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Tue Jul 10, 2018, 05:25 PM

Speculation (part 17)

Like many people here, I had no interest in watching the Trump show last night. It was a cheap imitation of when LBJ attempted to build suspense before the 1964 Democratic National Convention, regarding his choice for vice president. But President Johnson – for all of his faults – was a master politician, whereas Trump “ain't a pimple on a good man's ass” (to quote LBJ).

I was invited to sit down at a small meeting among grass roots activists in the early afternoon today. We had people from three different counties in rural upstate New York. These are all registered members in the Democratic Party, who write letters to elected representatives, make phone calls, attend public rallies, go door-to-door, and who always vote. After hearing some sad, yet humorous stories about acquaintances who do not grasp the implications of a news report in the biggest regional newspaper, that documented the unethical behaviors of a republican state senator from our region, we got down to work.

Our focus was twofold: to coordinate efforts to prevent Trump's USSC candidate from being confirmed, and plans to get the maximum possible voter turnout in support of Democratic Party candidates at all levels in November. And we even had a woman there that one of the county party's has asked to run for a town seat next year. Every election is important.

The conversation eventually turned to the Mueller investigation, and the nonsense that Rudy G has been spouting over the past few days. The main question was will Mr. Mueller subpoena Trump to testify in front of the grand jury, if he refuses to meet with prosecutors? That is an interesting question, of course, and at this point, one can only speculate. Thus, as I do from time to time, I speculated on one possibility that may prove to be true.

There are two factors to consider. The first is Rudy's seemingly unrealistic demand that Mr. Mueller provide any evidence that Trump may have committed a crime. Now, any good criminal defense lawyer is going to know what's up, if police want to interview their client – or if the client is called before a grand jury, where the lawyer can't be in the room. But this is distinct, in part because Rudy is a no-good criminal, who works on Trump's criminal defense team.

Rudy contradicts himself by saying they need this evidence from Mr. Mueller, and then claiming they already know everything Mr. Mueller has. It can't be both, and is most likely neither. They have communicated with the lawyers representing some other witnesses. But, even in that case, some have cut connections with Trump's team, and pleaded guilty. Flynn and Gates, for example, are cooperating with prosecutors. Rudy doesn't have a clue what they have shared.

The second factor relates directly to something Rudy does know. Trump dictated the original letter to fire Mr. Comey; Stephen Miller wrote it up. The White House counsel strongly advised not sending it. He did not do so because it provided evidence of how upset Trump was by the way Mr. Comey damaged the Clinton campaign. Rather, the focus was on the Russian investigation. And Mr. Mueller has a copy of that original letter. It is evidence of Trump's attempt to obstruct justice.

That letter is not the lone piece of evidence of obstruction. Rudy does know that. He also knows that the Justice Department has a policy that prosecutors do not subpoena targets of investigations to testify in front of a grand jury. If Rudy believes – or knows – that Trump has been upgraded from a person of interest to a target in recent weeks, he knows that it is very unlikely that Mr. Mueller would attempt to ignore that policy. More, if Mr. Rosenstein were to give Mr. Mueller the green light to subpoena Trump, it could serve as grounds to fire Rosenstein.

Rudy has said that the Trump team is focused upon public opinion, because they believe there will be an attempt to impeach Trump in 2019. Their activities with the media are in line with that. More, Malcolm Nance recently stated that the grand jury will soon indict more people, and that Mr. Mueller's report to Congress will identify Trump as an unindicted co-conspirator. Perhaps Mr. Nance also thinks that Trump has become a target of the investigation.

Speculation on my part.
H2O Man

33 replies, 3054 views

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Arrow 33 replies Author Time Post
Reply Speculation (part 17) (Original post)
H2O Man Jul 10 OP
Wellstone ruled Jul 10 #1
H2O Man Jul 10 #8
Wellstone ruled Jul 10 #13
H2O Man Jul 10 #14
Wellstone ruled Jul 10 #31
Crutchez_CuiBono Jul 10 #28
H2O Man Jul 10 #29
Crutchez_CuiBono Jul 10 #30
BigmanPigman Jul 10 #2
H2O Man Jul 10 #9
yonder Jul 10 #3
H2O Man Jul 10 #10
Hekate Jul 10 #4
H2O Man Jul 10 #15
malaise Jul 10 #5
H2O Man Jul 10 #16
malaise Jul 10 #22
H2O Man Jul 10 #25
malaise Jul 10 #27
kentuck Jul 10 #6
H2O Man Jul 10 #17
kentuck Jul 10 #19
H2O Man Jul 10 #21
left-of-center2012 Jul 10 #7
Haggis for Breakfast Jul 10 #11
H2O Man Jul 10 #20
Haggis for Breakfast Jul 12 #33
H2O Man Jul 10 #18
grantcart Jul 10 #12
H2O Man Jul 10 #24
safeinOhio Jul 10 #23
H2O Man Jul 10 #26
kentuck Jul 10 #32

Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 05:28 PM

1. With Shine in as Com Head cheese,

this was a planned event to improve the numbers for Fake Noise against Maddow. Nothing more nothing less. This will be the new norm for Shine/Trump TV for now on. And it will be at least three times daily instead of twice.

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Response to Wellstone ruled (Reply #1)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 06:44 PM

8. Right.

I think the enemy knows that Cohen's team has begun some communications with the SDNY prosecutors. There hasn't been a proffer yet, and Cohen himself hasn't met with investigators. But his new lawyer has had some initial communications. Hence, Rudy's nonsense about if cooperating helps Cohen, go for it. But what the FBI and prosecutors are going to get will be damaging to Trump and his family.

Cohen has resented Ivanka and Jared for 18 months now. That resentment is growing, and it has spread to the Donald's -- and Cohen does know much of the truth about Jr's meeting at Trump Towers with the Russians.

By mid-August, the Trump team will also turn on Cohen. It should be interesting.

The grass roots is not powerless when it comes to the media. Years ago, for just one example, we engaged in a little effort to mess with "Mourning Joe." It worked. Though just one morning's show, it provided a model on how it can be done.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #8)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 07:35 PM

13. Appears Rudy is not going to have to answer

for not being a Registered Foreign Agent. This up coming Election has our Nations Constitution hanging in the balance. A capture of either House is the Prize and if we don't,it is time to leave never to return.

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Response to Wellstone ruled (Reply #13)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 07:43 PM

14. Definitely.

I think it is possible to win both the House and Senate. I'm reminded of something my buddy Rubin Carter said in Washington, DC, on July 4, 1976: "Miracles DO happen; they just take a dog-gone lot of work."

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #14)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 08:54 PM

31. Yes they do.

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Response to Wellstone ruled (Reply #13)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 08:23 PM

28. I'm never leaving this Country bc of Repubs.

No way, No how. They'd be burying me here from the resistance. No way.

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Response to Crutchez_CuiBono (Reply #28)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 08:34 PM

29. Interesting.

I remember in February of 2001 ....I was with my sons, nephews, and a group of their friends, hanging out with Rubin after he spoke at Colgate University. Rubin sais that I needed to move to Canada, and suggested the young men relocate, as well. One of my nephews respectfully said, "No, this is our country, and it's worth fighting for." Rubin liked that.

Last fall, my daughters looked around the homestead in the Old Sod, determined to find a cottage for me to retire to. (One big enough to house them, too, of course!)

Two weeks ago, a young friend suggested our family join her, halfway around the earth.

I understand anyone thinking of leaving. But I'm staying.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #29)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 08:50 PM

30. No offense to Canada.

I love it there. I was born here, and I'm not leaving. Not without a fight. And there's still some left in me.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 05:35 PM

2. Tjank you for all your work and that of your acquaintances!!!

I like the last paragraph...I hope Malcolm is right (he often is).

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Response to BigmanPigman (Reply #2)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 06:47 PM

9. I agree.

Malcolm is a treasure. He knows exactly what he's talking about, as his first book on the 2016 election shows beyond a doubt. He is, in a very real sense, the current Deep Throat.

His new book is required reading, too.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 05:51 PM

3. Thanks for the thread, ditto on the last paragraph as well.

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Response to yonder (Reply #3)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 06:49 PM

10. Thank you.

We need to crush these people. Figuratively, of course. But utterly remove their influence from our society.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 06:04 PM

4. Very interesting. Thanks, H2O Man. nt

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Response to Hekate (Reply #4)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 07:44 PM

15. Thanks, Hekate!

Keep on fighting the Good Fight!

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 06:11 PM

5. K & R

Thoughtful as ever

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Response to malaise (Reply #5)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 07:46 PM

16. Thanks, Buddy!

I was thinking today ....would it be good for DU to pitch in to offer Beavis and Butthead Trump an all-expenses-paid rhino hunting trip? Kind of a peace offering? Or at least an honest effort to feed the lions?

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #16)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 08:08 PM

22. Hehehe

I'd like them all to play golf in Scotland this weekendvas Hurricane Chris crosses the pond.

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Response to malaise (Reply #22)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 08:18 PM

25. "Unite the Clans!"

(I am related to William Wallace on my maternal side.)

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #25)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 08:20 PM

27. Nice

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 06:21 PM

6. They are flooding the market with propaganda...

The news people need to understand that Guiliani is nothing but a mouthpiece for Donald Trump. The audacity of anyone that would accuse Mr Mueller's investigation of being the "most corrupt investigation" ever? This from Rudy and the Trump "Administration"...

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Response to kentuck (Reply #6)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 07:50 PM

17. You are right!

I think most of them know he is full of shit, no different from Kelly Ann Conway. Why even allow them 15 seconds of air time? At very least, confront them on their lies. (If they are hesitant to appear rude, I'd volunteer to appear with them. It's not that difficult a job.)

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #17)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 07:59 PM

19. I think Trump will be ready to fire Rosenstein when he returns from his trip.

And put in his place someone that will stop the Mueller investigation. I feel like that may be coming soon?

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Response to kentuck (Reply #19)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 08:07 PM

21. You have good reason

to think that. One of the things not being reported in the media, so far as I am aware, is that Mr. Mueller has begun spreading cases, in the way he did with Cohen to the SDNY. This is because there is an awareness that Trump is intent upon firing Rosenstein.

Months ago, some republicans in the Senate quietly told him not to cross that line. Rudy's misinformation & disinformation campaign is in large part to put pressure on those republicans.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 06:38 PM

7. Oh my God !

"It was a cheap imitation of when LBJ attempted to build suspense before the 1964 Democratic National Convention"

I actually remember that.
I was a news junkie, and only 18.

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Response to left-of-center2012 (Reply #7)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 07:03 PM

11. Me as well !

But LBJ was a powerhouse of a politician. Love him or hate him, you had to admire his tenacity, his swagger, his astute ability to size up the opposition and know exactly where the vulnerability could be found. I can only imagine what colorful things (and face it, he was creative in his choice of words) LBJ would have to say about the current anomaly in the WH.

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Response to Haggis for Breakfast (Reply #11)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 08:02 PM

20. My father loved LBJ.

Dad was a first-generation son of Irish immigrants. His family loved FDR -- especially his aunts and great aunts, who were big on Leland Olds. (Most railroaders thought the world of Olds.)

My father thought LBJ would be an even greater president than FDR. At least until the war ruined the potential of the Great Society. I remember my father showing me pictures from newspapers and magazines, of LBJ invading Senator's personal space. Pushing his finger into their chests, until he "convinced" them to do what he wanted. Then wrapping his arm around his victim. Ha!

He's not among my favorite presidents -- I like JFK and Obama best. But LBJ is a more interesting character study, perhaps the most curious in our nation's history.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #20)

Thu Jul 12, 2018, 10:28 PM

33. Did you know

That LBJ had an embroidered pillow on the couch of his personal office that read, "Fuck 'em all."

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Response to left-of-center2012 (Reply #7)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 07:56 PM

18. Right?

I'm disappointed more people on MSNBC and CNN don't point out how frequently Trump copies LBJ and Nixon. It's not like they don't have some solid historians on as guests.

It has to be Bannon or some equally horrible person behind Trump's doing this. We know that Trump doesn't read. It's unlikely he could name LBJ's vice president. But whoever it is promoting this knows that LBJ's bad side would appeal to Trump. Johnson was particularly cruel to Humphrey, who was actually a very good man, and outstanding politician pre-1964. But LBJ viewed him as weak and emotional.

Thank you for your response!

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 07:11 PM

12. Recommend

Who would have believed that a clown car could have so many actor

And how is it possible that Rudy can make so many exits? I swear I just saw him say something to stupid for any lawyer to say and he is stepping out of the car while I can still see his backside walking out the circus tent.

Mueller if you can't find a "fat lady" to cue your entrance let me know and I will go out in a dress.

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Response to grantcart (Reply #12)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 08:17 PM

24. One of my associates

asked us today if Trump was really president, or was this just a terrifying dream? He asked that question three times. Is there such a thing as "daymares"?

Early on in the republican primaries, I remember my older son saying that people shouldn't laugh at Trump, or fail to take his campaign seriously. He noted that Trump was using some of Hitler's speech patterns.

A couple of weeks ago, I visited my 90-year old uncle, a WW2 hero. I asked him if what was happening in our country was the same as what he had fought against. "You're god-damned right it is," was his response.

I think that Mr. Mueller has to take a bold action by early September. And I don't say that for political reasons. If he doesn't, I think Trump will be in a position to crush the rule of law completely.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 08:09 PM

23. I'm done guessing.

Every day is a new surprise and I await the final one. We will know it when it gets here. Until then all bets are off.

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Response to safeinOhio (Reply #23)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 08:20 PM

26. As long as

everyone is actively opposing Trump's USSC nominee, and preparing for November's elections, it's all good.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #26)

Tue Jul 10, 2018, 09:37 PM

32. I would like to see a small bi-partisan group of Democrats and Republicans form a Committee....

...to Save Our Country.

It could be four or five Senators to begin with.

It could then expand as long as any Democrat or Republican wished to join them.

If they could get together enough Senators, they would have the majority needed to protect our country at this dangerous time. It will take some leadership from someone.

Just my opinion.

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