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Tepco just said the 10 million x reading was a mistake.

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Bonobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:46 AM
Original message
Tepco just said the 10 million x reading was a mistake.
Edited on Sun Mar-27-11 08:00 AM by Bonobo
TOKYO – Officials say a measurement showing a huge spike in radiation levels at a stricken Japanese nuclear complex was a mistake.
The readings, which showed water testing 10 million times higher in radioactivity than normal in the reactor's cooling system, drove workers to flee.
On Sunday night, though, plant operators said that while the water was contaminated with radiation, the extremely high reading was inaccurate.
"The number is not credible," said Tokyo Electric Power Co. spokesman Takashi Kurita. "We are very sorry."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110327/ap_on_re_as/as_japan_earthquake
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femmedem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:49 AM
Response to Original message
1. Was hoping to read something like this. n/t
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Bonobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:49 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. Me too x 10 million! nt
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originalpckelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:49 AM
Response to Original message
2. So how high was it in reality?
What caused the bad reading?
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Bonobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:50 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. I posted all the info I have. It just came in. nt
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originalpckelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:57 AM
Response to Reply #4
15. If you know the number was wrong, it means you have data proving it was.
Or you know what malfunctioned with the measuring equipment.

Why not tell us what happened or what the later measurement was?

We'll see what happened.
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Bonobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:58 AM
Response to Reply #15
19. I see what you mean of course.
But I don't have any more info.

Just the statement.
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nenagh Donating Member (657 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:58 AM
Response to Reply #4
16. So glad the reading was wrong, Bonobo and thank you for posting..
I cannot imagine the strain on yourself and the family..

Keep well... and

:hug: For Bonobo and family.. :hug:
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Mariana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:45 AM
Response to Reply #2
54. I don't think they have a different reading
if the translation is good. "Credible" doesn't mean "accurate", it means "believable". The writer of the article says it was innacurate, but that is NOT what Takashi Kurita said. His statement in quotes does not imply that they have any new information that shows the high reading was wrong. He's saying they don't BELIEVE the extremely high reading. Again, this is IF the translation is good and he used words that actually mean "The number is not credible."
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TheEuclideanOne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:53 AM
Response to Reply #2
58. It was wrong, it was really 20 million times
Glad they corrected that.
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Cirque du So-What Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:50 AM
Response to Original message
5. Assume for a moment that the readings were off by a factor of 1,000
I would still be uneasy with levels 10,000 times higher than normal.
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TheMadMonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:37 AM
Response to Reply #5
51. So would I. At 10E7 x the normal safe exposure window is about 2/5 second.
And about 4 seconds for permissible emergency exposure levels. (10 seconds for an extreme emergency.)

It's also probably about the real exposure level of the those Chernobly workers standing knee deep in pulverised reactor core, whilst shovelling it back into the building.

For 10,000 x normal (which does match figures announced earlier), the permissible "emergency" window is roughly an hour (or 2.5 hrs) which is just barely enough to cause a very small number of additional cancers in a fairly large population.

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Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:50 AM
Response to Original message
6. praise the lord.
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eShirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:50 AM
Response to Original message
7. that's one hell of a mistake
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Wilms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:52 AM
Response to Original message
8. But the article is not offering a revised figure.

I imagine these decimal points will shift all over the chart as a natural part of this, um, unnatural event.

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Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:53 AM
Response to Reply #8
11. because first they were telling the truth, then they decided to lie again.
Edited on Sun Mar-27-11 07:54 AM by Hannah Bell
because that would make it so much more convincing.

could you be glad, just for a minute? just a little.

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originalpckelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:55 AM
Response to Reply #11
14. They've made mistakes before...
so it's not unexpected.

Whatever it is, downplaying the problem in the early hours/days is probably going to take lives in the future with higher cancer risks.
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Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:58 AM
Response to Reply #14
17. "downplaying"? there had just been a 9.0 earthquake & up to 16-meter high tsunami,
transportation & communication was knocked out, whole villages were destroyed, 1/3 of the country had serious damage, aftershocks & tsunami warnings continued for days -- & you say the gov;'t "downplayed" the nuclear problem?

hell, it probably took them days just to get a reasonable grasp on what was even going on.

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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 11:35 AM
Response to Reply #17
75. Seriously. It takes time to figure out what is going on at all and then it changes rapidly
After the last 15 yrs, it is difficult to know who to trust about what info. Add to that the instant spreading of instant "news" and the desire to have to know NOW and predict with accuracy and it ends up being a mess.

