General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsSo let me get this straight:
If you've hugged, kissed and embraced thousands of people in your public life and one of them felt "uncomfortable", maybe you shouldn't run for President.
But if you've bragged about grabbing women's pussies and getting into teenage girl's dressing rooms because of your position, you should hold that office.
uponit7771
(90,335 posts)Sherman A1
(38,958 posts)Yeah, that sounds about right......
DontBooVote
(901 posts)lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)DontBooVote
(901 posts)And not just ogling teen girls...
By the way, where did the Mar-A-Lago Madame story go?
ALBliberal
(2,339 posts)unblock
(52,195 posts)in their world, men are above women in the social heirarchy, so they're generally fine with letting men get away with crap like that.
democrats have a tougher time with it because we respect women and take such accusations seriously and prefer a world in which women aren't made to feel "uncomfortable".
to me, it's more a question of proportion, what's the appropriate response to accusations or proven infractions.
so far, i think biden is handling the situation fine. far better than many people here are....
Squinch
(50,944 posts)of thing before, including the last time he ran for President, he knows better than to do it. It is, predictably, gumming up the airwaves with negative stories about a Democrat, its bringing out the asshole who like to run around with their hair in fire with the, "So let me get this straight: this means no one can ever touch anyone ever again!!!1" bullshit.
This is an unforced error on Joes part. This is unnecessary and ridiculous drama that takes time away from the Democratic message. Its childish crap and he knows better. And if you think she's the last that will cime forward, I have a bridge to sell you.
With the field we have this year, there are at least half a dozen candidates that don't come with this kind of idiotic baggage and drama. I'll pick one of them.
DFW
(54,338 posts)Unfortunately.
smirkymonkey
(63,221 posts)behaving like Trump does with women, we should just throw their accusations back in their faces and tell them to go to hell. I don't want to see anyone else get "Frankened" for some misinterpreted bullshit. Joe may be a little on the touchy-feely side, but he's not a pervert or a misogynist.
Ex-Defense secretarys wife says photo of her with Biden misleading
https://www.politico.com/story/2019/03/31/joe-biden-stephanie-carter-1246007
After the swearing-in, as Ash was giving remarks, he leaned in to tell me thank you for letting him do this and kept his hands on my shoulders as a means of offering his support, Carter wrote. But a still shot taken from a video misleadingly extracted from what was a longer moment between close friends sent out in a snarky tweet came to be the lasting image of that day.
Carter wrote that she and her husband had previously known Biden and his wife, Jill, for many years, long before he had become vice president, and revealed that she expressed her condolences to the couple about the medias coverage of the incident.
I told them I felt awful that after he had generously taken time out of his day to swear in an old friend, his attempt to support me had become a joke and even more supposed proof positive that he didnt understand how to respect women, Carter wrote. I thought it would all blow over if I didnt dignify it with a response.
Carter also wrote that while she does not know Flores, she supports her right to speak her truth, adding that Flores and all women should be believed. But her story is not mine. The Joe Biden in my picture is a close friend helping someone get through a big day, for which I will always be grateful, Carter wrote. So, as the sole owner of my story, it is high time that I reclaim it from strangers, Twitter, the pundits and the late-night hosts.
watoos
(7,142 posts)Gillibrand could come out in support of Biden, it would go a long way to make people forget about Franken, well maybe not a long way.
MicaelS
(8,747 posts)I will vote for her, if she wins the nomination, but that is all.
Trumpocalypse
(6,143 posts)if this harms Biden with womens groups and he is the nominee, he may have to pick Gillibrand for VP.
MicaelS
(8,747 posts)There are plenty of other qualified woman. KH comes to mind. She is my preferred candidate right now.
Trumpocalypse
(6,143 posts)with the metoo movement .
imanamerican63
(13,772 posts)One sick S.O.B!
PatrickforO
(14,570 posts)Of course, we wring our hands, resign and go on abject apology tours.
The Republicans just say 'fuck you' and go about their business.
And if it gets really bad, as in the Kavanaugh hearings, you'll get someone like Lindsey Graham give an impassioned speech about those poor men and how these horrible women have utterly ruined their lives. As odious as that was, it sure worked, didn't it?
0rganism
(23,938 posts)we see it every day
and it's not just the news media, it's the American electorate going along with this
there is no simple answer, not for the problem in general or this particular instance.
pdsimdars
(6,007 posts)Trumpocalypse
(6,143 posts)Democrats should have a higher one.
handmade34
(22,756 posts)this is not about Biden... this is about Flores and her comfort level
Honeycombe8
(37,648 posts)I was a bit wild in my youth. I'm sure stories would spew forth "for the good of the country, and to have a teachable moment," some of which I wouldn't remember. I don't think I could ever get elected!
BadgerMom
(2,770 posts)Collimator
(1,639 posts)People are conflating social behavior with sexual behavior. Part of the problem is that many aspects of social behavior have been dictated by gender roles and to many, gender equals sex. (That is not "sex" in terms of actions but rather identity.)
In past mainstream American culture, a man could kiss a woman on the cheek in greeting during an initial introduction under certain circumstances. Issues of age and rank would also come into play. A man kissing another man under identical circumstances would raise eyebrows and the word, "inappropriate" might indeed, be mentioned.
The very word, inappropriate, is becoming highly charged in the public discourse because of this problem. If Biden had worn Birkenstock sandals to a State dinner, that would be inappropriate. If he had worn ass-less chaps that would have been [s]hilarious[/s]-- I mean indecent.
The #Metoo Movement is critical because it addresses hidden systematic abuses of power framed within a sexual context. Like any human endeavor, it can be flawed by differing interpretations and sensibilities. We must take care to distinguish behavior that would be considered criminal and indecent were it conducted in public from behavior that is socially inept, annoyingly presumptuous or "merely" patronizing.
As mentioned before, in "Olden Times" a "gentleman" might kiss a "lady" on the cheek upon first meeting her. A kiss on the mouth would have earned him a slap to the face from the woman or more likely a stern, restraining hand to the shoulder by the damsel's male protector. He would not have been arrested (I think), but he would have been socially sanctioned from his peer group.
Times have changed, and now it seems people are clamoring from social sanctions against those who kiss a woman's cheek. I can applaud this change, because many of the ingrained attitudes that have kept women back were laying right below the surface of many of the social "niceties" of the past. As the change filters through our 21st Century, we can be patient enough to not pillory those men who were raised with mid-20th Century social standards.
Such men are not sexual predators and should not be grouped with men whose actions were clearly criminal. Weinstein groped and exposed himself to people who did not consent to any form of sexual action. These actions range from sexual assault to indecent exposure. Rose appeared nude in front of employees and colleagues who, again, offered no invitation or gave consent to unclothed condition. This is indecent exposure. Lauer had a mechanism in his office that allowed him to lock people in the room with him. Even if all he did was show vacation slides, that is essentially kidnapping.
None of those behaviors would be considered appropriate in a civilized society, much less in our modern one. Those men understood entirely well that their actions were outside acceptable standards, which is why they veiled with their power.
Biden and others committed their deeds--"mis"-- or other wise in public. They have been challenged to see their patterns in a new light by differing standards and they are capable of change.
Trumpocalypse
(6,143 posts)MarianJack
(10,237 posts)And the Evangelicals continue to follow blindly,
RESIST!
Trumpocalypse
(6,143 posts)the same low standard as Republicans?
Me.
(35,454 posts)She isn't