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Mon Nov 11, 2019, 12:45 PM

"Cheating to save himself from a 2020 election defeat" vs. "personal political gain."

We should pound the idea that Trump abused his office for "cheating out of fear" in order to "save himself" in the Ukraine case. That framing puts Trump in the proper light. It paints him as a cornered, fearful man. More importantly, it emphasizes motive.

Our side really is bad at this rhetoric stuff. In this case (as in many, many cases) we seem to be somewhat lamely trying to trigger "process or legal norms." We are "tattling to Mommy." We think that we can cleverly imply Trump committed a campaign finance crime because he sought "political gain" (a thing of value) from a foreign country. The legal process will be triggered. End of story.

Nope. That just won't work. It will backfire. The legal process will sustain damage, not Trump and his Republican servants.

To support our legal processes and norms, we need to appeal to the reasons the norms exist, not to the norms themselves. Appealing to the norms themselves invites them to be questioned and called "fake" in simpleminded, lazy tribal appeals. The campaign finance laws are there to prevent corruption and cheating. We need to point out Trump was corruptly trying to cheat. That will sell both campaign finance laws and the accusation of abuse of power.

Also, universal human values produce extremely low regard and disgust for cowardly, cheating behavior to avoid humiliating defeat. We are less inclined to judge how people obtain "personal gain." Trump wasn't "being selfish," in other words. He wasn't being "greedy to obtain personal gain." A whole lot of people will look the other way if those are the accusations. Trump needs to be seen as the bully kid on the playground who was seeing a punch in the nose in his future and was scared.

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Reply "Cheating to save himself from a 2020 election defeat" vs. "personal political gain." (Original post)
gulliver Nov 11 OP
saidsimplesimon Nov 11 #1
gulliver Nov 11 #2
Thomas Hurt Nov 11 #3
gulliver Nov 11 #4
Thomas Hurt Nov 11 #5

Response to gulliver (Original post)

Mon Nov 11, 2019, 12:52 PM

1. guilliver,

His appeal, so I'm told, is that he is "one of US". He represents a "winner".

Let's change that image to expose him as a loser in 2020. imo

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Response to saidsimplesimon (Reply #1)

Mon Nov 11, 2019, 12:53 PM

2. I agree

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Response to gulliver (Original post)

Mon Nov 11, 2019, 12:56 PM

3. This was all about him and massive ego.

Trump's election was besmirched with the Russian help. The narcissist didn't win it and so he has rehab his rep.

He also really doesn't want to lose in 2020. The presidency gives this freak a way to feed narcissism and he wants to be America's Putin.

Personally I don't think this freak will give up the office. It doesn't if wins or not. Even if he gets a second term he will not leave at the end of it.

People tend make those claims when the other party holds the WH but this nutjob I am afraid means to stay till he drops dead.

I use words like nutjob or freak, but this guy is mentally bent and utterly amoral. He wants to be a dictator.

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Response to Thomas Hurt (Reply #3)

Mon Nov 11, 2019, 01:08 PM

4. The Republicans also have a heavy ego investment they are desperate to save.

We should be asking them when they will finally admit they were wrong about Trump...to be big and admit they were wrong. They can cover their egos by saying he just went too far.

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Response to gulliver (Reply #4)

Mon Nov 11, 2019, 01:15 PM

5. A Nixon Redux with the party of family values is a blow to their party and ideology.

GOP has been trying to even the score by impeaching a Dem since Nixon.

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