"downplaying", right. Good reply.

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originalpckelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 11:45 AM
Response to Reply #75
77. Tell that to the people living around the plant...
They can't even leave their houses. How would you like to be in that situation?
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 11:53 AM
Response to Reply #77
78. I certainly wouldn't like to be in their situation. Am talking about us, here.
Even for those in the midst of or near a disaster, it still takes time to figure out what is going on. I am not excusing this or saying it is ok, just saying it takes time and to realize that the situation is fluid and you can't predict things well often.

Please don't jump on me about people living in/near/around the disaster zones as I am in no way excusing any misinformation.

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originalpckelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:14 PM
Response to Reply #78
81. People who work in nuclear power probably have a fair idea...
of what happens when you lose power to cooling pumps in nuclear reactor. Just a guess.
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Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-11 02:51 AM
Response to Reply #81
117. you do realize that the tsunami deluged the facility, right? two of the deaths
at the facility were of workers lost in the earthquake/tsunami.

the first job was just getting back to the facility in the aftermath.

looks easy from your computer chair. you have all the answers.
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Wilms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:24 AM
Response to Reply #11
45. I'd be glad to get a reply that is both germane and coherent.
Yours was neither. It's a terrible and disappointing departure from all your posts on subjects other than the disaster in Japan. I'll still recommend those despite the anomaly.

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dkf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:52 AM
Response to Original message
9. Yeah it's probably "only" 1 million x.
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Bonobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:54 AM
Response to Reply #9
13. Is it just pessimism that prompts you to say that?
I mean you sound almost disappointed?

Would it be so bad if this even didn't actually destroy Japan?

I realize of course that it might be a setback for the "no nuclear power" movement, but that's a small sacrifice, right?
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dkf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:15 AM
Response to Reply #13
34. Because I am pissed off at Tepco.
And upset that my friend in Iwaki decided this is his life's work and stayed 18 miles away from the reactors and is constantly out and about delivering stuff to people, that is why.

Yeah it's not 10 million times, but I doubt it's some benign number.

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Bonobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:19 AM
Response to Reply #34
40. Shit. Well I don't blame you.
I'm pissed at them too.

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Art_from_Ark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 11:56 PM
Response to Reply #34
110. Iwaki
That's much closer to the nuclear plant than I am. I wish your friend well. It must be tough up there living with that complex in the backyard.
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ohheckyeah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-11 02:22 AM
Response to Reply #13
112. I can't imagine how upsetting
it must be in your position to see comments suggesting that information we are getting is not credible. It can't be very pleasant or comforting and I feel for you.

I think the people who say that aren't trying to be macabre but are expressing the deep distrust most people have toward governments and corporations. Unfortunately, the distrust has been well earned. Hopefully, we are all being told the truth and the nuclear situation isn't as bad as many believe it to be.

Take care.
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Bonobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-11 02:46 AM
Response to Reply #112
115. Thanks.
Yes, it is upsetting and what is the most upsetting is that people seem to be lining up in FAVOR of bad news because it suits there sense of how the world works -but they don't realize it is tantamount to cheering for the death of my country.
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ohheckyeah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-11 02:53 AM
Response to Reply #115
118. I know. I've refrained
from posting much about it because I am naturally cynical toward governments and corporations BUT I so hope and pray that things will calm down and the cleanup and healing can start. I wish I could do something to help and wish I could say something that would make you feel better. I'm so sorry for what you are going through.

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PCIntern Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:29 AM
Response to Reply #9
48. Maybe it's 100,000,000 or 9,000,000 or who TF knows?
This has become a guessing game and a bluffing game...not grounded in reality. A lot of stories meant to confuse and obfuscate: gee, we said 10 million, we were wrong...sorry. Now people don't know what to think or believe...but it's all OK...they didn't anyway and it doesn't really matter...the radiaion will do what it does no matter what man says, thinks about, or lies about.
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Art_from_Ark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:52 AM
Response to Original message
10. You should read some of the Japanese comments about that
Edited on Sun Mar-27-11 07:53 AM by Art_from_Ark
東電 「1000万倍は間違いでした、ごめんね」  間違い確定

http://alfalfalfa.com/archives/2823380.html
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Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:00 AM
Response to Reply #10
20. all i see is squares. could you give us a hint?
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Bonobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:02 AM
Response to Reply #20
22. It says:
"Tepco: We made a mistake about the x 10 million. Sorry."


...Sounds very flippant and casual. As if such a huge mistake is no big deal.
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Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:06 AM
Response to Reply #22
24. you mean the comments are saying the explanation sounds overly
casual?
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Bonobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:08 AM
Response to Reply #24
26. No, just that the apology sounds overly casual.
After all, it was a HUGE number!

BTW, do you agree with me that this is a fairly good sign that they are actually being open about releasing scary numbers?
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Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:12 AM
Response to Reply #26
29. i'd think so. certainly i don't see how releasing a scary number then backtracking
it would aid in a "cover-up".

my basic position is you can't cover up a nuclear accident in the modern age & everyone knows it. so why would they try, at least on the broad details like radiation levels?

if they're lying substantially, everyone will eventually know it. so why bother?
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PCIntern Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:49 AM
Response to Reply #29
57. You don't?
I do.
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femmedem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:47 AM
Response to Reply #26
56. That was my second thought after reading your OP.
The first being an atheist's version of Thank God.
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Art_from_Ark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:12 AM
Response to Reply #20
28. OK
Here are some comments:

信じないから
("I don't believe them")

1000万倍→10万倍ってことでOk?
("Is it OK if it's only 100,000 times instead of 10 million times?")

ゴメン30億だった。って事も
("We're sorry-- it was 3 billion times")

アホしかいないのか
("Are there just a bunch of idiots (there)?"

バカなんじゃないの
("Isn't this stupid?") or maybe ("Aren't they stupid?")
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Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:14 AM
Response to Reply #28
31. sounds like du. thanks.
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stockholmer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:59 AM
Response to Reply #31
60. roflmao
:rofl:
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 11:36 AM
Response to Reply #31
76. +1.
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Dappleganger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:32 PM
Response to Reply #31
94. Ha!
There's little doubt their bullshit meter is running at full speed right now.
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Bonobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:12 AM
Response to Reply #10
27. Wow, that was the least of the comments!
Most people are saying something like:

"So what are the real numbers, you jerkoffs!?"
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originalpckelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:17 AM
Response to Reply #27
37. Precisely!
What the hell are the real numbers?

How do they know they were wrong?

What happened?

I'm glad I'm not the only one with a little common sense.
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Bonobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:18 AM
Response to Reply #37
39. Not at all, it seems as if most people reacted just as you did. nt
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JTFrog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:53 AM
Response to Original message
12. Check your PM's please.
Thanks.

JT
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enough Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:58 AM
Response to Original message
18. Blame the instruments. It couldn't be that high, so it isn't. That is exactly what happened
Edited on Sun Mar-27-11 08:03 AM by enough
in the first days of Three Mile Island. The workers saw readings on the instruments that "couldn't be right," so they didn't believe it. Turned out the instruments were correct after all.
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originalpckelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:01 AM
Response to Reply #18
21. Yeah, the silence on what the real measurement was...
or what error caused the false one is deafening.

You think you'd have to know either of those two things to make a public statement to the contrary.
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Chris_Texas Donating Member (707 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:04 AM
Response to Reply #18
23. Unlike 3 mile island these guys are NOT saying "that doesn't seem right" before reacting
They are reacting instantly and as cautiously as possible, even at the risk of a lot of false alarms.
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Bonobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:07 AM
Response to Reply #23
25. Furthermore, their willingness to release the 10 million times figure originally
at least suggests strongly to me that they are being honest.

After all, it was a frightening number that they released right away.

If they are guilty of all the hiding of the truth, why would they have originally released it?

Good sign about openness IMO.
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enough Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:13 AM
Response to Reply #23
30. Actually, they are saying "The number is not credible, we are very sorry."
That's the quote from the article. That's all they are saying at this point.
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originalpckelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:14 AM
Response to Reply #30
32. How can they be so sure?
What happened?

