Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

7 Reasons Why Capitalism Can't Recover Anytime Soon

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » General Discussion Donate to DU
 
Better Believe It Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-23-10 11:54 AM
Original message
7 Reasons Why Capitalism Can't Recover Anytime Soon
7 Reasons Why Capitalism Can't Recover Anytime Soon
There are important social, political and economic developments that belie the rosy predictions of politicians.
By Shamus Cooke
December 21, 2010

As the recession grinds on, politicians in most industrial countries have an incentive to make exaggerated claims about the supposed coming economic recovery. Some say the recession is over. Obama is in the group that claims we're on "the road to recovery," while other nations can only spot recovery "on the horizon." Below are seven important social phenomena that point to a more realistic economic and political outlook.

1) Central Banks are Dumbfounded.

2) Trade War.

3) Military War.

4) U.S. Economy at a Standstill.

5) Bailout Capitalism.

6) Bailout Repercussions.

7) The Far Right Emerges.


To deal with working people more ruthlessly, the radical right is being unleashed. In normal times these bigots yell furiously but no one listens. But in times of economic crisis they're given endless airtime on all major media outlets. The message of the far right promotes all the rottenness not yet eradicated by education: racism, xenophobia, religious intolerance, violence, and a backward nationalism that fears all things "foreign." These core beliefs effectively divide working people so that a concerted campaign against the corporate elite is harder to wage. Meanwhile, labor unions, progressives, and other working class organizations are instead targeted.

The above phenomena do not happen in a normal economic cycle of boom and bust. These symptoms point to a larger disease in the international economic system, a disease that cannot be cured by politicians who swear allegiance to this deteriorating system and to the wealthy elite who benefit from it. To ensure that the economic system is changed so that working people benefit, large-scale collective action is necessary, based on demands that unite the majority of working people: a massive job-creation program at the expense of Wall Street, no cuts to Social Security and Medicare, a moratorium on home foreclosures, passage of the Employee Free Choice Act, and so on. With the unions in the lead promoting these demands, working people could put up a real fight.

Read the detailed first six reasons and full article at:

http://www.alternet.org/economy/149104/7_reasons_why_ca...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Demeter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-23-10 12:01 PM
Response to Original message
1. What We Are Experiencing Isn't Capitalism
It's a toxic combination of fraud, pillage, theft, slavery and rape.

In its purest form, capitalism is saving and investing. This is piracy.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Better Believe It Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-23-10 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. You just gave a clear definition of how modern capitalism functions!

We've never had "pure capitalism" any more than we've had "pure socialism" or "pure communism".

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
social_critic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-23-10 03:13 PM
Response to Reply #3
14. That's right
But capitalism as practiced in Canada is a lot better than communism practiced in the USSR, don't you think?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
blindpig Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-23-10 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. Sure it is.

Capitalism is piracy. Capitalist appropriate the labor of workers, is that not theft?

With the exception of the post WWII period, 1950-1973, capital has ruthlessly exploited workers as much as it could. That period was unique, not the norm, a result of the US being the only industrial power left standing after the war and the Cold War, which required Capitalism to 'keep up appearances in the face of a competing system. The bloom is long off the post war boom and the Soviet Union is no more so this is what we get, same old pre-New Deal capitalism. A little historical perspective will get ya a long way.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Demeter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-23-10 06:06 PM
Response to Reply #4
15. Only If the Capitalists and the Workers Aren't The Same People
which they could easily be.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
blindpig Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-10 06:54 AM
Response to Reply #15
20. That's a rather narrow catagory.

To be a capitalist ya gotta own the means of production. The people you allude to would be the small business folk who have employees but who actually do work along side their workers, even if in a management capacity. We would count these among workers, not only do they work but they are equally threatened by big capital, which drives them out of business as a matter of course. These folks tend to support the capitalist model until it comes close to destroying them. A lot of them are currently Tea Party types, getting it all wrong, but at least some of them will 'see the light' as they find exactly how self defeating their current affiliation is.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Demeter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-10 02:08 PM
Response to Reply #20
23. Worker's Cooperatives
a home-grown, organic form of capitalism
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
socialist_n_TN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-10 02:31 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. Actually thiese are NOT capitalistic.............
at least I don't think so. This model is a core tenet of my version of socialism. Worker co-ops are worker ownership of the means of production, ergo NOT capitalistic. There IS a difference between trade and capitalism.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Demeter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-10 04:42 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. Actually, They ARE
Capitalism is an economic system in which the means of production are privately owned and operated for a private profit; decisions regarding supply, demand, price, distribution, and investments are made by private actors in the free market; profit is distributed to owners who invest in businesses, and wages are paid to workers employed by businesses and companies.

