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Fri Sep 14, 2018, 07:13 AM

TIME's new cover: This is what it's like to be a teacher in America

TIME’s new cover: This is what it’s like to be a teacher in America



For many teachers, this year’s uprising is decades in the making. The country’s roughly 3.2 million full-time public-school teachers (kindergarten through high school) are experiencing some of the worst wage stagnation of any profession, earning less on average, in inflation-­adjusted dollars, than they did in 1990, according to Department of Education (DOE) data.

Meanwhile, the pay gap between teachers and other comparably educated professionals is now the largest on record. In 1994, public-school teachers in the U.S. earned 1.8% less per week than comparable workers, according to the Economic Policy Institute (EPI), a left-leaning think tank. By last year, they made 18.7% less. The situation is particularly grim in states such as Oklahoma, where teachers’ inflation-adjusted salaries actually decreased by about $8,000 in the last decade, to an average of $45,245 in 2016, according to DOE data. In Arizona, teachers’ average inflation-adjusted annual wages are down $5,000.



MORE:
http://time.com/longform/teaching-in-america/?xid=time_socialflow_twitter&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=time


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Reply TIME's new cover: This is what it's like to be a teacher in America (Original post)
kpete Sep 14 OP
mucifer Sep 14 #1
Nitram Sep 14 #2
mucifer Sep 14 #4
Nitram Sep 14 #14
Cuthbert Allgood Sep 14 #42
jayschool2013 Sep 14 #57
whathehell Sep 14 #65
seaglass Sep 14 #5
SunSeeker Sep 14 #51
pangaia Sep 14 #3
Name removed Sep 14 #68
SummerSnow Sep 14 #6
Soph0571 Sep 14 #10
Merlot Sep 14 #30
radical noodle Sep 14 #35
Merlot Sep 14 #55
TeamPooka Sep 14 #56
certainot Sep 14 #31
appalachiablue Sep 14 #38
certainot Sep 14 #58
lindysalsagal Sep 14 #66
ck4829 Sep 14 #50
AllyCat Sep 14 #7
bucolic_frolic Sep 14 #8
Cuthbert Allgood Sep 14 #45
bucolic_frolic Sep 14 #49
SWBTATTReg Sep 14 #9
calimary Sep 14 #11
zentrum Sep 14 #12
workinclasszero Sep 14 #19
aggiesal Sep 14 #28
ck4829 Sep 14 #25
Freethinker65 Sep 14 #29
appalachiablue Sep 14 #40
zentrum Sep 15 #78
BSdetect Sep 14 #13
justgamma Sep 14 #37
Bernardo de La Paz Sep 14 #15
appalachiablue Sep 14 #41
workinclasszero Sep 14 #16
JDC Sep 14 #17
oasis Sep 14 #18
lillypaddle Sep 14 #20
randr Sep 14 #21
HopeAgain Sep 14 #22
appalachiablue Sep 14 #43
blueinredohio Sep 14 #23
ck4829 Sep 14 #24
smirkymonkey Sep 14 #26
LastLiberal in PalmSprings Sep 14 #27
Name removed Sep 14 #67
Yavin4 Sep 14 #32
Shoonra Sep 14 #33
OKNancy Sep 14 #34
PoindexterOglethorpe Sep 14 #36
MissB Sep 15 #73
PoindexterOglethorpe Sep 15 #74
RayOfHope Sep 15 #75
PoindexterOglethorpe Sep 15 #77
aggiesal Sep 14 #39
appalachiablue Sep 14 #48
essme Sep 14 #44
marlakay Sep 14 #54
Uncle Joe Sep 14 #46
moondust Sep 14 #47
eppur_se_muova Sep 14 #52
3Hotdogs Sep 14 #53
Hekate Sep 14 #59
cp Sep 14 #60
tavernier Sep 14 #61
Demovictory9 Sep 14 #62
whathehell Sep 14 #63
BigmanPigman Sep 14 #64
Name removed Sep 14 #69
AwakeAtLast Sep 14 #70
RayOfHope Sep 15 #76
DFW Sep 15 #71
Amimnoch Sep 15 #72

Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 07:37 AM

1. That's horrible. There is a huge discrepancy though in some states

teachers in Chicago have AMAZING pensions.

