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8/13/10-Officials dispute reliability of Waukesha County clerk's election data system

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kpete Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 07:21 PM
Original message
8/13/10-Officials dispute reliability of Waukesha County clerk's election data system
Edited on Thu Apr-07-11 07:34 PM by kpete
Election Returns: What Went On in Waukesha?
After Hours of Silence, Embattled Clerk Reports Wildly-High Turnout in Prossers Top County

http://www.onewisconsinnow.org/press/election-returns-w...


................

Officials dispute reliability of Waukesha County clerk's election data system

By Laurel Walker of the Journal Sentinel

Aug. 13, 2010 |(24) Comments

Waukesha Waukesha County Clerk Kathy Nickolaus' decision to go it alone in how she collects and maintains election results has some county officials raising a red flag about the integrity of the system.

Nickolaus said she decided to take the election data collection and storage system off the county's computer network - and keep it on stand-alone personal computers accessible only in her office - for security reasons.

"What it gave me was good security of the elections from start to finish, without the ability of someone unauthorized to be involved," she said.

Nonetheless, Director of Administration Norman A. Cummings said because Nickolaus has kept them out of the loop, the county's information technology specialists have not been able to verify Nickolaus' claim that the system is secure from failure.

more: http://www.jsonline.com/news/waukesha/100595954.html
http://www.bradblog.com/?p=7988
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catgirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 07:25 PM
Response to Original message
1. This is unbelievable

Ohio all over again.
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DemReadingDU Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 07:39 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Exactly what I was thinking
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bjobotts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 12:38 AM
Response to Reply #2
49. Are elections to be decided by the vote "counters"? Where is the scrutiny for election fraud?
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valerief Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 10:00 AM
Response to Reply #49
83. They always are. nt
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mod mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 07:06 AM
Response to Reply #1
65. Remember how Blackwell had the data routed to a private server run by a GOP firm?
I wonder if signatures will match up to totals. No validation should occur until they do!
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valerief Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 10:00 AM
Response to Reply #65
84. More importantly, and got away with it. nt
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piggy2000 Donating Member (30 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 10:34 AM
Response to Reply #1
88. Don't Forget Florida..

This woman needs to be interrogated just like any other common criminal.
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rzemanfl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 07:45 PM
Response to Original message
3. She fucking pulled this BEFORE? People here are saying the
Edited on Thu Apr-07-11 07:47 PM by rzemanfl
additional votes are legit. HORSESHIT! She is a fraud who has been granted immunity in the past. I don't believe her. Sorry. I live in Florida and have seen this shit before.
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RagAss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 08:17 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. I live in Florida too...these folks are being naive.
Edited on Thu Apr-07-11 08:17 PM by RagAss
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rzemanfl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 08:43 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. I used to live in Wisconsin , that naive attitude comes from
having a football team that wins, I think. Or from cheese.
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RagAss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 09:00 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. LOL !
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russspeakeasy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 09:23 PM
Response to Reply #8
15. Me too, please buy my house so I can move to a liberal state
like Texas. The votes are never safe.
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TxVietVet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 06:42 AM
Response to Reply #15
62. Texas, a liberal state?????
Man, just check out the state congress. It's mostly goofy conservanazis. People here believe all the conservanazi bu$hit. Right now the rethugs have a strangle hold on the budget. What do they want to cut? Education and anything that looks like it will benefit poor, minorities or working people.

Lot's of these rednecks wouldn't know what liberal or progressive was unless their pulpit pimp 'splains' it to 'em. This is thumper heaven. Even the radio preachers spew out the conservanazi lies.
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Wednesdays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 07:00 AM
Response to Reply #62
63. Something tells me Russ had tongue stuck tightly against cheek while typing that.
Just a hunch.
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TxVietVet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 08:10 AM
Response to Reply #63
68. I figured surely he jest.
:think:
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robinlynne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 10:47 AM
Response to Reply #62
90. That was a joke. sarcasm. and the funniest joke I've seen in a while.
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AtheistCrusader Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 09:28 AM
Response to Reply #15
78. The Republicans howl just as loud here in Washington State
every time there's any sort of election issue. They call it 'recount until you win' in King County.

