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Thu Mar 14, 2019, 07:37 AM

STOP Calling Social Security & Medicare Entitlements!

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Reply STOP Calling Social Security & Medicare Entitlements! (Original post)
kpete Mar 14 OP
duforsure Mar 14 #1
Hoyt Mar 14 #2
watoos Mar 14 #4
Sherman A1 Mar 14 #6
Freddie Mar 14 #5
lagomorph777 Mar 14 #17
emulatorloo Mar 14 #28
JayhawkSD Mar 14 #38
certainot Mar 14 #50
still_one Mar 14 #3
watoos Mar 14 #7
EndGOPPropaganda Mar 14 #9
watoos Mar 14 #13
EndGOPPropaganda Mar 14 #63
still_one Mar 14 #11
JHB Mar 14 #33
EndGOPPropaganda Mar 14 #8
johnp3907 Mar 14 #10
Iggo Mar 14 #12
NRaleighLiberal Mar 14 #14
SWBTATTReg Mar 14 #29
NRaleighLiberal Mar 14 #30
SWBTATTReg Mar 14 #31
JHB Mar 14 #34
LiberalLovinLug Mar 14 #54
Bengus81 Mar 14 #15
watoos Mar 14 #19
area51 Mar 14 #32
PubliusEnigma Mar 14 #16
populistdriven Mar 14 #18
watoos Mar 14 #20
populistdriven Mar 14 #21
watoos Mar 14 #24
UpInArms Mar 14 #48
zentrum Mar 14 #22
Odoreida Mar 14 #23
llmart Mar 14 #25
redstatebluegirl Mar 14 #26
IronLionZion Mar 14 #27
Silver Swan Mar 14 #35
FiveGoodMen Mar 14 #36
fescuerescue Mar 14 #37
MineralMan Mar 14 #39
marybourg Mar 14 #40
Cerulean Southpaw Mar 14 #42
jdu Mar 14 #41
Name removed Mar 14 #43
area51 Mar 14 #55
debsy Mar 14 #44
workinclasszero Mar 14 #45
mntleo2 Mar 14 #46
Ilsa Mar 14 #47
murielm99 Mar 14 #56
pamela Mar 14 #49
SergeStorms Mar 14 #51
PatrickforO Mar 14 #52
Kashkakat v.2.0 Mar 14 #53
karin_sj Mar 14 #57
Progressive dog Mar 14 #58
keithbvadu2 Mar 14 #59
cstanleytech Mar 14 #60
deek Mar 14 #61
tclambert Mar 14 #62
summer_in_TX Mar 14 #64
Texin Mar 15 #65
Catch2.2 Mar 15 #66
SpezelEd Mar 15 #67
pnwmom Mar 15 #68
DeminPennswoods Mar 15 #69

Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 07:47 AM

1. They have to brand it that way,

To con people into believing its bad , when its good, and make it acceptable for the few that'll believe anything they say is true. Its the opposite of the truth. They know it too. the cuts are again to pay for more to go to the wealthy.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 07:54 AM

2. We paid for them, so we are "entitled" to them. I do get that GOPers have made the term evil.


The term "entitlements" correctly describes the funds. We are entitled to them because we paid for them.

Theoretically, cuts in taxes for general revenue -- such as trump's tax cuts for the wealthy -- should not affect SS or Medicare, but it definitely will have an impact at some point.

Cuts in Medicare by previous Presidents -- even President Obama -- have not really impacted the program significantly; however, don't trust trump. Haven't really looked at what trump is proposing closely because his junk is not likely to be enacted.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #2)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 08:06 AM

4. Yip, I agree 100%

I have no problem with the word entitlement. I am getting SS and Medicare right now because I am entitled to them, I paid in to them for 45 years.

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Response to watoos (Reply #4)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 08:11 AM

6. Same here

I paid into them and therefore am entitled to receive my benefit according the rules of the program.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #2)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 08:07 AM

5. Yes exactly

“Entitlements” is merely government-speak for those benefits which must be paid out by law, earned and expected. The term is not meant to be offensive.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #2)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 09:51 AM

17. Exactly. We are legitimately ENTITLED to them; GOP has trashed a perfectly good word.

We pay for them, therefore we are entitled to them.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #2)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 10:52 AM

28. Exactly. We paid for them so we are entitled to them. Republicans love twisting words

and love what I call “willful misinterpretation” of fact and truth. They apparently teach that in Republicans 101.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #2)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 02:14 PM

38. Exactly right.

Why do we let the opponent define the argument? An entitlement is something to which one is entitled. If you pay for something you are entitled to receive that for which you paid.

