Fri Mar 23, 2018, 10:57 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

Why 17 Democrats voted with Republicans to ease bank rules/I am sick of Democratic bashing.

Seventeen Senate Democrats voted with Republicans to ease regulations on some banks.
Most of those Democrats face re-election this year, and seven are running in states Trump won.

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/03/15/why-senate-democrats-voted-for-bank-bill-to-ease-dodd-frank-rules.html

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72 replies	Author	Time	Post
Why 17 Democrats voted with Republicans to ease bank rules/I am sick of Democratic bashing. (Original post)	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	OP
Which is more important, this country and the people or them keeping jobs??	Angry Dragon	Mar 2018	#1
ALL that matters is D's are in seats, no matter who they are or what they voted on.	Eliot Rosewater	Mar 2018	#3
Do you mean this or are you being sarcastic?	oberliner	Mar 2018	#5
No...the math is everything...warm Democratic bodies are needed for a majority...even a less	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#27
Okay	atreides1	Mar 2018	#52
Yes, it's called politics and it sucks	njhoneybadger	Mar 2018	#54
I would ask you to consider if losing elections and allowing the GOP to destroy progressive policy	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#62
Suppose republicans figure this out,	pangaia	Mar 2018	#53
Our moderate Dems have never caucused with the Republicans after election.	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#63
I have to agree, we are in survival mode	njhoneybadger	Mar 2018	#51
We have to win...and I don't think folks understand that there are many Senators up for re-election	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#64
we better because	bdamomma	Mar 2018	#67
Agree. Of course, once Dems rule the House and Senate, ...	JustABozoOnThisBus	Mar 2018	#68
Them keeping their jobs...can you imagine 7-17 more GOP senators in 18?	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#4
I am worried, that we still have to convince people about the math.	Eliot Rosewater	Mar 2018	#6
Right it is math...and when I looked into the why Democrats (some) voted for this bill, I understood	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#9
I hate they voted for it, in a perfect world I would work to replace them with someone who wouldnt	Eliot Rosewater	Mar 2018	#15
Those that had selfish reasons can be voted out in a primary after we take power back...in	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#25
How do we explain that though. This onslaught of millions of new voters, energized	Eliot Rosewater	Mar 2018	#28
Another poster had a video from Barney Frank who says the bill is not that bad...I didn't think it	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#36
What is so sad is how some folks just cant get it in their heads this is NOT about	Eliot Rosewater	Mar 2018	#38
The pugs have been more successful than us because they look to the bigger picture consistently.	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#65
Well, we actually picked up 6 seats in the House in 2016...	Demit	Mar 2018	#24
We really do...and we can get good stuff down only if we win.	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#29
Well....	awesomerwb1	Mar 2018	#8
+1000	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#11
I'm with you on that.............	MyOwnPeace	Mar 2018	#30
Makes sense.	awesomerwb1	Mar 2018	#2
17 Dems are concerned about their re-election. I don't blame them and if we took	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#7
I agree with you. (read my other post above) nt	awesomerwb1	Mar 2018	#10
I did read it and thought it was spot on. Even sent smilies! (haha)	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#14
Right on!	awesomerwb1	Mar 2018	#16
I call bullshit on this article	hueymahl	Mar 2018	#12
It would be used to show that Democrats are blocking everything Trump does...and red state	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#17
If they can't spin this in their favor, they deserve to lose	hueymahl	Mar 2018	#20
We can't afford for them to lose...it would be a huge disaster for all.	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#23
That is my point	hueymahl	Mar 2018	#26
The red state Democrats did not vote for anything else this year...and were being portrayed as	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#39
I hear you and I disagree, respectfully	hueymahl	Mar 2018	#46
What this meant is less banks will qualify for this...and won't be able to screw taxpayers...I want	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#49
You and I agree 100% that we need a Democratic Majority to get more/better regs! NT	hueymahl	Mar 2018	#56
There is agreement in what is needed...we just have different ideas on how to achieve it. In the end	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#66
They are being portrayed as having voted for nothing...this helps in that way.	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#50
Yes. Bullshit.	Orsino	Mar 2018	#72
I don't get why they think this is an issue people care about	marylandblue	Mar 2018	#13
Go on right wing websites and read about it...they care about everything Trump cares about.	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#19
Anyone hanging out on a Riecht Wing website is not voting for a Democrat	hueymahl	Mar 2018	#22
I go there to see what the enemy is up to...but if you want to see why seven Dems voted	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#35
My opponent tried to stop banks from ripping you off!	leftstreet	Mar 2018	#18
These are red state Senators and those with banking interests in their states.	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#21
You're saying GOPer voters love banks?	leftstreet	Mar 2018	#37
No, I am saying the red state Democrats are being portrayed as being in lockstep with	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#42
So we have to sit quietly by and not say a word when Democrats act like Republicans??	HopeAgain	Mar 2018	#31
No, say what you want within the rules of course, but vote Democratic always. We must	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#33
Even Barney Frank said not to bash these Senators, and that the changes weren't that bad.	Hoyt	Mar 2018	#32
There are not bad changes as the article I posted shows.	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#34
If somebody votes like a Republican you have a Republican.	davsand	Mar 2018	#40
You won't get your version of Democrats in red states and without such Democrats, we will never	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#44
I could CALL myself a Republican, but it won't make me one.	davsand	Mar 2018	#57
In order to win a majority, we need moderate Dems...we can't have one any other way...50 state	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#61
I do not consider the red state Democrats Republicans...they are moderate Democrats.	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#69
I wonder if purity of vote will be as important as being drafted into a war with Iran for some. nt	fleabiscuit	Mar 2018	#41
My fear is that Trump will use nukes on Korea...and will start a nuclear war...and you are right.	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#45
So what is Mark Warner's "excuse" besides bullshit and Kaine didn't need the cover in Virginia!	FreeStateDemocrat	Mar 2018	#43
Both Virginia Senators voted for it because rural voters have a reduced access to capital...	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#47
Fuck them? if they don't win re-election, we are fucked.	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#48
This is exactly the type of talking points I heard most of 2016 from purists and the Bernie crowd	BoneyardDem	Mar 2018	#55
If a "Dem" won't vote with the party on anything they are hurting the party.	davsand	Mar 2018	#58
This was one vote of many...red state Dems voted with the Democratic majority over 90%	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#59
so what do you suggest?	BoneyardDem	Mar 2018	#70
That is a good point...and we work at the grassrooots and legislature level to win hearts and	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#71
That is what I am hoping for...in order to do that we have to keep the Senators we have...reality is	Demsrule86	Mar 2018	#60

Response to Demsrule86 (Original post)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:00 AM

Angry Dragon (36,693 posts)

1. Which is more important, this country and the people or them keeping jobs??

Reply to this post

Response to Angry Dragon (Reply #1)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:03 AM

Eliot Rosewater (26,828 posts)

3. ALL that matters is D's are in seats, no matter who they are or what they voted on.

Because of math.

I never joke about the math, it is serious and real. Anybody with a D after their name is better than ANYBODY with an R for MATH reasons

Reply to this post

Response to Eliot Rosewater (Reply #3)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:04 AM

oberliner (58,724 posts)

5. Do you mean this or are you being sarcastic?

Reply to this post

Response to oberliner (Reply #5)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:19 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

27. No...the math is everything...warm Democratic bodies are needed for a majority...even a less

than perfect Dem is better than a shitty Republican.

Reply to this post

Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #27)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 12:15 PM

atreides1 (15,250 posts)

52. Okay

Then can we at least admit that in order to fill the seats in Congress with Democrats, we too are willing to throw out principles and integrity...as long as we have the numbers???

Reply to this post

Response to atreides1 (Reply #52)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 12:21 PM

njhoneybadger (3,493 posts)

54. Yes, it's called politics and it sucks

Reply to this post

Response to atreides1 (Reply #52)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 01:15 PM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

62. I would ask you to consider if losing elections and allowing the GOP to destroy progressive policy

since Roosevelt represents integrity? What principle is found in a loss? Moderate Democrats may not agree with you or me...but it is wrong to say they are without integrity...and we can't have majority any other way.

Reply to this post

Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #27)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 12:21 PM

pangaia (24,324 posts)

53. Suppose republicans figure this out,

and run with a D after their name?
then what?

I mean, I get 100% what you and other are saying and can certainly not say I disagree.

So my question is not a black and white one....

Reply to this post

Response to pangaia (Reply #53)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 01:16 PM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

63. Our moderate Dems have never caucused with the Republicans after election.

Do they prevent us from getting everything we want...sure. Single payer for example, but we got the ACA. And we will get nothing without them.

Reply to this post

Response to Eliot Rosewater (Reply #3)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 12:01 PM

njhoneybadger (3,493 posts)

51. I have to agree, we are in survival mode

Can't we stop attacking each other for the next 7 months

Reply to this post

Response to njhoneybadger (Reply #51)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 01:18 PM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

64. We have to win...and I don't think folks understand that there are many Senators up for re-election

this year. The GOP could end up with a veto proof majority...it is scary as hell.

Reply to this post

Response to njhoneybadger (Reply #51)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 01:23 PM

bdamomma (59,502 posts)

67. we better because

this was one of things Malcolm Nance mentioned about the splitting of the Democratic party and how Russia saw the divide and decided to divide people between the two democratic challenges in the 2016 election. Just saying.

We need to unite at this most serious time in our history our lives depend on it.

Reply to this post

Response to Eliot Rosewater (Reply #3)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 02:12 PM

JustABozoOnThisBus (20,485 posts)

68. Agree. Of course, once Dems rule the House and Senate, ...

... we can start nitpicking DINOs and Blue Dogs. And we will.

Reply to this post

Response to Angry Dragon (Reply #1)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:04 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

4. Them keeping their jobs...can you imagine 7-17 more GOP senators in 18?

We have a tough fight ahead in the Senate. The bill can be altered/improved after we regain power.

Reply to this post

Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #4)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:06 AM

Eliot Rosewater (26,828 posts)

6. I am worried, that we still have to convince people about the math.

Reply to this post

Response to Eliot Rosewater (Reply #6)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:08 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

9. Right it is math...and when I looked into the why Democrats (some) voted for this bill, I understood

Math matters...50 Republicans voted for it and it would not have made it to the floor had we won in 16...we dance to the GOP tune...and winning is the only thing that matters at the moment.

Reply to this post

Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #9)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:12 AM

Eliot Rosewater (26,828 posts)

15. I hate they voted for it, in a perfect world I would work to replace them with someone who wouldnt

UNLESS that someone cant win due to demographics.

Again, this is simple, MATH

Reply to this post

Response to Eliot Rosewater (Reply #15)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:18 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

25. Those that had selfish reasons can be voted out in a primary after we take power back...in

blue states only. It would be madness to primary red state Senators for this vote.

Reply to this post

Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #25)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:20 AM

Eliot Rosewater (26,828 posts)

28. How do we explain that though. This onslaught of millions of new voters, energized

in 2016, how do we explain to them that they need to support the Democrats they DISAGREE with the MOST?

Reply to this post

Response to Eliot Rosewater (Reply #28)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:34 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

36. Another poster had a video from Barney Frank who says the bill is not that bad...I didn't think it

was that bad either...I am glad they raised the amount needed for two big to fail status.

Reply to this post

Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #36)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:38 AM

Eliot Rosewater (26,828 posts)

38. What is so sad is how some folks just cant get it in their heads this is NOT about

them, their politics, their needs as on an individual basis, etc.

I wish it was, but it has never been. It is about the bigger picture and on one side you can count on them NOT attacking you mentally, financially and spiritually on a daily basis and on the other side you can count on them doing that.

I wont find a government that provides a guaranteed income or universal healthcare no matter who I vote for in the next few years UNLESS I first give all power over to the party most likely wiling to do that in the first place.

Most people here would NOT like my politics because I am so far left it is ridiculous, BUT, my politics are meaningless without power.

Reply to this post

Response to Eliot Rosewater (Reply #38)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 01:19 PM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

65. The pugs have been more successful than us because they look to the bigger picture consistently.

Reply to this post

Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #9)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:18 AM

Demit (11,238 posts)

24. Well, we actually picked up 6 seats in the House in 2016...

a fact that got lost in the disaster of the presidential election. Plus two seats in the Senate, I believe.

But I agree with your general premise. We need the numbers desperately.

Reply to this post

Response to Demit (Reply #24)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:21 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

29. We really do...and we can get good stuff down only if we win.

Reply to this post

Response to Angry Dragon (Reply #1)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:08 AM

awesomerwb1 (3,720 posts)

8. Well....

I'd rather have Dems in DC than the current rep comrades. I understand the vote, and I understand your point.

So for me for now, we need to get every Dem re-elected and get a majority in the House.

I'll take a crappy Dem over almost any gop comrade right now because we need to take back the country and get rid of the trump disease ASAP.

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Response to awesomerwb1 (Reply #8)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:10 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

11. +1000

This is my only mission at the moment.

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Response to awesomerwb1 (Reply #8)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:21 AM

MyOwnPeace (11,415 posts)

30. I'm with you on that.............

Reply to this post

Response to Demsrule86 (Original post)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:01 AM

awesomerwb1 (3,720 posts)

2. Makes sense.

I'm not a fan of Dem bashing BUT

I'm also not a fan of working hard to help get them elected and donating tons of money (for me) to have some of them turn into "invertebrates" as soon as they get to DC.

Reply to this post

Response to awesomerwb1 (Reply #2)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:06 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

7. 17 Dems are concerned about their re-election. I don't blame them and if we took

a big loss in the Senate and failed to get the house which is still gerrymandered, it would be an unimaginal disaster for progressive and for policy. Remember 7 of them are in areas where Trump still polls wells. The others are at risk as they are in states with large banking interests and moderates too.

Reply to this post

Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #7)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:09 AM

awesomerwb1 (3,720 posts)

10. I agree with you. (read my other post above) nt

Reply to this post

Response to awesomerwb1 (Reply #10)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:11 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

14. I did read it and thought it was spot on. Even sent smilies! (haha)

Reply to this post

Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #14)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:12 AM

awesomerwb1 (3,720 posts)

16. Right on!

Reply to this post

Response to Demsrule86 (Original post)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:11 AM

hueymahl (1,889 posts)

12. I call bullshit on this article

Decreasing regulations on the largest banks that brought us the great recession is hardly a "hot button" issue in their districts, no matter how red they may be. Their inability to spin this as a positive to their constituents is hard for me to believe (with the slight possible exception of Delaware, which is highly dependent on banks and corporations).

I think what is really going on is they are being paid off by the banking interests in their states and voted they way their owners told them to.

Reply to this post

Response to hueymahl (Reply #12)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:13 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

17. It would be used to show that Democrats are blocking everything Trump does...and red state

Senators are at serious risk...and those in banking states too...this did help smaller banks so it was not completely horrible...and it raised the amount of money needed for a bank to be deemed to big to fail. We can fix this bill when we regain power.

Reply to this post

Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #17)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:15 AM

hueymahl (1,889 posts)

20. If they can't spin this in their favor, they deserve to lose

I'm all for doing what is necessary to win, even if it means compromising democratic principles. I just don't think they needed to here. I think the true motivation was money. They were scared to lose the money they get paid from the banking industry.

Reply to this post

Response to hueymahl (Reply #20)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:17 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

23. We can't afford for them to lose...it would be a huge disaster for all.

Reply to this post

Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #23)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:18 AM

hueymahl (1,889 posts)

26. That is my point

This is not an issue they would lose on with their constituency. This is an issue of sucking on the money teat of the banking industry.

Reply to this post

Response to hueymahl (Reply #26)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:38 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

39. The red state Democrats did not vote for anything else this year...and were being portrayed as

obstructionists in the campaigns. They need to vote for something...and in my opinion this is better than any other bill. Barney Frank says 95% is still intact...and there is an easing on truly small banks...and the amount needed to be considered to big to fail has been raised...that is not a bad thing.

Reply to this post

Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #39)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:43 AM

hueymahl (1,889 posts)

46. I hear you and I disagree, respectfully

Especially about the part of raising the "too big to fail" threshold. THAT is a very bad thing. We need more regulation of banks of all sizes, not less. More regulation of financial institutions of all kinds, not less. If I was a bank president, I would be very happy with this result and believe that I invested my political contributions wisely.

Reply to this post

Response to hueymahl (Reply #46)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:53 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

49. What this meant is less banks will qualify for this...and won't be able to screw taxpayers...I want

regulation too...but you won't get it without a Democratic majority.

Reply to this post

Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #49)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 12:36 PM

hueymahl (1,889 posts)

56. You and I agree 100% that we need a Democratic Majority to get more/better regs! NT

Reply to this post

Response to hueymahl (Reply #56)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 01:21 PM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

66. There is agreement in what is needed...we just have different ideas on how to achieve it. In the end

I believe Democrats will vote for the Democratic candidates in the general in 18 and 20. I think we have a good shot.

Reply to this post

Response to hueymahl (Reply #26)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:55 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

50. They are being portrayed as having voted for nothing...this helps in that way.

And even if I am wrong...and they did it for whatever reason...it doesn't matter. We need all of them to win in 18...and if we take a couple more we can shut down Trump's judicial picks.

Reply to this post

Response to hueymahl (Reply #12)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 03:37 PM

Orsino (37,416 posts)

72. Yes. Bullshit.

Republican voters aren't going to be impressed by a vote on a bill they don't care about.

These are corrupted Democrats, not desperate ones.

Reply to this post

Response to Demsrule86 (Original post)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:11 AM

marylandblue (12,308 posts)

13. I don't get why they think this is an issue people care about

It's really just a Wall Street giveaway. Do ordinary people care about banks? Does it create any jobs? I don't think so.

Reply to this post

Response to marylandblue (Reply #13)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:14 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

19. Go on right wing websites and read about it...they care about everything Trump cares about.

Reply to this post

Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #19)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:16 AM

hueymahl (1,889 posts)

22. Anyone hanging out on a Riecht Wing website is not voting for a Democrat

Even if it was Jesus himself running.

Reply to this post

Response to hueymahl (Reply #22)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:32 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

35. I go there to see what the enemy is up to...but if you want to see why seven Dems voted

for this bill, visit a couple.

Reply to this post

Response to Demsrule86 (Original post)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:13 AM

leftstreet (32,475 posts)

18. My opponent tried to stop banks from ripping you off!

Yeah, I can see how that would work

I thought the 'blue wave' was about NOT being like Trump

Reply to this post

Response to leftstreet (Reply #18)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:16 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

21. These are red state Senators and those with banking interests in their states.

Reply to this post

Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #21)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:36 AM

leftstreet (32,475 posts)

37. You're saying GOPer voters love banks?

That's the first I'd heard that

Reply to this post

Response to leftstreet (Reply #37)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:41 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

42. No, I am saying the red state Democrats are being portrayed as being in lockstep with

Democrats and screwing Trump-this puts their re-election at risk...vote for the GOP send Trump some help blah blah. They needed to vote for something.

Reply to this post

Response to Demsrule86 (Original post)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:25 AM

HopeAgain (4,407 posts)

31. So we have to sit quietly by and not say a word when Democrats act like Republicans??

Democratic bashing is different then being highly critical of a vote against issue which was previously an important Democratic position.
And so many on here wonder how anyone could be an independent??

Reply to this post

Response to HopeAgain (Reply #31)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:28 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

33. No, say what you want within the rules of course, but vote Democratic always. We must

get back in power...and the worst Democrat is better than the 'best' Republican...the Democrats have held off voting for GOP bills for over a year...the 17 all had reasons for their votes...most I understand...and losing 7 Senatorial seats would be way more disastrous than a bill that can be improved when we gain power. If the Democratic Senator's explanations don't satisfy you primary them after we have power of course...not now. Also, don't primary red state Democratic Senators for any reason...it is madness to do so. We need them for a majority. I would add you should get involved in primarying sitting Democrats only if you are from their state.

Reply to this post

Response to Demsrule86 (Original post)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:26 AM

Hoyt (47,392 posts)

32. Even Barney Frank said not to bash these Senators, and that the changes weren't that bad.

Before condemning these senators, take a look at this video from Vice on HBO. In it, Frank says don't condemn these senators, 95% of Dodd-Frank is not changed, and more.

What Barney Frank Really Thinks About Roll-Back of Dodd-Frank.

Reply to this post

Response to Hoyt (Reply #32)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:31 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

34. There are not bad changes as the article I posted shows.

We need all our Senators to win re-election.

Reply to this post

Response to Demsrule86 (Original post)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:39 AM

davsand (13,186 posts)

40. If somebody votes like a Republican you have a Republican.

Calling yourself a Dem then voting regularly like a Republican has another name (well, several, actually. Some would probably get me deleted.) We'll stick to "Democrat In Name Only" for the purposes of this discussion. Primaries are vital in those cases. Sure, there's always gonna be a vote that you may not agree with, but being wrong on EVERY freaking issue should be a big red flag.

YMMV, but a primary for those guys should always be on the table.

Laura

Reply to this post

Response to davsand (Reply #40)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:42 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

44. You won't get your version of Democrats in red states and without such Democrats, we will never

have a majority and accomplish exactly nothing ever. I consider Joe Manchin and Claire McCAskill moderate Democrats.

Reply to this post

Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #44)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 12:42 PM

davsand (13,186 posts)

57. I could CALL myself a Republican, but it won't make me one.

Just can't do it. I could never vote the way they do. Electing me as a Republican would elect a RINO, and it would do everything to undermine their values when it came time to vote on critical issues like the ACA repeal, the wall, DACA, , abortion, LGBT rights, etc... Pretty sure Republican voters would come after me in a primary.