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Response to mucifer (Reply #1)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 07:44 AM

2. If the city goes bankrupt those pensions will disappear overnight.

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Response to Nitram (Reply #2)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 07:53 AM

4. It can't be overnight. The state of Illinois would have to change it's constitution

that takes time. We are deeply in debt.

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Response to mucifer (Reply #4)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 08:16 AM

14. You'd be surprised how fast pensions get lost in the negotiations over bankruptcy.

Take Detroit, for example:

"Five years after Detroit's bankruptcy filing, retiree Barbara Yokom feels the financial hit each time she pays about $940 a month for health coverage...Health care wasn't the only hit, of course. Yokom saw a cut to her pension. She also was part of a group that had to hand over extra money that was part of a savings plan. She ended up turning over nearly $45,000 in what was known as a "clawback."

https://www.freep.com/story/money/personal-finance/susan-tompor/2018/07/18/detroit-bankruptcy-retirees-pension/759446002/

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Response to mucifer (Reply #4)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 10:12 AM

42. If there is no money, there's no money.

I know teachers in Illinois. They are worried. Our fund in Wisconsin is in great shape. So it is a state-by-state thing.

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #42)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 01:59 PM

57. Colorado froze our cost-of-living pension increase

We retirees from Colorado PERA are in the first year of a two-year freeze. Of course, this is my second year of retirement from Colorado, so I haven't received any increases. Thank goodness I'm now teaching in Iowa.

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Response to mucifer (Reply #4)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 07:31 PM

65. Having billionnaire Repuke Rauner as Governor doesn't help..

He of the failed "'Turn around'and trash your Union" agenda.

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Response to mucifer (Reply #1)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 07:55 AM

5. Yes, there is a wide disparity I think between states/districts. My daughter is a teacher in a

middle to upper middle class district and she gets paid well. She is worth every penny, I know how hard and how many hours she works.

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Response to seaglass (Reply #5)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 11:32 AM

51. Yes, shamefully, US school funding depends in large part on property taxes.

So the rich neighborhoods lavish their schools with money, while poor neighborhoods have nothing. It is a national scandal that cements income nequality in childhood. The rich kids get a head start. Poor kids get a kick in the head. And of course, a lot of this local funding set up has to do with racism. Many white Americans do not want to pay for the eduction of black and brown kids. Same reason we don't have universal healthcare.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 07:45 AM

3. Plus so many have to teach that insane common core shit.



disgusting.

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Response to pangaia (Reply #3)


Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 07:57 AM

6. Wow, why does the govt hate teachers?

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Response to SummerSnow (Reply #6)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 08:07 AM

10. They impart knowledge to the next generation and this government wants to keep them ill informed

If they are informed individuals when they get to voting age no way in hell would they consider voting republican. Keep them stupid so they can stay in power = disempower teachers so that they can't do their jobs properly

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Response to SummerSnow (Reply #6)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 09:29 AM

30. Not the gov't, just republicans.

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Response to Merlot (Reply #30)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 09:50 AM

35. No, not just republicans

Arne Duncan was not a friend of teachers either.

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Response to radical noodle (Reply #35)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 01:14 PM

55. True about arnie. But as a whole, the democratic platform doesn't

call for privitization/defuning of public schools.

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Response to Merlot (Reply #30)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 01:24 PM

56. right now the government IS Repulican. But they hate it for a few reasons. Religion and money at the

center of it.

Republicans and the Christian right want Jesus in the schools.
Destroying public education helps that cause.

GOP businesses want to turn education into a for profit business, like prisons.
Destroying public education helps that cause.

Lastly, an ignorant population beholden to Jesus works better for the GOP than a free thinking agnostic society.
Destroying public education helps that cause.

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Response to SummerSnow (Reply #6)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 09:32 AM

31. govt is us. we let 1500 radio stations spew pub ed privatization bullshit for 30 years

all over over the country hating unions, demeaning and hating "overpaid" "liberal" (thinking ) teachers, electing privatizing ayn randian sex-on-the-wrong-brain assholes.

if the kochs would pay $1000/hr for a 1 hr radio infomercial, 1200 stations doing 15 hrs a day have been worth about $5BIL FREE for that crap. for 30 years.

even worse, we let 88 universities (www.republiconradio.org) endorse 260 limbaugh/kkk stations, many of the loudest in the country. there's no excuse for them not to look for apolitical alts to broadcast sports on, especially with all the global warming denial and racism on those stations.

ironically, those stations are very dependent on college and pro black athletes to bring in advertising to pay for all that, while they all attack kneeling athletes. and they call them unpatriotic while they support trump and might as well be working for putin.

and all it would take is for 1 uni to start looking for apolitical alts to get others to follow, and advertising for rw radio would head for the hills.

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Response to certainot (Reply #31)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 10:03 AM

38. The awful state of radio, thanks again for explaining. The apathy

over this is concerning and much damage has taken place.

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Response to appalachiablue (Reply #38)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 02:08 PM

58. thanks. it may be up to mueller to find out putin's been paying limbaugh or

something like that, since our orgs are failing to do anything

but it's talk radio that's enabling most of the mueller resistance, with limbaugh and sons attacking the 'deep state' and will still get them a lot of undeserved election wins, kavenaugh, and bargaining power because of the 'base' - just a pack of dittoheads with 300 blowhards filling their sails

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Response to certainot (Reply #31)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 07:31 PM

66. Thank you.

We get the schools we demand. And that's what we give our own children.

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Response to SummerSnow (Reply #6)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 11:24 AM

50. Good question

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 08:03 AM

7. Thanks a ton Koch whores.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 08:03 AM

8. Unequal district funding

Senior teachers in my county can make in excess of $100k per year. Superintendents paid as much as the President. States need to have a dialogue about uneven funding, taxation, pay grades, seniority. The well-off portions of older Americans have earned it, but others are not, and have worked and spent too. So something could be more balanced. In my quick take on it, anyway.

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Response to bucolic_frolic (Reply #8)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 10:14 AM

45. Public school teachers make a 6-figure salary?

I find that hard to believe.

Are you sure you aren't including benefits in there for that number?

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #45)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 10:34 AM

49. I was going to give you a researched range and what I recall from articles BUT

this will explain what I'm talking about fairly well.

https://patch.com/pennsylvania/doylestown/teacher-salaries-bucks-county-how-does-central-bucks-compare

In a dozen school districts there's not an average salary below $75,000. As to whether that includes benefits ... dunno.

Seems to me I recall an article where a football coach with years of seniority earned over $100k but it's my memory so I couldn't swear to it.

And there is this: https://patch.com/pennsylvania/newhope-lambertville/50-pennsylvania-school-districts-where-teachers-are-paid-most

"Note: the salary numbers include only base salary and do not take into account money earned from additional duties."

I'm having a hard time feeling empathy for these underpaid teachers. Especially when one considers the level of property taxes to pay for them here.

So yes, to answer your question, many of these districts have average salaries from $80 to $99k, without benefits, and since that's an average, seniority salaries are more, new hires are less, and the seniors in their pre-retirement years could well be earning over $100k.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 08:04 AM

9. The mantra of cut taxes, cut taxes, cut taxes in order to gain political office (the repugs in ...)

particular who use this an an excuse) is irresponsible and ignorant of the fact that state governments do pay quite a few bills (teacher's salaries, repair roads, lots of other stuff) and when someone runs (or a group) for public office promising to cut taxes etc., and then they replace the cut taxes/salaries etc. with some so called promise that the cut taxes would result in an economic miracle (like in KS) and all of the required funds (that were cut by repugs) would magically materialize to pay all of the bills.

Didn't work. It doesn't take an economics major to figure this out.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 08:13 AM

11. Pretty pathetic that America has to be smacked in the face like this.

WHAT will it take? WHAT will it take - to recognize how tremendously important and critically necessary the teaching profession is?

Dear God! We NEED our teachers! We need to support and assist them, and have their backs every minute of every day. We trust our precious children to them for at least a third of their lives while they’re school-age. Figure roughly 1/3 of a 24 hour day goes to sleep, 1/3 to on-duty/work/school, and the last third to off-duty/family interaction.

Teaching is HARD work. I’ve done a little myself. And heck, I only taught an individual class at any given time. The prep work alone is almost an entirely separate job, in and of itself! And any good teacher recognizes that to stay good, it’s like exercising to stay fit. You have to keep up. You’v got to be studying and working on your craft and always expanding and learning new things and techniques. You can’t afford to stop and sit and calcify. You’re a knowledge curator and broker. And the more you know, the better a teacher you can be. And that means you never really take a vacation. You’re ALWAYS working. Every day’s experiences are part of the lesson prep. And that’s not counting actual class time, and YOUR “homework” grading all those papers and tests and reports.

God! It takes work. It’s a GARGANTUAN responsibility because it’s on our teachers to get our kids ready for the future. It should AT LEAST pay our teachers a decent wage!

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 08:14 AM

12. DeVos privatization

........style thinking is at the root of this shameful de-funding.

They want to destroy all public ownership including Medicare, SS, the post office, and the military. They are now drowning our education system in the bathtub.

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Response to zentrum (Reply #12)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 08:33 AM

19. Yup

This is part of an ongoing process by the damned republican party to destroy this country for the average citizen.

While Shitler waves race hate in his bases face to keep them occupied, shit like this goes on in the background.

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Response to workinclasszero (Reply #19)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 09:25 AM

28. I agree, but ...

you have to ask yourself;
How many of those teachers vote for Greedy One Percent (GOP) candidates?

If statistics hold for teachers, then half are voting for the party that stagnates
their wages.

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Response to zentrum (Reply #12)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 09:17 AM

25. +1

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Response to zentrum (Reply #12)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 09:27 AM

29. +1000

And let students be taught by uncertified teachers in unregulated schools (both for profit and non-profit) that can hand select their students from the public pool while syphoning taxpayer funds.

Do not worry, if you have money, great schools will still be available and if you make enough to send your kids to one, you might even get a tax break. And those same kids will be able to afford the unpaid internships where they effectively pay for the work experience necessary to compete for real jobs.

Good luck to the average American child.

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Response to zentrum (Reply #12)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 10:07 AM

40. Righto, privatize all of it for profit- schools, roads, hospitals,

and more. How much longer PBS & NPR will last, though they've been receiving some corporate funds for a while.

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Response to appalachiablue (Reply #40)

Sat Sep 15, 2018, 10:21 PM

78. NPR has decided so far

....to fight back hard. They have shows that are more and more critical of Trump and all aspects of what's happening to our 3 branches and tax structure. He's pushed them left.

So if they are going to be defunded and I fear you're right---they intend to rally us---and fight back.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 08:16 AM

13. Union members?

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Response to BSdetect (Reply #13)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 10:00 AM

37. You hit it on the nose.

Pukes hate unions with a passion. They've been going after teachers for years. They finally convinced their peons that teachers are making a fortune.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 08:21 AM

15. The median starting salary in Canada is $50,000 and health care is free nationwide.


That's Canadian dollars, but the cost of living is lower and did I mention health care is free?

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Response to Bernardo de La Paz (Reply #15)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 10:11 AM

41. Good info. about Canada, tx. They're better in so many areas

and what a shame most Americans are clueless. Unionization in Canada is still 30%, their banks don't get into risky speculation and they became the No. 1 middle class for the first time several years ago. The US held that position for decades, now we're around 17.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 08:27 AM

16. This is sickening and bloody outrageous!

The damned GOP is throwing trillions of dollars at billionaires and blowing up the deficit while teachers are barely surviving!

TRILLIONS for our bloated military and not one damn penny for teachers!

Of course the last thing the GOP wants is an educated voter so teachers pay the price for that!

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 08:30 AM

17. These make me ashamed

My wife teaches Kindies at a private school and I will be completely honest, her income is just spending money for us. It would never be enough to live on.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 08:30 AM

18. Damn shame. America has got to do better. nt

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 08:39 AM

20. Pathetic and shameful

They should look for jobs that pay better. Maybe when the teachers start to disappear, the gov't will get a clue.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 08:44 AM

21. Out teachers are treated this way because a certain political party

hates children that are not in a womb.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 09:10 AM

22. Education of the general public is not in the best interests of the GOP.

Educated people only vote GOP if they have more than their share and don't want to share anything with anybody.

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Response to HopeAgain (Reply #22)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 10:13 AM

43. Righto. No more educated, well employed & large middle class. pfft!

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 09:10 AM

23. My nephew who goes to Kent State

said other students were shocked that people in our area always vote for whatever the school puts on the ballot here. I don't know what teachers are paid here but it must not be bad because you never hear any complaints.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 09:16 AM

24. It's OK though...

DeVos is working hard to make sure teachers can buy guns at a discount.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 09:21 AM

26. This is just shameful in a nation as wealthy as ours.

Education should be a priority and teachers should be well paid in order to insure we get and retain the best and the brightest. The republicans basically want to gut the public education system in this country to ensure that they have more mindless voters and industry fodder. This is by design.

Democrats need to make the elevation of public education a priority.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 09:23 AM

27. I'm a sub, mostly for the local middle school.

Usually I'm the only one teaching, so when the kids are absolute brats I expect it, since I remember considering having a sub as being a "play day." (Surprisingly, except for the sixth graders the students in the elementary schools are attentive and respectful.)

There are a few classes where I co-teach, helping the students with their assignments. I'm surprised at how disrespectful the students are toward the teacher. They sit in the back and chatter through the class, they get up and wander around to get a tissue or sharpen their pencils or just give a friend a hug or a whack on the head--all while the teacher is talking. I usually yank the offenders (one time it was five students) out of the class and stand with them silently outside for around ten minutes -- it drives them crazy because they had girded themselves to be yelled at. Then I'll explain why I removed them from the class and we'll go back in. I never threaten them with disciplinary action, just let them know I took them out so the teacher could do their job without being interrupted. One class was so disrespectful overall that the teacher was almost in tears when it was over.

About a quarter of the students come to class unprepared, and have to borrow a pencil . In middle school I make them leave their cellphone or a shoe as collateral.

I know part of this is because we live in a poor area of the county, where the students are raised by their grandparents while the father or mother are in jail on drug charges. Too many have told me they didn't care about school because they're going to live on the street. That really hurts.

Principals have told me they're glad I'm there because the children don't get a lot of positive experiences with males in their lives. I try never to raise my voice, choosing to control the class and individual students with hand signals. I also don't treat them like they're my friends, which is something a lot of the other male teachers do. They know I care about them, and when I correct their behavior it's not because I'm angry with them. When a boy wants to "high five" I'll turn it into a handshake, and tell the young man, "This is how men greet each other." Surprisingly, I get a lot of boys coming over to shake my hand and wish me a good day.

I do not know how the teachers do this job day in and day out. It wears me out just to work three days a week.

Despite this the teachers keep showing up, keep doing their best to teach the students. I don't know what they get paid -- I know that subs get paid shit --but whatever it is, they deserve more.

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Response to LastLiberal in PalmSprings (Reply #27)


Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 09:40 AM

32. Well, its not like education is important in a globally competitive economy

We'll just slap tariffs on everything and good paying, low skilled jobs will magically appear at our doorstep. MAIA (Make America Ignorant Again).

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 09:45 AM

33. This is a matter of national security ....

While we are all gung-ho to send kids to college and have them learn the technical skills to keep our country prosperous and strong, the elementary and secondary school teachers are being beaten and starved financially, and being coerced out of the profession or at least hobbled in it. The result should be regarded as a serious national security issue.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 09:49 AM

34. I started working as a substitute teacher this year

When my husband died last Nov. it became clear to me that I need to go back to work at age 69. The pay isn't good, but it will help me stay in my home a little longer I hope. Cancer not only drains your life, but even with insurance, it drains your savings!!

Anyway, teachers are definitely not paid enough. It's exhausting work... but also rewarding. No matter the rewards, I wouldn't do it if I didn't have to.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 09:58 AM

36. While I agree that teachers should absolutely be paid more,

some of the individual stories don't make real sense to me. They'll report a wage of $50-60,000/year, and claim they still need an extra job or two to make ends meet. A lot of people manage somehow on significantly less than that. Yes, starting pay in many places is often abysmal, but after a couple of decades the pay is decent. Plus, many of them have spouses or partners who are presumably working.

I was once in a conversation with an elementary school teacher who was complaining about how little she made, and when I asked her just how poorly she was paid, she told me she made $60,000/year. I have never earned that much in my life.

I realize this makes me seem completely heartless. I'm not. I will repeat, teachers should be paid more. They also should get a fuck of a lot more support from administration and parents. The stories I hear about ill-behaved students enrage me. When I was in school we were expected to sit quietly at our desks, and very little note passing ever went on.

The underlying problem of poor teacher pay is, in my opinion, rooted in the fact that too many people who don't currently have children in the public school system simply don't understand that a strong educational system benefits everyone. Taxes are a dirty word to far too many. There is zero sense of the common good, and worse yet, a sense that anyone can baby-sit a bunch of kids. Because a lot of people view teaching as baby-sitting.

The really sad point is that this cover story probably won't change a thing.

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Response to PoindexterOglethorpe (Reply #36)

Sat Sep 15, 2018, 07:30 AM

73. They may have more in student loans than the average American.

At least around here, you are required to obtain your master’s degree within a certain number of years. It’s not a field where you can get your master’s degree paid for- generally you’ll owe for both under grad and grad degrees.

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Response to MissB (Reply #73)

Sat Sep 15, 2018, 09:52 AM

74. Perhaps. But my casual observation of the student loan debacle

is that the biggest problem with them is students who take out massive loans while taking five or six years to complete a degree in which there are few if any jobs. Like anthropology. Or 17th century French literature.

While teaching may not pay as well as some fields, there are jobs there. It's a rare year when newly graduated teachers cannot easily find a job. Sometimes a person needs to be willing to be a sub for the first year, or may need to relocate a short distance away if the nearest school district isn't hiring at the moment, but almost always the jobs are there.

Unfortunately, most fields don't pay for you to get your master's, although some companies will do so if you are already working for them. The hard sciences are a pleasant exception. Tuition is forgiven, fees are probably forgiven, and you'll get a stipend that may be enough to live on, depending on where you are attending school. I know all about this because my son is in a PhD program in astronomy, and not only does he get all of the above, but he gets sent off on conferences, all expenses paid. Wow.

And again, most of the stories I see aren't of new teachers who are making $17k/year, but of teachers long in the field who are making decent wages, making more than a lot of other people out there.

