General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsRiddle me this: When did Christianity become solely owned by Conservatives?
I ask because of this:
Some in the media are complaining that Gabby Douglas is "so, so, so into Jesus." LIKE if you are tired of liberal attacks on Christians.
So, is there some attack under way on Christians by "liberals" that I am unaware of?
I am a Christian and I am a liberal. I am very proud of both!
NYC_SKP
(68,644 posts)And I'm not kidding.
To the extent that there is a Jesus who would cry, the appropriation of the Christian mantle by the RW is a matter that would make Jesus cry.
Tennessee Gal
(6,160 posts)Among other things, Jesus was kind, giving, loving, and compassionate. Those things are lacking in today's Conservatives.
NYC_SKP
(68,644 posts)A small number of churches and groups are coming around to say otherwise.
FarCenter
(19,429 posts)10:34-36 - "Never think I have come to bring peace upon the earth. No, I have not come to bring peace but a sword! For I have come to set a man against his own father, a daughter against her own mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law. A man's enemies will be those who live in his own house."
JNelson6563
(28,151 posts)Jesus was wonderful!1! Got it?
Julie
CJCRANE
(18,184 posts)especially ideas that go against ingrained traditions and values.
Every religious messenger who has come along has divided people, at least initially, until the new ideas become accepted.
piratefish08
(3,133 posts)Buzz Clik
(38,437 posts)I know what you are saying is true about conservatives claiming exclusive rights to Christianity (and their twisted view of it), but I do not understand the context. How does the pic of Gabby Douglas or her religious outpourings translate into an attack on liberals?
Tennessee Gal
(6,160 posts)This quote:
Some in the media are complaining that Gabby Douglas is "so, so, so into Jesus." LIKE if you are tired of liberal attacks on Christians.
newthinking
(3,982 posts)It is why this Christian left the church I originally was involved in.
Unfortunately, this kind of "Christianity" (which really does not follow Christ in any real manner), is fairly predominant. See my post below for why.
ellenfl
(8,660 posts)Archae
(46,301 posts)Later re-named himself Paul.
RagAss
(13,832 posts)BlueinOhio
(238 posts)Constantine laid on his death bed for 2 weeks and stank before anyone go near him. The Donation of Constantine is a fraud and so is him being christian. Try Mithrasism, it explains a lot. By the way the conservatives commandeered christianity during the 80's. They preach politics in church and not the words in red.
xchrom
(108,903 posts)so when billy graham was anointed as the pastor to presidents -- it was pretty much complete.
never mind billy had strong racist over tones from the 40s or that most people were main stream christian -- i.e. methodist, presbyterian, Lutheran, etc -- and paid no attention to unaffiliated evangelicals -- billy was the real deal -- and so was everybody who thought like him.
newthinking
(3,982 posts)and follow few of Christ's teachings. They practice a form of "Hedonism" that replaces the most important teachings expressed by Jesus. So it should not be a surprise that their real moorings follow cultural trends. And because their leaders are mostly authoritarian and steeped in pride and privilege, of course they would trend toward leading their ignorant flocks into belief systems like the conservatives.
In addition, Republican Operatives have purposely been working in immigrant circles and particularly immigrant churches for years. Most of the current growth within "Christian" churches currently is the Churches that new immigrants belong to. They learned their "Christianity" from conservative wealth "gospel" missionaries and television evangelists.
It's going to get worse worldwide, because significantly, these wealthy conservative churches are the ones who are working in other countries. There are far fewer alternative teachers of Christianity providing alternative voices in the "mission fields" (so to speak).
Lydia Leftcoast
(48,217 posts)Republican operatives infiltrating the denomination.
There is also a think tank called The Institute for Religion and Democracy, whose entire reason for existence is to bash the mainline denominations (Lutherans, Episcopalians, Methodists, etc.) for being "too liberal" and having "lost their way."
Freddie
(9,257 posts)Rick Santorum implied the same, 45 million of us Lutherans, Methodists, Episcipalians, etc. were no longer Christian.
Then there's "steeplejacking", where a group of Fundies infiltrate a mainline church and convince enough members to leave the denomination because it's not following "the true words of God." happened to a UCC church nearby which is now nondenominational.
YoungDemCA
(5,714 posts)nt
datasuspect
(26,591 posts)WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)Tennessee Gal
(6,160 posts)Freddie
(9,257 posts)And respected women as well; it's St. Paul where all the "women should keep silent" crap comes from.
A HERETIC I AM
(24,362 posts)The fact is, so called "Christianity isn't that at all. It is "Paulianity" and "Peterianity".
And the Bible thumpers are just fine with that.
As Bishop John Shelby Spong aptly put it, If you took away Revelations and the Book of David, the Modern Christian would have nothing to carry on about (paraphrasing) and that means the Paulites / Peterites.
Johonny
(20,819 posts)thus both Liberals and Conservatives have to pick and choose the sections of the Bible they like. Most of the oldest material in the testament paints Jesus as an apocalyptic Jew that believe the end of time was coming and the Kingdom of God's rule on Earth was at hand. I don't think this concept exactly fits in with building a functioning liberal society, although descriptions of what some New Testament authors thought was important about this world do...
CJCRANE
(18,184 posts)I think there is a good argument for more of a Zen take on Jesus' words.
Some of Jesus' sayings may have been more like Zen koans, metaphorical ideas designed to get people thinking in new ways.
On the Road
(20,783 posts)even though it should be completely self-evident.
People tend to read their own times back into historical documents. But even a century ago the social, political, and religious lines were drawn so differently as to be almost unrecognizable. It takes a huge amount of context to even begin to understand the milieu that Jesus lived in.
People who think that Jesus' central message can be summed up in the Sermon on the Mount might do well to read Mark, which was probably the first gospel ever written. It's not in there at all. Nor is it in John, although there is something sort of like it in Luke. However, Mark 13 is there, as well as a lot of angry diatribes.
So if it wasn't the Golden Rule and the beatitudes, what was it all about? Mark is extremely cagey. It was certainly apocalyptic, nationalistic, and purist, even if the details are not clear. The Romans thought he was plotting a revolution. That may or may not be true, but his patterns of teaching resembled others that did start revolts.
So who knows? But Jesus would probably reject both Democrats and Republicans. He might feel actually more comfortable in the orthodox Jewish community.
Poiuyt
(18,117 posts)Read the works of Jim Wallis
NYC_SKP
(68,644 posts)Mostly though, I love her smile!
cherokeeprogressive
(24,853 posts)Solely? Really?
Tennessee Gal
(6,160 posts)That attitude is certainly not one of Christianity.
Harmony Blue
(3,978 posts)but only in the U.S. you will find some mean spirited, twisted Christians. Christianity outside the U.S. is very different, especially Eastern Christianity.
newthinking
(3,982 posts)There has been, and continues to be, lots of money spent by these wealthy churches and televangelists in other countries. There is a noticable shift toward fundamentalism even in circles that were traditionally more centrist. I think that trend will continue, expecially in second/third world countries where the "westernized" "gospel" is very attractive and forcefully proclaimed.
Skidmore
(37,364 posts)bullied by money grubbing pastors. When "prosperity gospel" was sold by grafting Dispensationalism to capitalism. Mostly when good people refused to speak up and fire ministers who taught hatred. Lethal silence...
OriginalGeek
(12,132 posts)then why was Fox the ones complaining about her lack of patriotism for wearing a purple leotard?
She is apparently christian.
Fox attacked her.
Sounds like a right wing attack to me.
Robyn66
(1,675 posts)I am a liberal and a christan, I believe in evolution, global warming and gay rights. I believe in caring for my fellow man and loving my neighbor. I am not deluded or hateful I do not criticize people who are agnostic or atheists. I get great comfort from my faith and don't force it on anyone, and I expect people to give me the same respect by not tearing in to me or making assumptions about me because I am a person of faith. Some people seem to feel they have the right to just come up to you and berate you for no good reason.
My 13 year old daughter was wearing a necklace with the fish on it. She was shopping, minding her own business when a woman came up to her and started yelling at her saying that my daughter was "FORCING HER RELIGION ON HER". My daughter was literally doing nothing but checking out cd's and movies and she was accosted by someone who was wearing peace signs by the way.
I find that kind of thing troubling. As Liberals we should respect EVERYONE whether we agree with them or not and not berate anyone. And you know what, if you think what someone says is silly so what. Everyone has a right to speak. All religious speech is not hate speech.
Our church has free community suppers and does a lot of work for those in need. We don't just talk the talk we walk the walk, and that is the best part of being a part of my church, its being with a group of people who all want to help people.
Tennessee Gal
(6,160 posts)Yes, that I agree with. If only Conservatives would accept that standard! But they do not. They belittle, rant, and rave. It is difficult in today's society to have a calm rational discussion with them.
How they came to the conclusion that if you are not a Conservative in your political leanings you are beneath them, even to the point of questioning your Christianity, is my struggle. It is foreign to Christ's teachings. It is judgmental.
It is a puzzle I have not been able to come to terms with and it is quite aggravating, if not downright infuriating.
demosincebirth
(12,530 posts)ever you point out the good in "christian" teaching there will always be the the proverbial
"yea but." Just like clockwork. You are seeing it now. They are so predictable.
cordelia
(2,174 posts)jeff47
(26,549 posts)It's your religion. Why are you letting conservatives be the public face of it?
demosincebirth
(12,530 posts)Zalatix
(8,994 posts)Deal with the impostors and phoneys, or they'll take over. That's how I take it, and that's how it appears to be in reality.
jeff47
(26,549 posts)Yet you're letting them speak for you.
It's really not that complicated. If you're upset that the perception is "Christian = RW Fundie" you are going to have to do something to fix that perception. No, we will not notice the works you do with no fanfare. You and Christians like you are going to have to start making as much noise as the fundies.
demosincebirth
(12,530 posts)about christians on DU without even thinking about why they are here . Maybe they are here because they share the same beliefs, politically, that you do. Yet, you belittle their beliefs because some are not as far left as you and some of your cohorts. You forget that we are all, basically, liberal democrats fighting for the same cause. You don't know me and what I do or have done on my spare time. You just assume that because a person is christian you know what he stands for and what he believes. Religious prejudice and bigotry is SOP with many so-called progressive and liberals on DU. You start pointing fingers at people of faith about what they should or should not do...I suggest you look at your hand and you'll see that three fingers are pointing back at you. Also, what have you done lately to further the progressive cause aside from pontificating to me.
Peace.
jeff47
(26,549 posts)You are upset that conservative Christians have assumed the public mantle of what it is to be Christian. They've been working very hard at it for 30 years, and liberal Christians have spent 30 years not doing anything about it.
And now you're pissed at me? Look in the mirror bub. It's your religion. You're the one who has to fix it's public perception.
What did that Jesus fellow say about lying? Because you are.
If you go read my posts I say absolutely nothing about what you believe. I'm talking about what happens in the public square. We frankly haven't a clue what liberal Christians believe, because they have utterly abandoned the public square to the conservative Christians.
You're the one who has a problem letting conservatives define what it is to be Christian. How, exactly, do you think atheists can fix that for you? We can't because it's your religion.
Well, I haven't been whining that doing nothing isn't fixing my problems.
You don't get to end an unfounded and massively hostile attack with "peace".
demosincebirth
(12,530 posts)jeff47
(26,549 posts)hifiguy
(33,688 posts)the good, the good need to fight back. Loudly.
demosincebirth
(12,530 posts)If I say I'm spirtual, I'm not. So, who knows. I just try to do what I think is right.
Peace
We liberal Christians live our faith without wearing it on our sleeves.
jeff47
(26,549 posts)I'm an atheist.
I've experienced lots of attacks from conservative Christians. Liberal Christians felt "we should respect EVERYONE whether we agree with them or not and not berate anyone" and didn't do anything.
I'll start caring about your feelings when you start trying to take your religion back. Until then, you're just enabling the crazies with your silence.
Tierra_y_Libertad
(50,414 posts)The ones who decide what/who is or isn't Christian.
"When the Tao is absent, ritual arises." Lao-tse
gollygee
(22,336 posts)That whole "help the sick and feed the hungry" thing is so first century.
bluestateguy
(44,173 posts)They and others of the evangelical ilk have marginalized, made to feel unwelcome and pushed out Christians who do not think exacatly like they do.
malokvale77
(4,879 posts)That was the same day I walked away from religion.
Deep13
(39,154 posts)That's when the imperial government turned Christianity from a localized, informal religion to an official, hierarchical, instrument of the state.
NYC_SKP
(68,644 posts)yardwork
(61,539 posts)You're saying that the media is attacking Gabby? They have been for weeks. What's that got to do with liberals?
Tennessee Gal
(6,160 posts)I suppose they think all the media is "liberal" and that gives them the right to project.
yardwork
(61,539 posts)I thought you were saying in your OP that the media is attacking Gabby for being Christian, and that you're mad at liberals for attacking Gabby for being Christian, and I was asking what does the media have to do with liberals?
Have any liberals attacked Gabby for being Christian?
Tennessee Gal
(6,160 posts)demosincebirth
(12,530 posts)read the Religion forum?. Most Christians liberals on DU avoid it.
marybourg
(12,594 posts)of the flag and "life".
hootinholler
(26,449 posts)Now we have the full blown theocratic movement still driven by the minority of people of the Christian faith.
Some will argue that it happened much earlier during WWII with Rushdooney, but I think he just articulated the platform on which The Family built their special brand of "Jesus loves a winner."
Jeff In Milwaukee
(13,992 posts)Here you had Jimmy Carter, who is a devoutly religious man (and a man who acts based on his faith) vs. Ronald Reagan, a Hollywood liberal who knocked up his second wife while still married to his first wife. Reagan, A.a man whose only religious experience while President consisted of falling asleep during an audience with Pope John Paul II.
Reagan was the darling of Christians and Carter was somehow a secular liberal.
hootinholler
(26,449 posts)HiPointDem
(20,729 posts)Freddie
(9,257 posts)Story is when he came to Washington he asked which church/denomination to attend because he had no idea what any of them were about.
And he's a huge hero to the Religious Right.
ThoughtCriminal
(14,046 posts)Replaced Jesus with Paul and the dogma became Anti-Sermon-On The -Mount.
Cheap Grace and Prosperity Gospel were the perfect match for Republican Me-Firstism.
AsahinaKimi
(20,776 posts)Many, like Rush Limbaugh have told their audience that Liberals and Democrats hate this country and don't deserve to be Americans. To them...I have an answer...
AnotherMcIntosh
(11,064 posts)ones you want to concentrate on."
drb
(1,520 posts)cbayer
(146,218 posts)The left needs to take it back.
Egalitarian Thug
(12,448 posts)demosincebirth
(12,530 posts)by what...looking at him/her? That's quite a gift.
Egalitarian Thug
(12,448 posts)Now, you're going to try to try re-writing history? Of course, there have been individuals here and there that have tried, but they don't seem to be able to rally the support like the vengeful authoritarians.
demosincebirth
(12,530 posts)Egalitarian Thug
(12,448 posts)But then that would entail actually doing something...
demosincebirth
(12,530 posts)A-dios.
unblock
(52,126 posts)ellenfl
(8,660 posts)they own faux religious righteousness. what they espouse is NOT christianity . . . at least not how i understand it.
ellen fl
Tennessee Gal
(6,160 posts)sibelian
(7,804 posts)I'm an atheist but I'm horrified that a religion whose core values centre around altruism have been appropriated by the right.
aquart
(69,014 posts)Isaiah 10:1-3
New International Version (NIV)
10 Woe to those who make unjust laws,
to those who issue oppressive decrees,
2 to deprive the poor of their rights
and withhold justice from the oppressed of my people,
making widows their prey
and robbing the fatherless.
3 What will you do on the day of reckoning,
when disaster comes from afar?
To whom will you run for help?
Where will you leave your riches?
Posteritatis
(18,807 posts)rrneck
(17,671 posts)That's where the money is.
Arkansas Granny
(31,507 posts)jeff47
(26,549 posts)Liberal Christians decided to not speak up when conservative Christians started speaking for all Christians.
turtlerescue1
(1,013 posts)First they cannot comprehend that anyone would dare to think, second just as the church leaders in the days of Yeshua/Jesus would do, they feel some unwritten right to be the supreme authority. What is stunning is they can quote the words in red letters, then in the next breath spout cruel condemnations to anyone for just about any reason. Of course my only recourse is to "gently" remind them about the Guttenberg press and Marty/"take on the Vatican"/ Luther who translated the works into their language so ALL could read it. It doesn't always end the anger or rhetoric, but what it usually does is force the other person to start "Well for me...."
A while back I was fired up about the hatred spewed from the Fundie pulpits to which our new pastor said "They have simply forgotten WHOSE Table it is they sit at."
STILL I will admit this openly and freely and often: I see more decency, compassion and efforts by those who deny Christianity than is often seen among those who preach these things and forget how to do them for the sake of self-righteousness.
jeff47
(26,549 posts)Right now, only the conservatives are talking to us non-Christians....well, more like yelling at us non-Christians. With no liberal Christians talking, we're gonna assume conservatives speak for all Christians.
turtlerescue1
(1,013 posts)liberal and Christian. We get it from both sides, and lately my thought has been "that narrow gate spoken of seems to be getting a lot more narrow for someone like me to try to enter by".
jeff47 I can not preach to you, the best I can do is suggest you find a newer translation of the training manual and go to that second half and digest the words with your own understanding. There's 180 degrees between what the conservatives loudly say, and what the training manual says. There is one thing to take notice of in reading the Four Gospels, who the thorn is in Yeshua's side- and to me in THIS day those thorns are found yelling at non-Christians. But they are equal-opportunity self righteous, they don't like Liberal/Progressive Christians either- we've "lost our way".
I have most of the translations/versions of the training manual, but have a preference for the Jerusalem Bible, I did not know it was banned in 1968 in the US and Canada when it became my choice. Yeah, I'll explain this choice: In Exodus the Creator gives a name to Moses for when he goes back to the "slaves" he's about to lead through the wilderness for 40 years. The Jewish feel the name is too sacred to be spoken. BUT in my addled brain: its like there is a football hall of fame, and a god hall of fame, so to clarify which god I believe IS GOD, I use and prefer to read that name when I study and try to understand that Book. "Yhwh" "I am that I am". The Jerusalem Bible uses the name. Plus the translation is more geared to my level of intelligence. There is also versions that include the Acrophya/ non canonical(excluded from the "Book" , one of these is Esdras II. One of the keys that still stuns me is that it was believed the Christ would be a military leader and be the Hero that blessed the Jewish people. What came instead was a Leader who practiced love and set an example, plus opened up that it was not just those of Jewish heritage to be told. St. Paul had his reasons, but he wasn't part of those who wrote the Four Gospels, though most of his writings are wonderful and graceful, the words that are where our "example" comes from are in those first four.
Don't think I think I know it all, because there are places and words and ideas and concepts I will struggle with forever I fear. Like the Nephilim. Duh???? Another that still makes me cringe is: Okay the real reason I found my rear in the Lutheran School was because the State of California decided it would teach sight-reading over phonetics. So the number of times I read Genesis about Eve and the serpent and the fruit is beyond counting. Years and years worth. One day a few years ago I'm reading the same verses again, only THIS time- I realilzed "I'm just like Eve, naive, gullible...I am EVE." I am "easily deceived", what this did was make me more neurotic about having truth, truth being eternal not temporary.
Life is an adventure. Finding your own Soul is also an adventure, a becoming aware. Some may never feel the need to, then there are those like myself who lust after understandings.
Do I not believe in the Big Bang, dunno, wasn't there. BUT still believe even the Big Bang came from Intelligence. If there is any logic to this it has to do with what I believe are creations from Intelligent Design. The variety, be it birds; minerals; and my favorite wonders are the tastes and smells of what the earth produces. I AM easily amused, but HOW did the taste of a peach, lemon, apple, almond, walnut, watermelon, zucchini came to be separate from each other?
Okay I've blathered on too long. So I'll close with this: There is a perfectly sound reason that the Creator wants one-to-one relationships, wants it personal not as a collective. In the end it may be where the Conservatives can't see the forest for all the trees.
jeff47
(26,549 posts)Frankly that's a lost cause.
Conservative Christians spend a lot of time demanding that society follow their beliefs regardless of personal belief.
You need to counter that. You need to demand that society NOT follow their beliefs. You need to say "No, Christians don't hate gay people" or poor people. Or any of their other hot-button issues.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)people. But they allow the right to speak for them. They excuse themselves from the table saying 'too hard, rock and hard place etc'.
turtlerescue1
(1,013 posts)The post I responded to: "You don't talk to them. You talk to the rest of us. Right now only the conservatives...With no liberal Christians talking, we're gonna assume conservatives speak for all Christians."
Society will follow what the collective of individuals choose to follow. Just as I refuse to accept being told to be a Christian I must be a member of the Fundamentalists.
I would "like to teach the world to sing in perfect harmony", so that not one person lacked feeling accepted. It would be wonderful to "alter" the ME focus of people, but it is also a personal decision, choice and path. Maybe we'ld get bored, dunno.
A liberal Christian did "talk to the rest of us". My goal isn't to "convert", that's too personal a decision. What I did attempt was to suggest reading the "training manual" . Strongest I can be. You're a democrat you already understand about acceptance, what are the odds you can convince a TeaBagger of any other ideology besides the one they've chosen?
jeff47
(26,549 posts)No. Society follows whomever is speaking the loudest. That's how you get society to do truly horrible things.
Then "All Christians are Fundamentalists" wins.
Simple as that. You refusing to engage the fundamentalists publicly means you approve of them to the public.
Cut the sophistry bullshit. It's quite transparent. Here's a hint: When you call it a training manual, you are declaring the Bible to be the "correct" way to live one's life. You are not being clever and letting people "find their truth". You are pushing yours.
I'm wondering just how many times I'm going to have to say this before it gets through to you.
Conversion IS NOT YOUR GOAL.
Perhaps I need to stand in a pulpit before you start listening?
You don't need to convince a single person to change their religion or other deep-held beliefs. You need to provide examples of non-fundamentalist Christians in the public square. Because right now, only the fundamentalists are talking in the public square.
You need to say "The fundamentalists are wrong because of __________". In public. You need to make as much noise as they do. In public. Not because you want to change them, but because you want us to know you are not like them.
If you don't, we'll just assume your silence is assent.
turtlerescue1
(1,013 posts)You say you are an atheist, that is your choice. So- Ayn Rand was an atheist, does that mean you like Mr. Ryan follow(ed?) the same beliefs as Rand? Her philosophies? Her practices?
How you came to your Values and Beliefs does not make you a Randian follower. (Supposedly part of Rand's system of beliefs was on some basis with a serial killer's view of the world compared to his.)
More likely you reached your conclusions not based on someone else's. Ole Marty did believe the world was flat, he also seemed to have a tinge of racism in him. STILL at the time Luther stood up for what wasn't popular in the Vatican. Surely the Vatican spoke the loudest over Luther. Yet centuries later, those Protestant Lutherans are still around, still stuffy and still finding ways to laugh at the stuffiness..."This is most certainly true."
jeff47
(26,549 posts)You don't like that conservatives are publicly defining what it is to be Christian.
You are now attacking me for that. Why? I can not change the status quo because I am not a Christian.
Luther nailed his theses to the church door. He engaged the public. He said "those people are wrong", and he did so VERY LOUDLY.
You are whispering in a crowded shopping mall and complaining that no one hears you.
If you want to be heard, you will have to nail your own theses to the church door. Otherwise, the conservatives who have been shouting for decades will be the only ones heard.
What I'm trying to get across is you have to solve this problem. You can not rely on us to fix it for you.
Why? I really don't care about it.
I'm attacking Fallwell, Robertson and the other right-wing Christians because they are right-wing. I don't give a damn that they try to use Christianity as a fig leaf. There is no way I can take that fig leaf from them because I am not a Christian.
You can take that fig leaf away. But you're gonna need some parchment, a few nails and a church door.
Dreamer Tatum
(10,926 posts)I don't see too many of them objecting when God is called Invisible Sky Daddy or
Jesus is referred to as Jeebus incessantly, or when the Bible is referred to as
fiction, and so on.
So maybe there aren't many of them, or they're pretty meek.
yawnmaster
(2,812 posts)lib2DaBone
(8,124 posts)with very little scrutiny and less thought.. it became obvious that 911 was an inside job and false flag attack.
Bush Jr, Cheney and the Neocons need a smokescreen to keep people occupied and stumbling around in the dark.
Religion (God, Guns, and Gays).. the perfect tri-fecta.
The Corporate Weapon whores also needed an "enemy" or bogyman.
With the Soviet Union threat all but gone.. the big money hacks needed a new revenue stream.
Enter the War on Terror.. the war on Muslims.. TSA, Homeland Security, Manchurian Shooters in movie theaters.. Timothy McVeigh, ..all right on time ...and the American people none the wiser.
Jamaal510
(10,893 posts)IMO, one cannot be a true Christian while simultaneously supporting policies that intrude in other people's sex lives and take away spending power from the working-class.
patrice
(47,992 posts)patrice
(47,992 posts)riverbendviewgal
(4,252 posts)and I also believe that people should not be bullied by those who profess to be so Christian and know what Jesus said in his time..
If Gabby wants to believe in Jesus...I have no problem with that.
The best description of Jesus and his life is out of the book URANTIA
I read the whole part on his life and it is the most believable account of Jesus. I don't believe Jesus would hate anyone.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Urantia_Book
I didn''t any other part of the book...a bit surreal and the book is HUGE.
My faith as a child was Catholic. Now I am agnostic/atheist. Still deciding.
raouldukelives
(5,178 posts)You could fill a book with the ways your standard "Conservative Christian" fails at being a Christian. In fact, it would be far simpler to just imagine a Bizzaro Christian.
They always howl about patriotism but time after time they are on the front lines pushing the meaning of traitor to new glorious levels.
They love, love, love, love America but not as much as they love raping her citizens and lands for money.
They sure do care about the sanctity of marriage and the darn welfare queens but not about their own infidelities of billions of dollars in free money for global corporations.
Maybe they are just Bizzaro Americans.
HiPointDem
(20,729 posts)the late 70s/80s. deliberately promoted and funded.
i think the same thing is true with islam & judaism (& i can guess that similar things are happening with far eastern religions)
the reasons i can only speculate on.
greyl
(22,990 posts)Not even close, not in the least, not at all.
-humanist
WCGreen
(45,558 posts)Seriously, I have had my doubts and personal reason but when the conservative came out and started to sermonize on how if you come to Jesus and give us money, you will be rewarded....
All these entrepreneurial "churches" that are preaching as if Jesus was on the other side standing with Herod and the Phrases instead of out with the down trodden and huddled masses...
So, I don't trust people who think that you can financially prosper if you accept the Lord into your heart
Dawson Leery
(19,348 posts)they have a special personal relationship with Jesus/God which empowers them to do anything.
Example:
Consider the size of the the universe, everything that exists. If God made everything that existed, we are supposed to believe that a sports player who claims a personal existence with God, has this divine being personally guiding their every move? God is assisting them to run a 1/10th of a second faster than an opponent, or swim a 20th of a second faster, or score another point in a tied game?
Really? A sports game is the most important thing for God?
jmondine
(1,649 posts)CabCurious
(954 posts)99Forever
(14,524 posts)When the rest of the Christians didn't stand up to their insanity.
They are loud and obnoxious, the rest are invisible.
eShirl
(18,479 posts)sweetapogee
(1,168 posts)Jesus said in Mat 10:16 "I am sending you out like sheep among wolves. Therefore be as shrewd as snakes and as innocent as doves." NIV
Good advice I think.
2pooped2pop
(5,420 posts)but it is obvious that this is a party that does not believe in God. They just use it to rouse the idiots. There is a feeling that those that spout about God are good. It's just marketing for the republicons. It they were true believers, they would know their actions are sending them to hell. They don't believe.
Neither do I, but I don't claim to stand with God.
I think maybe the false prophet stuff might be a good explanation and the true believers ought to pay more attention to the idiots they follow.
Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)cbdo2007
(9,213 posts)allowed here.
catbyte
(34,341 posts)Yet another thing to thank Ronald Reagan for.
still_one
(92,061 posts)hifiguy
(33,688 posts)I'd say that in the modern era it was when the assholes on the reichwing shouted everyone else down. What is appalling is that the Falwells and Robertsons got so little pushback from those who identify as christians and actually try to live by the words attributed to Jesus regarding charity, brotherhood and unity.
But they have no one to blame for that but themselves.
marlakay
(11,428 posts)and not trying to shove it down my throat
I have more of a problem with my religious neighbors who cuss, yell, drink and generally are less moral than those of us who don't believe
But that said, I have many christian friends who actually live what they believe, are good giving loving people and we both should be able to believe or not believe what we want as long as it doesn't hurt others.
DearAbby
(12,461 posts)Stand up and call these people what they are, they are not Christian, they are MONEYTHEISTS. of the Prosperity Gospel. Take back your faith.
MNBrewer
(8,462 posts)spanone
(135,795 posts)republicans embraced their paranoia. reinforced their fears.
we had the christian coalition....
preachers like pat robertson should have been slapped with fines and forced to pay federal taxes.