Interesting story re: Reagan's near-assassination (at least I think it is - opinions vary):

[PCIntern]

On that afternoon, I was teaching a large pre-clinical class at one of the large dental schools here in PA, and the course director came down, and gave me the 'come-hither' crooked finger. I stepped outside of the laboratory wherein students were drilling fake Ivorine teeth, and he said to me, "The President has just been shot outside of a hotel in Washington. You tell the students - I don't want to do it." And he turned around and left.

I was just out of dental school myself, but had been teaching even as a student so I picked up the mic and announced, "Everyone just stop what you're doing for a minute." The room got real quiet..."I was just informed by Dr. 'So and So' that President Reagan has been shot at a Washington hotel. That's all he knew, and all I know for now, but we'll see what we can do about getting a radio on the P.A. here so go back to work and we'll do what we can."

The student sitting directly to my right, the son and grandson of a well-known pair of local dentists said, "Is he dead yet?"

I got back on the mic, and said, "OK, stop again." And I turned to him and said, "I heard that, Dave, and I want to enlighten you about something and since you were so vocal, we'll just let the rest of the class (165 students) hear this: This is NOT how we are supposed to change powers in this country - that we lived through this with President Kennedy and it did not go well. Government by assassination is about the worst thing that can happen in a so-called free country and no matter who it is, it is almost indescribably inappropriate for any individual to hope for something like this to happen."

I was followed by thunderous applause and believe you me, most of the students in that room in those days were Democrats or even further Left. (Things have changed, of course).

In retrospect, there is so much hate-talk these days that I don't know if I would still do the same thing...I'm so inured to it that I would probably just shake my head and continue.

[no_hypocrisy]

1. Sorry. I could only recommend your post one time.

Well said.

[Name removed]

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[Name removed]

4. Deleted message

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[gratuitous]

3. I chatted with a college friend a week or so later

In the first flush of the shooting, there was a lot of confusion. Breaking news interruptions of daytime programming and the like. But it quickly became apparent that Reagan had sustained only a superficial wound, and there was no mortal danger (little did we know that the public was being played for suckers - a pattern that would become quite obvious in years to come - and that Reagan survived through a combination of luck and medical skill). When the fourth or fifth breaking news interruption mentioned that Nancy Reagan was rushing to her stricken husband's side, several young women in the dorm asked in unison, "What is she wearing?"

[RamboLiberal]

19. IMHO the public wasn't being played for suckers

That wound was extremely small being a 22 round under the armpit. If Reagan hadn't coughed up blood in the car and Paar the Service agent changed destination to hospital Reagan would've been dead. Even at the hospital they were shocked after they got a chest tube in to Reagan the amount he was bleeding internally.

Confusion reigned that day on his condition.

Excellent book out on the shooting Rawhide Down - just skip the first parts where author is a big Reagan admirer. From the moments outside the hotel to in the ER & surgery it is a good read.

[gratuitous]

22. Indeed, that's where the luck came in

I suppose the public may not have originally been played for suckers, but it took one hell of a long time for the seriousness of Reagan's wound to become public knowledge. I personally recall the almost light-hearted commentary around that time, with most of the focus being on Reagan's alleged "Mommy, I forgot to duck" quip when he came out from under anesthesia.

It might have been a case of "Gee, if we'd known it was that easy to withhold information, maybe we should do it more often." The Reagan shooting was hardly the first time information in the public interest was held back, but the lack of curiosity and follow-up by the major media may have set off some kind of bell in some people's minds. We'll surely never know.

[RamboLiberal]

24. One thing to remember back in those days no 24/7 media

No real public internet. Just 3 major networks with 1/2 hour of national news a night. Just a local morning and/or evening newspaper for news.

Be quite different if it happened today. Just look at the Giffords shooting and how many press conferences we watched from medical staff.

[WolverineDG]

5. My mom hated JFK

but sat in front of the TV with tears streaming down her face. The President of US had been assassinated. Didn't matter that she didn't vote for him. He was the leader of her country.

I was at home watching soaps when Reagan was shot. I only had to go to school half-days my senior year. I spent the next 4 hours taking notes, even writing down Frank Reynolds' announcement that James Brady had died.

dg

[PCIntern]

6. Remember how upset Reynolds got when

he was given conflicting info?

[8 track mind]

18. "Get it RIGHT!" n/t

[WolverineDG]

32. I remember he said something like

"I'm not going to announce that if you haven't confirmed it."

But that was after he'd had to retract the statement that Brady had died.