We had a locked, correctly tagged container of ballots found in an election workers car, when all should have already been delivered to county election commission, and the votes in that box put Gregiore over the top to a win (democrat) and I have heard nothing but BITCHING ever since.

Even though, the people caught voting for dead spouses so far, have been, as far as I can tell, ALL republicans.
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glinda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 11:02 PM
Response to Reply #8
26. Yup. Fraud.
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SnakeEyes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 11:29 PM
Response to Reply #3
33. Even Nate Silver is saying it's looks legit
If it isnt legit its going to be really easy to find out. An entire city not included in the totals is easily verifiable since all ballots are paper. Just count them up.
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AmBlue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 12:06 AM
Response to Reply #33
44. Count the ballots... then compare with the number of voters who voted.
Edited on Fri Apr-08-11 12:07 AM by AmBlue
Auditing elections involves ballot accounting, or comparing the number of ballots to the number of voters who voted. They should be the same.

The campaign cannot and should not be distracted by the "data" on her PC. The back-up for that data is ALWAYS the paper ballots COMPARED WITH the voter sign-in sheets from election day. Hopefully the ballots have been impounded and now should be hand counted, then compared with the tallies of the voters that signed in to vote on election day. Absentees and overseas ballots as well. I'd be real curious to know what the security measures for the ballots are in that county.

Her PC's data should absolutely be examined, but the true vote count of the ballots should EQUAL or be the same as the sign-in books (or whatever means they use to check-in voters on election day). If the counts don't match and are significantly more or less than the number of voters that signed in, then that's a big red flag.

THIS is the beauty of paper ballots and why we fought so hard for them.
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mod mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 12:12 PM
Response to Reply #44
99. They need to get a court order to impound the ballots/machines/records!
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ooglymoogly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 04:34 PM
Response to Reply #44
104. Can the paper ballots be changed, or other paper ballots be substituted for them?
This woman had the keys to every machine in the place and took her computer home with her to spend more me time with it. And so many fishy excuses. And Gee, she did it before. Duh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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fasttense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 07:38 AM
Response to Reply #33
66. Do you have a link? I searched 538 and couldn't find anything on it. n/t
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SnakeEyes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 08:24 AM
Response to Reply #66
69. From his twitter account @fivethirtyeight
The numbers being floated about missing votes in Brookfield seem reasonable. Would be ~11% of Waukesha vote, same as in Prez election in 08.

Before missing votes were found, Waukesha's turnout had been 7.5% of WI's. Versus 7.8% in Pres '08, 8.7% in Gov '10, 8.7% in Feb. election. about 15 hours ago via web

So I don't think there's any conspiracy here ... Waukesha's vote total had been slightly lower than you might expect. about 15 hours ago via web

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sybylla Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 09:03 AM
Response to Reply #69
73. The One Wisconsin Now article in the OP disagrees with Nate Silver
"...estimates put overall turnout near 38 percent, a wild outlier to historical data and the earlier mid-day estimation of Waukeshas own officials..."
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SnakeEyes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 10:25 AM
Response to Reply #73
87. Tweets 1 and 2 disagree
I'm going to go with the statistical guru that is using current numbers and comparing with other relevant current and past data. Rather than just a single number that isn't clearly defined nor is it compared with other numbers as Nate did.

Whatever this 38% refers to, if it were a wild outlier Nate would be all over it. A "wild" outlier would stand out to a stats guru. He's ideologically on our side and wouldn't ignore it..
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SnakeEyes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 11:02 AM
Response to Reply #73
93. Newest post from Nate
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mistertrickster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 02:46 PM
Response to Reply #93
103. He's arguing on statistics alone, which aren't conclusive either way.
He's saying that without the 14K votes, Wauk. Co. was a little lower than usual, but with the votes it's about what you'd expect.

But might the lower vote count simply been all those CONs who were disaffected by Walker?

This is a well-reasoned argument, but it proves nothing.

It's not nearly as convincing as the Clerk saying she "forgot to save," when the program she uses automatically saves even in the event of an electrical power outage.

I think it's much more likely, if honest error is involved, that she counted the city twice.
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SnakeEyes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 07:07 PM
Response to Reply #103
116. the table of results during canvassing
showed zeroes. And there are republicans and democrats in the process. Pretty easy to know whether it's true or not.

