AP Source: Obama to seek changes in Pell Grants

[XanaDUer]

WASHINGTON — President Barack Obama's budget plan would cut $100 billion from Pell Grants and other higher education programs over a decade through belt-tightening and use the savings to keep the maximum college financial aid award at $5,550, an administration official said.

Nearly $90 billion of the projected savings would be achieved through two changes, said the official, who spoke on condition of anonymity ahead of Monday's release of Obama's 2012 budget. The spending plan applies to the budget year that begins Oct. 1.
Congress would have to approve both changes.

...
But at the same time, Obama wants to increase spending in areas he says are priorities, such as education and innovation, which he says are important for long-term economic growth and competitiveness.
"It would be a mistake to balance the budget by sacrificing our children's education," he said Saturday in his weekly radio and Internet address, in an apparent warning to Republicans.


http://www.centredaily.com/2011/02/13/2516801/ap-source-obama-to-seek-changes.html

[somone]

1. Rarely is the questioned asked: Is our children learning?

[msanthrope]

26. Obviously not, since so few posters in this thread were capable of doing the actual math--

A few facts, conveniently left out of this OP--

Under this proposal, the max grant stays at 5.5k for the main school year.

5.5k is the HIGHEST award in history, and was brought to you by Barack Obama....

Now, if no cuts are made to this program, the max award for everyone tops out at 3k for the main school year. Possibly, you might get an additional 3k, but ONLY if you go to summer school.

So--Obama KEPT the awards at 5.5k for ALL, and the only people POSSIBLY losing five hundred dollars are people who MIGHT go to summer school.

I mean, let's not facts cloud our anti-Obama rants, here....

[silver10]

28. So, if the award is the same...

where are the savings?

[johnaries]

29. They are listed in the article, and they make a lot of sense to me.

The first proposal would end the "year-round Pell" policy that let students collect two grants in a calendar year, with the second grant used for summer school. The official said the costs exceeded expectations and there was little evidence that students earn their degrees any faster.

The change would save $8 billion next year and $60 billion over a decade, the official said.

So, that's $8 bill a year that doesn't seem to be doing any good. Why not re-direct it somewhere will it will do some good?

And...

A second proposal would reduce loan subsidies for graduate and professional students. That would free $2 billion next year and save $29 billion over 10 years, according to the official.

The federal government currently pays the interest on student loans for some graduate and professional students as long as they stay in college. But the official said experts think the subsidy has failed to encourage more students to attend graduate school and that it isn't well-matched up with borrowers who have trouble repaying the loans after they leave school.

[silver10]

31. You didn't answer my question.

I asked if the award is the same, where are the savings?

I can make up numbers too - by corporations hiring American workers and not outsourcing overseas, we can save $8 billion (up to $60 billion in a decade) in unemployment benefits each year - see?

For example, if the Pell award maximum of $5,500 is not being cut, how is cutting the use of Pells for summer not cutting the maximum amount of each award a year? Prior to this cut, was each student able to get two $5,500 Pell awards - for an annual use of $11,000 in Pell grants for each year?

Nice of you to comment that that $8 billion a year in Pell grants wasn't doing any good. If it helped students get an education, no matter faster or not faster, it was doing good. I didn't know that Pell grants were intended to be the NASCAR of education?

Some students are not able to take more classes during regular terms because they cannot afford to - and they also don't have the time because they may need to work while earning their education.

I say let's take the trillion dollars in tax cuts being given to the wealthiest top 2%, that's $1 trillion a year that doesn't seem to be doing any good. Why not re-direct it somewhere will it will do some good?

[msanthrope]

34. Um, have you not realized that administration costs are a savings? n/t

[silver10]

36. ummmm, no.

It does not speak to administrative costs, only to the cut in awarding the Pell for summer classes.

If there are administrative costs, too bad they didn't list them.

[silver10]

41. sorry that I am not reading into the article and assuming anything

[JCMach1]

2. We are going to lose a generation of students who cannot afford to educate themselves...

[XanaDUer]

3. Yes, we are

I want my student loan off my back, and I thought about getting a second master's, and now I'm not so sure.

[uppityperson]

13. PELL grant can't be used after have bachelors, but yes, is talking cutting loan subsidies for grad

students and professional students. It looks like this would impact you. And me. But not my kid.

[uppityperson]

Did you read the proposed cuts? 2 pell grants in 1 yr and loan subsidies for grad/professional stude

Please, read the article as yes they are cuts, but read what and why.

And yes, am helping a child in college right now and increasing costs suck.

[uppityperson]

25. He's keeping Pell max the same, cutting $500 ONLY if student goes to summer school

yes, that is $500 less if someone wants to go to summer school, but by doing so will be able to keep the grant the same for students the rest of the yr.

[msanthrope]

27. How??? By keeping the Pell Grant at it's HIGHEST historical award level?

Read post 26 on the actual math of how this shakes out....

We are keeping the award level at the HIGHEST it's ever been.

[silver10]

32. The math makes no sense

If the award is the same, where's the savings? The total amount of Pell award for each student IS being cut.

I can say I have 5 awards each student can get each year - worth $1,000 each. The max is $1,000 for each award.

In the interest of maintaining the maximum amount, I am now eliminating the other 4 awards so each student can get the maximum.

How kind of you, considering the average amount for college tuition.

Fancy word play from the corporate-owned media and the corporate sell-out which is Obama.

[msanthrope]

33. No, what you aren't accounting for is the administration of the Pell.

Giving one 5k award is cheaper, administratively, than 5 1k awards.

Ever fill out a FAFSA?

[silver10]

39. isn't that clever?

[silver10]

40. $8 billion a year in administrative costs?

For a $60 billion savings over 10 years? Really?

[originalpckelly]

4. I have an idea to help balance the budget: RAISE TAXES ON THE RICH!

But we can't do that, because that might hurt the economy. However, we can steal from poor/middle class kids, right? That's acceptable, that's not going to have any economic impact, now is it?

What a stupid fucker.

DU seriously needs a middle finger smiley for stories like this. Well, here's one:

[XanaDUer]

5. What constantly annoys me about this is

why are not middle-class and poor folks saying anything about this? Being slightly pissed off? Do they not care?

[originalpckelly]

7. They're fucking DUMB!

The education system of America produces people just smart enough to do the few things we cannot outsource (but believe if we could, we would) and not ask any questions while doing it.

[patrice]

12. They think doing something will have no effect. Almost all of us are habituated to

false dichotomies, "If it doesn't look like this ___________________, it's NOTHING at all, ever." All part of top-down thinking, rather than understanding how powerful REAL truly committed creative change at the bottom REALLY is.

We need to figure out how to facilitate grassroots fundamental change ourselves and then use that to change those "above" us.

[XanaDUer]

30. I agree with you

at my last job, folks knew something wasn't right, but felt like wth? You cannot win either way. Which is not a good position to be in to feel you can change anything.

[patrice]

6. I'd like to see some studies on who is getting what college tuition assistance. I recall a few stori

es a some years ago about the upper-middle and lower-upper income classes drawing down a significant amount of assistance. All part of THE BIG
QUESTION in this country: Why do "we" give money to people who don't NEED it?

[uppityperson]

8. READ the artcile, he proposes cutting the 2 Grants in 1 yr thing. Here...

"The first proposal would end the "year-round Pell" policy that let students collect two grants in a calendar year, with the second grant used for summer school. The official said the costs exceeded expectations and there was little evidence that students earn their degrees any faster. The change would save $8 billion next year and $60 billion over a decade, the official said."

[uppityperson]

10. 2nd proposal is cutting loan subsidies for grad & professional students.

"A second proposal would reduce loan subsidies for graduate and professional students. That would free $2 billion next year and save $29 billion over 10 years, according to the official."

READ the article to make sure you are outraged at the right things.

[WinkyDink]

16. Do you KNOW what "$60 B over a decade" means for our budget? NOTHING, THAT'S WHAT. NOTHING. IT IS

"SOMETHING" ONLY FOR THE POOR.

[uppityperson]

20. msanthrope put it well here, it is not being decreased or cut except for 2 grants in 1 yr situations

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=407861&mesg_id=408071
The amount of the award stays at the maximum--5,500, which is not repayable.

Obama was the one who increased the award to 5,500.

Unless the shortfall is addressed, the max award will only be 3,000.

So, trimming inefficiency allows the award to stay at the highest level...facts you thought weren't important.

[originalpckelly]

17. So what are they doing with the money?

The implication is that they're not using it for education, which is not possible, right?

It's government nonsense. These kids are either using it to enrich themselves, make up for time they had to spend in remedial classes catching up, or they're using it to get ahead.

I think we should pay for and encourage all of the above. The money is not just being wasted.

[uppityperson]

21. please read the article. See what is being cut and why.

[Me.]

9. Those Tax Cuts For The Rich Have To Be Paid Somehow

So lets take away college, warmth and whatever else the poor and middle class have as benefits.

[patrice]

19. for The Rich AND The Middle Class. I, for one, was willing to give up mine to set things right, but

my frakking political party, dropped that ball, even though they COULD have picked up some relatively new constituency with deficit "hawks" that we could have had SOME influence over on these judgment calls. We gave all of that away, now the cuts are going to have to just go wherever the weakest constituency is. The only good thing about this is that it will possibly cause people to get better organized and, hence, more REAL WORLD effective.

[patrice]

24. My point being, when your social-economic class HAS chipped in on the debts and the other social-eco

nomic clas HAS NOT (i.e. Middle Class tax breaks allowed to expire while The Rich held on to theirs) . . . as I was saying, when you have chipped in on the bills and someone else hasn't, that puts YOU in the power position in saying what budget cuts are going to happen in order to pay those debts, because you already gave and they didn't, so The Rich would be the ones who would have to take whatever budget cuts WE, the Middle Class, say they should. But, never mind, "we" threw this opportunity away last year, for Christmas spending money.

[WinkyDink]

11. More $$ to TFA and charters; less educational opportunity to the poor.

Just when I think I cannot be more gobsmacked.............

[spotbird]

14. OK, aside from the disastrous policy, how does

the continuation of the destruction of the middle class make Obama or the Democrats more electable?

[WinkyDink]

18. They no longer need our money. That has been the Master Plan. Go where the $$ is: the same source as

for the Republicans.

Please the multi-billionaires, and who needs YOUR five bucks in the mail, HMMMMM??

[yourout]

15. Is the Administration really that dumb?.....Without the hardword and turnout of ...

young college students and Academia he never would have been elected and yet they seem
to be pissing on them at every opportunity.

[uppityperson]

23. masanthrope put it well here...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=407861&mesg_id=408071

[silver10]

38. yes, but

where were they in November 2010?

[Doctor_J]

22. He should know that uneducated morons vote Repuke

This is bad politics as well as bad policy

[Bluebear]

35. Just wait until we get a Democratic president....

Oh, never mind...

[silver10]

37. I can't wait ;)

Maybe someday.

[OhioChick]

42. Why do I feel like I'm under Republican leadership?

:wtf:

Be sure to see this, as well:

Graduate Students May Face Higher Debt Under Obama's Budget Plan

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x4732142