Our response should be, "You're damned right it's an entitlement, so keep your filthy hands off of it."

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #2)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 04:59 PM

50. we let team limbaugh spin it for 30 years - money is free speech, corporations are people,

tax breaks for the rich and corps will pour down to us, media deregulation will lower prices, net neutrality is bad, single payer doesn't work, and so on

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 08:05 AM

3. They ARE ENTITLEMENTS. People pay into Social Security and Medicare, and they are ENTITLED

to those benefits.

THAT IS WHAT IT MEANS

The word "entitlement" has developed a negative connotation because people DO NOT UNDERSTAND the word. The connotation has been twisted by right wing groups to imply a meaning of "sense of entitlement", to say they "don't truly deserve it", and that is right wing bullshit.

Social Security and Medicare are called “entitlements” because anyone who meets the criteria to receive them, has a RIGHT to receive them. They are, in fact, ENTITLED to these benefits.

Why some seem so willing to be manipulated by the right wing propaganda machine on things like this is absurd.

It is similar to what they did with the word liberal, to equate it with a negative connotation, or this so-called liberal media.

When a republican refers to the Democratic party as the "democrat" party, it is time to call them out when that occurs, and correct it right then and there. That occurred during the Cohen hearing when a republican House member did that, and unfortunately, Cummings should have stopped him the moment he said that, and corrected it. Allowing republicans to define us has been one of our major errors.

That is the problem, we tend to let these things slide, and they get distorted and misrepresented. You have to stop it in its tracks.

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Response to still_one (Reply #3)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 08:15 AM

7. You are right, I agree that

Democrats don't know how to combat right wing propaganda. I get SS and Medicare, I paid in to them for 45 years, I am entitled to them.

I live among Trumpers in central Pa. when they call me a Socialist I tell them that Republicans are really the Socialists. Trump just gave billions of taxpayer dollars to soy bean farmers because they lost profits because of Trump's tariffs. I tell them if they want to fight Socialists go to Alaska where every resident is given a check from taxes put on oil drillers.

Republicans are also liberals. They are liberal with regulations on banks and the environment and other institutions.

Here's the main problem that Democrats have that is always overlooked, the M$M is complicit with the far right and controls the narrative, pushes far right narratives. It is hard for Democrats to buck Repugs with the M$M on the side of Repugs.

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Response to watoos (Reply #7)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 08:20 AM

9. Tell them they're suckers

In central Pa, here’s my suggestion:
Don’t engage on policy, it’s fruitless.
Engage on propaganda. Tell them Fox lies to them to get votes for billionaire tax cuts. Ask them who Rupert Murdoch is. Ask them if they know what he did in the U.K. and Australia. Ask them if they like getting lied to and controlled by a foreigner.
Ask them how it feels to be suckered by billionaires who are picking their pocket. Call them suckers and fools. Tell them Dems are the party of average people, that Jesus would be a Dem today, and Republicans are a party controlled by billionaires who are lying to people like them.

This is my strategy in Westerm PA and Ohio. And it works! No one will ever tell you you’re right to your face. But you’ll see their views changing over time. The key is to get them to doubt Fox.

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Response to EndGOPPropaganda (Reply #9)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 08:41 AM

13. I know better than to debate with zombies. I give them zingers.

Re: Socialism, we have a large stream that runs through the center of our borough of 1500 people. I tell them thank god we got the Army Corps of Engineers to build our flood control project back in the 60's or maybe our 2 bridges and downtown would have flooded out.

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Response to watoos (Reply #13)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 11:19 PM

63. It's not a debate. You laugh at them. Call them idiots

The way to get through to right wingers is to laugh at them and point out they are idiots getting suckered by billionaires.

Don’t debate. Laugh. Denigrate. Think of Hannities style, except you’re telling the truth. It works.

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Response to watoos (Reply #7)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 08:30 AM

11. Excellent response. Not only farmers, the tax bill gave those "socialist" corporations all kinds of

taxpayer dollars so they can either give themselves an extra bonus, have the corporation buy back shares of its stock, to elevate its price, but do very little to elevate the position of their employees, at least according to the latest statistics, wages have been stagnant for most workers for quite some time, and there sure isn't any indication that the new tax bill improved that

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Response to still_one (Reply #3)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 12:26 PM

33. Not merely "has developed". The negative spin was quite deliberate.

Back at least since the 80s, conservatives would cite, accurately, how much of the federal budget went to entitlements.

