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Jack Layton elected leader of Canada's New Democratic Party

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CocaCola58204 Donating Member (658 posts) Click to EMail CocaCola58204 Click to send private message to CocaCola58204 Click to view user profile Click to check IP address of the poster Click to add this poster to your Friend List
Jan-25-03, 04:59 PM (ET)
Jack Layton elected leader of Canada's New Democratic Party
TORONTO - Federal New Democrats have chosen Toronto city councillor Jack Layton as their new leader on the first ballot.
He took 53.5 per cent of the vote, beating two veteran MPs and three other candidates during an afternoon of voting that was held up by computer problems.
Manitoba MP Bill Blaikie came in second place, with 24.7 per cent, while Saskatchewan MP Lorne Nystrom wound in third place, with 9.3 per cent.

http://www.cbc.ca/stories/2003/01/25/ndp_030125

A toast to the future of Canada's left!

Find out more about the new leader of the NDP at http://www.jacklayton.ca

Find outt about the NDp at http://www.ndp.ca

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  Table of Contents

  Subject     Author     Message Date     ID  
 Cheers to the NDP! Cascadian Jan-25-03 1
   In America, the New Democrats are the equivalent hedda_foil 01/25/2003 3
       Tony Blair is a Tory in Labour's clothing. Cascadian 01/25/2003 6
       No comparison . . . jos 01/26/2003 8
 Yes, a toast to Canada's future and Jack Layton..!!!! zidzi Jan-25-03 2
 Canadians, he's your man! Cascadian Jan-25-03 4
 Good news for Canada! StevenLee Jan-25-03 5
 Ahhhh Canada Forkboy Jan-25-03 7
 I voted for him ;) iverglas Jan-26-03 9
   Good for you! IndianaGreen 01/26/2003 10
       ah, but you see --- iverglas 01/27/2003 13
       p.s. -- if you liked what Jack had to say iverglas 01/27/2003 14
   This tells me Jack Layton may become Canada's next leader. Cascadian 01/27/2003 12
 He is a great man - ther hope for the future od the left up here RBHam Jan-26-03 11
 I saw this story on News World International Lydia Leftcoast Jan-27-03 15
 He sounds like a good guy trebizond Jan-27-03 16
   chances of success? iverglas 01/27/2003 17

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Cascadian (261 posts) Click to EMail Cascadian Click to send private message to Cascadian Click to view user profile Click to check IP address of the poster Click to add this poster to your Friend List
Jan-25-03, 05:10 PM (ET)
1. Cheers to the NDP!
I cannot call myself an expert on Canadian politics but I have long been a Pierre Trudeau admirer. I have also heard of the NDP and I like a lot of what they stand for. I hope they can shake things up in Canada in the next elections.

With the Democratic Party floundering down here, maybe those on the left side of Demos can join with some other small left wing parties and organizations and create an American New Democratic Party. What do you think?

John

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hedda_foil Donating Member (1330 posts) Click to EMail hedda_foil Click to send private message to hedda_foil Click to view user profile Click to check IP address of the poster Click to add this poster to your Friend List
Jan-25-03, 05:48 PM (ET)
Reply to post #1
3. In America, the New Democrats are the equivalent
of Blair's New Labour in the UK. They're the DLC sponsored "centrists" -- think Lieberman and Breaux for their two most sterling examples.

Do not go gentle into that good night
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

Dylan Thomas
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Cascadian (261 posts) Click to EMail Cascadian Click to send private message to Cascadian Click to view user profile Click to check IP address of the poster Click to add this poster to your Friend List
Jan-25-03, 06:12 PM (ET)
Reply to post #3
6. Tony Blair is a Tory in Labour's clothing.
That man has become a huge thorn in the side of Labour's left wing. He has implimented so many Conservative-inspired policies during his tenure as P.M. that there is no real difference between the two parties. It's no surprise he has become Bush's best friend in Europe.

It also seems that he is getting into trouble with his approval ratings in Britain as a result of supporting Bush's war. Sadly, no other Labour leaders have showed themselves to challenge Blair's leadership. None that I know of anyway.

John

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jos (161 posts) Click to EMail jos Click to send private message to jos Click to view user profile Click to check IP address of the poster Click to add this poster to your Friend List
Jan-26-03, 06:04 PM (ET)
Reply to post #3
8. No comparison . . .
between the NDP in Canada and "New" Labour in England and "New" Democrats in the U.S.
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zidzi Donating Member (1250 posts) Click to EMail zidzi Click to send private message to zidzi Click to view user profile Click to check IP address of the poster Click to add this poster to your Friend List
Jan-25-03, 05:29 PM (ET)
2. Yes, a toast to Canada's future and Jack Layton..!!!!
Go Canada for keeping it real!! If it gets too creepy for me down here I might just have to migrate one day!!~~~~~~~Z
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Cascadian (261 posts) Click to EMail Cascadian Click to send private message to Cascadian Click to view user profile Click to check IP address of the poster Click to add this poster to your Friend List
Jan-25-03, 05:53 PM (ET)
4. Canadians, he's your man!
LAST EDITED ON Jan-25-03 AT 06:06 PM (ET)

From what I have read so far, Jack Layton could give the Liberals as well as the Tories and Alliance a run for their money in the next election. It seems like Canada wants a real change from all the accounts I am getting. Wouldn't it be a hoot if Layton becomes prime minister? The right wingers who are running the U.S. would crap their pants!

I hope he does make it. Vote for the NDP!

John

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StevenLee (401 posts) Click to EMail StevenLee Click to send private message to StevenLee Click to view user profile Click to check IP address of the poster Click to add this poster to your Friend List
Jan-25-03, 06:05 PM (ET)
5. Good news for Canada!
The left is reborn in Canada!
Liberals better watch out and the Alliance will see their seat shrink!
It's a good thing..


Today,"terror" is the term coined to define the murderous deeds of the poor and the weak and the "war on terror" is the term coined to define the murderous deeds of the strong and rich - Nurit Peled-Elhanan

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Forkboy (2857 posts) Click to EMail Forkboy Click to send private message to Forkboy Click to view user profile Click to check IP address of the poster Click to add this poster to your Friend List
Jan-25-03, 06:36 PM (ET)
7. Ahhhh Canada
would you be willing to take in a certain Forkboy and wife?

To all the terror of fathers and kings
To all the little dictators that shit on everything thats good
To the whiners and the cryers, the screamers and the liars
To the hypocrites who can't live up to all the things they talk about
To the guilty and the proud
I want to shout out loud
No means no! - NoMeansNo

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iverglas (489 posts) Click to EMail iverglas Click to send private message to iverglas Click to view user profile Click to check IP address of the poster Click to add this poster to your Friend List
Jan-26-03, 08:43 PM (ET)
9. I voted for him ;)
Well, after 2 hours of trying, I finally managed to cast my vote.

I could have voted in advance, by mail or on line; 50% of party members did. That would have involved marking 1st, 2nd, 3rd, etc. preferences (6 candidates) if I wanted, for subsequent ballots. I preferred to wait and do it real-time on the day. Unfortunately, a hacker got there first when the polls opened at noon, after the final candidate speeches, and voting was delayed over an hour.

Of course, the results were pretty much already determined by the advance voting (although no one knew what those results were until all votes were counted after the on-line polls closed on Saturday). A majority on first ballot is an absolutely resounding victory and vote of support.

Normally, party leaders are elected by delegates from the various riding (constituency) associations. This makes watching the outcome, even for party members, like watching a beauty pageant: you bet on the winner, rather than *doing* it. It also involves the usual winner-takes-all problems when delegates are selected by first-past-the-post voting.

Last leadership election, my riding had 3 delegates. There were 3 nominees committed to Svend Robinson (left-wing, atheist, gay, pro-Palestinian rights MP from British Columbia), including me, and 3 nominees committed to Alexa McDonough (leader of the party in New Brunswick, party insider, no known policy positions of interest). By literally 50% +1, with a run-off having to be held for the 3rd position when I came in tied with the Alexa nominee at first and then lost, all our votes went to Alexa.

I went to convention as a useless alternate, and Svend conceded after the first ballot when it was plain that the 3rd candidate's supporters would all go to Alexa. And we've had several years of bland and boring and a complete lack of national profile as a result. (Well, as a result of a number of other factors outside our control as well, but the leadership vacuum didn't help.)

This time, Jack had the support of Svend, representing the left (although not the farthest left of the party; the Socialist Caucus ran its own candidate), and also had the support of Ed Broadbent, the leader in the 1980s, identified with the righter wing of the party, but much loved by the Canadian public. If we had a presidential system, rather than the parliamentary system in which one votes for local candidate/party and not Prime Minister, Ed might have been our PM. ;)

This is all different from the US process for selecting parties' candidates, where voters register as one party or another. Here, the voters' list has nothing to do with parties. People may join a party, and the party members select their leader. (The leader of the party with the most seats in the House of Commons, provided that s/he has been elected to his/her own seat in the house, will be Prime Minister.)

This was the first time a party held direct elections, and the on-line real-time voting really felt just damned good. I had not been completely sure of my vote, since I had long liked Bill Blaikie, and wanted to watch all the final speeches and think. Just before voting, I also talked to my sister, a former resident of Jack's municipal ward in Toronto, who dispelled my qualms that he might be a little bit too much hat and not enough cattle. Even in the context of a right-wing council and mayor, he worked his ass off and accomplished a lot on things like homelessness, a cause he also championed as president of the Canadian Federation of Municipalities. And Bill's continuing sarcasm toward other candidates helped clinch it. (Bill was one of three MPs in the running, and the fact that Jack is not a member of Parliament was a sore point with them.)

But like many in the convention hall, I would have voted for Pierre Ducasse after his tremendous speech if he'd been not quite such a newbie; he's real leadership material, and apparently a really nice guy. We hold no seats in Quebec (we once had one) and there is simply no NDP there provincially, but Quebec itself is in fact a model of many social democratic policies the NDP advocates -- for instance, its universal $5 a day child care program. Pierre needs to get himself a seat in Parliament (and I'll be one of many sending him some $$ for the effort next time). He's only 30, and there's lots of time.

We will not be having a federal election until at least the spring of 2004; Prime Minister Jean Chrétien has promised his party that he will step down as leader in February 2004, so that the Liberal party can elect a new one, and then call an election some time after. The new one will be Paul Martin, representing the far right wing of the Liberal Party. The one credible "l"iberal leadership candidate, Allan Rock, just withdrew.

Last week, "c"onservative (in Canadian terms) columnists in two newspapers handed out advice for the NDP in getting back on track. I found this interesting: they were seriously examining the mood of the country, and finding that it had swung away from the hard-right sentiment of the early 90s, and they were almost exhorting the NDP to make some hay out of the anti-war groundswell, Kyoto, and popular support for the revitalization (and re-funding) of the health care system.

Pretty much everyone, even including conservative columnists, appears to have had about enough of the anti-Canadian antics of the present Official Opposition, the loony right-wing Canadian Alliance. The NDP, as such and in its previous incarnation as the CCF, was the moving force behind universal health care, old age pensions, and a lot that is decent about life in Canada, and we might just be able to *lead* a little in swinging the pendulum back in the direction of decency now.

It's the same the whole world over. It's the poor what gets the blame.
It's the rich what gets the pleasure. Ain't it all a bleeding shame?

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IndianaGreen Donating Member (14481 posts) Click to EMail IndianaGreen Click to send private message to IndianaGreen Click to view user profile Click to check IP address of the poster Click to add this poster to your Friend List
Jan-26-03, 08:47 PM (ET)
Reply to post #9
10. Good for you!
I like what Layton says about the Middle East:

Canadian policy towards the Middle East, especially the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, must be premised on our strengths. What is required now is not joining with U.S. President George W. Bush in destabilizing an already volatile region through a new war in Iraq, but rather for Canada to use our tradition as peacekeepers and peacemakers to work towards a lasting peace in the Middle East. It is time Canada became a voice for genuine peace.

http://www.jacklayton.ca/jacks_vision/default.asp?load=peace

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iverglas (489 posts) Click to EMail iverglas Click to send private message to iverglas Click to view user profile Click to check IP address of the poster Click to add this poster to your Friend List
Jan-27-03, 10:05 AM (ET)
Reply to post #10
13. ah, but you see ---
ALL of the six candidates opposed Cdn involvement in an attack on Iraq *even if* there is a UN resolution.

What a luxury to have to choose among six candidates all of whom are on your side. ;)

There was very little policy difference among any of them. The differences were mainly emphasis, in terms of the party's focus, and of course "leadership" factors. My one bitch with Jack in that respect is that he looks like Colonel Mustard (see the photo posted in this thread).

