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Fri Jan 11, 2019, 05:16 PM

what is it that the asshole wants to see in a bill before he'll sign it? "The Wall," but what does

that even mean? That the bill will actually say we'll build a 30-foot wall or steel fence or whatever along the entire border, in those words? Obviously border infrastructure needs to be funded, along with everything else the government operates...so I'm sure there's bound to be money for maintenance or even expansion of the various walls and fences that exist now, in whatever appropriations bill.

So he must actually want it to say, "we'll build a big giant wall across the entire southern border, even where it's impossible to put a wall" basically? Is there a draft out there somewhere of what it is he actually wants in order to end the hostage situation?

And do I have it right that he's got absolutely nothing to bring to the table, just wants "wall" and won't take anything else as an answer?

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Reply what is it that the asshole wants to see in a bill before he'll sign it? "The Wall," but what does (Original post)
anarch Jan 11 OP
guillaumeb Jan 11 #1
haele Jan 11 #2
anarch Jan 11 #4
gratuitous Jan 11 #3
anarch Jan 11 #5
MoonRiver Jan 11 #6
jberryhill Jan 11 #7
anarch Jan 11 #8
jberryhill Jan 11 #9
NastyRiffraff Jan 11 #10
Qutzupalotl Jan 11 #11

Response to anarch (Original post)

Fri Jan 11, 2019, 05:18 PM

1. A wall around Robert Mueler, and a wall around the truth.

And yes, the orange terrorist is holding the country hostage.

But the GOP leadership refuses to call the police.

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Response to anarch (Original post)

Fri Jan 11, 2019, 05:25 PM

2. How about "Border security to include new sections of Border Wall..." without any specifications.

...one could just add an additional 10 ft. to sections that had already been planned, or add a wall to official buildings at border gate crossing. And instead of spending $5 Billion + on a stupid wall that anyone could shovel under or climb over, they can use most of that $5 Billion on technology to extend the "wall" using the appropriate types of sensors along with better trained and managed Border Patrol.

Haele

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Response to haele (Reply #2)

Fri Jan 11, 2019, 05:30 PM

4. that's kind of what I'm getting at

So it must be he wants his grandiose (if impractical, and in some cases probably actually physically impossible) concept of a solid, tall and impenetrable wall that stretches the entire length of the southern border with Mexico, actually specifically described in the bill.

If not, then why not do something like you describe?

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Response to anarch (Original post)

Fri Jan 11, 2019, 05:30 PM

3. Trump just wants to burn a big pile of money

The ask of $5.8 billion (or whatever it is this afternoon) won't do jack/squat about building the impenetrable barrier Trump keeps yammering about. It will be as effective as using a squirt gun on a wildfire for all the effect it will have. But once you've thrown $5 billion at WALL, you have to keep feeding the beast. The administration will be back at appropriation time for another $10 billion of $50 billion or however much Trump wants. Once Congress has said yes once, they're not likely to say no next time. And the time after that? Well, by then the boondoggle will have taken on a life of its own and it will have to be, must be, funded or concede that we were just burning money for no particular purpose.

This is a classic "give 'em an inch and they'll take a mile" scenario.

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Response to gratuitous (Reply #3)

Fri Jan 11, 2019, 05:35 PM

5. right, but then the government just stays shut forever?

They've already tried putting in funds for "border security", without even asking for anything in concession.

This is all just so stupid it is actually boggling my mind. How long before actual pitchforks and torches here?

Ugh, I'm sure I've said that before during this goddamned nightmare.

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Response to anarch (Original post)

Fri Jan 11, 2019, 05:41 PM

6. Spoiled brat will not get what he wants.

The adults are in charge now.

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Response to anarch (Original post)

Fri Jan 11, 2019, 05:44 PM

7. ah, you've fallen into the trap that there is a definable "something" which he wants

The direct answer to your question - i.e. "What does he want?" - has nothing to do with a wall, the border, or anything tangible.

He wants chaos and drama around an entirely artificial "controversy".

He wants those things for their own sake, and not for any tangible goal.

He does not care about the consequences. He genuinely does not give a shit what happens to anyone if he never gives this up.

And he's got Mitch McConnell in his corner to back him up on this.

Quite simply, he is completely willing to let this country descend into complete chaos, simply to score a "win" and to antagonize the people his base does not like.

He couldn't give a shit about a wall. Really. You can't look at this thing in terms of "what rational goal is he attempting to accomplish". There isn't one.

He's not sane.

Unfortunately for everyone else, the consequences of giving into this child having a tantrum are worse than the consequences of not giving in.

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Response to jberryhill (Reply #7)

Fri Jan 11, 2019, 05:53 PM

8. well, exactly...I guess what I mean is, what do they think is the endgame for this shutdown?

There definitely is a rational goal that he's accomplishing, which is to plunge the U.S. into chaos and weaken our global power and alliances with Europe, all to the benefit of the Russians.

It just seems like the impacts are going to expand from this to the point that it will backfire on them. Global capital does depend on a fair portion of Americans not completely welching on their many debts...what happens to that situation if the U.S. economy crashes?

I dunno. I can't believe we've gotten this far into this "administration's" tenure without things falling apart completely, cities burning, etc. American carnage, made real.

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Response to anarch (Reply #8)

Fri Jan 11, 2019, 06:32 PM

9. We're getting there


But, yeah, this has nothing to do with the wall, the border, or anything like that.

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Response to jberryhill (Reply #9)

Fri Jan 11, 2019, 06:39 PM

10. Exactly

The shutdown is a power play. And the wall is just an excuse for a shutdown, which is an excuse for a "national emergency." Somebody's convinced the fat toddler to hold off on that, but he's still threatening because he doesn't listen to adults.

Of course he has no idea what the bill's language should say; he hasn't even thought about it. The bill is irrelevant.

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Response to anarch (Original post)

Fri Jan 11, 2019, 07:30 PM

11. Nancy should say

We’re willing to give you $5.7 towards your big, beautiful wall.

Not $5.7 billion; five dollars and 70 cents. See if he notices.

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