And then they'd spend the rest of their speech or appearance talking about Welfare, never once mentioning what a thin slice of the big, scary number they cited was actually welfare programs vs the big chunks that were SS and Medicare. They led the audience to the false impression that we were spending huge fortunes on poor people, without actually saying so. It's not as if Bush thought up the technique when he fostered the impression that Saddam was involved in 911.

This fed directly into prejudices and propaganda that there was a vast army of "shiftless, lazy" you-know-whos sponging off "your hard-earned tax dollars."


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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 08:16 AM

8. Yes! Never use the "E word".

The E word is a Frank Luntz-tested way to imply poor people are lazy. Do not use it! Thanka for posting this.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 08:25 AM

10. NO!

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 08:32 AM

12. Right after I start. (n/t)

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 09:22 AM

14. It's not the word, it's how the media and right wing use them to their desires.

We are entitled to them because we payed into them.

But - those on the right use it as if we are getting something for nothing.

It's a shame, but the word has been weaponized by propaganda

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Response to NRaleighLiberal (Reply #14)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 11:07 AM

29. Sorry folks, this is unrelated to this trend , but I wanted to know how NRaleighLiberal's trip ...

to STLMO was (at garden show)?

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Response to SWBTATTReg (Reply #29)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 12:04 PM

30. Superb! Wonderful hosts, fellow gardeners, lots of seeds given away,

Books sold and signed, many new friends. Talk at Bowood was great experience. Lived Pi Pizza and Pappy's BBQ. Exhausting but worth it. Off to Taylor MI for an event Saturday?

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Response to NRaleighLiberal (Reply #30)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 12:07 PM

31. Excellent, my friend, excellent!!! nt

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Response to NRaleighLiberal (Reply #30)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 12:32 PM

34. +1!

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Response to NRaleighLiberal (Reply #14)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 07:00 PM

54. yes, it is how "the media and right wing use" the word.

I think Democrats have to understand this. It seems sometimes they are too arrogant for their own good sometimes. By clinging onto these names long after they have been poisoned. Give it up! You can't always win the battles, winning the war is more important. Republicans have successfully changed the meaning of entitlements to mean either limousine libtards sipping champagne and feeling entitled to speak out just because of their celebrity, (or bribe their kids into exclusive colleges), that or Democratic voters that are voting D just because they feel 'entitled' to get free stuff. Stick with "earned benefits" and do not waiver.

Its almost like when the Republicans decided to call the Affordable Care Act, "Obamacare". In the mistaken belief that it would fail, (with their help), and so this move, or any future move even remotely towards a mandated tax based health insurance system, would be forever stained with his name, and the debacle they were hoping to bring about.

But when Democrats saw this, and with the belief that it would succeed, especially with Hillary almost assured to carry on in the Presidency, fix the problems and solidify it, they doubled down and began to join the Rs in adopting the name "Obamacare" instead of pounding out the term Affordable Care Act at every opportunity when guests on news shows. I remember even Obama himself calling it "Obamacare"! When every time the legislation came up, they should have made a point of referring to is as the ACA only. Because it only opened the door for Republicans to muddy the waters in their base states to the point that most supported the ACA, but hated "Obamacare", even though they were the same thing! The word "Affordable" was lost in the discussion, and it was easily re-defined as a (failing) vanity project by Obama.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 09:33 AM

15. And anyone thinking Medicare is "free" wait until you hit 65..............

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Response to Bengus81 (Reply #15)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 09:52 AM

19. You got that right

People don't know that we pay monthly premiums that comes out of our SS. There is also a small deductible.
Then after that, Medicare rarely pays the entire expense, 80% is pretty accurate.

Medicare for all isn't the same as single payer health care.

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Response to watoos (Reply #19)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 12:20 PM

32. That's why

people are calling for single-payer/comprehensive Medicare for All; improved Medicare. The current version of Medicare is way too skimpy and expensive.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 09:41 AM

16. Call them Socialism, as they should be.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 09:51 AM

18. START calling defense spending nondiscretionary!

Nearly everyone agrees that we should have some sort of minimum military always capability aka spending, say 500 billion. Therefore it is non-discretionary.

It also helps put the already paid for nondiscretionary social security and Medicare spending in better perspective.

Now let the right attack the "baked in" (their words) non-discretionary spending.

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Response to populistdriven (Reply #18)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 09:55 AM

20. Bingo,

Too bad it will never happen. People need to listen to Ike's farewell address to the nation.

We will never balance the budget as long as we spend so much on the military. We have 12 or 13 aircraft carriers and the rest of the world has 2 or 3.

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Response to watoos (Reply #20)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 10:00 AM

21. I love taking away the rights edge policies by using their own logic against them.

To bad the left is too conservative to do it.

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Response to populistdriven (Reply #21)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 10:16 AM

24. Again I agree,

What the M$M calls the far left is really centrist America. The big gorilla in the room is that people underestimate the effect of the M$M. People actually believe that msnbc is liberal when in fact all that msnbc does in put a left leaning slant to a right wing narrative.

Democrats have already forgotten that the reason we won a blue tsunami in 2018 is because we ran to the left. Yes there were places where candidates like Connor Lamb had to run slightly right but all in all we won in 2018 by being leftists err centrists.

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Response to watoos (Reply #20)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 04:33 PM

48. My favorite Eisenhower quote:

Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired, signifies in the final sense a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed. ~ Dwight D. Eisenhower

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 10:01 AM

22. Thank you!!

We pay for it!!!! Hello?

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 10:02 AM

23. It is a legal term and so they *must* be called entitlements

It has nothing to do with feeling "entitled".

Better to educate people on this point than try to dumb it down, causing more confusion.

The Federal Government pays obligations in this order.

1) Debt service.

2) Entitlements -- This is the official legal term, not political rhetoric.

3) Budget items.

Social Security & Medicare and entitlements because they are legally obligated to be paid regardless of the budget.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 10:22 AM

25. They are entitlements.

We are entitled to them.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 10:37 AM

26. If they are then I am "entitled" to all of the money I have paid into these programs for 45 years.

Fine, write me a check for the money I have paid in over the years. Of course they can't since the current generation will be paying for us, as we did for the one before us.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 10:41 AM

27. You are entitled to nothing!



Unless you're wealthy and powerful, then you are entitled to tax cuts and subsidies and all sorts of sweet business deals to help you create jobs overseas or automate and replace American workers.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 12:41 PM

35. In Social Security language

"Entitled" is the official word for someone receiving Social Security receiving benefits. ("Benefits" is also the official term for such payments.) If you meet the requirements for Social Security benefits, but have not file a claim, you are "eligible" for benefits. You must file an application claiming benefits to become "entitled."

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Response to Silver Swan (Reply #35)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 12:58 PM

36. In the average news cycle, though, it sends the wrong dog whistle.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 01:05 PM

37. Why?

First off they are entitlements. People paid in and they are entitled to it.

Second. That language actually helps cements that they cannot be taken away.

I suspect that the right would love call them something different. Like "temporary benefits"

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Response to kpete (Original post)


Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 02:36 PM

40. They ARE entitlements!

Stop letting the right wing distort our language and dominate our thinking.

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Response to marybourg (Reply #40)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 03:40 PM

42. exactly

remind them of what entitled really means. it doesn't mean privileged or getting a handout, it means you hold the title to a thing. you own it and it IS owed to you, and they're talking about stealing it.

we need to get back to using the word for what it really means, so it has no value as a weapon.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 03:24 PM

41. Absolutely

YES YES YES PLEASE

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Response to kpete (Original post)


Response to Name removed (Reply #43)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 07:26 PM

55. +1 n/t

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 04:03 PM

44. I AM ENTITLED to them...

... as I have been paying into them for nearly 40 years!

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Response to debsy (Reply #44)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 04:13 PM

45. No shit right!?

I paid my first SS taxes in 1971 and I'm still paying them every two weeks in 2019!

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 04:19 PM

46. Which is why ...

...Gore talked about a "locked box," over 20 years ago. This was about balancing the budget on the SS Trust money with the pretense "it would be paid back..." Oh yeah, where is it, Congress, is it even being discussed? Nope, nope, nope!"

I hate to say it as I have some issue with Gore but he was more than right about this. They have taken $trillions and then try to say we will not have enough money to pay everyone. BullS**t!!! why do they think they are so special that they can just take our money for their own BS like not taxing the rich and for that matter not taking SS out of anyone who makes more than $114,000 a year?

