I have a lot of anger against voters

[cali]

In state after state, people voted these reactionary,cruel assholes into office. What the fuck were they thinking? That they didn't like dems? That the repukes would create jobs? The agenda of these assholes was damned clear.

[Kolesar]

1. The Cleveland Plain Dealer had an agenda to get the Republicans elected

They endorsed John "Lehman Brothers" Kasich for governor. They spun the story about corruption in county government as an attack on the Democratic Party.

[cali]

2. I know the MSM is complicit. I still can't excuse many voters.

[HughBeaumont]

23. And you know what's stupid?

When you read their justification of why they endorsed Kasich the Fascist, it really isn't grounded in hard logic, reasonable attributes or a past political record that showed he dutifully served any amount of population to the best of his abilities. It pretty much boiled down to "well . . . he seems like a bold cowboy risk taker . . . and. . . well, damn it, we just LIKES him better then that thur Demmycrat!"

Unbelieveable.

[Kolesar]

26. PD's editor Goldberg skipped out for the West Coast

Their editorial page is basically Voinovich/coal industry biased.

[HughBeaumont]

34. With tools like Kevin O'Brien being groomed for the top spot.

O'Brien's crayon scribbles often make teabaggers seem merely off kilter by comparison. The worst columnist in the country is still and will forever be fighting the Cold War.

[xchrom]

3. At the end of the day the voter is the problem.

But dems have to create dynamic messaging, legislation, etc that gives voters a real reason to stick with dems.
Dems haven't done that.

[Tansy_Gold]

18. I've thought it very very interesting that one of the "targets" of the right

the past few months has been Frances Fox Piven, one of the leading advocates for HAVA and co-author (with her late husband Richard Cloward) of "Why Americans Still Don't Vote, and why politicians want it that way."

Hmmmmmm, coinkydink anyone?



TG, TT

[xchrom]

20. conservatives really are as devious as you and i think they are.

it's funny to call them stupid -- but they know how to use every damn trick in the book and win.

[Tansy_Gold]

The leaders are not stupid. The followers?

I'll reserve judgment.


:evilgrin:




TG, TT

[kentuck]

4. Me too.

Especially those that refuse to educate themselves but are the first to grab a gun and spout right-wing slogans.

[rasputin1952]

5. I just read where LA had a 25% voter turn out...

for a special election for a LA State Senate seat...25%...and the GOP appears to have won, turning the state senate over to the R's. The electorate of this nation needs to get some fire under them...or we won't have a nation anymore.

[HereSince1628]

6. Listen to them. Ask yourself whats common to their message.

They are trying to educate us about their motivations. There is no secret there.

Why is that important?

Because when Progressives understand their psychological needs, we can take advantage of the t-baggers insecurities.

I'm not suggesting that we tweak their noses, rather that our messages can be made to lower their insecurities and take away their motivations.

[Volaris]

9. Agreed. And if it could be accomplished,

the possibility of uniting Republican Populists with Democratic Populists could create a new kind of Center in American politics, that would almost ALWAYS fight Up, rather than laterally, and then the keepers of the Corporate Status Quo would have a class warfare battle that they know already they can't win. But yes, we have to find out what is REALLY scaring the hell out of that segment of the electorate. They know something is wrong, something is out of place, but I don't think they can readily express what it is; perhaps, after 30 years of RedWinger Radio, they have forgotten how to even THINK about what it is they just FEEL is out of place..

[HereSince1628]

14. I think we are seeing the possibility of that in Congress

The t-party Congressmen don't seem to be in it to preserve the classic ideological sporting event that has been the last 7 or so Congresses.

[creon]

38. I agree

The RW populists know that something is wrong, but most do not know when, where or how it went wrong. But, it did.

RW politicians and RW radio do a very good job of manipulation.

First, I think that it is about race and diversity. RW politicians and commentators appeal to those fears.
Next is culture and religion. That is, also, fertile ground.

Those two are enough to drown out any anything about economics and class.

[creon]

7. Fear and anger

These are hard times. Many people are angry and afraid. The GOP ( and other political groups) does a very job of manipulating that fear and anger, to their advantage.

The Democrats did not help - those politicians gave their opponents the ammunition - when they did a poot job passing good bills in the 111th Congress.

Politicians usually know something about politics; know how to gauge the passions of the moment and can find the means to make use of those passions. In 2010, the Democrats did not do that. The GOP did.

Governing is a different matter. Politicians do not govern so well; in fact, many do not know how to govern.

[HereSince1628]

8. And a heaping helping of Jealousy

The modern GOP lives at the intersection of GREED and JEALOUSY.

When you look for possible explanations as to how the working poor and the affluent and rich vote for the same partyline the existence of that intersection or something very similar is one of the few explanations that resonates.

It is known that fear is a motivator of conservative behavior. But I don't think the affluent are particularly frightened. They are greedy. The truly poor are frightened particularly over housing, food and job insecurity

But the t-partiers at yesterdays rally in Madison didn't seem down or out, their comments mostly seemed built on a self-assured fact-free perception that 'others' had it unfairly better or were trying to make it unfairly better than the shake like had given them (the tbaggers). Jealousy.

[creon]

10. That too

Greed, fear, anger and jealousy make people stupid and easily manipulated.

[reformist2]

42. Fear and paranoia. It's hard to vote Democrat when you think they're commies

and that Obama is secretly an anti-American Muslim who "pals around with terrorists."

[creon]

44. I agree

There are people who are that gullible.

Most of them have no idea that they are being gamed.

[jp11]

11. I too harbor feeling of anger for other voters who didn't show up or voted for

who I think should have won. The problem is we have a two party system and are left with generally only one viable choice that 'best' represents the position we agree with, it often isn't perfect and can even be 'bad' when perceived corruption, lack of touch, or skewed priorities seem to be what 'your' person stands for. What is the solution there, you can't make them do what you want, but you can 'fire' them.

The lesson here that *I* see is that our side needs to be better, make their message better, stand up for the people more, call out the other side when they lie and misrepresent the truth, or try and contort issues to their screwed up point of view. If our side doesn't do that they alienate voters, they turn them off and lose, it is the voters 'fault' for not coming out to vote but it isn't entirely their fault when their elected officials won't stand up and fight for their party's supposed beliefs or call out the lies of the other side.

The short answer I think is they weren't satisfied with what the person they 'hired' was doing or simply never voted for that person in the first place.

[HereSince1628]

13. Anger can be a motivator

Maybe it can be channeled into actions that will change the outcomes of the things we don't like.

Use it, don't let it abuse you.

:hi:

[DCBob]

12. Fauxification of America.

Which pretty much includes all media these days... not just Fox.

[no_hypocrisy]

15. + 1

FOX day in, day out. If not preaching to the choir, FOX demoralized and eroded some support Obama had on Inauguration Day. Without the same strength of his base going to the polls to vote democratic last November, republicans won and now make the rules in the House and in many states.

[DCBob]

16. Fox is truly a force to be reckoned with. They capture the eyeballs and the minds..

of millions of Americans 7x24x365. We have to find some way to counter them or we will find ourselves on the losing side of most issues.

[midnight]

17. The agenda was real clear!

[butterfly77]

19. I agree..

and yes those are the things they thought and some still think. In most cases hate was fueling their mind for the "liberals" and the poor'

Some of them don't realize they are poor and some don't realize they don't have bootstraps to lift them up its all the "liberals" fault.

Now,some of them realize what they have done and realize they are the them,they thought they were hurting..

[BeFree]

21. Well, they love you

The fact that you can just ignore all the evidence of stolen votes makes KKKRove a very happy man.

Just read thru this thread and not one mention of the republican vote stealing machines. :puke:

[Michigan-Arizona]

37. Exactly BeFree

Most people I talk to anymore don't bother to vote because they feel like their vote doesn't count with these rigged machines. I had to get down to your post to see any mention of this problem. Thank you

[cali]

43. I'm not ignoring that there are rigged machines, but no that doesn't account

for the fucking FACT that voters in many states swung to the right and the repubs.

It's delusional to believe that it's all rigged machines.

And delusional is what I expect from you. you demonstrate it over and over and over and over

:puke:

[jody]

22. What method of selecting people to govern We the People do you propose as an alternative? nt

[HughBeaumont]

24. Preferrably one that separates money from the electoral process.

That way, our choices wouldn't be

Corporate-approved Moderate Laissez-Faire Republican posing as a Democrat
Corporate-endorsed-and-preferred Batshit Insane Warhawk Trickle-Down-Loving Theocrat posing as a Republican
Symbolic (but eventually wasted) Vote.

[jody]

31. Candidates spent millions for jobs that pay a few hundred thousand dollars suggesting running for

political office is limited to those with fortunes and puppets for wealthy supporters.

Voters could limit campaign expenditures to dollars donated by those registered to vote from a candidate’s constituency but limited to $10 per registered voter to be matched by government.

Over 200 thousand Californians voted for one House seat in the last US election and over 7 million for the Senate seat.

House candidates could collect over $4 million to campaign and Senate candidates over $140 million.

That’s democracy blue-collar workers can afford.

[JVS]

25. There are two ways you can look at this.

1.) Swing voters are not actually moderates, instead they're idiots who don't pay attention to politics most of the time and then go with what looks best when it's time to vote.

2.) Political parties win elections by getting high turnout among their base. The teabaggers were a direct appeal to the Republican base and it caused them to rally. The Democratic party has largely fractured its own base since 2008 by failing to live up to expectations in many ways. As such, enthusiasm was dampened and they were unable to win against the gung-ho teabaggers.

[old mark]

27. K&R- I post the same about PA voters pretty often. We have a majority of over

We have a majority of over 1 million registered Democratic voters here in PA, yet lost the November elections for Senator, Governor and enough of the state legislature to make the remaining Democrats irrelevant.
I guess some people wanted to "send a message", and they sure as hell did...Democratic voters are fickle, and can be very stupid, just as much as GOP voters...although the GOP tends to get out and vote no matter what, while Democrats tend to stay home if they don't like a candidate.

We have certainly fucked ourselves in the USA, and if that offends anyone who didn't vote for political reasons, that's fine with me. You deserve it.


mark

[MH1]

30. I hope the 'message' that was really sent, is being well received by the message senders.

see my post below, we are in full agreement here.

[MH1]

28. I agree with you on this wholeheartedly.

Recc'd, but apparently others don't put the blame where it belongs.

Sure, there's some amount of fraud, there's some amount of legitimate "can't get to the polls", but if people were against this evil and bothered to get off their sorry asses and vote against it, the current crop of assholes wouldn't have a chance.

What we are arguing now is "revoke the EPA completely" rather than arguing crappy mostly ineffective cap-and-trade vs. straight up carbon tax.

What we are arguing now is whether women can have access to family planning services at all, rather than whether a 14 year old should have parental consent.

What we are arguing now is the existence of unions, not the details around the edges that assumes their existence.

It fucking matters, people. It matters whether crappy Democrats or crappy republicans hold office. Because the republicans are a whole hell of a lot crappier than the crappy democrats.

[Honeycombe8]

29. Me, too. As they say, elections have consequences. All I can do is vote, and I did.

I showed up at the poll and voted Democratic. So my conscience is clear.

But clearly, a lot of Democrats in the country didn't show up, or voted Independent or Republican.

Still, that is typical for elections in between Presidential elections. Younger people don't tend to vote in those, and most older people are Republican.

I also blame Democratic leaders, because part of WHY older people voted against incumbents or Democrats is because they were scared of the health care reform bill. And they were ONLY scared of it because the Democrats didn't flood the airwaves to explain it.

[DU GrovelBot]

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[southernyankeebelle]

33. I didn't vote for my dem congressman because it was like voting for a republican. I voted Mickey

Mouse. I sure wouldn't vote for a republican.

[jody]

36. Apparently we have similar voting records. Click on the picture for the history.

[BzaDem]

39. If you are going to enable a Republican's victory by not voting for the Dem, isn't that part of the

problem (rather than part of the solution)? Do you really have the right to be taken seriously if you are upset with their policies later, if you won't do the minimum amount you can to keep Republicans from office?

[Horse with no Name]

35. I agree.

Because this is what it has come down to.
It is no secret that Democratic lawmakers have ALWAYS had to clean up republican messes--whether it was the deficit, social issues, etc.
This time it is different.
It is critical mass and the cleanup has to take place in the trenches instead of the legislature because of the way these things are being shoved through.
Had people taken a little more time in the voting booth and not voted in reactionary mode, then we wouldn't be in this precarious position.

[socialshockwave]

40. It's all mind games

The Right has, admittedly, the best spin-doctors around.

They could make you sell your own mother in "the best interests of our country".

[reformist2]

41. They believe one or more of the consipracy theories. See my Glen Beck thread.