Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

After almost 10 months of solitary confinement, you'd be suicidal, too.

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » General Discussion Donate to DU
 
tekisui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 05:25 PM
Original message
After almost 10 months of solitary confinement, you'd be suicidal, too.
Bradley Manning has been held since May 26, 2010, nearly the entire time in solitary confinement. Solitary confinement and isolation are a form of punishment that will break the psyche and morale of anyone. It is psychosis-inducing and will lead one to want to kill themselves.

There is a reason he may be suicidal. The Department of Defense did it to him. They are breaking him down to a shell of a person. How you define it or label it is largely irrelevant. It is wrong and unjustified to subject a person to this type of punishment, especially without a trial or a conviction.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
monmouth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 05:29 PM
Response to Original message
1. And yet his father says he is doing fine.....n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tekisui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 05:34 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. His father says it is wrong, and they have crossed a line.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-15-11 08:45 AM
Response to Reply #1
39. He sounds like a fuckwad of a tool to me.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NuclearDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 05:31 PM
Response to Original message
2. Well...at least you'd have one or two imaginary friends
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tekisui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 05:55 PM
Response to Reply #2
13. No doubt.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
L. Coyote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 05:31 PM
Response to Original message
3. Solitary confinement causes mental illness and constitutes torture. U.S. Code
It is, beyond a doubt, a crime and torture, even if only used as a threat!!

U.S. Code

TITLE 18 > PART I > CHAPTER 113C > 2340

2340. Definitions

As used in this chapter
(1) torture means an act committed by a person acting under the color of law specifically intended to inflict severe physical or mental pain or suffering (other than pain or suffering incidental to lawful sanctions) upon another person within his custody or physical control;
(2) severe mental pain or suffering means the prolonged mental harm caused by or resulting from
(A) the intentional infliction or threatened infliction of severe physical pain or suffering;
(B) the administration or application, or threatened administration or application, of mind-altering substances or other procedures calculated to disrupt profoundly the senses or the personality;
(C) the threat of imminent death; or
(D) the threat that another person will imminently be subjected to death, severe physical pain or suffering, or the administration or application of mind-altering substances or other procedures calculated to disrupt profoundly the senses or personality; and
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tekisui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 05:35 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. Thanks for posting that.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dkofos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 05:35 PM
Response to Original message
5. Just tell them what they want to hear.
It worked for Curvball.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jdlh8894 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 05:37 PM
Response to Original message
7. solitary confinement -
He's on a cell block w/other prisoners.Single cell,yes. In the hole.no.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tekisui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 05:38 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Not allowed to communicate with other prisoners, no windows. no
sight of others.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jdlh8894 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 05:58 PM
Response to Reply #8
14. He sees them every morning
when he is naked. Or ,should I say ,they see him.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 07:00 PM
Response to Reply #14
23. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 06:36 PM
Response to Reply #8
18. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 05:38 PM
Response to Original message
9. And yet, there is no doctor's report to the effect.
Nothing but Pentagon bs.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tekisui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 05:40 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. And those in power's acquiescence. And the troop of apologists.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 06:00 PM
Response to Reply #10
15. The George Bush Defense: someone told them it was okay. n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
RandomThoughts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 05:40 PM
Response to Original message
11. They have to claim they are breaking him down.
To try and understand why they think they have to treat people wrong.

A backwards system has to justify its actions, part of that is to create an action that has a result they think is better. Breaking people.

If they looked at the function of his actions, they would see he was showing problems, not causing them. But then you have to realize where the problems are. And that is in the secrecy.


It is not hard to understand.

I do not believe people have to be broken. And actually those that want love, are usually able to live a life without knowing. But as said in Equilibrium, some have to see some things to correct those that have seen and use it backwards.



Note the intent of saying something is occurring to a person, is to try to claim such a thing is possible. They are trying to justify some action by saying it is moving some direction. I think they are strengthening the resolve of those against errors in secrecy used to hurt people.

The metaphorical Manning will be even stronger while he walks free unbroken. However he would not need to be stronger, if there were not people doing wrong in secret. He could sleep in love, if there were not the problems of those not sleeping using things against many people.


And I am still due beer and travel money and many experiences. And reverse metaphors do not work, to change the intent of a function.

Or Jupiter is often commented as justice, so io dine. would be the moon in that movie not to take. So if you want to reverse a metaphor to reverse the concept of light and darkness, and make 'containment seem better' as it is in those accidents, but not how it is in reality of light and dark.

Then io dine, is wrong, as said in 2010 movie.