If we want this to change perhaps it takes those of us to keep asking Congress, the press, and our own Legislators, "Where's ma money, Beyyyitch???" And why aren't the deadbeat rich paying their fair share?

Just sayin' here ...

Love, Cat in Seattle

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 04:24 PM

47. We need to reclaim the word, just like the word "liberal." nt

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Response to Ilsa (Reply #47)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 08:08 PM

56. You are correct.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 04:43 PM

49. No

I'm glad that right wingers are finally catching on to the fact that Social Security and Medicare are considered "entitlements." For years, far right politicians and pundits had their followers arguing that we should cut entitlements while they were oblivious to the fact the the pols and pundits meant Social Security and Medicare. It took the left years of saying "you know, Social Security and Medicare are entitlements" before they began to realize they had been arguing to cut their own benefits.

These memes are coming from the right. They demonized the word and now that they realize it applys to things they like, they want us to stop using it. Fuck them.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 06:27 PM

51. I said that the first time...

I heard a republiCANT utter the word "entitlement". It should infuriate every American, republiCANT or Democrat!

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 06:41 PM

52. You bet.

These are are earned benefits.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 06:47 PM

53. EXCEPT THATS WHAT THEY ARE - people are entitled to them exactly because they are an earned

benefit. Unlike welfare programs which come out of general revenue.

Why not just reclaim the word? And use another word to denote welfare programs coming out of GPR?

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 08:33 PM

57. This drives me absolutely bonkers!!!

And even more so when it's a Democrat or a left-leaning newscaster or pundit that uses that term. INFURIATING!

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 08:54 PM

58. We are entitled to Social Security and Medicare

because the US government made a contract with us. We paid for those entitlements over our working lives so that we would not be a burden on society.
The word entitlement is not the problem, the theft of our payments to fund higher income for those who have the most is the problem.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 10:02 PM

59. Protect them?

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 10:04 PM

60. Shouldn't it be "Stop lying and calling Social Security and Medicare entitlements"

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 10:10 PM

61. earned benefits to which you are entitled. eom

.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 10:38 PM

62. But this is a whole big pot of money that the entitled rich aren't entitled to steal . . . yet.

The greediest of the greedy, who made their fortunes on UNEARNED income, just want ALL the money. They don't want poor people, which to them includes working class people, to have ANY of the money.

You probably think that would take us back to the time of slavery. The greediest of the rich are thinking, "Yeah, those were great times. If only someone would make America great like that again."

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Thu Mar 14, 2019, 11:23 PM

64. Doubling down on directly reclaiming the word "entitlements" is a big mistake.

There's now a visceral negative reaction to the word. It's not just Republicans. Independents and Dems too have absorbed it from the culture (a.k.a. MSM). It bypasses rational thought. Any attempt to reclaim it will be a huge uphill battle and isn't worth the time and energy.

R's carefully developed that visceral reaction over time. It would take a longterm pr campaign with an emotional appeal that developed an opposite visceral reaction, not an exercise in logic. That's going to cost time and money. Is that the best use of it?

When you are explaining you're losing.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Mar 15, 2019, 12:01 AM

65. Goddamnit! They are entitlements. I toiled for them for three decades.

I worked and paid into the system that guaranteed I'd be rewarded from them when I retired. I AM ENTITLED to those benefits I paid into them for decades! Maybe the narrative for Dems should be whether rethugs should be able to glom onto the system we paid into and our IRAs to pay for retrumplican boondoggles or not. When do poor rethug trump voters get wise to this shit?

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Mar 15, 2019, 01:27 AM

66. This is one thing the Dems need to learn...

How to Brand themselves. How to get out the message to the public. The republicans are great at this. The Dems...not so much.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Mar 15, 2019, 02:23 AM

67. Entitlement Definition

Entitlement means you paid for it, so you're entitled to it. Please stop calling it welfare.

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Response to SpezelEd (Reply #67)

Fri Mar 15, 2019, 05:03 AM

68. "You're entitled to it. Please stop calling it welfare." You win the prize for best answer.

And welcome to DU, SpezelED!

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Mar 15, 2019, 07:44 AM

69. Technically, it's insurance

The official name for social security is Old Age, Survivors and Disability Insurance. Everyone knows how insurance works, you pay into it and when the time comes and you need it, it pays out benefits.

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