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Sun May 12, 2019, 02:03 PM

Someone please explain to me this economic situation and our reaction to it.

Trump spokespeople on trade with China keep saying that it will mean some SHORT TERM PAIN for consumers but in the long run it will be worth it. WTF does that mean?

We are and have been since i can remember, the #1 world economy. Trump keeps saying that businesses want to move here and from all over the world financial systems want to invest here. Our corporations with all their tax breaks and farmers with all their subsidies have been making record profits and their stockholders have gained huge dividends and profits as well. ALL THIS HAS BEEN ACCOMPLISHED UNDER THE PRESENT TRADE POLICIES WITH CHINA. China holds 90% of our debt. So what is it that we are hoping to accomplish with these negotiations with China. Our trade with China has made it possible for ordinary men and women who work for stagnant wages have been able to afford a few of the so-called "luxuaries" of life and a comparatively high standard of living to the rest of the world. So what are we trying to accomplish with Trumps tariffs and trade negotiations.

How much profit is enough? How much return on investment is enough? Where is the point of diminishing returns if we are making life more economically difficult for more and more people just because they don't look like us? How long before their misery consumes us all?

Short term pain is pain only for working men and women. The wealthy have so much they won't even notice the rise in prices. They only recognize a drop in dividends and profit by 1 or 2 percent. It's not just the nature of our national life style that is changing forever, our collective soul is being totally destroyed.

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Response to sarabelle (Original post)

Sun May 12, 2019, 02:10 PM

1. And also, mostly it is not purely Chinese goods

Like in the 19th century, where people would buy imported China made by Chinese people and shipped here by them. They are American companies taking advantage of cheap Chinese labor. The labor is so cheap that it is not overwhelmed by transportation costs. China is very far away yet it is cheaper to sell us things made there.

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Response to sarabelle (Original post)

Sun May 12, 2019, 02:13 PM

2. The investor class hopes that if the TV pundits tell us often enough

that the economy is doing great & point us to the DJIA as proof, we'll forget that we're living paycheck to paycheck & each month it has to stretch a little further than the month before.

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Response to sarabelle (Original post)

Sun May 12, 2019, 02:17 PM

3. trump, GOPers, and even B Sanders believe that by imposing tariffs and otherwise thumbing our noses

at global trade with allies or foe, it will increase American jobs at home and lead us to even greater "prosperity."

And, all of this will be accomplished without negatively impacting the world and our relations with economies hurt by the America First -- screw everyone else that competes with us -- ideology.

Fact is, by imposing tariffs on Chinese and perhaps other country's goods, we increase the prices of those products to American consumers, hurt China's economy, and give American producers cover and more room to increase prices so they make more money while not necessarily producing better goods and services.

This kind of attitude is what forces us to spend more than any other country on our military, because the world is in no mood to continue to let America take more than its fair share of the world's wealth.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #3)

Sun May 12, 2019, 03:02 PM

4. And please remember: Once the tariffs are off THE PRICES WILL NOT GO DOWN!!!

The higher prices will remain forever.

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Response to sarabelle (Reply #4)

Sun May 12, 2019, 03:42 PM

7. Why is that? nt

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #3)

Sun May 12, 2019, 04:07 PM

9. Back in the day it was

Often stated that America was 5% of the world population and used 30% of world resources. May not be exact, but it was disproportionate. Dotard screeching that we are being cheated by everyone else is stupid.

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Response to treestar (Reply #9)

Sun May 12, 2019, 05:13 PM

10. I laugh every time he talks about us being cheated. Sure, American Privilege has been nice for us,

but we need to share a bit more with the world and definitely quit whining.

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Response to sarabelle (Original post)

Sun May 12, 2019, 03:23 PM

5. uniquely qualified

Trump knows about as much about economics and trade as he does about ice dancing, which is to say nothing at all. In fact, as Mr. Trump's record a a businessman comes more into focus it is harder to fathom why he was ever considered knowledgeable about ANY topic. Period.

There are however things that we could (and probably should) be negotiating with the Chinese about. Intellectual property concerns are a big one from anyone with real knowledge of history and status-quo. Cyber security is another. Balance of trade is well down on the list for most businessmen .. and economists.

Unfortunately, Mr. Trump's understanding of "negotiation" is informed at much the same level, and with roughly equal grasp as his abilities on other directions (such as campaign rallies and pussy grabbing). If ever there was an individual uniquely qualified to steer the ship of state (or world economy) onto the rocks ...

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Response to stopdiggin (Reply #5)

Sun May 12, 2019, 04:02 PM

8. His negotiation ability is less than zero.

We've seen that on display against Pelosi and Kim. And Putin just tells him what to do.

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Response to sarabelle (Original post)

Sun May 12, 2019, 03:37 PM

6. China holds HOW MUCH of our debt???

China owns approximately 5.1% of US debt, about $1.12 trillion. Japan is second at $1.04 trillion.
Far cry from your 90%. Link

China routinely violates many standards of international trade and the world has tried for years to get them to reform. No one thus far has been stupid enough to start a tariff war over it.

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Response to many a good man (Reply #6)

Sun May 12, 2019, 07:45 PM

11. China needs to be brought into line

I wonder how China would take the US mirroring their laws for use against them, I mean if their laws are fair surely they couldn't object.

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Response to sarabelle (Original post)

Mon May 13, 2019, 12:16 PM

12. No one has given an answer yet.

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Response to sarabelle (Reply #12)

Mon May 13, 2019, 01:09 PM

13. Actually it doesn't mean a damn thing.

The SHORT TERM PAIN (for a better long run) comment is bullshit. There is some underlying idea that Trump is trying to sell to economically ignorant people that his tariffs are going to reverse the trade imbalance and bring back jobs. And that's bullshit.

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