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Tue Aug 6, 2019, 10:50 PM

'I think Trump needs to show his face': Laid-off miners losing faith...

'I think Trump needs to show his face': Laid-off miners losing faith in coal promises
Chris Kenning, Louisville Courier Journal Published 11:45 p.m. ET July 31, 2019

Read here: https://www.courier-journal.com/story/news/2019/07/31/laid-off-eastern-kentucky-coal-miners-continue-block-train/1879761001/

(snips)
Protesting Kentucky coal miners sweated through a fourth day on top of a railroad track as they continued blocking a coal train from leaving a Harlan County mine.

Recently laid off, the miners are demanding weeks of back pay from their bankrupt employer as the company assets were put up for auction Thursday.
+++
But Blackjewel’s collapse left more than a quarter of Harlan County’s miners jobless. Some say they have nearly given up on President Donald Trump’s long-promised coal revival.

"I think Trump needs to show his face” in Harlan County, said miner Scott Mefford, who was among the dozens of miners on the train tracks near a sign that read, "No Pay, We Stay."
+++
Since the bankruptcy, Harlan County’s miners have struggled with overdrawn bank accounts, payments on houses and electric bills. Some said 401(k) contributions hadn’t been properly credited to their accounts for months. Many have been relying on charity, unemployment or are considering changing careers amid coal’s long decline here.

"Our husbands worked for that money," said Sherrie Bowman, who said that her electric was temporarily disconnected and that she hasn't been able to get her son for critical medical treatment in Lexington.

The bankruptcy of the nation's sixth-largest U.S. coal producer came after a string of other major coal company bankruptcies in recent years, including Blackhawk and Wyoming-based Cloud Peak Energy in May.

KY.........

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Reply 'I think Trump needs to show his face': Laid-off miners losing faith... (Original post)
KY_EnviroGuy Aug 6 OP
sakabatou Aug 6 #1
Blue_Tires Aug 7 #48
hatrack Aug 6 #2
spanone Aug 6 #3
TeamPooka Aug 7 #62
UniteFightBack Aug 6 #4
Marie Marie Aug 6 #14
Skittles Aug 6 #5
struggle4progress Aug 6 #6
KY_EnviroGuy Aug 6 #16
Brother Buzz Aug 6 #7
sprinkleeninow Aug 7 #25
Brother Buzz Aug 7 #29
sprinkleeninow Aug 7 #30
Brother Buzz Aug 7 #33
sprinkleeninow Aug 7 #36
sprinkleeninow Aug 7 #39
Brother Buzz Aug 7 #42
sprinkleeninow Aug 7 #45
smirkymonkey Aug 7 #27
Brother Buzz Aug 7 #31
smirkymonkey Aug 7 #34
Brother Buzz Aug 7 #38
Dan Aug 6 #8
Brother Buzz Aug 6 #10
nolabear Aug 6 #9
Blue_true Aug 7 #21
sprinkleeninow Aug 7 #32
Takket Aug 6 #11
msongs Aug 6 #12
Blue Owl Aug 6 #13
KPN Aug 6 #15
KY_EnviroGuy Aug 6 #19
Blue_true Aug 7 #22
KY_EnviroGuy Aug 7 #47
Blue_true Aug 7 #55
KPN Aug 7 #51
Blue_true Aug 7 #56
KPN Aug 7 #57
Blue_true Aug 7 #59
ooky Aug 6 #17
Bluesaph Aug 6 #18
sprinkleeninow Aug 7 #28
Blue_true Aug 6 #20
SoCalDem Aug 7 #23
KY_EnviroGuy Aug 7 #40
Skittles Aug 7 #43
KY_EnviroGuy Aug 7 #46
Skittles Aug 7 #54
Corgigal Aug 7 #24
durablend Aug 7 #49
Demovictory9 Aug 7 #26
JDC Aug 7 #35
Wounded Bear Aug 7 #37
durablend Aug 7 #50
pansypoo53219 Aug 7 #41
Hekate Aug 7 #44
get the red out Aug 7 #53
kentuck Aug 7 #58
Botany Aug 7 #52
Blue_true Aug 7 #60
Botany Aug 7 #63
Blue_true Aug 7 #64
Botany Aug 7 #65
maxrandb Aug 7 #61
Joe941 Aug 7 #66

Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Tue Aug 6, 2019, 10:51 PM

1. We warned them, they didn't listen

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Response to sakabatou (Reply #1)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 04:08 AM

48. +1

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Tue Aug 6, 2019, 10:53 PM

2. Yes, and I think Scarlett Johansson needs to take me out for dinner tomorrow night . . .

Not going to happen either.