Although that is just resting the reversal of the metaphor. I don't think a nuke leak(data) is a good thing. But a leak of good information to help people is good.

So there are some that defend secrecy, and create a situation that tries to make a metaphor around that. Then try to get people to attach the concept of secrecy to that bad effect of people hurt from radiation. (radiation was also refereed to as better thoughts in BSG when they found earth, remember that)

So light is good.
metaphor gets constructed to associate oil leak, or radiation leak as bad and containment good <-backwards effect to reverse concept of idea of light being good.

So reversal of the reversal, io dine in metaphor, resets that secrecy is wrong.


(side note ofcoarse a radiation leak, and oil leak are bad) but trying to set that as a metaphor for secrecy, to reverse the concepts of light, is Orwellian.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
RandomThoughts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 05:40 PM
Response to Original message
12. They have to claim they are breaking him down.
To try and understand why they think they have to treat people wrong.

A backwards system has to justify its actions, part of that is to create an action that has a result they think is better. Breaking people.

If they looked at the function of his actions, they would see he was showing problems, not causing them. But then you have to realize where the problems are. And that is in the secrecy.


It is not hard to understand.

I do not believe people have to be broken. And actually those that want love, are usually able to live a life without knowing. But as said in Equilibrium, some have to see some things to correct those that have seen and use it backwards.



Note the intent of saying something is occurring to a person, is to try to claim such a thing is possible. They are trying to justify some action by saying it is moving some direction. I think they are strengthening the resolve of those against errors in secrecy used to hurt people.

The metaphorical Manning will be even stronger while he walks free unbroken. However he would not need to be stronger, if there were not people doing wrong in secret. He could sleep in love, if there were not the problems of those not sleeping using things against many people.


And I am still due beer and travel money and many experiences. And reverse metaphors do not work, to change the intent of a function.

Or Jupiter is often commented as justice, so io dine. would be the moon in that movie not to take. So if you want to reverse a metaphor to reverse the concept of light and darkness, and make 'containment seem better' as it is in those accidents, but not how it is in reality of light and dark.

Then io dine, is wrong, as said in 2010 movie.

Although that is just resting the reversal of the metaphor. I don't think a nuke leak(data) is a good thing. But a leak of good information to help people is good.

So there are some that defend secrecy, and create a situation that tries to make a metaphor around that. Then try to get people to attach the concept of secrecy to that bad effect of people hurt from radiation. (radiation was also refereed to as better thoughts in BSG when they found earth, remember that)

So light is good.
metaphor gets constructed to associate oil leak, or radiation leak as bad and containment good <-backwards effect to reverse concept of idea of light being good.

So reversal of the reversal, io dine in metaphor, resets that secrecy is wrong.


(side note ofcoarse a radiation leak, and oil leak are bad) but trying to set that as a metaphor for secrecy, to reverse the concepts of light, is Orwellian.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Sonoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 06:28 PM
Response to Original message
16. There are several guys on DU who have spent time in solitary.
We know who we are, and communicate with one another.

None of us ever felt suicidal, although we did feel a bit crazy.

At one point or another, we were also kept in max on bread-and-water diets..

It is really more of a game than most people would imagine.

Mutual harassment.

Sonoman
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BOG PERSON Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 06:35 PM
Response to Original message
17. you're posting this on an internet forum
Edited on Mon Mar-14-11 06:41 PM by BOG PERSON
it's safe to assume at least 99% of your readers have been, for most of their adult lives, shut-ins with deplorable personal hygiene, whose only human contact is the pizza delivery guy. it's easy for us to scoff at bradley manning's suffering after only TEN MONTHS of crushing isolation, because we live in a kind of exile too. we are dead to the real live world.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tekisui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 11:40 PM
Response to Reply #17
30. Speak for yourself?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 06:39 PM
Response to Original message
19. no shit... but hey, it's not torture to torment people psychologically
I have to laugh at those saying this shit... they really think most people are stupid. They should be ashamed but no.... goofey
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Badfish Donating Member (543 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 06:40 PM
Response to Original message
20. Gotti did more than 9 years in 23 hour lockdown.
where was the outrage then ?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Luminous Animal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 06:52 PM
Response to Reply #20
21. Amnesty International lodged a complaint and plenty of U.S. citizens
agreed. There are plenty of us who deplore the institutionalized torture of U.S. prisoners.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Badfish Donating Member (543 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 06:53 PM
Response to Reply #21
22. So a 23 hour lockdown is torture ?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
elias49 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 07:04 PM
Response to Reply #22
24. Care to try it yourself for 10 weeks, never mind ten months?
A space about the size of a big closet?
Go for it tough guy.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Luminous Animal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 07:28 PM
Response to Reply #22
26. With few diversions and severely restricted human contact? Yes it is. I believe
Amnesty International first complaint against U.S. "High Max" prisons was in regards to conditions of John Gotti imprisonment who was held in similar conditions.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Luminous Animal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 07:47 PM
Response to Reply #22
27. From the U.N. Committe Against Torture (Addressing the United States) and confirms 23 hour lockdown
is torture.
36.
The Committee remains concerned about the extremely harsh regime imposed on detainees
in supermaximum prisons. The Committee is concerned about the prolonged isolation periods
detainees are subjected to, the effect such treatment has on their mental health, and that its purpose
may be retribution, in which case it would constitute cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or
punishment. (article 16)