There is no consensus on the precise definition of capitalism, nor how the term should be used as an analytical category.<1> There is, however, little controversy that private ownership of the means of production, creation of goods or services for profit in a market, and prices and wages are elements of capitalism.<2> There are a variety of historical cases to which the designation is applied, varying in time, geography, politics and culture.<3> Some define capitalism as where all the means of production are privately owned, and some define it more loosely where merely "most" are in private hands while others refer to the latter as a mixed economy biased toward capitalism. More fundamentally, others define capitalism as a system where production is carried out to generate profit, or exchange-value, regardless of legal ownership titles. Private ownership in capitalism implies the right to control property, including determining how it is used, who uses it, whether to sell or rent it, and the right to the revenue generated by the property.<4>

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capitalism

When the workers own the means of production, that's private ownership. That's capitalism where the labor is the owner, and profits are shared by the labor, and there's no "rentier" class, contributing the land and machinery and sucking off the profits so that workers are reduced to slavery.

If the State owned it, it's socialism.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
socialist_n_TN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-10 11:57 AM
Response to Reply #25
26. Ah, the phase of this argument that turns to semantics.........
There are a LOT of definitions of capitalism out there and even MORE definitions of socialism and even a few definitions of Communism. I've had this argument before with one of my favorite posters on here, someone I agree with 80+% of the time. But on this subject, she's stuck on a classic definition of capitalism that is NOT the definition of capitalism in the real world.

So I propose this. ASK a capitalist today for a definition of capitalism. My guess is that you'll get an answer reflecting the PRESENT version of capitalism. I'll go futher and guess that MOST capitalists will say it needs to go even FARTHER into the laisse faire direction. Now ask that capitalist what worker ownership of the means of production is. Any guess as to what that answer would be?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
socialist_n_TN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-23-10 08:30 PM
Response to Reply #1
16. I've had this argument before. This IS capitalism.........
Capitalism is concerned with making money off of the labor of the working class. It has NO ethics as to as how that money is made. If a capitalist makes MORE money from unethical, or even EVIL, business practices not only does that not MATTER, it's actually BETTER capitalism BECAUSE IT MAKES MORE MONEY. Even the capitalists say that rules on capitalism warp the system and what are ethics if not rules?

As pig said below, the ONLY reason we've had the type of capitalism that we had from FDR to Reagan was because there was a competing system. It didn't matter if that system was also imperfect, it was still a competing world view that the capitalists had to take into account. Ergo, the "kinder gentler" capitalism of the time UP TO REAGAN. When the Wall fell and the USSR broke up, they didn't have to pretend anymore.

This IS capitalism.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BOG PERSON Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-23-10 12:16 PM
Response to Original message
2. have you considered the possibility
that capitalism just isn't as profitable as it used to be, and it's getting harder and harder for capitalists to break even? this would actually increase the likelihood of war (of the conventional sort, not the low-intensity conflicts we've all grown accustomed to). there comes a point when nothing can restore the profitability of capital except the destruction of capital - the persistence of this slump suggests we may have reached that point
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Better Believe It Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-23-10 12:17 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. Wall Street and corporate America seem to be doing better than ever ....
Edited on Thu Dec-23-10 12:17 PM by Better Believe It
at our expense of course.

No shortage of profits that I can detect.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BOG PERSON Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-23-10 12:24 PM
Response to Reply #5
8. that's because the US government printed out
a zillion dollars to keep US monopolies afloat and these monopolies are basically just sitting on it. but a certain famous, important guy once said you can't increase the wealth of a society by printing out money anymore than you can get fat by buying a larger belt.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Better Believe It Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-23-10 12:27 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. The wealth of the nation has increased for most people. Just the rich are making out like bandits!
Edited on Thu Dec-23-10 12:32 PM by Better Believe It
Big business is sitting on nearly two trillion dollars in cold, hard cash!

Those year end corporate and Wall Street bonuses must be enormous!

It's party time!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProudDad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-23-10 01:13 PM
Response to Reply #2
12. Recently, thanks to capitalism and cheap fossil fuels
Edited on Thu Dec-23-10 01:14 PM by ProudDad
the human race went into bankruptcy...

By going into population overshoot and beginning to exploit resources and pollute the environment at a rate much higher than the Earth can replenish...

That's what vampire capitalism depended on to build the horribly unequal and destructive "economy" that's oppressing the real "economy" of provision of the Earth's creature's needs in a sustainable manner...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
villager Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-23-10 12:21 PM
Response to Original message
6. Amazingly, this has been unrecc'd -- but the Robber Barons have their fans here
n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lunatica Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-23-10 12:24 PM
Response to Original message
7. Capitalism may be the last bubble to burst.
In it's present state it's a bubble just like all the other bubbles that have burst. It has nothing to stand on. It exists not on a basis of trade, or production or consumer side economics. It exists in the invisible and formless and unsubstantive Wall Street trading that's not even based on flimsy paper itself. It's all based on that twinkling light that computer screens give off.

Trying to restore Capitalism to some former perceived power in society where there was more equity will only make the cycle happen all over again. Poverty isn't the lack of money. It's the refusal of those who have the money to use it to help others. It's as simple as saying that the poor are poor only because the rich are rich. Even with 6 billion people on the planet there is still enough resources to go around and there's certainly enough innovations that people can think up to deal with all the problems we have now. Green technology, based on actual physical things being built and used would solve many problems facing humanity right now. Unemployment, pollution, climate change, world hunger and disease, and it would stop more than one war in the world. But Capitalism as it exists today has effectively killed that possibility up to now.

Leaders need to think outside the box. They need to stop thinking that all enterprise should end in someone making more money or getting rich. That shouldn't be the end game. Money used correctly would make this planet a better place for everyone right now.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bluestate10 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-23-10 08:51 PM
Response to Reply #7
17. Another crying thread.
I won't put you and the original poster on ignore because it is more important that I read what you have to say. And fight the nearsightedness that I see. If I sound like a broken record, please excuse the repetition. Hard as it is for some to see, we own our lives. Don't like big bank bailouts, find a community centered bank or member centered credit union, many exist out in the USA. If big banks buy up community banks to get their hands on your assets again, get with like minded people and start up your own bank, run on principles that are dear to you. If the state or FEDs try to shut you down even though your charter is done right and your taxes are paid, F them, go around your community with a bullhorn detailing what is being done, stand on street corners with signs if necessary. Don't like out sourcing of jobs? There are companies that don't like outsourcing of jobs either and choose to manufacture on the mainland USA. Buy your needs from those companies.

But is is easier for many rail against the elusive, 900 pound boogie man that is hiding in dark shadows, the proverbial "them", the evil, mysterious, connected, favored gnome that controls our strings. Bullshit!!! US citizens and their own buying decisions are their own worst enemy. Corporations are not all powerful, they want profits, take those profits away and they do what you WANT them to do.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProudDad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-23-10 01:11 PM
Response to Original message
10. Some damn good reasons why it SHOULDN'T be allowed to "recover"
Resource depletion, population overshoot, Peak Oil, and Catastrophic Global Climate Destabilization...!

PS: Not only did I not notice you'd already posted this article (COOL of you to do so!)...

But then the DU server posted my OP about it twice...alas!

K&R
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
blindpig Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-23-10 01:13 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. Yes, tear it down. n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProudDad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-23-10 01:15 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. I prefer to think in terms
Edited on Thu Dec-23-10 01:16 PM by ProudDad
of building something locally to replace it... :hi:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bluestate10 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-23-10 09:52 PM
Response to Reply #13
18. 100% agree. nt.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-23-10 10:13 PM
Response to Original message
19. I like the last line that I read there.
"With the unions in the lead promoting these demands, working people could put up a real fight."
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
area51 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-10 10:14 AM
Response to Original message
21. Kick. n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-10 10:20 AM
Response to Original message
22. recommend
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Tue Sep 16th 2014, 04:14 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » General Discussion Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC