Nauseating Frothy Mixture: "Science should get out of politics"..

[Fumesucker]

http://2012.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/12/santorum-science-should-get-out-of-politics.php?ref=fpnewsfeed

Rick Santorum is known for his insistence that religion has an important place in political life — and also for criticizing various examples of scientific consensus such as evolution, global warming, stem-cell research, human sexuality, and other matters. But in his latest pronouncement, he might have just outdone himself.

The Des Moines Register reports from a Santorum campaign stop at the University of Northern Iowa, where he talked about education:

Discussing controversial classroom subjects such as evolution and global warming, Santorum said he has suggested that “science should get out of politics” and he is opposed to teaching that provides a “politically correct perspective.”

It’s hard not to think here of The Simpsons, and a line from their famous educational expert, Superintendent Chalmers: “‘Thank the Lord’? That sounded like a prayer. A prayer. A prayer in a public school! God has no place within these walls, just like facts have no place within organized religion!”

[NashVegas]

1. Yeah. All We Need Is Yet Another Faction of Self-Interested Lobbyists

Look, if you don't think the "science-based community" (as I shall call it for the purpose of this conversation) is as driven by its own self-interested agenda as much as any other faction that's gotten its hands in the pie, wake the hell up.

When it's used in the realm of politics, "science" is every bit as prejudiced as the science-based community representative who is given access to the microphone.

I'm all for getting religion out of government. I'm also all for kicking Monsanto's ass the fuck out of politics.

on edit:

Regarding your photo - where do you think that pepper spray came from?

[sibelian]

3. 2+2=4.

ta da! I'm a lobbyist.

[NashVegas]

6. Certainly, That Qualifies You More Than, Say ...

"There is no proven causual link between _______ and cancer. Now STFU"

[Fumesucker]

4. Do you blame Oppenheimer for the bomb?

Do you think religion is going to get out and stay out of politics?

ETA one more question: Should scientists not speak up as citizens on the issues of the day?

[NashVegas]

15. Blame, Rationalization

In recent years, I've had opportunity to witness what happens when people who, in the course of looking out for their own interest, indirectly enable others' abuses are called on to take responsibility for their parts in the course of events.

Accusing the person doing the confronting of misplacing blame is a diversionary tactic. Stop it.

Scientists should absolutely speak up. But they should speak up out of their own consciences, not their patents pending.

[Fumesucker]

21. What, you think we all haven't watched that play out on a damn near cosmic scale the last ten years?

Who or what are you "confronting"?

Personally I don't expect scientists to be free of human foibles, I don't hold them up as some sort of priesthood.

[Rex]

8. Batboy is that you?

[libodem]

12. It is NOT batboy

That is Michelle 'Crazy Eyes' Bachman.

[Rex]

14. Oh hell, you are correct.

Need to go get my eyes examined, must need new glasses! Thanks for pointing that out. :thumbsup:

[sufrommich]

11. Holy Cow, science is to blame for Monsanto? WTF? nt

[Aerows]

23. MONEY

and GREED are to blame for Monsanto.

[sufrommich]

25. Exactly, the fact that there are scientist who will do harm

for money is not a reflection on science, it's a reflection on human nature.

[Aerows]

26. Couldn't agree more

Science is just rational, well-reasoned proven fact. If people twist it to their own means, it's the people who are doing the harm, not science.

[NashVegas]

28. And That Is Different From Religion ... How?

[Fumesucker]

29. The "rational well reasoned fact" part is a bit different from religion..

:shrug:

Edited as usual for speling.

[NashVegas]

30. I Was Referring to the Second Part of That Sentence

You know, this?

"If people twist it to their own means, it's the people who are doing the harm, not science."

[Fumesucker]

31. When you begin with outright fantasy, much of which is self contradictory..

Twisting it to your own ends is remarkably simple, a moron could do it. And many do, Frothy Mixture is a prime case in point.

[muriel_volestrangler]

33. Look at the context; he means 'science' should stop saying evolution and global warming are real

This was about education. If you haven't followed the links to the original report, here it is: http://caucuses.desmoinesregister.com/2011/12/09/santorum-parents-not-obama-know-what-is-best-for-their-childs-education/

"SETTING: The lobby at the Gallagher Bluedorn Performing Arts Center, University of Northern Iowa. The event was part of a series of presidential candidate forums on education issues sponsored by UNI and Iowa Public Radio, which recorded Santorum’s presentation for rebroadcast on Monday."

What do you think he means by teaching with a 'politically correct perspective' on evolution or global warming? He means teaching the reality, rather than equal time for some idiotic "some people think God created the world in 6 days 6,000 years ago" rubbish. Or "there's a few Koch-funded scientists left who will talk crap for dollars - their claims need to be taught too." Or he wants no mention of evolution or global warming at all, so the money and churches can get their messages out uncontested.

'Self-interested lobbyists'? Have you really fallen for right wing talking points like that?

[amyrose2712]

2. We are quickly losing ground in education, especially in science.

"I don't really know why they even teach science in school anyway" That this comment was made to a science teacher during recent parent teacher conferences is astonishing to me.--- WTF!

[sufrommich]

5. Science never got "in" politics. It just proved religion

wrong, which is a sin.
It cracks me up that they are down to arguing that facts are "political corectness".

My favorite Carl Sagan quote:

"I worry that, especially as the Millennium edges nearer, pseudoscience and superstition will seem year by year more tempting, the siren song of unreason more sonorous and attractive. Where have we heard it before? Whenever our ethnic or national prejudices are aroused, in times of scarcity, during challenges to national self-esteem or nerve, when we agonize about our diminished cosmic place and purpose, or when fanaticism is bubbling up around us-then, habits of thought familiar from ages past reach for the controls.
The candle flame gutters. Its little pool of light trembles. Darkness gathers. The demons begin to stir."

[Rex]

7. Money should get out of politics, but we know that asshats

like Frothy Mixture live and die on handouts by the paymasters. How can total idiots get so much airtime? Oh right, Rush...

[Aerows]

20. The truth is cheap and ugly

They have to pay big bucks to construct beautiful lies so that they are repeated over and over again.

[Rex]

32. It would be so much cheaper to do away with the extravagant machine

and just admit the truth and move forward.

[Ohio Joe]

9. WTF?

Does he even listen to what he says? What a stupid asshole he is.

[eppur_se_muova]

10. Science is mostly just common sense writ large -- R's really want all sense gone from politics.

They only want to appeal to voters at the instinctive, brainstem level -- fear others, protect one's own at all costs.

[sufrommich]

13. "Science is mostly just common sense writ large"

So is morality, but you're talking about people who believe they would commit all kinds of havoc if not for the threat of an angry god.

[woo me with science]

16. We should really start keeping a list of these comments.

Remember Rick Perry: "The idea that I'm going to let people talk this plan down for the sake of just having an intellectual discussion is not correct."

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x2216009

[Aerows]

27. "Just for the sake of an intellectual discussion"

Well let's not have any of THOSE kinds of discussions. Stupidity-based discussions are much more productive, right?

[treestar]

17. After religion is removed from politics.

[Capitalocracy]

18. Politics should get out of science. nt

[Aerows]

19. Doesn't believe in science

But believes that the moment of conception occurs when a sperm meets and egg. Wonder how he learned that?

[sufrommich]

22. You obviously don't know the difference between God's

science and Satan's science.

[Aerows]

24. *smile*

Apparently not. Poor Galileo. The Catholic Church didn't pardon him for declaring that the Earth wasn't the center of the universe until the mid 1950's. I think there were some others that were similarly prosecuted, persecuted and jailed for stating that the Earth isn't flat.

Satanic scientists, the lot of them!

[Initech]

34. Let's get religion out of our government, Rick.

[housewolf]

35. I think he's got it backward -

politics (and politicians) should get out of science! AND religion AND health care

So there!