The other issue is that it's not breaking news that teachers, especially in the early years, are not well paid. I remember teachers when I was in school -- and I graduated high school in 1965 -- complaining about it. It's among the reasons that in this country teaching is such a female profession. The assumption was always that a woman would have a husband, which back then was a reasonable assumption.

I will add this: I chose to send my sons to a private school for reasons that were personal to them. It was an excellent decision. But I was often unpopular among the other parents because whenever one of them said they shouldn't have to pay school taxes because their kid was in a private school, I strongly and vocally disagreed. Strong public schools ought to be the foundation of our country, and all of us, whether or not we currently have kids in school, need to support them, financially and otherwise.

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Response to PoindexterOglethorpe (Reply #36)

Sat Sep 15, 2018, 10:09 AM

75. Here might be the thing about that $60K--

that teacher may bring home significantly less than that.

In my state, teachers pay into retirement, I think its around 12% of your salary, and its mandatory. Then taxes on top of that. Then insurance. For me personally, I carry health insurance for my two children, dental insurance for our whole family. None of these insurance plans are great, so when we do use them, what we pay out of pocket is pretty significant.

When all is said and done, I bring home only 55% of my gross pay.

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Response to RayOfHope (Reply #75)

Sat Sep 15, 2018, 01:32 PM

77. That's true of a lot of people.

Taxes, insurance, retirement contributions, all take a similar toll on most people.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 10:07 AM

39. Everybody wants the services ...

but nobody wants to pay for them.

I live in a Right leaning area of San Diego.
Whenever there is a school proposition on the ballot, I hear
"I don't have any kids in the schools system anymore, so why should I vote
to increase salaries (or improve school facilities or ...)?"

Do I jump down their throats!!!!

I first ask them, "Where did you go to school?"
The huge majority always mention a public high school or university.
I then ask them, "Who do you think paid for your education."
They always answer "My parents."

Not even close. In San Diego County it costs approximately $10,000 to educate
1 student per year.
Property taxes are usually where the schools get their funding.
I pay around $12,000 per year in property taxes.
Of that $12K, about 10% is budgeted for the schools, so that's about $1,200.
I have a daughter. If I only paid $1,200 per year for 12 years that's $14,400
from Kindergarten to graduation. Yet it costs $120,000 to educate her.

Where did the remaining $106,000 come from?
From everyone reading this, that's where.

I tell them, that it's their turn to pony up the cost of their own education, not their
kids.

I went to public school myself. I think I got a really good education. My university
studies was primary subsidized by the government through grants and scholarships.
I would have to pay $1,200 for the next 88 years to cover my daughters cost of education,
and some more to cover my own education.

There is a saying that "High Tides lifts every boat".
A good education benefits everyone.

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Response to aggiesal (Reply #39)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 10:23 AM

48. What a shame, and I thin kthe same way. Support the next

generation, like we were- all of us attended public schools and colleges.

This selfishness seems particularly strong in the last 20+ years, which coincides with so many adopting Libertarian ideology aka selfishness, which has been heavily pushed too long by the right.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 10:13 AM

44. many teachers in NC

consider themselves conservative, and consistently vote against themselves. I asked one why and she said "abortion."

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Response to essme (Reply #44)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 11:55 AM

54. Before abortion was a political fight

Decades ago republicans cared about clean water and air, many of the things we care about.

Now politicians know they can ruin environment and other things and still get the vote because of that one thing.

I have been wishing for years there was a way to get abortion out of politics but its firmly in and I understand the fight on both sides even though I believe in choice.

People who firmly believe its murder aren’t going to change until their beliefs change.

One of the problems I get upset about with schools since my property taxes pay for them is all the religion in schools now. We are suppose to be a country of all beliefs not just one.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 10:14 AM

46. Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread kpete.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 10:20 AM

47. Education? What's that?

Inheritance is what matters now. The more you inherit the smarter and more qualified you are. Just ask Betsy.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 11:37 AM

52. But they're only supposed to work until they get married and have a man for support !

That's the way God intended it ! This is just God's punishment for failing to follow His plan !

