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"How America planned for an attack on BRITAIN in 1930 with bombing raids and chemical weapons"

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WinkyDink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 11:21 AM
Original message
"How America planned for an attack on BRITAIN in 1930 with bombing raids and chemical weapons"
Emerging world power feared British reaction to its ambitions
Plan Red was code for massive war with British Empire
Top-secret document once regarded as 'most sensitive on Earth'
$57m allocated for building secret airfields on Canadian border - to launch attack on British land forces based there

Details of an amazing American military plan for an attack to wipe out a major part of the British Army are today revealed for the first time.

In 1930, a mere nine years before the outbreak of World War Two, America drew up proposals specifically aimed at eliminating all British land forces in Canada and the North Atlantic, thus destroying Britain's trading ability and bringing the country to its knees.

Previously unparalleled troop movements were launched as an overture to an invasion of Canada, which was to include massive bombing raids on key industrial targets and the use of chemical weapons, the latter signed off at the highest level by none other than the legendary General Douglas MacArthur.

The plans, revealed in a Channel 5 documentary, were one of a number of military contingency plans drawn up against a number of potential enemies, including the Caribbean islands and China. There was even one to combat an internal uprising within the United States.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2039453/How-Ame...
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Yes, Virginia, there ARE real conspiracies where real people KEEP THEIR MOUTHS SHUT FOR DECADES.
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newspeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 11:26 AM
Response to Original message
1. now this is one I have never heard about!!!
Of course, there are some americans that don't realize we attacked Canada in the War of 1812. So, it looks like some scenario game? Is that what it is or speculation? Anything for invading Germany and Italy--or are they the good guys at that time?
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sharp_stick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 11:27 AM
Response to Original message
2. These weren't really all that secret
Edited on Tue Sep-20-11 11:28 AM by sharp_stick
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_Plan_Red

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Color-coded_...

Just because you hadn't heard of it doesn't make it a massive conspiracy.

on edit:
"War Plan Red, a more hypothetical plan for war against the United Kingdom and Canada, caused a stir in AmericanCanadian relations when declassified in 1974."
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newspeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 11:40 AM
Response to Reply #2
10. didn't say it was a massive conspiracy
took history classes in college, knew of the business plot, just never heard of these hypothetical plans.
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sharp_stick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 11:44 AM
Response to Reply #10
12. No you did not
Edited on Tue Sep-20-11 11:45 AM by sharp_stick
and in any case, I wasn't replying to you. ;-)
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newspeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 11:53 AM
Response to Reply #12
16. oh, yes I did.
Took african-american history, women's studies, european history (as seen through french history) native american religion-philosophy and US history-College of the Redwoods and UC Davis.
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sharp_stick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #16
19. I will try one more time, perhaps I wasn't clear.
Edited on Tue Sep-20-11 11:59 AM by sharp_stick
The "no you did not" was simply agreeing with you in that you did not implicate anything like a conspiracy theory. I don't know you and therefore have no idea what your educational history is, nor would I ever pretend to do that.

My original reply was to the OP not to your reply at the same level as mine.
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newspeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 12:02 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. oops, sorry for the misunderstanding
apparently, I got a little defensive there.
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sharp_stick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 12:05 PM
Response to Reply #20
21. No worries
it's not like I've never done anything like that. It's amazing how much we require things like vocal tone and facial expressions to actually know what someone else means.

Even with smilies and the like it's easy to misinterpret written comments, especially short quickie replies on message boards.
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jberryhill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 11:47 AM
Response to Reply #10
14. I'm quite sure we have an invasion plan of Canada and Mexico too

That doesn't mean anyone is fixing to invade Canada or Mexico.
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MicaelS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 11:55 AM
Response to Reply #10
17. Single Integrated Operational Plan (SIOP) is the US blueprint
For Nuclear War. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single_Integrated_Operatio...

If the NCA decides that the United States must launch nuclear weapons, they will direct the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff (CJCS) to do so via the Nuclear Football briefcase. At the NCA/JCS level, the orders will be to execute SIOP strike options, Major Attack Options (MAOs), Selected Attack Options (SAOs), and Limited Attack Options (LAOs). Individual countries or regions can be included in or withheld from nuclear attacks depending on circumstances.

In other words the President, through the Two Man Rule, has the option to nuke just about any country, or region or city on the planet. Many of these Attack Options are contained in the President's Emergency Satchel aka Nuclear Football always near the President.

Spend some time Googling Single Integrated Operational Plan and Major Attack Options if you want to know more.

There are lots of REAL plans you, and most people, don't know about.
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snagglepuss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 12:07 PM
Response to Reply #2
22. Thanks for the links but according to wiki, the plans weren't all that detailed which
is different from what is now revealed. What caught my eye is the statement that the outcome of such a war would have been for Britian to hand over Canada which is alarming when one considers that not only had fascism got a foothold in America the 1930s but also that socialism and communism had a foothold in Canada. The larger question is whether this war was to stamp out socialism from North America by forcing Britian to hand over Canada?
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NeedleCast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 11:30 AM
Response to Original message
3. Conspiracy? Nah
The US has invasion/war plans for practically any scenario. Many of them include attacking or attacks by our current allies.
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Rambis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 11:31 AM
Response to Original message
4. We have contingency plans to annihilate every country/regime on the planet
friend foe or oil field that needs our attention :crazy:
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Xithras Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 11:51 AM
Response to Reply #4
15. Yep. And several different contingencies for each.
Want to invade Bhutan via Bangladesh? We have a plan for that. Want to invade Bhutan via India? We have a plan for that too.

The CIA and Pentagon have military experts who individually specialize in every nation on the planet. One of the primary duties of these experts is to track the military and social situations in their nations, and their relationships with surrounding nations, and keep potential invasion plans current in real-time.

While it's a bit more comprehensive today than it's been in the past, this is really nothing new. The practice of keeping war plans current, even in times of peace, can be traced all the way back to the Romans.
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arbusto_baboso Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 03:29 PM
Response to Reply #15
30. Exactly.
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mod mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 11:31 AM
Response to Original message
5. "There was even one to combat an internal uprising within the United States."
hmmh I wonder if this plan was to aid or fight the banker's plot.
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newspeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 11:38 AM
Response to Reply #5
9. well, McArthur did have a hand
against the protesting veterans.
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 11:46 AM
Response to Reply #5
13. Read what happened to the WWI bonus marches...
who was involved in that little dark period?

macarthur, eisenhower and patton.
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mod mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 12:13 PM
Response to Reply #13
23. Wasn't aware of Eisenhower's role but I did find this:
During the military operation, Major Dwight D. Eisenhower, later President of the United States, served as one of MacArthur's junior aides.<14> Believing it wrong for the Army's highest-ranking officer to lead an action against fellow American war veterans, he strongly advised MacArthur against taking any public role: "I told that dumb son-of-a-bitch not to go down there," he said later. "I told him it was no place for the Chief of Staff."<15> Despite his misgivings, Eisenhower later wrote the Army's official incident report which endorsed MacArthur's conduct.<16>

At least he attempted to stop it.
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 03:21 PM
Response to Reply #23
28. Trying to keep macarthur from doing anything is a fools errand.
Edited on Tue Sep-20-11 03:23 PM by Javaman
but at least he's on record that he "tried". Since eisenhower was his aid, he also probably knew full well that macarthur wouldn't listen. To me it reads as nothing more than eisenhower trying to keep his own neck free of the noose if the people actually wanted to prosecute.

Check this out. Just a prime example of the colossal fucking asshole macarthur was...

"Having driven the veterans from the downtown area, MacArthur had fulfilled his mission. But whether his blood was up, or he merely sensed a need to inflict a coup de grce against the purported Communist element an enemy he considered more insidious than disgruntled veterans MacArthur did not rest on his laurels. He ordered his troops to advance upon the 11th Street bridge leading to Anacostia Flats. Someone, waving a white shirt as a flag of truce, came racing across to plea for time to evacuate the women and children. MacArthur granted an hour's reprieve.

Though accounts differ, the president now seemed suddenly to exhibit an untimely case of nerves. Fearing repercussions, he twice sent word that the Army was not to cross the bridge. MacArthur refused to listen, saying he hadn't time to be bothered by people coming down and pretending to bring orders. He sent the troops across against explicit instructions. Using more gas, the soldiers moved into Bonus City. Its occupants fled in terror, refugees rousted from their pitiful camp."

http://www.historynet.com/the-bonus-army-war-in-washing...

Hoover instead of relieving him of command for disobeying orders, chose to do nothing.

If you get a chance, read the whole thing, it's really disgusting how those people were treated that day by the US Government and the US Army.
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RZM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 11:34 AM
Response to Original message
6. Not a big deal at all
The fact that such plans existed has been known (and joked about) for quite some time. They have something similar I'm sure.
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dtexdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 11:36 AM
Response to Original message
7. Figure that every country has 'contingency' plans for war against every other country.
And this was an America in the hands of Republicans who had a strong isolationist contingent.
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pampango Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 11:56 AM
Response to Reply #7
18. Good point. The isolationist republicans - Hoover and congressional leaders - were behind this. n/t
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whistler162 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 11:38 AM
Response to Original message
8. Up there with the plans to combat the invasion of the US
by the troops of Andorra!
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MicaelS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 11:43 AM
Response to Original message
11. I remember reading SOMEWHERE..
That after WWI and the Washington Naval Treaty, some in British Admiralty regarded war with the US as possible and even probable. But I'm damned if I can fink a link to that. IIRC, it was only the Admiralty, and the not the British Army, that regarded with the US as possible.
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gordianot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 12:59 PM
Response to Reply #11
24. You are correct they did resolve treaty concerns.
Both concentrated on the growing threat from Japan in the Pacific in the 1930's.
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 01:02 PM
Response to Original message
25. And Plan Black was for the Caribean
and...

We have plans to go to war with just about anybody in the world at all times.
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Ikonoklast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 01:24 PM
Response to Original message
26. This country had war contigency plans for a land assault on Greenland.
In case it was invaded.

By what crazy army, of that I'm not sure.
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LanternWaste Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 01:36 PM
Response to Original message
27. The Rainbow Plan was a series of contingency plans
The Rainbow Plan was a series of contingency plans dealing with the ever-shifting alliances of the great powers through the twenties and into the mid-thirties. So named because each hypothetical aggressor was given a different color code (i.e., Plan Red dealt with the hypothetical aggression of Japan, Plan Yellow with Spain and Portugal, etc.).

As an aside, it's rather odd reading the plan for war with Japan as it was written prior to the advent of any real carrier doctrine, and emphasized a battleship-oriented conflict in the Pacific.

Regardless, the Rainbow Plan ran the gamut of wholly hypothetical conflicts, each with its concomitant war responses to the scenario. And though most seem in hindsight without grounds, Japan was one of the hypothetical aggressors which at the time, was roundly criticized by the military as being too absurd to even consider.

In most cases, they were never more than that-- contingency plans that collected dust.
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Edweird Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-20-11 03:24 PM
Response to Original message
29. "Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everyone you meet."
Because you never know...
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