Frank Reynolds knew how to kick ass & take names on the air.

dg

[8 track mind]

38. ill see if i can find it on you tube n/t

[8 track mind]

39. found a video on youtube, ABC news

seems to me the worst thing you could ever do is piss off a secret service agent with a .38 special

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGUrBfp8G2Y&feature=related

[Raine]

17. Same event but ugly story

When Kennedy was killed I was in elementary school, private school in a conservative area. The principal came in and told my class that Kennedy had been killed, the kids cheered. The principal of course got really angry and the kids stopped in mid cheer but the ugliness Ill never forget. :-(

[SDuderstadt]

21. Might I ask where you lived at...

that time?

I have heard of schoolchildren cheering in Dallas, but not in other places. It is deplorable.

[Raine]

33. A burb of Los Angeles County

a very wealthy conservative area that voted overwhelmingly republican until about the 1990's. It's pretty much blue now but then a Democrat didn't stand a chance. Even being blue now after the 2008 election people who had Obama signs suffered vandalism to their property after the election.

[reggie the dog]

35. I would have cheered if W were killed

and i wouldnt have stopped for any right wing principal telling me not to. same goes for Reagan too.

[defendandprotect]

7. People haven't changed - it's still a liberal nation --- that's why

the right wing has to control everything -- from the corporate-press to

buying government and elected officials -- publishing houses -- on and on --

not to mention GOP voting computers -- and the LARGE computers used by MSM

which took them from reporting actual vote tallies to giving them new powers

to PREDICT and CALL elections -- WINNERS and LOSERS -- ELECTORAL COLLEGE VOTES --

and what we saw in 2000 was simply a REVERSAL of those new powers --

RW propaganda has changed the country -- just as Hitler's propaganda changed that country!



See: Operation Mockingbird

[apocalypsehow]

27. This reply is utterly untethered from anything - *anything* - discussed in the OP. It is as if you

were composing a reply for another thread, lost track of it, and simply decided to post the same reply here instead, even though the reply has absolutely no bearing on or relevance to the OP above.

Curious business.

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

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[PCIntern]

9. Interesting post:

:popcorn:

[NYC Liberal]

10. In other words, "they're horrible people, so we should be horrible people too"?

[reggie the dog]

13. but they are not horrible

they are acceptable people, acceptable elected officials saying they like to HUNT us, so we should just as acceptably call for hunting right wingers. I wish some people in the illinois state house would brag about going out and hunting conservatives and i wish we had a left wing radio host calling for ridding the usa of conservatives except for a couple we could keep in a zoo.

why is it that calling for the killing of us is acceptable but it would be horrible if we called for the killing of them?

[lunatica]

12. All those people you say were killed were killed long before you were born

It's a different story when you live through the trauma of it and the horrible fallout from it. Having your leaders assassinated and murdered kills your spirit much faster than empty slogans and stupid t-shirts. When your leaders, people like Robert Kennedy, MLK Jr. Malcolm X and JFK get killed part of you gets killed. But maybe you have to live through it to get that. I wouldn't feel the same if I hadn't live it.

[reggie the dog]

14. and i wish conservatives could have their wind taken

and feel empty, and have their spirits killed and know that if their leaders go "too far" in helping the corporations that they will have "consequences" like MLK, X, JFK, RFK and Wellstone did.

[apocalypsehow]

25. Let's see, Malcolm X was killed by NOI members; JFK by a self-professed Marxist; RFK by Palestinian

Nationalist mad about Senator Kennedy's support of Israel; and Paul Wellstone died in a plane crash that had no ideological implications.

Of those you listed, only MLK could even remotely be said to have been assassinated by someone on the right-wing extremist side of the ledger, White Supremacist James Earl Ray.

Not one of those examples was an instance of the fallen having gone "too far" in any event, since JFK was an enthusiastic booster of the "military-industrial complex," RFK was running as fast to the Right as he could in the 1968 primary (see his joint live appearance with Ronald Reagan where he repeatedly defers to and constantly finds himself in "agreement" with then-Governor Reagan), and Paul Wellstone never let up fighting for his beliefs to the day he died, in a plane crash that, though tragic, had not the slightest suspicion of foul play about it.

As for MLK and Malcolm X, neither of those men held political power and were, in fact, quite marginalized during the time they were actually living. They were no threat to "corporations" in any way, shape, or form.

The content of your replies in this thread is not only appalling, they are quite simply factually incorrect.

[reggie the dog]

34. You actually believe that NOI killed X

and that lee harvey oswald killed JFK....

wellstone died in a mysterious plane crash with no proof of wrongdoing, just like a kennedy kid, how coincedental.

I tend not to believe official stories because i have studied history and found numerous instances in which those in power elimate potential enemies and then find patsies

[reggie the dog]

36. MLK was not a threat to the white supremecist system? nor X???

[madokie]

11. i remember the day well

I was reassembling a dozer engine listening to the radio and coping a toke from time to time and they break with the news and I immediately have flashbacks to the Kennedy's assassination. A few days later I read that John Hinchley's parents were having dinner the night prior to that incidence with babs and poppy so I've suspicious of the bush clan every since. Back then I was more interested in having a good time than I was paying attention. After all I was one of the Vietnam Vets who came home with a whole clearer picture of whats going on so this attempt made me start paying attention again.

splchk

[csziggy]

15. I'm not as good a person as you are

At the time I was upset - the president had been shot and even if I detested the man, I hated the idea that another president might have been assassinated.

But times have changed and so have I. While watching a program about the Reagan shooting, I could help but think how different this country would be today if the Secret Service agent had let the presidential limo return to the White House. According to the doctor who treated Reagan, if it had Reagan probably would have bled to death.

If Reagan had died, what differences might there have been in the laws that were passed and the policies enacted that have destroyed our country over the last thirty years? Sure Bush I would have been president, but I don't think he would have followed the same agenda. And I am certain that his public persona would have had the same effect on the American public to let him get away with some of the things that Reagan's actor persona allowed him to do.

I doubt Bush I could have gotten re-elected and think he would have been like Johnson and alienated the voters that brought his predecessor into office. Who might have been able to be our Democratic president in 1985 instead of eight years of Republicans?

So from thirty years on, I wish we could have lived through a different outcome.

[PCIntern]

16. Well, your point is taken, but next time,

it's "our" guy again, and it's again OK with certain elements of the population. I don't like it...sorry.

[apocalypsehow]

28. So, what you are saying is that you endorse political assassination as a method of changing a duly-

elected government you do not like. That is your position, boiled down to its essence.

There is nothing - nothing - even remotely progressive or liberal about that.

[csziggy]

29. No, but I can fantasize about how different things would be if it had suceeded

Without endorsing the act.

I can also worry about what it would be like if Clinton had been convicted when impeached, what the world would be like if the South had not lost the Civil War, and other alternative history scenarios.

I can also, as I do, feel guilty when I do wish it had been better if one of those scenarios had come to pass.

[apocalypsehow]

31. Maybe it's just me, but fantasizing about a guy dying from his gunshot wounds doesn't sound like a

very healthy use of ones time or imagination, regardless of the larger historical implications.

But thanks for clearing the "endorsement" bit up - that you don't endorse or support such activity even if you vehemently disagree with any given politician in power in a democratic society. Glad to hear it. :thumbsup:

[eShirl]

20. I'm surprised you haven't been scolded for "being nice" to undeserving "human filth"

definitely one of the uglier factions here

[PCIntern]

23. I told this story a few years ago in another context and

got nailed...

You might notice the 2 deleted messages above: one was definitely my fault for reacting to the one above it in an untoward fashion. I apologize to the Board.

[reggie the dog]

37. be nice right up until they "rid the USA of rats"

please, Rush takes his cue from radio mille collins (radio of a thousand hills) in Rwanda. He is whipping up hate of liberals, saying we should be hunted, exterminated and a couple preserved in a zoo so that once the jackboots take power the killing will soon begin. Look at the signs. ELECTED REPUBLICANS CALL FOR HUNTING LIBERALS! What more do you need to see that they are itching for a genocide? Most cops are conservative, most soliders too (and look into joel's army). They are just waiting for Rush or one of their talking heads to tell them to "begin cleansing" and we are going to see mass mass murders all over. they wear "liberal hunting permit" patches on their jackets to scare us. if you are hiking out in the woods and have long hair like me and wear tie dye and you see some asshole with a "liberal hunting permit " hat or patch who says something to their walking partners like "one day we are gonna be able to solve that kind of problem" what do you think they mean??? it is obvious. they mean 'one day we will be able to kill those assholes". they plotted against giffords with targets, said if elections dont work use a 2nd amendment solution and look what happened. so in this climate i would not shed a tear if one of them got assasinated, i would likely cheer, but i wouldnt endorse it, i would just be happy that it happened.

what do you suggest? being nice to the people who are plotting our genocide?

[apocalypsehow]

26. JFK Jr. had the same reaction you did: when he heard people in the class he was in cheering the

shooting of Reagan in 1981, he openly and loudly said "this is really fucked up."

The cheering stopped.

Good OP: Rec.

[PCIntern]

30. Interesting, I hadn't heard that. thanks! n/t