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Tue Aug 6, 2019, 10:54 PM

3. conned by the con man...the cruelty of trump.

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Response to spanone (Reply #3)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 08:36 PM

62. and con men don't come back to town after fleecing the marks. nt

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Tue Aug 6, 2019, 10:55 PM

4. Oh he'll be showing his bloated orange face at a hate rally near you Kentucky. That's all you gonna

get.

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Response to UniteFightBack (Reply #4)

Tue Aug 6, 2019, 11:25 PM

14. And, he'll throw them an empty promise or two.

And some of them will believe him. Fool me once, etc. etc.

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Tue Aug 6, 2019, 10:59 PM

5. these guys STILL think Trump gives a damn about them???

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Tue Aug 6, 2019, 11:00 PM

6. Banks of Marble



... I saw the weary miner scrubbing coal dust from his back
I heard his children cryin: got no coal to heat the shack

But the banks are made of marble with a guard at every door
And the vaults are stuffed with silver that the miner sweated for ...

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Response to struggle4progress (Reply #6)

Tue Aug 6, 2019, 11:29 PM

16. Thanks! Great song and appropriate today.

Seems to mostly be credited to Pete Seeger but a commenter on the lyrics page said...

In the notes to this song on Pete Seeger’s 1959 Folkways LP ‘American Industrial Songs’ Irwin Silber wrote:

Les Rice, the composer of this song, is a New York State apple farmer and one-time president of the Ulster County chapter of the Farmers Union. His songs have made him well-known to farmers throughout the northeast. Perhaps his most well-known composition is “Banks of Marble” which achieved great popularity among union members throughout the country and even in Canada, where new verses have been found.

This song, written around 1948-49. deals with the farmer’s perennial problem of “parity” and how it affects the farmer’s life.

I like the last lines:
I've seen my brothers working
Throughout this mighty land
I've prayed we'd get together
And together make a stand

Then we might own those banks of marble
With a guard at every door
And we would share those bolts of silver
That we have sweated for

.............

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Tue Aug 6, 2019, 11:02 PM

7. Hey coal miners, how about Moscow Mitch? Have you seen him lately?


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Response to Brother Buzz (Reply #7)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 12:27 AM

25. Wherz that billboard of Muscovite Mitch and his female--

"We're doing very well! How 'bout y'all?"

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Response to sprinkleeninow (Reply #25)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 12:32 AM

29. That's Claude Taylor's Mad Dog PAC - And it's money well spent

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Response to Brother Buzz (Reply #29)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 12:37 AM

30. Those are them! 'Mad Dog PAC'. Heheh. Very good indeed. eom

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Response to sprinkleeninow (Reply #30)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 12:49 AM

33. The billboatd I posted is a grassroots outfit in Kentucky

Indivisible Kentucky. It's another outfit that is worthy of some some jingle

WHO WE ARE

Indivisible Kentucky is part of a national grassroots movement based on the Indivisible Guide. We are regular people, just like you, who live in and near Louisville, Kentucky, for whom November 8, 2016 was a rude awakening. Many of us have been more couch-potato than activist, but now we realize that we no longer have the luxury of watching from the sidelines.

We believe that protecting our values, our neighbors, and ourselves will require mounting a strong, united, indivisible resistance to the Trump agenda — a resistance that seeks to protect all our civil rights, built on the values of inclusion, tolerance, and fairness.

Donald Trump is the biggest popular vote loser in history to ever call himself President. He is attempting to use his congressional majority to reshape America in his own racist, authoritarian, and corrupt image. If progressives are going to stop this, we must stand indivisibly opposed to Trump and the members of Congress (MoCs) who would do his bidding. This includes: phone calls, in-person meetings, public appearances, town halls, media events, emails and social media campaigns. Together, we have the power to resist — and we have the power to win.