It's very interesting that Martin is the only serious contender for the Liberal leadership. In point of fact, it does seem that the electorate is moving away from his right-wing line. Normally, the Liberal Party follows the mood of the electorate, it doesn't lead much. It gauges what must be done to retain power, and does it. When the loony right Alliance was picking up steam among all the "disaffected" voters, mainly in the loony western provinces, the Liberals moved right. But if the electorate really is moving back to traditional NDP ground -- especially in demanding that the health care system be re-funded à la the Romanow report, and not allowed to fall into private hands -- where will that leave the Liberals under Martin? They'll be off on some sideroad trying to "lead" from the rear as usual, when the voters have gone in a different direction.

(Pierre Trudeau was sublimely uninterested in the economy and social welfare issues in general. His focus was the traditional "liberal" issues of individual rights, and the constitutional renewal of Canada, including minority language and cultural rights. He was fortunate to govern during a period of prosperity, so he is associated with the good old days of government spending leading to things like universal access to post-secondary education without incurring crippling debt, youth job-creation programs, and so on.)

Had Chrétien stepped down last year, say, Martin would have had a pretty clear run. But Chrétien is more or less looking like he'll follow the public's lead (being at least cautious on any Iraqi involvement, so far, and making noises about requiring the provinces to accept conditions on health care funding that would keep them under tight rein, for instance by prohibiting any privatization) to the left-middle. To the extent that he does have "l"iberal impulses, the thinking is that he's wanting to make this his legacy, and hamstring Paul Martin, whom he intensely dislikes, in the process.

It will be interesting to see how the mood does go over the next year, and what effect a swing leftward would have on Martin.

Of course, from the "classical" NDP viewpoint, the right-er the Liberals, the better. (The problem being the NDP's own tendency to try to occupy middle ground when the electorate swings right, and not leading by advocating our own positions.) The problem is that so many people are simply knee-jerk voters for the "natural governing party"; they may discipline it occasionally by voting against it or even voting it out, but they'll come back. Election outcomes often depend on how pissed people are about Liberal arrogance.

It's the same the whole world over. It's the poor what gets the blame.
It's the rich what gets the pleasure. Ain't it all a bleeding shame?

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iverglas (489 posts) Click to EMail iverglas Click to send private message to iverglas Click to view user profile Click to check IP address of the poster Click to add this poster to your Friend List
Jan-27-03, 10:23 AM (ET)
Reply to post #10
14. p.s. -- if you liked what Jack had to say
You'd love Svend Robinson. He shoulda been the leader last time, but there wasn't a hope this time, so he backed Jack.

Last year, Svend spoke out on Palestine and as a result was disciplined by the party leader and stripped of his position as foreign affairs critic in caucus (the party's official foreign affairs spokesperson in Parliament). This is the email he sent to people who had expressed their support of his actions:

OTTAWA
June 2nd, 2002

Dear Friend,

I am writing in response to your words of support following my visit to Israel and the Occupied Palestinian Territories last month. Messages I have received from across the country, and the many messages from my constituents in Burnaby-Douglas, have given me strength and renewed determination to continue speaking out for peace and justice, and in solidarity with both the Palestinian people and the many courageous Israelis who have condemned the brutal and dehumanising policies of the Sharon government.

I am angered at the failure of the federal Liberal government to take a strong, principled stand at the UN Commission on Human Rights in Geneva on the Middle East. Indeed, it was Canada's shameful vote to oppose the human rights mission of Mary Robinson, Commission to do so, the other being Guatemala], and subsequent vote to oppose condemnation of Israel's military aggression that led me to travel to the region myself.

I have long spoken out for justice for the Palestinian people, as well as for a secure Israel in the pre-1967 borders. During the first intifada in the late 1980's I travelled to the West Bank and Gaza and stayed in a refugee camp in support of the Palestinians. In 1990, prior to the outbreak of the war in the Gulf, I travelled to Iraq and while there met with Palestinian leader Arafat. I have long been appalled at the squalid conditions in the Palestinian refugee camps, and the humiliation and despair and hopelessness they must endure. Collective punishment, land expropriations, home demolitions, extra-judicial killings and the daily humiliation of the Palestinian people were brutally exacerbated by the recent Israeli military offensive. Far from making Israel a safer place, Sharon's policies have had the opposite effect. Israeli writer Gideon Levy spelled it out eloquently in the Israeli newspaper Ha'aretz:

"What is the infrastructure of terrorism if not the occupation, the despair and the hatred? ... The nation wanted war, and it got what it wanted. Within a few days we succeeded in sowing hate in the heart of every Palestinian and it will not soon fade. The tens of thousands of Palestinians who are imprisoned in their homes after an unbearable year and a half, who are frightened by the sounds of gunfire and the rumbling of the tanks; the bodies that continue to be brought to the hospitals without letup; the mass arrests and the general destruction - these are now generating fierce resentment against us. The world, with the exception of the United States in the meantime, is again treating us like lepers, and public opinion in the Arab states is threatening to push their leaders into an all-out war. This is the balance of blood and terror of this operation, which has not a thing to be said to its credit, other than it satisfies the feelings of a public that is terrified by the terrorist attacks."

Canada must take a much stronger stand, including in the following areas:

· Supporting the call by UN Secretary-General Kofi Annan, UN High Commissioner for Human Rights Mary Robinson, (one of only two countries on the 53 member Commission to do so), the other being Guatemala], and others for immediate deployment of an International Protection Force in the Occupied Territories, with Canadian participation

· Substantial Canadian development aid to assist the Palestinian people to rebuild their shattered infrastructure

· Demanding that Israel end its obstruction of the missions of Mary Robinson and the UN Inquiry into the violence and possible war crimes in Jenin; particularly look into the blocking of ambulances and medical supplies to civilians, including mothers in labour and those needing kidney dialysis

· Calling upon Israel to immediately fully respect the 4th Geneva Convention on the status of civilians in the territories illegally occupied by Israel since 1967; Canada has a legal obligation as a signatory to the Convention to ensure that it is honoured

· Speak out strongly against any extension of the "war against terrorism" to Iraq, whose people have already suffered terribly from the impact of economic sanctions

At the root of this conflict is the occupation. It must end. Israel must fully withdraw from all land seized in 1967, including the West Bank, Gaza and East Jerusalem. The Palestinian people must have their viable state, and it must peacefully co-exist with the state of Israel. The Israeli Barak proposal of 2000, described by Assaf Oron, one of the organisers of the Israeli military refusenik movement as "...pitiful, completely controlled Bantustans in between our settlements and bypass roads..." was totally unacceptable. The illegal settlements must be disbanded and there must be an equitable response to the refugee issue. It is shameful that the number of settlers has doubled since the signing of the Oslo Accords in 1993. Imagine the anguish of Palestinians who watch their homes being demolished as new settlements are built on their lands. This is why I confronted the Israeli soldiers at the military checkpoint outside Ramallah, why I asserted that they had no legal authority to block me as they were on Palestinian land.

I was deeply moved by the courage, the anguish and the pain of the Palestinians I met, as well as the brave and eloquent Israeli peace activists. In addition to meeting with Palestinian activists such as Dr. Hanan Ashrawi, I met in Tel Aviv with Peace Now activists including Members of the Israeli Knesset, and leaders in the peace movement Gush Shalom, with whom I attended a large peace rally at Rabin Square.

The leadership of those military reservists who are refusing to serve in the Occupied Territories, in the movement Courage to Refuse "Ometz Lesarev" <www.seruv.org.il> is truly inspiring. As one of these "refuseniks" recently wrote before serving a 28 day prison term: "...I will not serve in your army. ..this army does not exist to bring security to the citizens of Israel; it exists to guarantee the continuation of the theft of Palestinian land. As a Jew, I am repelled by the crimes this militia commits against the Palestinian people."

Again, I want to thank you for contacting me to voice your support. It means so much to me. And let me assure you that I will continue to speak out on these fundamental issues of principle, despite the vilification to which I have been subjected by many in the media and attacks from some of my own caucus colleagues. To those who accuse me of taking sides, I have said that I plead guilty. I do take the side of life over death, of peace over war, of justice over tyranny and dehumanisation, and of the oppressed over the oppressor.

Sincerely yours,
Svend J. Robinson, MP
Burnaby-Douglas

So it does speak well of Jack that he got Svend on side. And that he got Ed Broadbent at the same time.

It also speaks well of Ed Broadbent (the leader during the 1980s) that he chose to act on principle rather than out of old loyalties, and endorse Jack, despite the considerable ill will among caucus against both Svend and Jack. (Only one other caucus member of the 10 who weren't running endorsed Jack -- also the only other person who supported Svend when he was censured, Libby Davies.) The decision was a difficult one for Ed for those reasons, but he obviously believed that Jack was the best leader and swallowed whatever old conflicts he had with Svend.

We'll continue to bring you these vignettes of Canadian politics as we head toward the election expected in 18 months or so. ;)

And now we'll wait and see what happens at the UN, of course, and whether Chrétien decides that what's good enough for the UN is good enough for Canada, either way it goes.

It's the same the whole world over. It's the poor what gets the blame.
It's the rich what gets the pleasure. Ain't it all a bleeding shame?

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Cascadian (261 posts) Click to EMail Cascadian Click to send private message to Cascadian Click to view user profile Click to check IP address of the poster Click to add this poster to your Friend List
Jan-27-03, 01:36 AM (ET)
Reply to post #9
12. This tells me Jack Layton may become Canada's next leader.
It was the NDP that inspired many of the Liberal policies under Pierre Trudeau in the 70's. With the Liberals moving too close to the center from what Trudeau had envisioned for a progressive Canada and with the Tories and Alliance too far to the right, the NDP could well take both of them in the next election. Paul Martin, who is tapped to become Chretien's secessor better not get too comfortable in the prime minister's seat should he get it. I hope Jack Layton does become P.M. Could can you imagine the reaction from the right wingers who run America when they find that Canada has swung to the left?

John

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RBHam (2365 posts) Click to EMail RBHam Click to send private message to RBHam Click to view user profile Click to check IP address of the poster Click to add this poster to your Friend List
Jan-26-03, 11:22 PM (ET)
11. He is a great man - ther hope for the future od the left up here
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Lydia Leftcoast Donating Member (5617 posts) Click to EMail Lydia%20Leftcoast Click to send private message to Lydia%20Leftcoast Click to view user profile Click to check IP address of the poster Click to add this poster to your Friend List
Jan-27-03, 02:47 PM (ET)
15. I saw this story on News World International
LAST EDITED ON Jan-27-03 AT 02:48 PM (ET)

last night, and I felt very wistful.

Why couldn't we have a major political party that actually and unashamedly reflects left-of-center views instead of continually trying to make nice with the other side?

I tremble for my country when I
consider that God
is just and his justice cannot sleep
forever."--Thomas Jefferson

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trebizond (70 posts) Click to EMail trebizond Click to send private message to trebizond Click to view user profile Click to check IP address of the poster Click to add this poster to your Friend List
Jan-27-03, 03:10 PM (ET)
16. He sounds like a good guy
LAST EDITED ON Jan-27-03 AT 03:22 PM (ET)

What are his chances of success? A couple of you seem to be suggesting he could be a shot for PM: if memory serves me correctly, didn't the NDP only score about 10% of the vote at the last election, so isn't that a bit over-ambitious at this point? I read that alot of NDPers went Liberal last time because they were terrified of the Alliance nutjobs who seem to want to destroy everything that makes Canada stand out, espoecially in comparison to us, as a progressive nation- so perhaps the combination of a decline in support for the Alliance and the accession of a business-schill like Martin to the Liberal leadership, coupled with a dynamic new NDP leadership, could seriously change the Canadian political landscape? This is all very interesting, a very pleasant departure from the ceaselessly depressing political scene we Americans..sorry USAmericans have to put up with...


I haven't the faintest idea what the hell linux is, but I sure like penguins and jetpacks!
NO OIL WAR!

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iverglas (489 posts) Click to EMail iverglas Click to send private message to iverglas Click to view user profile Click to check IP address of the poster Click to add this poster to your Friend List
Jan-27-03, 04:06 PM (ET)
Reply to post #16
17. chances of success?
Of forming the government? Nil. ;)

One factor is regional. We have no presence in Quebec (about, I dunno, 1/4 of the seats in the House). It's too much to expect that we could suddenly up and take seats there, let alone a significant number.

Another is the first-past-the-post system in a multi-party context. Many MPs are elected with less than 40% of the vote in their constituencies. Much depends on the split. And this leads to strategic voting -- if voters feel (however unrealistically) that the Conservative or Alliance candidate could win in their riding, they'll vote Liberal even though they would have voted NDP all things being equal. This will happen even in ridings where the Liberal could never be defeated.

NDP MPs in particular are almost always elected by a plurality rather than a majority: our success depends on having two strong right-wing parties competing for the same votes. This is not really the case now; the Conservatives are dead ducks, and the Alliance is increasingly lame.

This then translates into hugely unrepresentative numbers in the House of Commons. You know: Al Gore won the popular vote, but lost the election. Jean Chrétien's party got far less than a majority of the popular vote (38.5%), but holds a majority (51.5%) of the seats. And this -- the unrepresentative number of seats -- makes the NDP, for instance, look even weaker than it is.

http://www.fairvote.org/e_news/970603.htm

The winner-take-all national elections that took place in Canada yesterday (June 2, 1997) were clearly unfair -- with the Liberals turning 38.5% of the popular vote into 51.5% of seats and the Conservatives seeing their 19.1% of the national vote translate into a paltry 6.6% of seats.

What was most stark, however, were the incredible distortions, province-by-province. ... -- instructively, the Quebec separatist party (the Bloc Quebecois) won only 37.6% of the vote in Quebec, but snared a comfortable majority of the province's delegation and will be the third largest party in parliament despite not fielding any candidates outside of Quebec.

At present, we have 7% of the seats in Parliament, and 11% of the popular vote. We have 21 seats; we'd have 33 under strictly proportional representation. We had slightly more than the Bloc Québécois in (national) popular vote; the BQ has more than twice as many (44) seats.

Another example is British Columbia's last election:
http://www.gowebtide.com/freeyourvote1/media/mondayMag052302.html

Though it previously opposed changing the system, even the NDP is now on record as favouring a review of the way we elect our MLAs <members of the provincial legislature>. (Of course, the fact that New Democrats hold just 2.5 percent of the seats while collecting 22 percent of the popular vote last year might possibly have stimulated their newfound enthusiasm for change.)

... Had such a system been in place for the 2001 election, assuming that the number of seats remained at 79, there would now be 18 NDP MLAs (compared with two now), 11 Greens (compared with zero) and just 50 Liberal MLAs (as opposed to 77).

And wouldn't that have been amazing: the legislature would have been almost 1/7 Green, instead of 0/79 as now. And then we'd have to start worrying about our own vote splitting. ;) (The circumstances were a little unusual in BC, with a lot of voters wanting to punish the outgoing NDP govt, but many not willing to vote right.)

Also, Liberals will just appropriate policy where it's convenient for elections. In 1988, they swore they'd rip up the free trade agreement. The rug was pulled out from under the NDP on that one (of course, my own position was that we should simply have hammered the Liberals on their own record on everything else, including promise-keeping) ... and the Liberals somehow grew to love NAFTA. The same thing happened previously with their vow to repeal the Tories' federal sales (goods and services) tax. They didn't.

And still people vote for them, year in, year out. It's kind of a rite of citizenship -- and immigrant populations are inducted into it, by the constant courting of multicultural communities by the Liberals, who make themselves appear as the immigrant's friend.

For the NDP to make inroads, something has to happen to sever "the Liberals" from "Canada". The neverending brouhaha about the Liberal leadership, while dying down a bit, completely occupied national politics for months. As I said to a friend's boyfriend, a Liberal backroom boy, a few months ago when unhappily forced to have dinner at his home -- Canada is not the Liberal Party, and the Liberal Party is not Canada, and I don't give a shit whom you elect as your leader! (In an obvious but undeclared pro-Paul Martin ploy, he was seriously attempting to persuade us to join his party so that we could "influence" the selection of the next Prime Minister and vote for the weak "left" liberal candidate, Martin obviously seeing more threat from righter-wing candidates, and wanting to split the vote as much as possible.)

But because of their ability to identify themselves with government and with the country itself, they keep winning ...

However, if they do select Martin and if the popular mood really has shifted away from that hard-right (in Cdn terms) crap, they may be making a big mistake, and it's one that we need to exploit the hell out of!


It's the same the whole world over. It's the poor what gets the blame.
It's the rich what gets the pleasure. Ain't it all a bleeding shame?

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