HomeLatest ThreadsGreatest ThreadsForums & GroupsMy SubscriptionsMy Posts
DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Main » General Discussion (Forum) » The difference between br...

Thu Nov 7, 2019, 10:58 PM

The difference between bribery and extortion:



"the most important difference is between a threat to do harm in extortion and an offer to do good in bribery."


https://criminal.laws.com/bribery/bribery-versus-extortion

7 replies, 477 views

Reply to this thread

Back to top Alert abuse

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 7 replies Author Time Post
Reply The difference between bribery and extortion: (Original post)
dixiegrrrrl Nov 7 OP
pat_k Nov 7 #1
dixiegrrrrl Nov 10 #5
pat_k Thursday #7
moondust Nov 8 #2
flying_wahini Nov 8 #3
dixiegrrrrl Nov 10 #6
Hermit-The-Prog Nov 8 #4

Response to dixiegrrrrl (Original post)

Thu Nov 7, 2019, 11:49 PM

1. A "lay" definition of extortion

I got curious and poked around. Apparently there is a bit of a legal debate about the difference between bribary and extortion, particularly as it applies to public officials. Specific statutes have somewhat different definitions.

As I poked around, I came across the following "lay" definition of "coercive extortion by a public official" in the THE THEORY, HISTORY, AND PRACTICE OF THE BRIBERY-EXTORTION DISTINCTION

Certainly seems to fit.

B. The Ordinary-Language Distinction Between
Bribery and Coercive Extortion
1. Refining the Lay Definitions

<snip>

In my view, coercive extortion by a public official is the seeking
or receiving of a corrupt benefit paid under an implicit or explicit
threat to give the payor worse than fair treatment or to make the
payor worse off than he is now or worse than he expects to be. The
payee is guilty of extortion; the payor is the victim of extortion.


In this case, the "corrupt benefit" to the payee (Trump) is mounting an investigation to smear a political rival. The threat is withholding aid expected under bill passed by Congress ("make the payor worse off than he is now or worse than he expects to be" )

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to pat_k (Reply #1)

Sun Nov 10, 2019, 01:07 PM

5. The word bribery is floating around now


which is important because Article 2 explicitly addresses it:

The President, Vice President and all civil Officers of the United States, shall be removed from Office on Impeachment for, and Conviction of, Treason, Bribery, or other high Crimes and Misdemeanors.

which sheds important light on the Ukraine deal now, 'cause Pence was involved, luckily, when trump sent him to personally lean on Zelensky.

Even more importantly, the definition of "civil officers of the united states" is:

all officers of the United States who hold their appointments under the national government, whether their duties are executive or judicial, in the highest or the lowest departments; of the government, with the exception of officers of the army and navy.

https://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/civil+officer

However, it is noted that
a senator of the United States, it was decided, was not a civil officer, within the meaning of this clause in the constitution.


However #2.....Federal Judges and Supreme court judges, who are appointed, do seem to be included.

Think on the possibilities of that...................

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to dixiegrrrrl (Reply #5)

Thu Nov 14, 2019, 11:13 AM

7. As the article I came across discusses...

Extortion and bribery aren't as clearly differentiated as some may think. (Link to article)

Use of bribery for this kind of "quid pro quo" isn't off base.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to dixiegrrrrl (Original post)

Fri Nov 8, 2019, 12:25 AM

2. "do what I want or else...

...you don't get the aid you need to fight the war my boss is waging on you and many more of your people will die"

sounds like a threat to do harm = extortion

It's not an offer of, say, a new car in every garage.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to dixiegrrrrl (Original post)

Fri Nov 8, 2019, 01:16 AM

3. So when they say, I'm gonna break your kneecaps if you don't do what I want (extortion)

Or I won’t break your knee caps if you do what I say . (Bribery) LOL!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to flying_wahini (Reply #3)

Sun Nov 10, 2019, 02:18 PM

6. Actually, I won't break your knee caps if you do what I say


is extortion too.....it is an implied threat.

Bribery is a win/win concept....I offer you money to do something for me....we both get a reward,
so to speak.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to dixiegrrrrl (Original post)

Fri Nov 8, 2019, 01:19 AM

4. add some complex evil to it ...

An arsonist keeps trying to burn down your house with your family in it.

Your neighbors give you a hose and turn on the water at their house.

A gangster kinks the hose and tells you he'll let the water through, if you do him a favor.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Reply to this thread