The city also published their numbers on their website on election night. http://tinyurl.com/3oq3vgr
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ooglymoogly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 08:44 PM
Response to Reply #69
118. There are many ways to steal an election than the obvious straw man you erect.
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paparush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 11:09 AM
Response to Reply #33
95. Didn't some precintcs "run out of paper ballots" and were switched to touch screen voting?
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jwirr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 11:26 AM
Response to Reply #3
96. Is there a link to the past fraud and immunity agreement?
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ooglymoogly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 01:16 PM
Response to Reply #3
100. Judging from her past record she is likely to have already, even before
this latest convenient miraculous find cheated the vote to the max. The magic votes found are just enough to avoid a recount; isn't that precious. This woman needs to spend a few years in prison as a felon for tampering with elections.
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femrap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 07:47 PM
Response to Original message
4. Damn it....I can't take
Edited on Thu Apr-07-11 07:49 PM by femrap
another stolen election.

ETA: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :wtf: :wtf: :wtf: :wtf: :argh: :argh: :argh: :argh: :argh: :argh: :argh: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :grr: :grr: :grr: :grr: :grr: :grr: :grr: :grr: :grr: :grr: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:
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FeelingBlue Donating Member (146 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 10:08 PM
Response to Reply #4
25. My smilies, exactly. n/t
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SnakeEyes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 11:30 PM
Response to Reply #4
34. If that's the case
it will be easy to find out. Good think WI uses paper ballots.
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Nostradammit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 02:38 AM
Response to Reply #34
53. Which Kathy Nickolaus keeps locked in her garage, right?
About time to put an end to this bullshit once and for all, I'd say.
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Poboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 07:52 PM
Response to Original message
5. recommend.
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Thunderstruck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 07:52 PM
Response to Original message
6. Koch theft!
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RUMMYisFROSTED Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 09:58 PM
Response to Reply #6
20. Koch Robin'.
:think:
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femrap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 07:55 PM
Response to Original message
7. She needs to be in
dressed in orange....damn it.
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louslobbs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 08:23 PM
Response to Original message
9. No one gave her authority to do this(sure ok), she did it herself to "protect" the integrity of
the election LOL. Give me a fucking break. This needs to be investigated throughly because there is no way of verifying what she did, (although it looks very suspect), and have a new election in that county, done without Nickolaus involved and overseen by Democratic and Republicon vote watchers. What she did, didn't give her "good security" it has caused red flags to be raised about the legitimacy and integrity of this vote count. Either do it over the right way, or throw out the votes and don't include them in the calculations. This makes me sick, Koch strikes again. She didn't want someone "unauthorized" to be involved so that she could do what the Koch Klan wanted done. She'll probably be driving around in a new Bentley Mulsanne if this works, courtesy of Koch Klan Korp. Another Republicon pig, cheating voters to feed the corporate pig. How come no one else thought of this? Deciding to take the election data collection and storage system off the county's computer network - and keep it on stand-alone personal computers accessible only in her office - for "security reasons". Or perhaps, nefarious reasons? The Brookfield Vote Stealing Debacle. It was just an error and she's sorry.......just said on Rachel Maddow.

Lou
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freshwest Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 12:37 AM
Response to Reply #9
47. Rachel didn't give this any legitimacy, did she? This is fricking outrageous ballot box theft.
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tomp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 06:39 PM
Response to Reply #9
108. i can only assume what she did was illegal.
i mean, there must be a law that prohibits this, that clearly specifies the data chain. is she being charged?
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fishwax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 09:03 PM
Response to Original message
12. k/r n/t
:kick:
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deacon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 09:18 PM
Response to Original message
13. She's crooked. Crooked election, period. n/t
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Horse with no Name Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 09:20 PM
Response to Original message
14. So...let me get this straight. She did it before. She was softly reprimanded.
SO...then she does it again?

Is this willful incompetence?

Or what exactly is it?
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rzemanfl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 09:27 PM
Response to Reply #14
17. Just helping out the man SHE USED TO WORK FOR! eom
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 09:27 PM
Response to Original message
16. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. 
[link:www.democraticunderground.com/forums/rules.html|Click
here] to review the message board rules.
 