(I'm planning to bill Pat Robertson for sevices rendered for this PSA. Oh, and the RNC, of gourse. )

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 11:42 AM

53. I left teaching in 2006.i had only a bachelors degree. my salary was $89,200 per year.

I left the day after a shooting outside my classroom.

Fortunately, I have full pension. Of $60 k per year.

I wish other teachers were as well paid.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 02:47 PM

59. KnR

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 02:49 PM

60. Powerful

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 04:52 PM

61. They should run one entitled:

I’m a senator in America.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 04:53 PM

62. kick

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 06:55 PM

63. ..And people want to know why we need Unions?

This is an appalling and inexcusable disgrace.

Today's Repukes are anti-government extremists who won't support Public Schools (or any government entity) that doesn't directly benefit the Rich -- their kids, of course, all go to Private Schools.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 07:25 PM

64. I believe the reason that this profession

is widely known as underpaid and over educated and experiences and has been for about 75 years at least is due to the large number of women in the profession. When I was teaching I know we were taken advantage of because they actually told us, "teachers won't strike, they care too much about the poor children" by the district during union bargaining. Also, with two working parents, teachers are seen as babysitters and day care services. The fact is the babysitters and day care services make more than four times what teachers do per child, per hour.

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Response to kpete (Original post)


Response to kpete (Original post)

Fri Sep 14, 2018, 10:13 PM

70. I've gotten NO pay raise 10 out of 21 years

And insurance premiums went up every year, so some years COLA was eaten.

I drive an 18 year old car and haven't had a real vacation in 18 years.

And I'm better off than others.

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Response to AwakeAtLast (Reply #70)

Sat Sep 15, 2018, 10:11 AM

76. We have gotten "raises" on occasion, but never more than 1%

Usually my check goes up only about $20-50 per month, per year. Better than nothing but yeesh.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Sat Sep 15, 2018, 01:45 AM

71. This is a story too often told in America, and the result of one party's view that education is bad

Poor education means more ignorance, and ignorance seems to create more Republicans.

NO teacher should have to need a second job or drive a 20 year old car.

Here in Germany, it is the other end of the spectrum, although it's a different system entirely that creates its own problems. Both my girls couldn't wait to get the hell out of here and continue their education in the USA (how's THAT for irony?).

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Sat Sep 15, 2018, 06:19 AM

72. Imo, this is the single biggest problem in the country.

Over the years, in many threads, letters to my worthless congress critters, and the last 4 presidents.. If we’d just fix our education system, we’d fix SO many problems.

Get the salaries and compensation packages for teachers changed from “oh you’re a teacher.. bless your heart.” To “Wow, a teacher?!?!” Make it a desirable job where those in the profession are enabled to be great!

Change the curriculums to be more in line with the modern age. For example, in math move away from manual, on paper formula, and teach our kids how to input powerful formula into spreadsheets. Make it more practical to targeted professions such as math for engineers, math for science.

Most importantly, get critical thinking and critical analysis course into our high school curriculums! Teach our children how to look past the surface message, question the source of the information, question what influences are behind those sources. Research for truth and facts. If we armed our children with critical thinking skills so many of the modern problems with politics would fix themselves:

A population armed with the ability to think critically will make the shadow money in politics worthless. It would take the power away from it, because all of those ads and information would be getting examined by critical thought.

When you drill it down, corporations don’t have a vote.. at all. The only power they have is the money they can throw into PAC’s and lobbyists to sway voters and politicians into voting the way they want. When the targets of that money (us) are examining those ads, identifying what’s driving those ads, we’re less likely to be swayed by said ads. If you can’t take away the money itself, you can take away the power that money has.

The same with foreign influences. They don’t get a vote. But if our children and population are armed with the ability to process and question information received critically, the power of propaganda goes away, or at the very least highly reduced.

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