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DemocracyInaction Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 12:10 PM
Original message
Did Obama Say This or Not??
My head is spinning. I did not see all of his news conference Friday. Lawrence O'Donnell emphasized TWICE during his broadcast that Obama said none of the changes to Medicare would effect those currently on it---note: I did hear O'Donnell say "medicare" but I don't know if he also said medicaid and social security. Then, today I read here the Krugman (I think that's who) piece which does not mention that at all but just lists the "changes". Could someone who listened to that news conference tell me if, indeed, Obama said that. If so, then who the hell is lying here...Obama, Krugman or who/what????
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PSPS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 12:12 PM
Response to Original message
1. It doesn't really matter what Obama says. Let's see what he does.
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Big Blue Marble Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Are you really saying that it does not matter
what the President Of The United States says? Really?
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PSPS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 12:24 PM
Response to Reply #3
11. That's right. The past two years have shown us that what Obama says means little.
We'll all just have to wait to see what happens. Sadly, it rarely matches Obama's rhetoric.
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Big Blue Marble Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. Duplicate.
Edited on Sun Jul-24-11 12:17 PM by Big Blue Marble
Deleted
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Big Blue Marble Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 12:15 PM
Response to Original message
2. The chained CPI as purposed is directed at reducing the benefits
of both current and future beneficiaries. The purposed changes to Medicare of additional means testing will include current and future beneficiaries as well.

The push back of Medicare edibility date of course would have no effect on current beneficiaries.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 12:17 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. But a huge huge problem for those in their 50s and no insurance...
and no job prospects. It's a cruel thing to do.
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Big Blue Marble Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 12:25 PM
Response to Reply #5
12. Absolutely.
Asking people to wait those two years will devastate many financially. This is time Insurance premiums will be the highest, many people
suffering with illnesses, and not able to find work.

As I understand it, the average cost to the government for coverage in these two years is relatively small, while the costs to most
individuals will imperil their financial future.

This is a heartless way to reduce governmental spending.

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LaurenG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 12:37 PM
Response to Reply #5
15. This +1 million. Indeed very cruel. nt
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SusanaMontana41 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 01:09 PM
Response to Reply #5
24. It's immoral. Looks like he woke up the base ... n/t
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crazyjoe Donating Member (921 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 12:22 PM
Response to Reply #2
9. means testing? that scares me right there. does that mean
medicare kicks in after your have extinguished all the assets you've acquired in a lifetime of work? Sold your home, spent your 401k on medical care? this is bullshit!!
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DemocracyInaction Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 12:23 PM
Response to Reply #2
10. Big Blue few more questions
We who have state pensions have just been through the screw over. I can tell you it's definitely coming to SS. The state pensions were the trial balloon and people didn't pay attention. You will literally lose thousands and thousands that you thought over time you would get----welkum to Amureka. Now as to Medicare---does anyone have any info on "particulars". What I mean is this: Apparently there is already some means testing for the drug benefit (we don't have it because it's in our supplemental insurance). Are they now wanting to apply that to all the rest of medicare? And, I'd be real interested in at what level "means" comes in. Point blank, I think that people with six digit incomes in retirement should do co-pays or higher premiums. I'm afraid that they will say that if you make over ten dollars a year, we'll start jacking up your premiums!!!!! Anyway, do you have any other info??? And what about this statement he made of not applying to current beneficiaries...does this clown even know what's in his proposal???
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Big Blue Marble Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 12:49 PM
Response to Reply #10
19. Of course we really do not know exactly what the
implications of these cuts would be. Whatever they end up being, my real concern is that they will be only the first whack.

Medicare and Social Security are already somewhat means-tested, So a precedent is in place.

SS: If your income in addition to SS is greater than 25K (32K married filing jointly) 85% of SS is taxed at your marginal rate.
So you could be returning over one-third of your check right now. This clearly hits some middle class beneficiaries now.

Medicare: Singles with income of 85k or couples with income of 170K pay additional premiums depending on their income.
Link

As you can see, the increases are significant for high income folks. And that is now, what the future brings for all of us clouded
with deep uncertainty and far too little clarity.


The President used a lot of vague language on Friday, calling changes to these programs modifications.

This was one quote that struck me hard:

"but we sure hope you dont just balance the budget on the backs of seniors"

So they are planning to balance the budget on our backs in trade for some crumb from the Republicans not a good sign at all.

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mzmolly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 12:32 PM
Response to Reply #2
14. Has Obama said he's considering a chained CPI?
Edited on Sun Jul-24-11 12:39 PM by mzmolly
:shrug: I've seen the rumors, but not an actual plan or quote.
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Big Blue Marble Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 01:05 PM
Response to Reply #14
22. He said he supported proposals by the Gang Of Six.
They include the change to a chained CPI.

"...he called the plan "balanced" and "broadly consistent with what we've been working on" in his administration. "We're in the same playing field," he said."

MSNBC
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SusanaMontana41 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 01:15 PM
Response to Reply #22
26. He said all of that before reading the proposal.
How many in Congress will have time to read anything under a gun? I see another "Patriot Act USA"-type debacle that will be with us forever.
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mzmolly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 11:29 PM
Response to Reply #26
29. He never said he supported the specifics of any
proposal.
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mzmolly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 11:29 PM
Response to Reply #22
28. Not quite.
He said he supported their efforts and hadn't looked over specifics.
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Wilms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 12:17 PM
Response to Original message
6. Here's a link to the transcript and the relevant snip.
We then offered an additional $650 billion in cuts to entitlement programs -- Medicare, Medicaid, Social Security. We believed that it was possible to shape those in a way that preserved the integrity of the system, made them available for the next generation, and did not affect current beneficiaries in an adverse way.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

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asjr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 12:18 PM
Response to Original message
7. I have come to believe it doesn't matter
what our president says, it will only be changed to some degree by the media.
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lamp_shade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 12:18 PM
Response to Original message
8. Here... read it. > >
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PoliticAverse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 12:26 PM
Response to Original message
13. Here is what Obama recently said...

"We then offered an additional $650 billion in cuts to entitlement programs -- Medicare, Medicaid, Social Security.
We believed that it was possible to shape those in a way that preserved the integrity of the system, made them available
for the next generation, and did not affect current beneficiaries in an adverse way."

====

So the relevant line is "did not affect current beneficiaries in an adverse way".

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Luminous Animal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 12:47 PM
Response to Reply #13
18. Love the use of the word "adverse". Guess who gets to decide what is adverse
or not?
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Big Blue Marble Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 12:52 PM
Response to Reply #13
20. Slippery language.
The devil is in the details. We are not to learn of these until the deal done; passed; signed; and labeled "historic reform" that saved
Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid.
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Larkspur Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 12:53 PM
Response to Reply #13
21. He's talking about cutting benefits for those under 65, especially those who are50 and over
You know the group that is losing its jobs because it will cut a companies healthcare costs, but we're not old enough to go on Medicare.

Greedy millionaire politicians in Washington D.C., including Obama, are cutting benefits for those who aren't in their club so that their millionaire and billionaire donors can have more tax breaks.
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Courtesy Flush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 12:39 PM
Response to Original message
16. What about the people who will need it in the future?
Sure don't cut current recipients, but cutting future recipients is no better.
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dbonds Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 12:40 PM
Response to Original message
17. The distinction between current and future beneficiaries does NOT matter.
So we hurt people now, or we hurt the next generation - why is there a distinction in that?
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elleng Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 01:07 PM
Response to Original message
23. Yes, and won't affect beneficiaries, just providers etc.
Edited on Sun Jul-24-11 01:08 PM by elleng
Here's video of news conference.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

Thanks for asking, and for being interested in FACTS!
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Vattel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 01:09 PM
Response to Original message
25. Neither of them are lying.
Obama's changes to Meidcare wouldn't affect current recipients and Krugman didn't say that they would.
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Big Blue Marble Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-24-11 01:20 PM
Response to Original message
27. Read the transcript,
Someone has linked on this thread. I did watch the entire news conference, and IMO, he was using slippery language, but
see for yourself.
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