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Mon Apr 15, 2019, 03:37 PM

Just now on France24

Last edited Mon Apr 15, 2019, 04:10 PM - Edit history (1)

The commentators discussing Trump's suggestion to use planes with water tanks to drop water on Notre Dame. The commentators explained that those are used for fighting forest fires and that it is unsuitable for buildings and would cause buildings to collapse. One of them said: "They know what they are doing and don't need outside advice, thank you very much!"

The whole world knows he is an idiot.

57 replies, 7163 views

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Arrow 57 replies Author Time Post
Reply Just now on France24 (Original post)
madaboutharry Apr 15 OP
COLGATE4 Apr 15 #1
Stuart G Apr 15 #5
olegramps Apr 15 #9
leftieNanner Apr 15 #13
Collimator Apr 15 #19
COLGATE4 Apr 15 #20
Snackshack Apr 15 #24
Bernardo de La Paz Apr 15 #25
Texin Tuesday #50
jgmiller Apr 15 #32
hatrack Apr 15 #41
drray23 Tuesday #53
olegramps Tuesday #57
Siwsan Apr 15 #2
DesertRat Apr 15 #3
Voltaire2 Apr 15 #6
redstatebluegirl Tuesday #51
Stuart G Apr 15 #7
NastyRiffraff Apr 15 #18
tblue37 Tuesday #45
Hekate Apr 15 #4
zipplewrath Apr 15 #10
LuckyLib Apr 15 #26
John Fante Apr 15 #8
klook Tuesday #54
FakeNoose Apr 15 #11
RussBLib Apr 15 #12
pdsimdars Apr 15 #14
yaesu Apr 15 #15
Efilroft Sul Apr 15 #16
leftieNanner Apr 15 #17
SharonAnn Apr 15 #28
leftieNanner Apr 15 #38
ET Awful Apr 15 #21
Danascot Apr 15 #22
klook Tuesday #55
zwyziec Apr 15 #23
Kensan Apr 15 #27
Stonepounder Apr 15 #30
rzemanfl Tuesday #52
Trenzalore Apr 15 #29
Mme. Defarge Apr 15 #31
Honeycombe8 Apr 15 #33
Laura PourMeADrink Apr 15 #34
madaboutharry Apr 15 #35
Catch2.2 Tuesday #43
durablend Apr 15 #36
Laura PourMeADrink Apr 15 #37
Greywing Apr 15 #39
TruckFump Apr 15 #40
ThoughtCriminal Apr 15 #42
Catch2.2 Tuesday #44
struggle4progress Tuesday #46
lindysalsagal Tuesday #47
Rene Tuesday #48
CDerekGo Tuesday #49
lsewpershad Tuesday #56

Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 03:38 PM

1. I really didn't think it was possible for him to be

more of an international embarrassment than he already was but, once again he has proven me wrong.

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Response to COLGATE4 (Reply #1)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 03:44 PM

5. This is sarcasm...beware...response to original post...not post above...

The Idiot's Association of America....IAA...is offended by anyone including Donald Trump as a member of our Association............
...We, in the Association, have very high standards for ..."Idiots"...and Mr. Trump does not meet those standards....There is another association which Trump belongs in...."Stupid, Selfish, Idiots of America.


Please refer him to that one. We will not take him under any circumstances...@@

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Response to COLGATE4 (Reply #1)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 04:40 PM

9. I would like someone to explain to me why dropping water on the fire is wrong.

Why would it be any more destructive than water shooting from fire hoses? It was what I thought of when I saw the fire. It seemed logical to me that it could be effective. How more damaging could it be than an uncontrollable fire raging through a more than thousand years old structure. Regardless of your religious beliefs, it is a terrible loss. My condolences to the French. I wonder if it can be rebuilt and at what cost? Is it feasible?

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Response to olegramps (Reply #9)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 04:49 PM

13. I think it's the volume and weight of that much water

Coming down from a tanker. Also, the aim would be less precise. Notre Dame is in the middle of Paris. Too much danger for the surrounding areas.

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Response to olegramps (Reply #9)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 05:18 PM

19. Don't feel too bad.

I briefly considered a big water dump as an option. But then an American firefighter on ABC News explained that the weight of a large amount of water delivered in that way would damage the building even before it extinguished the flames. It's easy to forget that water has weight when you think of it simply as a liquid that can put out a fire.

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Response to olegramps (Reply #9)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 05:18 PM

20. Two principal reasons (according to those who know)

1- The weight of the water would crush the structure
2- If you miss, you'll hit pedestrians with the same weight

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Response to olegramps (Reply #9)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 05:27 PM

24. It is the weight...

...of water that would cause it to be much more damaging. Water is between 8-10 lbs per gallon depending on what system is used. 500/1000 gallons dropped (a minimum amount) would be equivalent to 4000-10000 lbs.

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Response to olegramps (Reply #9)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 05:35 PM

25. Weakened structures can't take the impact. Dropping TONS of water from a height... plus side impacts


The water is not dropped. It is released and the plane has forward velocity, so simple high school math concepts tell you that the water will have a forward momentum and some of it will hit the side(s) of the building.