I assume there will be a press conference to explain it, and they'll probably tell people why it happened then.
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Bonobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:15 AM
Response to Reply #32
36. I'm certain it will come out.
At this point, most Japanese do not trust what these Tepco louts are saying and will not accept anything less than a full explanation.
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Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:15 AM
Response to Reply #30
35. one hopes that the writer did not completely invent the rest.
Edited on Sun Mar-27-11 08:15 AM by Hannah Bell
"plant operators said that while the water was contaminated with radiation, the extremely high reading was inaccurate."
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Mariana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 09:06 AM
Response to Reply #35
63. It looks like the writer did indeed invent the rest.
Takashi Kurita in no way implied that there was any evidence or new information that shows the high reading was inaccurate. He said they don't BELIEVE the high reading ("The number is not credible"). Unless he said other stuff that isn't quoted, the writer jumped to that conclusion and misrepresented the statement.
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Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-11 01:57 AM
Response to Reply #63
111. as it turns out you were wrong.
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Bonobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-11 02:25 AM
Response to Reply #111
113. Yes and I will still like to know why anything that is close to positive news
is acted upon ny so many hear as if it is a personal affront to them.
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Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-11 02:29 AM
Response to Reply #113
114. A desire for positive news means you're a nuclear shill. Trying to keep the facts
clear means the same.

All the mind-readers & propheciers in this thread were wrong in this instance. But they never come back & cop to it.
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Mariana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:54 AM
Response to Reply #18
59. I think that's exactly what's going on here.
"The number is not credible" means "We don't believe the number". That's what "credible" means, it means "believable".
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:15 AM
Response to Original message
33. i'm sick of this crap. Get a team of international experts in there and give us facts
this is a world wide disaster. Japan should not be allowed to continue their wagon circling game.
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Bonobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:17 AM
Response to Reply #33
38. "Japan should not be allowed"
Try saying that about the US and think about how that would sound, about how that would go over.


"The US should not be allowed.... "


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originalpckelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:19 AM
Response to Reply #38
41. No country should be allowed to do something on its own...
that can have such profound consequences for the rest of the world.

Who the fuck knows what kind of consequences this will have for the rest of us. We're all in this boat together.
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Bonobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:24 AM
Response to Reply #41
43. Agreed but I did not like the wording "Should not be allowed"
Allowed by who? Japan is a sovereign nation.

There ain't no "allowed" in the conversation.

Japan is not the USA's lap dog anymore.
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:21 AM
Response to Reply #38
42. i know...i'm just frustrated. -nt
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Bonobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:25 AM
Response to Reply #42
46. Well I fucking understand THAT all right!
I am frustrated times 10 fucking million!
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:43 AM
Response to Reply #46
53. thanks for understanding ;)
that's one 10 million count I can get behind
:fistbump:
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Dappleganger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 10:44 AM
Response to Reply #33
66. They're not children.
And the US is the last nation to go wagging our finger wrt telling the public the truth about *anything*.
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 11:58 AM
Response to Reply #66
79. How about an international group then?
The rest of the world has a right to know what is happening
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Dappleganger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:25 PM
Response to Reply #79
87. These problems are best solved by scientists.
It's not about "the right to know".
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 02:08 PM
Response to Reply #87
108. What do you mean "It's not about the right to know"?
:wtf:

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grahamhgreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:24 AM
Response to Original message
44. What is the number then? WTF?
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Bonobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:25 AM
Response to Reply #44
47. The question on everyone's lips indeed. nt
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PA Democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:31 AM
Response to Reply #44
50. In the meantime, gov't asks water treatment plants nationwide not to take in rainwater
The health ministry has instructed the operator of water purification plants nationwide to temporarily stop taking in rainwater to prevent contamination in tap water following radiation leaks from the crippled Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant, ministry officials said Sunday.

While calling on the plants to ensure stable supply of tap water, the Ministry of Health, Labor and Welfare also proposed covering pools of the plants with tarps to keep out rainwater or to use powdered activated carbon that can help get rid of radioactive materials.

The instruction by the ministry came after radiation levels beyond Japan's regulated standard were found in tap water at multiple purification plants in Fukushima and other prefectures including Tokyo, 220 kilometers southwest of the plant.

Radioactive materials emitted to the atmosphere from the nuclear plant apparently fell down to earth with the rain. Radiation levels in water fall over time after it stops raining.

http://english.kyodonews.jp/news/2011/03/81334.html
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backwoodsbob Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:30 AM
Response to Original message
49. be safe
:hug:
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Bonobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:40 AM
Response to Original message
52. Frighteningly, most Japanese comments I read on the link that Art posted
seem to suggest that they are expecting WORSE numbers... I hope they are wrong.

One comment I read said that the max level that the machines could read was 10 million times the normal radiation level and so if they have it wrong, AND they are announcing late at night with no alternative number, that it most likely means the real number is HIGHER...fuck.

Man, people sound ready to rip those TEPCO guys to shreds.