Here in Kentucky, we have a unique opportunity: Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell, the power behind the obstruction of the last eight years, is accountable to us, his constituents. He has become the most powerful politician in Washington, DC during the Trump administration.

It is our obligation to make sure that Mitch McConnell remembers that he works for us.

https://indivisibleky.org/tag/billboard/

https://indivisibleky.org/mitch-is-bad-for-ky-billboard-launches-in-eastern-ky/

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Response to Brother Buzz (Reply #33)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 01:05 AM

36. 'Brother', my brother. Those are the billboards I saw on DU. Was too spent from another crapola day

to search for that posting. Thx for the links. I will def contribute some 'cabbage'. 😉 Good on them!

'We the people...'

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Response to Brother Buzz (Reply #33)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 01:19 AM

39. Your wish was my command! Just donated and will do some more.

A calm and peace-filled night be unto you.

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Response to sprinkleeninow (Reply #39)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 03:18 AM

42. They say an occasional dose of schadenfreude is good for the soul

The entire nation will be watching this race.

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Response to Brother Buzz (Reply #42)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 03:49 AM

45. Well he surely 'stepped in it', dint he now. eom

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Response to Brother Buzz (Reply #7)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 12:28 AM

27. When will they ever learn?

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Response to smirkymonkey (Reply #27)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 12:38 AM

31. They gotta put another record in the jukebox

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Response to Brother Buzz (Reply #31)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 12:59 AM

34. I like that one!

I was thinking of another one, slightly more folk...

Joan Baez

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Response to smirkymonkey (Reply #34)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 01:10 AM

38. I was flashing on that and thinking Malvina Reynolds wrote it

Nope, Pete Seeger

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Tue Aug 6, 2019, 11:02 PM

8. What's so sad is that Hillary

Had a plan to help the miners transition to something else - but the media was so interested in a 1 minute sound bite that they didn’t have an opportunity to hear her message.

But then Trump is a man and Hillary a woman - so they believed the con man...and now there is hell to pay.

In the case of the miners, I feel more sympathy for them than I feel for the farmers that supported Trump. Their health issues, threats of dying in a mining disaster, and just life issues - are nothing to brag about.

My thoughts.

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Response to Dan (Reply #8)

Tue Aug 6, 2019, 11:06 PM

10. They'd still be in the energy business under Hillary's plan....

manufacturing the world's greatest solar panels.

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Tue Aug 6, 2019, 11:04 PM

9. The reckoning.

It’s going to be really ugly.

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Response to nolabear (Reply #9)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 12:07 AM

21. Yep.

Trump has spent $37 billion bribing farmers. Coal miners won't be as lucky, the oil and gas industry want that industry dead and oil and gas actually has money to buy republican politicians.

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Response to nolabear (Reply #9)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 12:45 AM

32. Words of truth. There will be a day of reckoning that will come to pass..

Inevitable and unavoidable.

How and why? I have no foggy. But it can't continue. 'They' deluded to believe it can.

Been on the earth a goodly amount of time only to have arrived at this mind boggling damage being perpetrated.

Jesus continues to weep.

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Tue Aug 6, 2019, 11:13 PM

11. Hillary wanted to give you all free training

So you could be at the forefront of green energy and have safer better paying jobs

But you thought that was a fairy tale and trusted drumpf instead.

Vote Dem in 2020 or expect more of the same.

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Tue Aug 6, 2019, 11:17 PM

12. buggy whip makers suffered the same fate. they saw it coming years ago nt

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Tue Aug 6, 2019, 11:17 PM

13. The only mine tRump cares about is "mine" (as in "what's his")

n/t

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Tue Aug 6, 2019, 11:25 PM

15. Trump can't fix mines closing. He may try

an artificial fix like a financial bailout of sorts for miners’ lost wages. That money will only last so long. Maybe some of his Russian buddies can bail tRump out and buy/reopen a mine or two with money they need to launder. tRump may actually be able to show his face and get away with it this time. At some point, though, his number of lives will run out — like cats.