To avoid forward momentum, you can do a maneuver perfected for dropping atomic bombs which launches it upwards as the plane does a half vertical loop and twist. But then the effect height of the drop is much greater because of course it would be the top of the arc of trajectory that counts.

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Response to Bernardo de La Paz (Reply #25)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 10:14 AM

50. It's not just the weight & volume of the water, it's the velocity at which it would fall.

Coupled with the force of the water being used by the hoses on the ground, the structural pressures of an old building - even one of massive stone like ND - would undergo tremendous structural strain. All anyone need do is look at a photo of the Grand Canyon and be able to appreciate what the force of water (among other things) does to things over time, let alone in one frantic dump onto an architectural historical wonder from the 12th Century.

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Response to olegramps (Reply #9)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 06:30 PM

32. Closely watch some videos of tankers dropping on forest fires

As others said it's the weight of the volume of that water but also notice that even when they are dropping for forest firest they aren't dropping right on top of the flames. Helicopters will come in and make pink point drops but for the most part tankers are used to stop the spread. They drop from a higher altitude and let the water and/order retardent disburse to create a fire line. The point isn't always to put the trees that are buring out, it's to stop it from spreading.

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Response to olegramps (Reply #9)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 09:04 PM

41. Also, where would they fill up with water?

State of the art in CA firefighting involves landing tanker planes on reservoirs or the sea, using the motion of the plane to force water into the cargo hold to be dropped onto the fire. The plane never stops moving.

There are likely reservoirs around Paris, but the sea is some distance away, and this whole premise assumes they have comparable aircraft.

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Response to olegramps (Reply #9)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 10:41 AM

53. weight of water and kinetic energy.


when you drop thousand of pounds of water from a moving airplane, the force is proportional to the kinetic energy which is

1/2 * mass *(velocity)^2 . Given that its a lot of water and the plane moves at a nonzero velocity, the resulting impact can and will topple buildings, especially if they are already weakened by fire. What they chose to do instead is let the inner wooden structure burn and save the actual masonry, the wall structure. We can rebuild the wooden structures inside, not really rebuild the whole thing if its a pile of stone.


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Response to drray23 (Reply #53)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 04:23 PM

57. I understand about dropping a ton of water, but what about simulating rain?

Seems to me that a helicopter could drop the water or some type of chemical on the fire from a altitude and with the proper dispersal system to help put out the fire totally mitigating concern for any possible damage. This is like telling me that we could not simulate rain fall which everyone is hoping for in the case of forest fires since we are addressing a small area. It would appear to me that that would greatly lower the temperature and also help protect areas that have not ignited. I searched the internet and believe that some other methods should be explored outside of the box.

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 03:40 PM

2. I briefly wondered if they could drop fire retardant chemicals. Then common sense took hold

It's one thing using something like that on a wild fire. Quite another using something that uncontrollable on a fire in the middle of a major city.

Once the ancient wood, in that structure, started to burn, I seriously doubt there was any hope of extinguishing it.

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 03:42 PM

3. He thinks he's an authority on everything

Last edited Tue Apr 16, 2019, 01:47 AM - Edit history (1)

Including fighting Cathedral fires?


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Response to DesertRat (Reply #3)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 03:55 PM

6. He's just like my rightwing brother in law

A smug asshole who is an expert on everything. There is nothing he can't or won't mansplain.

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Response to Voltaire2 (Reply #6)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 10:18 AM

51. Wow I have one of those too.

He quit mansplaining to me after one rather contentious Thanksgiving.

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Response to DesertRat (Reply #3)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 03:57 PM

7. You know, Trump is much too stupid to know that his comment is "Stupid"

Think about it...Trump, no expert on fires, tells the Paris Fire Department, that is there right now, on how to fight a fire in an historic building..

.............total embarrassment to the United States, as well as the world........
.............

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Response to DesertRat (Reply #3)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 05:16 PM

18. Donald Trump giving advice to firefighters

You can't make this shit up. He really thinks he's smarter than everybody else. In reality, he's a nincompoop.

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Response to DesertRat (Reply #3)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 12:57 AM

45. Cliff Clavin. nt

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 03:43 PM

4. I am waiting, frankly, for President Obama to say something graceful and appropriate...

As I know he will.

Trump is an international embarrassment. Or as he likes to bellow, "a disgrace!"

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Response to Hekate (Reply #4)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 04:40 PM

10. And he does


/photo/1

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Response to zipplewrath (Reply #10)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 05:53 PM

26. He does indeed. Class all the way.

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 03:59 PM

8. Trump was going to suggest using wind, blowing the fire out like a candle,

but giant fans make a lot of noise, and that causes cancer!

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Response to John Fante (Reply #8)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 10:45 AM

54. LOL (nt)

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 04:43 PM

11. Chump wears a red hat, and he thinks it makes him a fireman!

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 04:44 PM

12. you just know Trump will say that, "if they'd only used water bombs, like I said..."