Many calls for the IAEC to come in and get some professional assesments...that the TEPCO clowns are amateurs and need to go.
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 08:46 AM
Response to Reply #52
55. Screw Chernobyl being the upper limit reference point
7 my butt.

We all know it could be much worse. China Syndrome or the like should be #10 (or higher if it gives comfort on some level)
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BrookBrew Donating Member (369 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:23 PM
Response to Reply #55
85. The funny thing is you all know nothing. Because THEY know next to nothing.
because it is still in process. This is not a shitty jane fonda movie, its real life.

Maybe "the road" or "mad max" should be the upper limit. This is sad and funny all at the same time. I truly hope posters dont believe this and are just stirring up some shit.

As of RIGHT NOW, there are no cases of radiation sickness. 3 men have gotten a <200msv dose, and NO ONE IS DEAD from this event.

Here are LIVE radiation levels all over japan in MICRO sv.

http://www.mext.go.jp/english/radioactivity_level/detail/1303986.htm
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suffragette Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:48 PM
Response to Reply #52
101. Bonobo, The IAEA now has teams there
Edited on Sun Mar-27-11 01:05 PM by suffragette
I noticed that in a article from yesterday (sorry, read so many it would take me awhile to track down which one)

I looked just now and found this about it on their site.

Lots of information there, though it's hard for me to tell which is coming from the IAEA teams (except the paragraph that specifies that) and which from other sources like Tepco.

As far as I can tell from this report, the specifics from the IAEA team at this time are from outside the plant, which still leaves Tepco as the only source for inside the plant unless or until that changes.


http://www.iaea.org/newscenter/news/tsunamiupdate01.html

IAEA Briefing on Fukushima Nuclear Accident (27 March 2011, 13:30 UTC)
Two IAEA teams are currently monitoring in Japan. One team made gamma dose-rate measurements in the Tokyo region at 8 locations. Gamma-dose rates measured ranged from 0.08 to 0.15 microsievert per hour, which is within or slightly above the normal background. The second team made additional measurements at distances of 30 to 41 km from the Fukushima nuclear power plant. At these locations, the dose rates ranged from 0.9 to 17 microsievert per hour. At the same locations, results of beta-gamma contamination measurements ranged from 0.03 to 3.1 Megabecquerel per square metre.



The Joint FAO/IAEA Food Safety Assessment Team arrived in Tokyo on Saturday. It will meet regulatory officials in various prefectures where food contamination has been detected. The team left for Fukushima early today. The Mission will assist and provide advice on sampling protocols, analytical procedures, data collected to date, and actions taken by the Japanese authorities for the control of contaminated foods.


Hope this helps.


ETA: This report was a general report from before Tepco's announcement last night. It's the most recent page I can find so far from IAEA.
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 01:21 PM
Response to Reply #101
104. I am glad to see that, thank you.
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suffragette Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 01:32 PM
Response to Reply #104
105. You're welcome
Though, this post makes me wonder how much access Tepco will give them:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x750991#752611
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grahamhgreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 09:04 AM
Response to Original message
61. More info: "He said officials were taking another sample to get accurate levels, but did not know
Edited on Sun Mar-27-11 09:06 AM by grahamhgreen
"He said officials were taking another sample to get accurate levels, but did not know when the results would be announced."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110327/ap_on_bi_ge/as_japan_earthquake;_ylt=AtXNekol9zKsPrlOXZeP6SOs0NUE;_ylu=X3oDMTNqb3RlaXNpBGFzc2V0A2FwLzIwMTEwMzI3L2FzX2phcGFuX2VhcnRocXVha2UEY2NvZGUDbW9zdHBvcHVsYXIEY3BvcwMxBHBvcwMyBHB0A2hvbWVfY29rZQRzZWMDeW5fdG9wX3N0b3J5BHNsawNqYXBhbmh1Z2VyYWQ-


What did they base their statement on? A guess?

Really, how long does it take to get a reading? I thought it was instantaneous.


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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 09:26 AM
Response to Reply #61
64. I believe someone has to go in to take the test, unless they
have some sort of robot to do it. In any case, while the actual test may be instantaneous, getting the test done isn't. I think elaborate safety precautions are taken for this sort of thing.

I'm betting it's already been done at the time of this writing, and we'll find out the results pretty soon.