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Response to KPN (Reply #15)

Tue Aug 6, 2019, 11:49 PM

19. I think tRump's skating on thin ice with many workers he lied to.

Not just coal miners but also power plant workers where that coal was burned.

Along with farmers, steel industry workers, automotive and appliance manufacturing workers, they're just now seeing they got flim-flammed.

And you're right - Rethugs will somehow delay the pain so they can blame Democrats.

So much winning....

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Reply #19)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 12:15 AM

22. You know.

Look at the situation of a electric power plant operator. Coal really messes up equipment, cause a lot of parts to be replaced or cleaned and cause days of down time. Natural gas does not foul equipment so plants can run much longer between repairs. Plus natural gas does not leave coal ash to be dealt with. Using natural gas saves a large plant operator tens, even hundreds of millions of dollars per quarter. Trump can't reset any of that reality, regardless of how hard he runs his con.

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Response to Blue_true (Reply #22)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 04:06 AM

47. Yes. The plants I worked in that switched to gas turbines....

have laid off dozens of workers, especially maintenance and obviously everyone in coal and ash handling. I hope these workers are finding new jobs but I think some will be relatively destitute because many were too old to start over. However, some of them had pensions coming or got a decent buy-out.

I don't think we're inventing enough new high-skilled jobs these days to take advantage of these laid-off workers with high expertise. What a waste.

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Reply #47)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 07:06 PM

55. I agree with you on high skilled jobs.

Machinists are in demand, but likely not for long with automatic lathes that use code to machine parts.

I have been one on DU that claim we have entered a epoch never seen before in human history. Some here argue that machines have always expanded employment, in this case that is not going to happen unless some people leave the earth to live elsewhere. If it remains just Earth, machines are being designed that replace both human brawn and human brains, in every industrial revolution previous to the invention of the digital computer, machines had replaced only brawn, if they did move into the brain space, they made people's brains more efficient, not replace them.

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Response to Blue_true (Reply #22)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 07:53 AM

51. Yep. Tick-tock. It's only a matter of time.

There are so many failures on his part that are becoming increasingly apparent, it’s hard to see how he can survive absent a blatantly conspicuous election theft. We pretty much know the KGOP will protect him until then however. In the meantime, how much more damage can we sustain?

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Response to KPN (Reply #51)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 07:20 PM

56. He is talking about handing out more money to farmers after China stopped buying

agricultural products. What is doing is naked self-serving, he knows that if he loses the rurals, he is done. But urban and Surburban voters that voted for him are getting screwed on the deal, with higher prices for consumer goods and high food prices (if farmers have to sell their grain at what they can get, feed prices SHOULD drop and meat prices SHOULD follow, but with Trump providing an endless backstop to his base, the economic dynamics won't play out as they should). Urban and Surburban Trump voters will vote to continue the raw deal they are getting if they vote for him on 2020.

I really think that China has found the key to dealing with Trump. Squeeze the hell out of US farmers and allow the yuan to devalue. I think by calling-in some debt China can destroy him, but the debt call-in would be a act just short of declaring war.
Add to the mix Great Britain headed toward a sure hard Brexit, then the circumstances for China turning the screws on that bastardized until he is defeated by an enraged populace are all falling into place.

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Response to Blue_true (Reply #56)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 07:25 PM

57. Sad but true. We may have to rely on China doing our

job for us.

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Response to KPN (Reply #57)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 07:44 PM

59. China seems to have decided that they and the world are better off without him.

We will see whether they are willing to go to the mat.

Trump has kicked every leg from under the fairly sound economy that President Obama left him. At some point the chickens will come home to roost and it looks like that is starting to happen to an extent. Investment by companies has stopped (so much for the tax break spurring them on). The economy is down to running on fumes.

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Tue Aug 6, 2019, 11:31 PM

17. Well, I'm sure it was great fun chanting "lock her up" with all your friends.

Now you all can starve together.

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Tue Aug 6, 2019, 11:36 PM

18. You know what?

Whomp whomp!
Thoughts and prayers!

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Response to Bluesaph (Reply #18)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 12:31 AM

28. They in my thots and covfefes. eom

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Tue Aug 6, 2019, 11:58 PM

20. Hillary had a workable plan for them.

They welcomed a con artist in, gave him a hard hat and he ran his con, faking shoveling coal. They chanted "lock her up" at his cue. They are now getting what con artists always deliver.

I don't feel sorry for the ones that went to Trump rallies and who voted for him, as I don't feel sorry for farmers that did the same. I do feel sorry for the miners among them who saw the con and voted for Hillary's doable plan, like I feel sorry for farmers that saw what Trump was and voted for Hillary.

All of us are in some type of soup now, the question will some of those that got conned allow themselves to get conned again.

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 12:17 AM

23. The ONLY solution to coal miners' problems is cheaper & easier that all the nonsense

Trumpie (and others) have tried.

There really are not that many of them, and most live in relatively cheap areas of the country..

The government just needs to PAY them what they made before +10%..pay for their kids' college (first 2 years with an option for more if they maintain good grades)..and guarantee them free healthcare. Offer assistance if they are able to or want to learn a new trade..Any money they make from part time work or a new job does not reduce their benefit, until their wages equal the benefit.

Where does the money come from? Declare coal a health hazard/toxic substance that is not needed anymore...force them to liquidate their assets and pay into the fund for workers. Lord knows they have all made a shitload of money for DECADES

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Response to SoCalDem (Reply #23)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 02:53 AM

40. Agree. We don't need to make enemies.

Most of these miners are poorly educated and it's very difficult to relocate. They are emotionally bonded to the mountains and have few skills beyond mining but they are a hard working, dedicated culture. We need to insure they have subsistence and insure there's free trade schools within easy distance to these areas. I would submit that the energy sector should pay that cost because they're making huge profits from the shift to natural gas.

There's not many industries willing to build in the mountains with little infrastructure and access to city amenities. Some that did such as call centers have closed and the jobs sent to India. Furniture making and textiles would both be a good fit but both industries have been taken away by globalization to low wage nations.

Until "American" companies return to caring about America and put people before profit, groups and cultures like these will suffer.

It's a crying shame we have public broadcast systems (TV and talk radio) and churches that have been used for decades as political weapons of war to brainwash millions of Americans with little exposure to politics and the world to think and act against their best interests. People like miners, farmers and manufacturing workers are highly vulnerable to buying into that right-wing dogma because Republicans learned how to use emotional triggers and lies to gain their attention and trust.

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Reply #40)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 03:18 AM

43. it's hard

they were fine with Trump hurting people, as long as it wasn't them

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Response to Skittles (Reply #43)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 03:52 AM

46. Racism is a very serious issue in the mountains.

In the 60s, some of the worst I've seen across the nation. Any outsiders are treated with high suspicion, but POC were seen as alien.

We still have a long way to go.

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Reply #46)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 04:55 PM

54. yes we do

ultimately I try not to let politics affect my humanity and I do hope those folk can get some kind of training so they are not tied to one industry - maybe that can happen if they will let go of the fantasy that rich con man cares about them

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 12:19 AM

24. Democrats.see above.

It might not be approval happy here at DU, but for a small amount of money and some empathy, we can show them we understand and we're on the human side of politics.

We can't fix their lives, and sure they fell for Trumps lies, but it won't be the last time people will be directly injured from this president.

It's just something to consider.

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Response to Corgigal (Reply #24)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 07:38 AM

49. Sure thing

Us: "Here's some money for you"
Them: "Uh, but that's SOCIALISM....but....we'll take it"
Us: "Um...you're welcome?"
Them: "LOCK HER UP!!!!!!"

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 12:28 AM

26. I feel bad for them

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 01:04 AM

35. Why did you sting me said the frog...

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 01:06 AM

37. Losing faith in Trump? Really?

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Response to Wounded Bear (Reply #37)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 07:38 AM

50. They're losing so much faith in him

That they'll vote for him again in 2020. Better Russian than Democrat, y'know...

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 03:09 AM

41. if the moron was smart, he would give the miner's their lost wages they deserve. fuck bankruptcy law

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 03:25 AM

44. "They say in Harlan County, there are no neutrals there. /You'll either be a union man...

