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Mon Sep 17, 2018, 09:41 AM

So I see that Morning Joe contributor Donny Deutsch just said (among other things)

"Women are taking over this country." He is right, even though that takeover is a slow moving train that will take a long time reaching it's destination. It can't happen quickly enough, though the pace will definitely accelerate this fall. The thing is, generally speaking, when women take power they share it. All of us will benefit, the vast majority of men included, in that form of society. Most men are far more frequently "oppressed" by other men than they ever would be by women in power who, by and large, will welcome any valuable input from any sources.

And the same goes for people of color. I eagerly await the coming changes.

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Reply So I see that Morning Joe contributor Donny Deutsch just said (among other things) (Original post)
Tom Rinaldo Sep 17 OP
Jarqui Sep 17 #1
Tom Rinaldo Sep 17 #4
Jarqui Sep 17 #13
Tom Rinaldo Sep 17 #14
Jarqui Sep 17 #16
dlk Sep 17 #2
Wounded Bear Sep 17 #3
Tom Rinaldo Sep 17 #7
NewJeffCT Sep 17 #9
Tom Rinaldo Sep 17 #10
Zambero Sep 17 #5
InAbLuEsTaTe Sep 17 #6
stonecutter357 Sep 17 #8
forgotmylogin Sep 17 #11
Power 2 the People Sep 17 #12
JustABozoOnThisBus Sep 17 #15

Response to Tom Rinaldo (Original post)

Mon Sep 17, 2018, 09:45 AM

1. I do not care for his wording

Without giving it as much thought as it deserves, this represents my thoughts better:
"Women are moving closer to taking their rightful, equal place in this country."

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Response to Jarqui (Reply #1)

Mon Sep 17, 2018, 09:50 AM

4. I get that. But my point is that when women gain power they do not exercise strong control

not in the same way that men typically do anyway (with obvious room for exceptions to the rule). So women taking over in my mind speaks to people deposing a form of rule that tends to shut most Americans out of the influence they deserve over all matters that concern them. It is more IMO than just women taking their rightful, equal place in this country - which of course is just. It opens the door to all of us having far more of that regardless of gender.

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Response to Tom Rinaldo (Reply #4)

Mon Sep 17, 2018, 01:37 PM

13. "when women gain power they do not exercise strong control ...

not in the same way that men typically do anyway (with obvious room for exceptions to the rule)."

I don't feel that way. Every leader has their own style. Beyond that:

I like the job Nancy Pelosi has done but it nothing to do with her gender.

I preferred Bernie Sanders over Hillary - not because he was a man - because I liked him and his policies better. Ditto for Obama.

I preferred Hillary Clinton handily over Trump not because she was a woman - but because I thought she would make a better president and I definitely liked her policies better.

Elizabeth Warren and Kamala Harris are a couple of Democrats I would consider seriously for 2020 - not because they are women - because they might be the best Democrat for the job.

However those women exercise control is strong and just fine with me.

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Response to Jarqui (Reply #13)

Mon Sep 17, 2018, 01:56 PM

14. Strong leadership - yes. Strong Control, not exactly

I wrote this OP for discussion purposes because the comment I referenced sparked a reaction in me and I wanted to explore it here with others I respect. I realize I am nuancing the use of words such as: strong, power, control, leadership, and making some subjective distinctions that others may not share in the same way.

Yes Nancy Pelosi is a strong leader who maintains control of her caucus. When I wrote "strong control" I meant to imply the use of raw power to subject others to one's will. I do not see that as Pelosi's leadership style - I think she is a strong woman with good leadership skills who inspires loyalty in others who respect her leadership, to some degree because she doesn't seek to dominate them. In my life experience I've seen that leadership style from both genders, but in upper positions I tend to see it more frequently in women - and that tends to empower others in those organizations regardless of gender. But yes I know good male leaders who do the same.

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Response to Tom Rinaldo (Reply #14)

Mon Sep 17, 2018, 02:28 PM

16. In my opinion, Obama has been the best president of my 64 years.

He led something like Pelosi, didn't he?

But both have demonstrated "strong control" with persuasion, reason, etc - not so much by clubbing someone over the head.

Hillary would have been a no nonsense president governing with ample "strong control"

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Response to Tom Rinaldo (Original post)

Mon Sep 17, 2018, 09:46 AM

2. Given the Job Men Have Done, are They Worried Women Will Mess Things Up?

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Response to Tom Rinaldo (Original post)

Mon Sep 17, 2018, 09:46 AM

3. That's kind of a bullshit way to look at it...

It's not a zero sum game. As the old saying goes, "White people tend to racism because they don't want POC to treat them like they have treated POC all these years."

Problem is, that is not what POC-and in this case, women-actually want. At least not in my experience.

POC and women, by and large, want to be treated as equals, as real citizens with equal protections and opportunities.

I know it's kind of subtle for the average Trumplodyte/Tea Partier to understand. I'd advise them to grow up, adults usually don't have problems with a bit of subtlety when looking at complex issues.

I do look forward to the changes, but statements like the above (by Deutsch) only promote fear.

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Response to Wounded Bear (Reply #3)

Mon Sep 17, 2018, 09:56 AM

7. See my reply above

Yes those men who are inclined to be fearful over "losing control" may react with fear to such a statement. And I would not suggest that the Democratic Party adopt it as an official slogan. Of course I agree that it is not a zero sum game, and I know that it is right wing framing to describe it that way. I however see this as a win/win. Women are 51% of the American public. When they have a just degree of representation "in positions of power", as opposed to how our nation is run currently, my voice too, male as I am, will be better heard than is now the case.

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Response to Tom Rinaldo (Reply #7)

Mon Sep 17, 2018, 10:08 AM

9. I'm hoping for a country

where it's no big deal anymore when a woman and/or person of color wins the presidency, governorship, Senate, House, etc or holds the CEO position of a Fortune 100 company.

When Hillary Clinton lost in 2016, I was more disappointed for my then 13 year old daughter than for myself because I was hoping she was going to be able to grow up in a world where it's not unusual that a woman became president following 8 years of a black man being president. (Not counting my fear of what Trump would be as president - this was just on a personal level)

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Response to NewJeffCT (Reply #9)

Mon Sep 17, 2018, 10:13 AM

10. THIS

The paradox is that the transition to that nation that we seek requires repeated observation of the fact that is not simply a "normal" and neutral state of affairs that men occupy such a high percentage of the positions of power in our society.

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Response to Tom Rinaldo (Original post)

Mon Sep 17, 2018, 09:50 AM

5. Better late than never!

Donald Trump truly represents the epitome of evil to those citizens who care enough to be informed. At the same time, his abhorrent actions and words are triggering some very good things these days. Hopefully to lead to some very good outcomes that will help to get us back on track!

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Response to Tom Rinaldo (Original post)

Mon Sep 17, 2018, 09:52 AM

6. The time is WAY overdue for women and POC to take over the reigns of power.

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Response to Tom Rinaldo (Original post)

Mon Sep 17, 2018, 10:02 AM

8. Disgusting OP !

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Response to Tom Rinaldo (Original post)

Mon Sep 17, 2018, 12:07 PM

11. I, for one, welcome the takeover by our strong Sisters and Mothers. (n/t)

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Response to Tom Rinaldo (Original post)

Mon Sep 17, 2018, 12:19 PM

12. Long time coming

We need to take the testosterone out of our foreign policy.

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Response to Tom Rinaldo (Original post)

Mon Sep 17, 2018, 02:21 PM

15. Well, ok, as long as they're Democratic women. nt

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