Blue Owl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 09:34 PM
Response to Original message
18. WHOA
This shit ain't even fucking close to being Kosher
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Metta Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 09:40 PM
Response to Original message
19. Rachel had on a WI law prof, former legislator, saying it looked suspicious.
He went into chapter and verse about it.
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freshwest Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 12:37 AM
Response to Reply #19
48. Good, that answered my reply above.
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tomp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 06:41 PM
Response to Reply #19
109. looked suspicious? understatement of the year. nt
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roxiejules Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 10:00 PM
Response to Original message
21. She was a Computer Spec. for the Rep. Caucus
For 13 years, Nickolaus worked for the Wisconsin State Assembly Republican Caucus as a data analyst and computer specialist. She resigned in May 2002.

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glinda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 11:04 PM
Response to Reply #21
27. Oh man! Huge flags! Geeze.
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sybylla Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 09:05 AM
Response to Reply #21
74. Resigned in scandal - after getting an immunity deal.
And she worked for Prosser for 8 years when he was in charge of the Assembly.
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roxiejules Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 09:11 AM
Response to Reply #74
75. The Dem at press conference was quite elderly
and could have been duped by the Clerk - especially around computer technology.
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robinlynne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 10:49 AM
Response to Reply #21
91. That's who we want taking acre of our votes, exactly!
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renegade000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 10:05 PM
Response to Original message
22. It's a problem when
an honest mistake is potentially indistinguishable from foul play. Without enough oversight/transparency, how can we tell? It's not inappropriate to assume the worst. This is ridiculous.
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 10:06 PM
Response to Original message
23. DREs - Election Results Easily Altered by Outsiders AND Insiders
Whether it is a DRE or an optical scan machine, the opportunity for tampering applies to persons with inside access (including government workers) and to a lesser extent, outside hackers. Therefore framing election tampering issues as "hacking" may not be an accurate framework for public concerns. Within the context of protecting voting rights, it would not matter whether vote alteration was done by an outsider or an insider.

Demonstrated Laboratory Attacks
Attacks have also been performed on both DRE machines and optical scan voting machines, which count paper ballots. (See California study, "Security Analysis of the Diebold AccuBasic Interpreter" <8>).

Diebold Election Systems AccuVote-TS (Manipulation of the votes by the Princeton University.)<4>
Nedap ES3B (Manipulation of the votes by a citizen group)<5><6>

(wikipedia)
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SnakeEyes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 11:35 PM
Response to Reply #23
36. Evidence of DRE used here?
Edited on Thu Apr-07-11 11:35 PM by SnakeEyes
There were comments from people on DU that some places out paper ballots but I can't find a source saying that this area was one of them.
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 11:44 PM
Response to Reply #36
39. Yes, a DUer posted this tonight::
A woman from Brookfield called Chicago CPT radio show and stated that Brookfield ran out of paper ballots and went to a DRE machine. Thu Apr-07-11 07:48 PM by riderinthestorm



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Ellipsis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 11:37 PM
Response to Reply #23
37. Waukesha county uses Opscans... who remebers any more.
They use typically DRES only for the disabled.


At this point, I don't know what to think.

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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 11:45 PM
Response to Reply #37
40. Apparently they ran out of paper ballots for the Opti-scan
and had the rest of the voters use a DRE machine. Please see my post above for the source.
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FeelingBlue Donating Member (146 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 10:07 PM
Response to Original message
24. Which is why the votes should be tossed,
and why Waukesha County should fire her.
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glinda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 11:04 PM
Response to Reply #24
28. Good resolve.
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freshwest Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 12:39 AM
Response to Reply #24
50. Yep, call for another election. Don't let the repigs steal this one. Make 'em do it all in daylight.
Taking it to her home and on her personal computer -- my @ss!
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Bound by Honor Donating Member (62 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 11:05 PM
Response to Original message
29. I would ask to bring in the VV heavyweights in
and have them audit the entire Waukesha county.

And issue relevant information enough to indict Ms. Kathy Nickolaus for election fraud, electioneering, tampering, and other election-related violations. She needs to spend time behind bars for a very long time.

In fact, if I was President Obama, I would immediately re-start the psychiatric wards for the mentally ill, and order all Republicans transferred and deprogrammed (meaning no Rush, Faux, or any of the right-wing idiots.) Note to self: Invent an implant that will deliver a brain shock when they are tuned to the wrong frequency (i.e., Faux, Rush, etc)



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Bound by Honor Donating Member (62 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 11:06 PM
Response to Original message
30. Waukesha County votes should be completely rejected
because she couldn't follow the damn state and federal laws regarding data collection regarding votes.

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SnakeEyes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 11:32 PM
Response to Reply #30
35. This is no reason to disenfranchise voters of an entire county
Edited on Thu Apr-07-11 11:32 PM by SnakeEyes
We cant allow Republicans to do it to us nor she we do it to them.

Since WI uses paper ballots with a paper trail there is no reason to throw them all out. Just recount them.
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Kablooie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 11:24 PM
Response to Original message
31. It also gave her a chance to forget about it until the Democrat won.
If she went to all that trouble, why did she happen to overlook including it in the official election results?

This stinks to high heaven and if they let this go, we are all doomed!

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nolabear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 11:27 PM
Response to Original message
32. I'm not inclined to be paranoid, but WHY does this never happen with the Dems?
Christ, dealing with the GOP is like trying to straighten snakes.
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DaDeacon Donating Member (494 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 11:41 PM
Response to Reply #32
38. That's what I've been saying!!!
YOU NEVER SEE A MODERN DEM WITH LOST/FOUND/ADDED VOTES! We really need to not take this laying down!
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in_cog_ni_to Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 11:48 PM
Response to Reply #32
41. They're rotten to the core. Notice that none of these lost and found votes EVER favor
Democrats? Hello!!!!
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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 04:52 AM
Response to Reply #41
56. NEVER! nt
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99th_Monkey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 11:55 PM
Response to Original message
42. Is the the Ghost of Katherine Harris, rearing her ugly head? After all, her name is Katherine. ~nt
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Blacksheep214 Donating Member (682 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 12:03 AM
Response to Original message
43. Sing Along!
We won't get fooled again! No, No!

It has gotten to the point that we can't trust our government to have clean, honest elections.

Florida 2000, Ohio 2004 and all the investigative reporting which proved we were hosed.

In court, if the police lose the accountability of evidence, it's tainted and inadmissable.

What does one call this? :wtf:
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Nictuku Donating Member (907 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 12:10 AM
Response to Original message
45. Access Databases ... Don't have to be 'Saved'
Any IT folks out there who knows the answer to this? I've worked with some MS Access databases, and my understanding is that you do not have to actually click 'save' when data has been input into a form. Data can be lost if you close the program improperly, but you generally are given a message about the data not being saved. So when she said 'she forgot to click on save' I had a few red flags go off in my head.

Can anyone verify this?

I did find this older article: http://allenbrowne.com/bug-01.html
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elbram Donating Member (27 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 01:04 AM
Response to Reply #45
51. I agree
In a database the records/tables update "live" as you enter the data, you do not hit save. I think that 'Save' is only needed for things like report format changes or database structure changes....
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drm604 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 02:19 PM
Response to Reply #45
102. IT person here. Yes and No.
Once a row has been inserted or updated and then committed than yes, it has been saved to disk. The caveat is in the application written around that database. It's possible that it holds the data somewhere and does not actually write and commit it to the database until there is some operator action such as clicking a "save" button.

But I'm trying to understand how she would have missed doing that. Any half decently written app would prompt you if you tried to close it without saving. I'd really like to see the user interface of that app to see if her explanation makes any sense.
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freshwest Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 12:31 AM
Response to Original message
46. In most places employees are not allowed to take public records home; and I suggest she had help.
Edited on Fri Apr-08-11 12:33 AM by freshwest
They were not her property, if they needed to be secured they could have been somewhere locked up. By removing them from proper custody, they have been been tainted and are not reliable.
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Rex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 01:09 AM
Response to Original message
52. She already committed criminal acts, why does she have a job again?
Oh right...fall gal.
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tavalon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 04:03 AM
Response to Original message
54. Hmmm, ya think?
IOIYAR.
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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 04:48 AM
Response to Original message
55. Sorry, I just know something is fishy.
Why would the Koch Brothers allow a free and fair election? They have too much invested. There is a reason these Republican governors are acting so reckless and arrogant. They seem to have no fear. They know something we don't know and it isn't only about Citizens United.
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democrank Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 05:04 AM
Response to Original message
57. K & R
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spicegal Donating Member (617 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 05:23 AM
Response to Original message
58. I listened to this woman's comments, and have to tell ya
it didn't give me much confidence. She stated it was "human error". Excuse me, and we're supposed to believe this is all legitimate. Has anyone heard of something like this happening anywhere. It's almost like someone in card game holding their hand under the table, then being allowed to produce it at the last minute, and say see, I won. But since Republicans are running the show, we know anything goes when it comes to making sure their guy wins. That's how we ended up w/Bush. It never ends.
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oldhippydude Donating Member (446 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 06:02 AM
Response to Reply #58
59. yep
kind of had deja vu Rosemary Woods (look it up if your too young for Watergate)
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roxiejules Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 09:01 AM
Response to Reply #59
72. Rose Mary Woods: On How Nixon's Watergate Tape was Destroyed
THE two enduring mysteries of Americas Watergate scandal were the identity of Deep Throat, the crucial source of the Woodward and Bernstein investigation, and the 18-minute gap in a key White House tape recording.