"they could have saved it"

yeah, because this ass knows more than anyone about anything.

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 04:52 PM

14. But he saw planed dropping water on TV. . . . . . (didn't notice the forest thing though)

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 04:52 PM

15. First time I heard that I thought about the secondary damage it would cause & trump talked

like he was at the fire though he was just watching his propaganda channel. The guy is sickening & his disgusting behavior hurts the entire country. There isn't a lot of options when it comes to saving a historic building like this, fighting the fire in a way that doesn't do further damage may be a lost cause at this point.

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 04:53 PM

16. "Trump Cathedral was actually before the Notre Dame the tallest cathedral in downtown Paris...

"Öand then when they built the Notre Dame it became known as the second-tallest, and now itís the tallest."

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 04:53 PM

17. Trumpy has to be pissed off

That he's not the top story in the news right now. But what about meeeeeeeee!

Pushed off the front page by a stupid old building that doesn't even have gold toilets or anything.

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Response to leftieNanner (Reply #17)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 05:58 PM

28. As Alice Roosevelt Longworth said about her father, Teddy. It applies to 45 "bigly"

"My father always wanted to be the corpse at every funeral, the bride at every wedding, and the baby at every christening."

Alice Roosevelt Longworth quotes

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Response to SharonAnn (Reply #28)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 07:16 PM

38. I'd be very happy for the first part of that trio!

Very good description.

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 05:20 PM

21. Next up: Trump "If they'd rake their cathedrals they wouldn't have these problems"

n/t

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 05:20 PM

22. If only they'd raked the floors!

nt

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Response to Danascot (Reply #22)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 10:46 AM

55. Exactly!

Why they arenít taking advantage of Trumpís big brain is beyond me. Itís a disgrace.

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 05:22 PM

23. Why ignorance of science and nature is inexcusable for any politician....

Trump once again demonstrates his profound ignorance. Even a 5th grader knows that water has mass and weight, specifically 8.3 pounds per gallon. So dropping 1000 gallons of water on a building is equivalent to dropping a 4 ton bomb on a building. Stupid is as stupid does. And this man is dangerously stupid.

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 05:57 PM

27. Well, this was likely his second option...

Trump probably thought they should detonate an explosive device inside the church to create a vacuum, and starve the fire of oxygen. He probably saw a movie clip where they did that, or maybe even remembered some news footage from the first Gulf War where this was done to extinguish the fires set to the oil wells.

But quick-thinking Trump thought only of everyone's safety, and realized an explosion might...just maybe, almost possibly, so you're saying there's a chance...cause unintended consequences. His large brain, capable of processing the best ideas, decided that dropping a few tons of water from above was definitely a better course of action.

What would the world do without this amazing sage?

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Response to Kensan (Reply #27)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 06:08 PM

30. I have to disagree with you. I suspect his first option

would have been that they should have done a better job of raking it.

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Response to Kensan (Reply #27)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 10:23 AM

52. I began thinking about washing socks when I read the post above yours.

Now I will.

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 06:00 PM

29. The fact he is so ready to comment about things he knows nothing about with authority is disturbing.

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 06:18 PM

31. What? Has he changed his tune?

What about using rakes?

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 06:31 PM

33. Maybe France didn't sweep the floor of Notre Dame.

Trump pointed out that CA didn't maintain and clean the forest floor, leading to the massive forest fires recently. Maybe he'll point this out to France, as well. He's helpful that way.

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 06:33 PM

34. "The whole world knows he is an idiot" EXCEPT 40 SOMETHING PERCENT OF OUR VOTERS

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #34)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 06:35 PM

35. Lol!

You have that right!

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #34)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 12:53 AM

43. Ain't that the truth

...a very sad truth.

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 06:35 PM

36. Eagerly awaiting his plan to rebuild it...

Should be doozy...

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Response to durablend (Reply #36)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 06:37 PM

37. Maga hats for sale with the rosaries.

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 07:21 PM

39. Ranks right up there with raking leaves in the forest ...

Just such an utter complete embarrassment.

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 08:57 PM

40. And every time he opens his month,

tRump proves the world right!

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Mon Apr 15, 2019, 10:47 PM

42. I think they did consider this in the post-Katrina fires in New Orleans

Fires in the upper stories and roofs were spreading. Seem ironic in a flood, but it was a huge problem and great concern that people were trapped with no way for firefighters to reach them.

I'm not sure if they were practical in that situation either, but I recall it was discussed.

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 12:55 AM

44. I wouldn't be surprised

if Trump tries to build a hotel there.

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 12:58 AM

46. "Maybe if I talk about stuff I don't know anything about, everybody will forget Russia!"

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 01:02 AM

47. He's certainly gone out of his way to make sure the entire effing world knows he's a moron

Except, of course, our inbread gop base.

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 07:58 AM

48. They need to get tarps covering everything to protect from rain/more water damage

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 08:40 AM

49. I honestly was waiting

for dump to 'recommend' rakes at some point...

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Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 11:44 AM

56. The whole world

minus his deplorable despicable fanatics.

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