http://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:Y9apikqI0CEJ:...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tekisui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-15-11 08:14 AM
Response to Reply #27
37. Keep posting that.
Thank you.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
11 Bravo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 07:19 PM
Response to Original message
25. The last time I checked, Charlie Manson was still ticking along.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tekisui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 11:41 PM
Response to Reply #25
31. Your point being?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ReggieVeggie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 07:51 PM
Response to Original message
28. he hasn't been convicted of anything
where is his trial? why is no one allowed to see him?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
elocs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 07:57 PM
Response to Original message
29. It completely depends upon the person and their state of mind.
A person with schizoid personality disorder or its major traits would not be too bothered by solitary which would be very disappointing to those trying to break them.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 11:45 PM
Response to Reply #29
33. You must know how wrong that is. n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
elocs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-15-11 07:03 AM
Response to Reply #33
36. No, it is not wrong. I assume you actually know what schizoid is, maybe not.
Schizoids are loners by choice. They have few friends, not because they are incapable of having friends, but again, that is their choice. They prefer their own company to that of other people. They would likely have little problem living in an isolated area with little contact with other people. They are content with themselves. There is a good chance that most of us know such a person and maybe understanding how they feel would help us understand them better.

So a schizoid would certainly not go insane as a result of enforced solitary confinement because being solitary is their choice. I'm not saying it would be fun or enjoyable, but a schizoid is naturally better able to cope with it. I wouldn't even make the claim that the vast majority of people placed in solitary confinement would go insane because it depends upon the person. So this has nothing specifically to do with Manning, but with the claim that solitary confinement would drive the person insane.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
elias49 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-15-11 08:44 AM
Response to Reply #36
38. I'm happy to say I don't know a "schizoid"...as you define it
but I have to echo EFerrari....what you're posting is wrong on several levels.
Are you sure you're not embarrassed by what you're saying?
"...a schizoid would certainly not go insane...". Maybe because he/she already IS?!
The "vast majority" of people placed in solitary (for 10 months) wouldn't 'go insane'?

:wow:

Meh. 2nd grade psychology doesn't work in the real world.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tekisui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-15-11 08:48 AM
Response to Reply #36
40. None of that is true. I have had several friends with schizophrenia.
In my experience, they yearn to have interactions with other people that they can trust. They have a had a hard time finding people they can trust. One friend would isolated himself for days on end, not because he wanted to, but because he was so overwhelmed with hallucinations, paranoia, fear and depression.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Rex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 11:42 PM
Response to Original message
32. It is torture, but hey he is OKAY (for now) so let it continue!
:sarcasm:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cliffordu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-14-11 11:51 PM
Response to Original message
34. This shit happens all the time to common criminals...
Look up Pelican bay...Or........just watch MSNBC on the fucking weekends.

I guess since he appeals to your politics he's a hero and a scapegoat, but if he was in for trafficking dope or being ugly in public you would really give a shit......

Oh, that's right, your concern is more of making hay at manning's suffering than actually giving a shit about human beings.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tekisui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-15-11 12:03 AM
Response to Reply #34
35. Whoa there.
Don't put words or thoughts in my mouth. I feel the same way about every prisoner, whether just charged or convicted. Especially without either.

Every prisoner and every detainee deserve dignity. Even the rat fucking assholes. It isn't the place of the state to punish before conviction. In my honest opinion, it isn't the place of the state to ever punish.

If I am 'making hay', which is meaningless as I have no power, it is for human rights.

I am not calling him a hero or a scapegoat. It isn't about him. It is about what is allowed to do to us.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tekisui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-15-11 01:23 PM
Response to Reply #34
41. Nice personal attack, btw.
You should familiarize yourself with the rules.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Sat Jul 26th 2014, 01:25 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » General Discussion Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC