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Tue Jul 9, 2019, 07:58 AM

The first Europeans weren't who you might think


BONES AND ARTIFACTS SOME 7,700 YEARS OLD FOUND AT AKTOPRAKLIK, A NEOLITHIC VILLAGE IN NORTHWESTERN TURKEY, OFFER CLUES TO THE EARLY DAYS OF AGRICULTURE. DNA EXTRACTED FROM THE SKULLS OF PEOPLE BURIED HERE HAS HELPED RESEARCHERS TRACE THE SPREAD OF EARLY FARMERS INTO EUROPE.

The idea that there were once “pure” populations of ancestral Europeans, there since the days of woolly mammoths, has inspired ideologues since well before the Nazis. It has long nourished white racism, and in recent years it has stoked fears about the impact of immigrants: fears that have threatened to rip apart the European Union and roiled politics in the United States.
Now scientists are delivering new answers to the question of who Europeans really are and where they came from. Their findings suggest that the continent has been a melting pot since the Ice Age. Europeans living today, in whatever country, are a varying mix of ancient bloodlines hailing from Africa, the Middle East, and the Russian steppe.

The evidence comes from archaeological artifacts, from the analysis of ancient teeth and bones, and from linguistics. But above all it comes from the new field of paleogenetics. During the past decade it has become possible to sequence the entire genome of humans who lived tens of millennia ago. Technical advances in just the past few years have made it cheap and efficient to do so; a well-preserved bit of skeleton can now be sequenced for around $500.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/technology/the-first-europeans-werent-who-you-might-think/ar-AAE4u1r?li=BBnb7Kz&ocid=mailsignout

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Reply The first Europeans weren't who you might think (Original post)
mfcorey1 Tuesday OP
WhiskeyGrinder Tuesday #1
scarletlib Tuesday #2
WhiskeyGrinder Tuesday #3
hlthe2b Tuesday #4
muriel_volestrangler Tuesday #9
hlthe2b Tuesday #10
WhiskeyGrinder Tuesday #12
hlthe2b Tuesday #13
WhiskeyGrinder Tuesday #14
hlthe2b Tuesday #15
WhiskeyGrinder Tuesday #16
muriel_volestrangler Tuesday #17
hlthe2b Tuesday #18
muriel_volestrangler Tuesday #19
hlthe2b Tuesday #20
DavidDvorkin Tuesday #6
lagomorph777 Tuesday #7
WhiskeyGrinder Tuesday #11
UTUSN Tuesday #5
lagomorph777 Tuesday #8

Response to mfcorey1 (Original post)

Tue Jul 9, 2019, 08:01 AM

1. Why on earth would a writer set up an article with a white supremacist thesis? Christ.

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Response to WhiskeyGrinder (Reply #1)

Tue Jul 9, 2019, 08:44 AM

2. I'm not understanding your remark.

Last edited Tue Jul 9, 2019, 08:35 PM - Edit history (1)

Are you implying that the article supports the White Supremacist theory among some groups that their original European Heritage is pure and undiluted by other groups until recently? Also many of the groups are embracing the very small amount of Neanderthal DNA they may have as representing their genetic purity. Clearly they do not understand that Neanderthals, while Human, are not Us. They are not Homo Sapiens.

I read the entire article and it in no way supports a theory of a pure European genome. Instead it supports the current theory and indeed proves it, in my opinion, that there were several migrations of humanity into Europe starting out of Africa and the European genome is a mix of several groups of Home Sapiens.

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Response to scarletlib (Reply #2)

Tue Jul 9, 2019, 09:01 AM

3. I'm saying that the first paragraph acknowledges white supremacy uncritically, taking it seriously

so as to knock it down with science. It's essentially treating white supremacy as a "both-sides" issue in an effort to not be too political. I would have sent it back to the writer for a rework.

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Response to WhiskeyGrinder (Reply #3)

Tue Jul 9, 2019, 09:15 AM

4. Because it has been a very long standing controversial alterntive theory in that discipline?

I would assume that is why it was prefaced before discussing these findings... Even science has to deal with the bigotry that infects minority or outdated views...

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Response to hlthe2b (Reply #4)

Tue Jul 9, 2019, 12:22 PM

9. I don't think it's been 'standing' much for several decades

"Now scientists are delivering new answers to the question of who Europeans really are and where they came from" isn't really true; these are the same answers that have been around for 20 years or more.

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Response to muriel_volestrangler (Reply #9)

Tue Jul 9, 2019, 12:29 PM

10. One doesn't defeat the devastating lies of anti-vaxers by ignoring their lies; so too with other

areas of Science.

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Response to hlthe2b (Reply #10)

Tue Jul 9, 2019, 12:50 PM

12. Is research meant to debunk something we already know is false, or to deepen our knowledge

of what we know is true? If I'm reading an article about an advance in vaccinations, I don't want to read about how some people reject vaccinations entirely because of unfounded fears.

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Response to WhiskeyGrinder (Reply #12)

Tue Jul 9, 2019, 12:57 PM

13. Both.. It is foolish to think this does not happen daily in all kinds of scientific disciplines.

We don't advance science if we ignore the need to educate on that which is disproven.

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Response to hlthe2b (Reply #13)

Tue Jul 9, 2019, 01:10 PM

14. Yeah, I worded that poorly.

We already know there wasn't a single "European" race. This research deepened our understanding of that knowledge. The way I see it, the article should have reflected that, rather than calling up already debunked ideas.

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Response to WhiskeyGrinder (Reply #14)

Tue Jul 9, 2019, 01:15 PM

15. Many authors probably would have. My guess is this one has been fighting the "vocal opposition"

and advocates of the "debunked" for years.

As in my example of anti-vaxers, if I were to author a paper analyzing long term vaccine safety trends, I might have written it solely emphasizing findings, had I written it prior to the now fully discredited 1997 Wakefield paper on MMR and autism. If I were to write that same paper now, though Wakefield has been soundly discredited, I'd surely incorporate and address the controversy head on.

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Response to hlthe2b (Reply #15)

Tue Jul 9, 2019, 01:55 PM

16. Fair enough.

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Response to hlthe2b (Reply #15)

Tue Jul 9, 2019, 02:14 PM

17. He's a journalist, who writes about archaelogy these days

I am an award-winning journalist with more than 15 years of experience reporting from five continents. I cover science, society, travel, history, politics, cycling and more.

I have written for a wide variety of publications, from Architect and Bicycling to National Geographic, The New York Times, Rouleur, Science and Wired. I am a contributing editor at Archaeology.

http://www.andrewcurry.com/

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Response to muriel_volestrangler (Reply #17)

Tue Jul 9, 2019, 02:34 PM

18. All the more reason to have written it addressing the controversy head-on as journalists typically

do...

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Response to hlthe2b (Reply #18)

Tue Jul 9, 2019, 02:43 PM

19. I can't find anything saying it still is a 'controversy'

Up to WW2, certainly. In more recent times, people have just looked at the evidence.

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Response to muriel_volestrangler (Reply #19)

Tue Jul 9, 2019, 03:01 PM

20. I'd like to think Nazism and white supremacy is not either. I'd be wrong...

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Response to WhiskeyGrinder (Reply #1)

Tue Jul 9, 2019, 12:07 PM

6. That was my reaction, too.

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Response to WhiskeyGrinder (Reply #1)

Tue Jul 9, 2019, 12:13 PM

7. I read it exactly the opposite; I don't get how you got there.

It's pretty obvious that of the key points of the article is to show that the white supremacist pseudo-science is BS.

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Response to lagomorph777 (Reply #7)

Tue Jul 9, 2019, 12:49 PM

11. It's like starting an article about new research into wave action by citing flat earthers.

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Response to mfcorey1 (Original post)

Tue Jul 9, 2019, 10:20 AM

5. K&R

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Response to mfcorey1 (Original post)

Tue Jul 9, 2019, 12:17 PM

8. ...and that's not even Turkey's oldest sign of civilization!

Gobekli Tepe: The World’s First Temple?
Predating Stonehenge by 6,000 years, Turkey’s stunning Gobekli Tepe upends the conventional view of the rise of civilization

Six miles from Urfa, an ancient city in southeastern Turkey, Klaus Schmidt has made one of the most startling archaeological discoveries of our time: massive carved stones about 11,000 years old, crafted and arranged by prehistoric people who had not yet developed metal tools or even pottery. The megaliths predate Stonehenge by some 6,000 years. The place is called Gobekli Tepe, and Schmidt, a German archaeologist who has been working here more than a decade, is convinced it's the site of the world's oldest temple.

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