Woods was asked to demonstrate in court how she might have inadvertently made the gap while having a telephone conversation, and her contortions, before a disbelieving court, became known as the Rose Mary Woods stretch. She had to create receiving a telephone call while transcribing. It involved removing earphones, stretching with her left hand backward to the main desk telephone, lifting the receiver, then with her right hand pressing the tape record button instead of the stop button, while all the time keeping the pedal depressed with her left foot on its forward play side.



http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/obituaries/art...
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paparush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 06:07 AM
Response to Original message
60. Lemme guess, it's an Excel Spreadsheet....?
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Nictuku Donating Member (907 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 10:07 AM
Response to Reply #60
85. No, she said Microsoft Access
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paparush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 11:03 AM
Response to Reply #85
94. Just heard on the Stephanie Miller show that there is one account for that machine that
is shared among all the office employees so it's virtually impossible to know who logged onto that machine at what time.
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hayrow Donating Member (230 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 06:26 AM
Response to Original message
61. Seriously!
This is election fraud at its crudest and most basic. You would have to be a total fool to believe anything from the Waukesha County liar. Will we let them get away with it, is the only issue. Now its up to the people of Wisconsin to stand up, or become the peons that the Koch brothers believe us to be.
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Harriety Donating Member (119 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 07:03 AM
Response to Original message
64. It's Not About Voter Fraud, It's About Election Fraud (typicial Repub style)
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SnowCritter Donating Member (192 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 07:43 AM
Response to Original message
67. Republicans claim that government doesn't work
Then they're put in control and prove it. Well, actually, they make sure that it doesn't work.
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tcaudilllg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 09:33 AM
Response to Reply #67
79. Scientifically verifiable +1
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myrna minx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 08:39 AM
Response to Original message
70. Wow - Wisconsin is ground zero in exposing all the the Repub dirty tricks.
Unreal.
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FourScore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 09:42 AM
Response to Reply #70
82. They are just so uncharacterisctially BAD at it.
If it weren't so infuriating, it would be laughable.
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dpbrown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 08:55 AM
Response to Original message
71. She clearly manufactured this vote count, and should go to prison for voter fraud

What a load of garbage. "Finding" votes days after the end of the election? After the opponent has declared victory?

Bolder even that Bush's stealing of Florida.

And ironic that the toady right was crowing about voter fraud before this happened.

I guess they don't care so much about voter fraud today, do they.
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tcaudilllg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 09:16 AM
Response to Reply #71
76. I agree. Either that, or throw the votes OUT!
This cannot be allowed. Absolutely not.
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SnakeEyes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 06:47 PM
Response to Reply #71
110. Found during canvassing
That's usually how it works.

As much as i hate to lose this, its really simple. When they canvassed the next it was discovered that the table of data had zeroes for an entire city.

And the city posted their results the night of the election: http://tinyurl.com/3oq3vgr

So they'd have had to rig up phony numbers that they provided her with.
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TBF Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 09:25 AM
Response to Original message
77. I'd check her bank account for any recent large deposits -
I smell Koch Bros.
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Hubert Flottz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 09:34 AM
Response to Original message
80. People who tamper with the will of the people should get life...
without mercy, instead of secret atta-boys from the ones who put them up to it.