The question I would have is: If you think the test should be done immediately, are you willing to go in and do it? If the answer is no, then you'll have to wait until whatever preparations that need to be made are made.
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grahamhgreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 11:28 AM
Response to Reply #64
71. Oh hell no, but Ann Coulter thinks radiation is harmless, maybe we could volunteer her? Or
send in Asimo!

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originalpckelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 11:30 AM
Response to Reply #71
73. I agree, that stupid robot has to be good for something.
"I can walk up and down stairs, but don't ask me to help in a real way, I also shit myself."
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grahamhgreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 11:31 AM
Response to Reply #73
74. LOL!
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originalpckelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 11:19 AM
Response to Reply #61
68. How do they know it's inaccurate if they can't say exactly what went wrong..
with their equipment? If they know it's just a bad calculation, then they should be able to figure out the real reading using the same data.

If it's something wrong with the equipment, they wouldn't know until they took another measurement.

If they detected some kind of problem with the equipment, they should be able to provide this to us. Why didn't they?

One has to wonder if they just got a reading they didn't like.
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grahamhgreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 11:30 AM
Response to Reply #68
72. Or, did they take a smple of the water back to the lab, or just an on-site reading?
Anyway, they should have waited til they had clarification before saying anything, IMHO.
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BrookBrew Donating Member (369 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:32 PM
Response to Reply #68
95. Because at 10 - 20sv they would be dead right now. Thats a massive lethal
dose.
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SidDithers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 09:04 AM
Response to Original message
62. K&R....nt
Sid
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Quixote1818 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 09:57 AM
Response to Original message
65. Kick
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Dappleganger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 10:47 AM
Response to Original message
67. Obviously, more readings need to be taken all over the place.
Until they get that done there's really no basis for believing the results from the super-high readings. Not doing this ASAP will only continue to add to more speculation and doubt.

I'm not pro-nuke in the least and believe that corporations and governments are all about CYA, but am not into pearl-clutching with every single news report.
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originalpckelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 11:24 AM
Response to Reply #67
69. Very true, but there's something fishy about this.
Edited on Sun Mar-27-11 11:26 AM by originalpckelly
If you ask a few questions:
1. How do they know it was a bad measurement? Wouldn't they have to have a second measurement that contradicts the first?
2. If they had a fault in their equipment, and that's the basis of their faulty measurement, then wouldn't they be able to say that to us? In other words, why not say it was a broken meter?
3. If the numbers are only wrong because of a bad calculation, which was the stated problem, the original data should be somewhere, and shouldn't they be able to re-calculate it the right way, and find out the real reading?

These questions lead me to believe that lying liars have lied again.

BUT we should all have every body part that can be crossed, crossed at the current moment that this was indeed wrong.

This is the world's problem now. We're all in this together. And it really has nothing to do with radiation.

The world could enter an even greater recession because of this happening in Japan. Lord knows what economic consequences this will have, or how many people will be homeless, starving, or even dying because of this inside and outside of Japan.
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BrookBrew Donating Member (369 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:18 PM
Response to Reply #69
84. Because they are not all dead. At the original obviously wrong dose
they would be getting 10 to 20sv doses. That is basically instant death.

I have STOPPED listening to all the BS news and give everything a 24 hour "bullshit check"

Here are live numbers (note MICROsv is used)
http://www.mext.go.jp/english/radioactivity_level/detail/1303986.htm
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bananas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 03:28 PM
Response to Reply #84
109. No, they reported it as 1sv in the basement
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BrookBrew Donating Member (369 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #67
82. They are here is the link. NOTE this in in MICROsv.
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originalpckelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 11:28 AM
Response to Original message
70. It's been a couple of hours now, and no new reading?
Edited on Sun Mar-27-11 11:29 AM by originalpckelly
You know, they're sort of leaving the whole world hanging here. People in Japan are probably afraid they're going to die some horrible death, and the rest of us are wondering if it will come to us somehow.
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BrookBrew Donating Member (369 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:26 PM
Response to Reply #70
88. There are HUNDREDs of readings from all over japan. I bet most of the population is asleep
because its 0224 am there. I also bet they will be going to work tomorrow and continually mourning the loss of 27,000 of their friends and relatives.

Its not coming to anyone in the US. I am waiting for the first moron to die from a KI overdose. That should be coming any time now.

http://www.mext.go.jp/english/radioactivity_level/detail/1303986.htm
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:30 PM
Response to Reply #88
92. " I am waiting for the first moron to die from a KI overdose", back on ignore (edited)
Edited on Sun Mar-27-11 12:54 PM by uppityperson
thought maybe you'd straightened up today and were posting less offensively but first post of yours I read it this. Back onto ignore. Since you continue to reply to my posts, perhaps you miss what ignore means. It means I cannot see what you wrote, only "ignored". If you want to continue to waste your time posting such stuff, go ahead. But I won't see it.
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BrookBrew Donating Member (369 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:31 PM
Response to Reply #92
93. If they kill fluffy the cat with KI that would be sad..
but any person dosing with KI in the United States over this has bigger problems.
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Urban Prairie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 01:39 PM
Response to Reply #92
106. DU obviously is primarily a politically themed website
Edited on Sun Mar-27-11 02:18 PM by Urban Prairie
I tend to view anyone who does not post on some other or many other topics, especially involving important liberal/progressive causes, to be a troll and soon placed on my ignored list, especially if they manage to be sufficiently offensive by making veiled insults to and assumptions about individuals, as well as to DUers as a whole, and tiptoeing up to the very edge, but not quite past it, and being tombstoned.

It seems that if anyone makes a post that even suggests that the Japanese are in any immediate or future danger of absorbing any amount of radiation directly or indirectly, then this member often replies to them with the incorrect assumption as if they have posted that they believe that the Japanese definitely will or already have

That said, Japan's prevailing winds tend to be from west to east, which likely means that much of the radiation in the smoke and steam, being emitted from the damaged/crippled reactors on the northeast coast of Japan is headed east and out to sea, as does the leaked radioactive waste water, which is for now, very beneficial for the Japanese people living west of and inland of the Fukushima complex.
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 02:03 PM
Response to Reply #106
107. Yup.
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Thunderstruck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:02 PM
Response to Original message
80. Have the workers returned to the plant? What's the new reading?
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spinbaby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:24 PM
Response to Reply #80
86. Only 100,000 times higher than normal
"A few hours later, TEPCO Vice President Sakae Muto said a new test had found radiation levels 100,000 times above normal — far better than the first results, though still very high.

"But he ruled out having an independent monitor oversee the various checks despite the errors."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/ap_on_bi_ge/as_japan_earthquake

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Dappleganger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:26 PM
Response to Reply #86
89. Therein lies their hubris getting in the way of public safety.
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BrookBrew Donating Member (369 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:30 PM
Response to Reply #86
91. They should stop the X normal notation. Its useless and drama provoking.
obviously its not your article and not directed at you. But FUCK they should just list the dose in mvs or sv in the headline.

No one knows what the normal base is and if they do why make everyone do math to figure their shit out.

I cant tell if it is 1sv an hour in the secondary containment area.
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Codeine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:36 PM
Response to Reply #91
98. 100X agreement.
Seriously, give me the fucking reading. I can compare the number to what I know and make an informed judgment about the situation. Otherwise they're just trying to scare me and I don't scare.
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Mariana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:28 PM
Response to Reply #80
90. I don't think there is a new reading.
I think they've just decided to refuse to believe the 10,000,000x reading, because "The number is not credible."
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BrookBrew Donating Member (369 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:34 PM
Response to Reply #90
96. And because they are not dead from a 10 - 20sv dose
that is also a hint.
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Rex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:18 PM
Response to Original message
83. So...are you going to release a number that is credible?
NM...the lies are just going to be a waste of time.
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Arugula Latte Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:35 PM
Response to Original message
97. Mmmm hmm. And they have such a stellar track record on accuracy.
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flamingdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:41 PM
Response to Original message
99. Via Twitter unconfirmed: Tepco revised from 10 million iodine to 100,000 nt
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BrookBrew Donating Member (369 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:44 PM
Response to Reply #99
100. 10million what? Again. with no reading
this is useless data.
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TNLib Donating Member (683 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:55 PM
Response to Original message
102. Tired of Tepcos BS
"We are very sorry."


I'm tired of Tepco's apologies why can't they just put out the facts on what is actually happening. Their information is so vague and sometimes nonsensical. They need to be honest and accurate. There are far too many lives at stake to be playing these games.
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Quantess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:59 PM
Response to Original message
103. Oh yes, it was a mistake.
Whoever said it is in the back room getting a swift beating.
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dogday Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-11 02:50 AM
Response to Original message
116. Tell that to those poor workers who were running like their
ass was on fire, which btw it might of been. I believe the people at the scene, not the owners of the power company.
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