...or a thug for J. H. Blair. / Which side are you on, boys? Which side are you on?"

I see some other people in this thread have alao brought up some of the old songs, like "Banks of Marble."

My heart goes out to them for swallowing Trump's lies (and I am not being sarcastic here). He will ruin them without a thought. Has ruined them. People will die before this is over.

I see one guy is talking about maybe retraining. Hells' bells, Hillary told you that. Obama told you that. But you hated the black man and you hated the woman, and you swallowed the orange man's Big Con. I am truly sorry.

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Response to Hekate (Reply #44)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 08:16 AM

53. Well put

My Papaw was a miner in eastern Kentucky and always called Harlan "bloody Harlan" because of its history. Ironic that the big realization they were warned about, that coal is going as an industry, is starting to set in there.

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Response to Hekate (Reply #44)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 07:35 PM

58. You'll never leave Harlan alive

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 08:12 AM

52. I want to say I have sympathy for them but I can't

They roared with pleasure as they chanted "lock her up," they were happy stooges in
Russian backed "Miners for Trump" operations, they have known for years that the coal
fired power plants were all being switched to natural gas because it is cheaper, cleaner,
easier on the equipment, and that it doesn't lead to acid rain, and their hatred for environ-
mentalists and change leaves me little room in my heart for them.

https://www.cnn.com/2019/08/05/us/blackjewel-miners-gilliam-foundation-donation/index.html

Watch the video of the coal worker who still is supporting Trump.

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Response to Botany (Reply #52)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 07:57 PM

60. The situation with coal and power plants mirror that for coal

and heating and cooking in homes. When natural gas became readily available in the portable tanks delivered by the gas company, home after home stopped using coal. Not using coal made sense, walls and other areas of homes did not need to be cleaned of coal soot and nothing had to be hauled to the stove or be removed from the stove's burning chamber.

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Response to Blue_true (Reply #60)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 08:37 PM

63. I just lost my Dad @ 90 last January and I showed him a little piece of coal that was on the ...

.... ground by what years ago had been a coal shoot @ a home in Columbus, OH about 10 or
15 years ago. Dad was the oldest son but too young for WW II and his house had a coal
furnace in Dayton, OH so his job was to stoke the furnace in the AM and then clean it out
in the PM and then add more coal for the night. My Dad looked at that piece of coal w/disgust
and he said that in 1945 or 46 when they switched from coal to natural gas was one of the
best things ever. He had zero romantic feelings for "the good old days."

I went to Harvard on the Hocking, aka Ohio U and I saw 1st hand that coal kills. It kills the
environment, it poisons the lakes and rivers miles away w/acid rain, it can and does kill or
cripples the miners, it scars the land, it leaves AMD (acid mine drainage) for generations,
it hardens the people who work with it and live around it, and helps to kill the supportive
capacity of the environment with green house gases.

Outside of its use in metallurgy it needs to be left in the ground.

BTW under Obama for the 1st time in 30 to 40 years the streams in S.E. OH that ran red
or blue (free acid) because of AMD they started getting clean up ... Trump scrapped that
program.

sorry to

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Response to Botany (Reply #63)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 08:53 PM

64. Even in the case of metallurgy, natural gas will soon completely surplant coal.

Natural gas can be used to heat reuseable ceramic beads that performs the function of coke. High carbon steel has pure carbon precisely delivered to the melt, reducing product variances. And like I pointed out, once a batch of metal is done, the beads can be recovered and reused.

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Response to Blue_true (Reply #64)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 09:21 PM

65. Thanx ... my knowledge is years out of date

I heard or read once that certain types of anthracite coal either because of its heat
and or chemical composition were needed in for certain types of metal production.

BTW the city I live in, Columbus, OH was at one time the # 1 buggy whip producer
in the world.

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 08:32 PM

61. I think you fucking miners

Need to STOP ELECTING FUCKSTICKS LIKE MITCH MCCONNELL!!!!

Maybe you can eat your maga hats when you're starving.

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Wed Aug 7, 2019, 10:02 PM

66. They got what they voted for.

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