The folks up there were probably Blackwelled.
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FourScore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 09:40 AM
Response to Original message
81. I hope she gets caught and goes to jail. n/t
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SnakeEyes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 06:49 PM
Response to Reply #81
111. Doesn't seem to be anything to get caught for
The city posted the same numbers on election night: http://tinyurl.com/3oq3vgr
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ck4829 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 10:20 AM
Response to Original message
86. Wow, just remember that *this was a year ago*. If you don't smell it, get your nose checked. K&R.
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RoccoR5955 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 10:41 AM
Response to Original message
89. Remember all of this in 2012, when the Presidential Election
is held, and the CONs run some loser, who, all of a sudden wins in districts with 1000% turnout and stuff like that.

They are tripping over themselves trying to make things look like they just made "human" mistakes, and had no ulterior motives. This makes my BS meter go off the scale! They cannot win an election legitimately, so they try whatever tricks they can to win.

So remember this in 2012.
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bergie321 Donating Member (797 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 10:57 AM
Response to Original message
92. This is unbelievable
But the Republicans will, no doubt, get away with stealing ANOTHER election.
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SnakeEyes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 06:50 PM
Response to Reply #92
112. It wasn't stolen
The city posted the results on their website on election night: http://tinyurl.com/3oq3vgr

That matches the missing votes.
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AlbertCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 11:26 AM
Response to Original message
97. without the ability of someone unauthorized to be involved,
OR the ability of those AUTHORIZED to get involved and check it out.

What, are we to just totally believe a single person (who used to work for the GOP) in this day and age?
Riiiiight.
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SnakeEyes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 06:51 PM
Response to Reply #97
113. How about the city being discussed?
They posted their numbers on their website.. match the ones she reports receiving from that city and failed to input them properly into the statewide totals.

http://tinyurl.com/3oq3vgr
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Blue Owl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 11:31 AM
Response to Original message
98. The votes were not found on state-owned voting equipment
They were found on her PERSONAL LAPTOP.

Um, Hello?
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mod mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 01:59 PM
Response to Reply #98
101. Exactly!
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onethatcares Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 04:44 PM
Response to Reply #98
105. yes this wasn't a Soduko game or even close
I can't even fathom a county worker taking home the drivers license data base or the tax collector data base on their own computer. The same one they might watch porn on or go to ebay with.

Then to find a non recountable amount of votes two days after the election has been decided has led me to ask; If this person was a Democrat and had worked for the Democratic candidate in the previous 5 years, would the main stream media be so silent about it?

Nah, I don't think so.
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SnakeEyes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 06:57 PM
Response to Reply #105
115. Nonrecountable?
Wisconsin uses paper ballots and requires a paper trail. When canvassing the next day it was discovered that the city of Brookfield had all zeroes in the table of results. They went back, looked to see the actual results, and included them. (which is the purpose of post election canvassing)

The city of Brookfield posted their numbers on election night which verifies the numbers being reported: http://tinyurl.com/3oq3vgr
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onethatcares Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 07:34 PM
Response to Reply #115
117. none of the other elections have a result
close to the Kloppenberg/Prosser race.

I guess the others weren't as glitzy, huh?

I'm just wondering how tha happens, and I understand the overs/unders/not interested.

I'd still like to see the papers.
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SnakeEyes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 10:47 PM
Response to Reply #117
119. then you'd have to take that up with the Brookfield election officials
that were responsible for counting the votes and transmitting the final counts to her
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SnakeEyes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 06:55 PM
Response to Reply #98
114. The votes were not found on her laptop
Her laptop was the intermediary between the voting machine totals and uploading them to the statewide database of results/totals.

During canvassing the next day, as they went over all the totals they were responsible for, they discovered the Brookfield numbers were all zeroes. The real numbers for Brookfield are the "found" votes.

The city of Brookfield's website even posted the numbers on election night. They match the ones being reported today. http://tinyurl.com/3oq3vgr
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Blacksheep214 Donating Member (682 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 04:48 PM
Response to Original message
106. Her next job
can be at Koss.

She seems qualified!
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jdadd Donating Member (950 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-08-11 05:38 PM
Response to Original message
107. "Without the ability of someone unauthorized to be involved,"
= Democrats
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