold on government. I also want to reduce the amount of money thrown into elections ($billions and $billions). I don't think that this is what our founders intended...I think that they knew of wealth and its sometimes negative impact on government, which is why they put emoluments within the Constitution and/or amendment(s?).

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Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 02:47 PM

35. Hopefully, the IRS is protecting everyone's tax return. It is our legal system that let's him hide.

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Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 05:21 PM

36. PROTECTION

These are the kinds of questions that should be brought up in the media. Trump is being protect by quite a few sources including the mass media (all of them not just foxnews). What's done in the dark will come to light. In trump's case that day will be after he's dead, but his family, his children, his grandchildren....will have to suffer the consequences of their incompetent, IMPEACHED patriarch.

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Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 05:32 PM

37. That is the crux of a universal question

Extremely wealthy people have a lot of contacts that look out for them, all the more so when corruption and financial irregularities are involved. So what I'm suspecting now that you mention it is that this is a question not only applicable to the IRS. He's had a lot of people looking the other way for various reasons, some not very related to him in particular, such as "it's good for the economy!"

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Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 05:47 PM

38. Yep

I have been asking that question for a long time, who is being paid off to keep him out of jail
all these years.

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Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 06:10 PM

39. Maybe see how big was the Russian bribe.

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Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 07:54 PM

42. Exactly

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Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Wed Feb 19, 2020, 08:46 PM

43. Fraud, corruption, etc are no longer crimes that must be punished...

Now they are something that a really successful person must do to improve his life which is an all-American value. At least that is what the fucking moron, Barf and Moscow Mitch are trying to brainwash the public with. All of these pardons and the fall of the DOJ is part of this cabal's "banana republic" plan all along.

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Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Thu Feb 20, 2020, 05:46 AM

45. William Barr's daughter

Got a job there the same day Daddy did.

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Response to shockey80 (Original post)

Thu Feb 20, 2020, 09:50 AM

47. We need a brave IRS employee to leak the returns!!! nt

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