I currently live in a congressional district with a multi term fundy holding the office. Nobody is willing to run against him, and as a result he sails through every election. The ONLY way he's ever gonna be gone is he either dies in office or another Republican takes him out in a primary. A RINO might be the solution to the problem.

Is it easier to see my point when I reverse the viewpoint? My opinion is that these 'Dems" we are discussing need to be primaried every time. MCaskill does vote with Dems, sometimes, BTW. Manchin, however is somebody that needs to be challenged every time.

Laura

Reply to this post

Response to davsand (Reply #57)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 01:13 PM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

61. In order to win a majority, we need moderate Dems...we can't have one any other way...50 state

strategy and the big tent strategy...it is the only way we ever get a majority. And without a majority, we get nothing.

Reply to this post

Response to davsand (Reply #57)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 03:01 PM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

69. I do not consider the red state Democrats Republicans...they are moderate Democrats.

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Response to Demsrule86 (Original post)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:40 AM

fleabiscuit (4,482 posts)

41. I wonder if purity of vote will be as important as being drafted into a war with Iran for some. nt

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Response to fleabiscuit (Reply #41)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:43 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

45. My fear is that Trump will use nukes on Korea...and will start a nuclear war...and you are right.

they would have to bring back the draft.

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Response to Demsrule86 (Original post)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:42 AM

FreeStateDemocrat (2,654 posts)

43. So what is Mark Warner's "excuse" besides bullshit and Kaine didn't need the cover in Virginia!

They sold out the working class so fuck'em. I have voted Democratic for over 50 years so I can only abstain rather than support Kaine.
I will vote against him in the primary, I'm sick of these assholes thinking it's is all about more money for themselves. When did it happen, that by becoming a US Senator you were assure of being a multi-millionaire?

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Response to FreeStateDemocrat (Reply #43)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:50 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

47. Both Virginia Senators voted for it because rural voters have a reduced access to capital...

Warner on why some blue state Senators supported the bill.

“What moved this bill was the longtime belief that there had been reduced access to capital, particularly in rural communities, and every state’s got some of that,” Warner said."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2018/03/19/why-democrats-voted-to-roll-back-obama-era-banking-rules/?utm_term=.a104bc42633d

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Response to FreeStateDemocrat (Reply #43)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 11:51 AM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

48. Fuck them? if they don't win re-election, we are fucked.

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Response to FreeStateDemocrat (Reply #43)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 12:35 PM

BoneyardDem (1,202 posts)

55. This is exactly the type of talking points I heard most of 2016 from purists and the Bernie crowd

I'm not sure the end result proved anything and fixed anything pro-Dem policy-wise.....what it did do was aid Republicans.

I'm completely sold on the fact that if Dems can get a majority in both houses and then in 2020 WH....we can have the same type of power the Reps currently wield and the course of several projects can be reversed. BUT, first things first, getting the majority. apparently that will have to happen without your vote.

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Response to BoneyardDem (Reply #55)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 12:52 PM

davsand (13,186 posts)

58. If a "Dem" won't vote with the party on anything they are hurting the party.

If they can't ever vote with the party they are a "placeholder" and nothing more. I would argue they hurt our party a lot more than they help it. I totally get that you have to represent your district, but when every vote contradicts the party platform, you are nothing more than a DINO using the party association to get elected.

Laura

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Response to davsand (Reply #58)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 01:09 PM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

59. This was one vote of many...red state Dems voted with the Democratic majority over 90%

of the time...so how often would a GOP replacement do that?...How about never. And without DINO's as you call them, are needed for us to have a majority in the Senate. That is the reality of situation.

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Response to davsand (Reply #58)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 03:02 PM

BoneyardDem (1,202 posts)

70. so what do you suggest?

backing a far left progressive that has no chance of winning this type of district? That's not a great strategy.

if there is such a thing as a "place holder" it would be the Dem that was elected until the district can turn blue enough and liberal enough to suit your special needs.

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Response to BoneyardDem (Reply #70)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 03:31 PM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

71. That is a good point...and we work at the grassrooots and legislature level to win hearts and

minds.

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Response to BoneyardDem (Reply #55)

Fri Mar 23, 2018, 01:11 PM

Demsrule86 (50,958 posts)

60. That is what I am hoping for...in order to do that we have to keep the Senators we have...reality is

we need red state Senators to hold a majority. This does mean we won't get every progressive policy...but we will get some good stuff...100% of nothing =nothing.

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