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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:23 PM Original message |
Should Democrats fight to change the way removed employees are made to leave the workplace? |
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LisaM (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:26 PM Response to Original message |
1. I agree with the concept, but the name needs work |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:27 PM Response to Reply #1 |
2. Good point. I'm open to other names. |
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John_Adams (110 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:28 PM Response to Original message |
3. I have never seen or heard of anything like you have described. |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:29 PM Response to Reply #3 |
4. It happens in a lot of businesses, from what I'm told |
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Bluenorthwest (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:35 PM Response to Reply #4 |
7. From what I'm told? What does that mean? Who is telling you? |
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Enrique (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:52 PM Response to Reply #7 |
21. i've seen it happen |
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tblue37 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 10:34 PM Response to Reply #7 |
59. Read "Criminalizing Teachers," a thread in GD that is |
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hobbit709 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:43 PM Response to Reply #3 |
11. Then you must not have much experience in working for a big corporation |
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John_Adams (110 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:48 PM Response to Reply #11 |
14. That is true... |
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hobbit709 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:51 PM Response to Reply #14 |
17. The big ones get bigger, they don't care how they treat the workers. |
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SDuderstadt (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:55 PM Response to Reply #17 |
25. That's kind of a broad... |
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hobbit709 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:59 PM Response to Reply #25 |
30. Not in my personal experience |
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SDuderstadt (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 07:00 PM Response to Reply #30 |
34. That's anecdotal... |
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hobbit709 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 07:03 PM Response to Reply #34 |
39. Whoop de fucking doo. |
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SDuderstadt (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 07:05 PM Response to Reply #39 |
41. "It's all anecdotal unless it makes the 6 o'clock news" |
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hobbit709 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 07:08 PM Response to Reply #41 |
44. i don't pretend to act like the Queen of Hearts. |
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Name removed (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 07:10 PM Response to Reply #44 |
45. Deleted message |
hobbit709 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 07:11 PM Response to Reply #45 |
46. not just yours. |
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Name removed (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 07:12 PM Response to Reply #46 |
47. Deleted message |
SDuderstadt (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 07:17 PM Response to Reply #47 |
49. LOL! |
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SDuderstadt (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 07:13 PM Response to Reply #45 |
48. LOL! |
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SDuderstadt (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 07:18 PM Response to Reply #44 |
50. ??? n/t |
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Name removed (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 01:12 AM Response to Reply #25 |
71. Deleted sub-thread |
alphafemale (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:52 PM Response to Reply #3 |
20. If there's any kind of sensitive information involved it's pretty common. |
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csziggy (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 01:34 AM Response to Reply #3 |
72. DU thread about teachers being treated this way |
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rustydog (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:33 PM Response to Original message |
5. Some people say....I'm just saying |
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rustydog (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:42 PM Response to Reply #5 |
10. Let me play Devil's advocate for a minute: |
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ecstatic (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:34 PM Response to Original message |
6. Warming up to your idea. It would be a nice contrast with Mitt "You're Fired" Romney |
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SDuderstadt (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:37 PM Response to Original message |
8. Maybe you could explain precisely how... |
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WinkyDink (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:38 PM Response to Original message |
9. Not that it isn't an issue, but it is not a BIG issue, all things considered. |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:59 PM Response to Reply #9 |
32. I didn't say it was more important than everything else. |
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SDuderstadt (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 07:01 PM Response to Reply #32 |
37. Here's an idea... |
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Blue-Jay (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:44 PM Response to Original message |
12. What precisely should Democrats do about the way people get shitcanned? |
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alcibiades_mystery (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:48 PM Response to Original message |
13. The GOP response writes itself: "Instead of focusing on getting you jobs, |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:51 PM Response to Reply #13 |
19. Not really. The less people are traumatized on their way out the door |
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alcibiades_mystery (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 07:47 PM Response to Reply #19 |
53. Yeesh |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 02:51 AM Response to Reply #19 |
82. A company that routinely traumatizes laid-off workers will find it hard to hire new people some day |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 03:00 AM Response to Reply #82 |
86. None of them care. They are glad to see headcount reduced by any means necessary |
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SDuderstadt (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 04:00 AM Response to Reply #86 |
94. "None of them care" |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 09:22 AM Response to Reply #86 |
97. There's another side to the headcount issue that you are not considering |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 12:23 PM Response to Reply #97 |
104. You're also assuming that everyone has the luxury of being choosy about who they work for. |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 04:45 PM Response to Reply #104 |
106. Name-calling and special pleadings are poor substitutes for presenting a reasoned position |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 05:00 PM Response to Reply #106 |
109. OK, perhaps I got a personal with you. |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:54 PM Response to Reply #13 |
24. We can say "Democrats fight for the dignity of working people" |
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RebelOne (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:48 PM Response to Original message |
15. I don't think all large corporations are like that. |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:50 PM Response to Reply #15 |
16. You were treated humanely, then. The way they handled it with you |
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RebelOne (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:54 PM Response to Reply #16 |
23. Right, everyone should have a Democratic boss.n/t |
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etherealtruth (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:51 PM Response to Original message |
18. Unfortunately, I don't think this can be legislated |
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PeaceNikki (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:52 PM Response to Original message |
22. "shame", "dignity" and "trauma" are totally relative. |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:56 PM Response to Reply #22 |
26. No...but it can at least be minimized. |
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PeaceNikki (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:59 PM Response to Reply #26 |
33. Never reason for security? Ever? |
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SDuderstadt (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 07:03 PM Response to Reply #33 |
38. I suspect you are wasting your breath.. |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 07:04 PM Response to Reply #33 |
40. You can have somebody watching in the room in case something happens |
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SDuderstadt (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 07:08 PM Response to Reply #40 |
43. "standing policy of immediately treating the victim like a serial killer" |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 02:33 AM Response to Reply #26 |
77. There is no room for Emos in an IT shop |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 03:02 AM Response to Reply #77 |
87. Security can be enforced without a perp-walk with guards in front of the other employees |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 09:27 AM Response to Reply #87 |
102. You're making a very big deal out of what seems to me a very small issue |
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Lance_Boyle (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 09:23 AM Response to Reply #77 |
98. Richmond disagrees. |
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SDuderstadt (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:59 PM Response to Reply #22 |
31. Not only that, but... |
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DainBramaged (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:57 PM Response to Original message |
27. In NJ the employer can be sued.if an employee is fired aggressively |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:59 PM Response to Reply #27 |
28. You are lucky. |
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Abq_Sarah (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 06:59 PM Response to Original message |
29. People who are doing the firing |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 07:00 PM Response to Reply #29 |
36. Well you can't really demand as much from the people who've BEEN fired |
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Abq_Sarah (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 07:18 PM Response to Reply #36 |
51. yeah, you can |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 07:38 PM Response to Reply #51 |
52. It's one of the most devastating things that can happen to a person |
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Fla_Democrat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 07:58 PM Response to Reply #36 |
54. Well, if that's the case.... |
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Name removed (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 11:48 PM Response to Reply #54 |
64. Deleted message |
Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 01:07 AM Response to Reply #54 |
70. Why is regulating the way people are treated in separating from their jobs |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 02:53 AM Response to Reply #29 |
83. It's never an easy thing to do, and few people are very good at it. |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 03:03 AM Response to Reply #83 |
88. Then we need to set up programs to train people in how to do it humanely |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 09:23 AM Response to Reply #88 |
99. Who's going to pay for those programs, Ken? |
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Baby Bear (104 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 07:00 PM Response to Original message |
35. No |
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BlueIris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 07:08 PM Response to Original message |
42. I'm all for dignity, (not that many have much at all) but employers have a right to self-protection. |
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saras (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 09:09 PM Response to Original message |
55. Yep - do it by REDUCING CORPORATE POWER IN GENERAL |
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SDuderstadt (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 09:12 PM Response to Reply #55 |
56. False dilemma.... |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 11:44 PM Response to Reply #55 |
61. Good for you. You believe in a society with humanity and dignity. |
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SDuderstadt (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 11:46 PM Response to Reply #61 |
63. Dumb strawman argument... |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 02:55 AM Response to Reply #55 |
84. I have just as much power in my work relationship as my employer does |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 03:06 AM Response to Reply #84 |
89. That's still not equal power with your boss by any means, and most people |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 09:24 AM Response to Reply #89 |
100. Some employees actually are deadwood and need to be dismissed |
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Xithras (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 09:23 PM Response to Original message |
57. Last time I was fired without warning.... |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 11:46 PM Response to Reply #57 |
62. Jesus...I hope it was a good sandwich, at least. |
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Xithras (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 02:00 AM Response to Reply #62 |
74. At least I got the sandwich. |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 02:49 AM Response to Reply #57 |
81. That was pretty smooth and gracious |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 03:07 AM Response to Reply #81 |
90. And they should never have done that to you. |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 09:19 AM Response to Reply #90 |
96. There's absolutely nothing wrong with cutting off a bank employee's access to computer systems |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 12:22 PM Response to Reply #96 |
103. that can be done without putting said employee through public humiliation |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 04:47 PM Response to Reply #103 |
107. I agree with everything in your reply |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 09:23 PM Response to Original message |
58. Wat? |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 11:43 PM Response to Reply #58 |
60. You "fully expect to be frog-marched out of the building with great fanfare in the unlikely event" |
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SDuderstadt (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 11:50 PM Response to Reply #60 |
65. What you are proposing is nothing like the... |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 02:30 AM Response to Reply #60 |
76. I have such complete access to sensitive systems, the only responsible way to fire me would be that |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 03:10 AM Response to Reply #76 |
91. It's disturbing that you accept their right to dehumanize you and treat you as a criminal |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-05-11 02:39 AM Response to Reply #76 |
124. Small devil's advocate point: |
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Starry Messenger (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 11:51 PM Response to Original message |
66. Geeze, this thread. |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 11:52 PM Response to Reply #66 |
67. Some people are just too comfortable with the idea of being subservient |
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lonestarnot (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-02-11 11:56 PM Response to Reply #67 |
68. Sad that. |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 02:37 AM Response to Reply #67 |
79. I don't feel subservient in my position. |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 02:58 AM Response to Reply #79 |
85. All right...but what is your opinion of what I'm talking about in the OP? |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 09:18 AM Response to Reply #85 |
95. I think your OP is lame. Companies that routinely mistreat people will suffer natural consequences. |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 12:24 PM Response to Reply #95 |
105. Only a tiny handful of people get to choose who they work for. |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 03:17 AM Response to Reply #79 |
93. Your position is a little too close to the old Anatole France quote |
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SDuderstadt (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 02:38 AM Response to Reply #67 |
80. "If you disagree with me... |
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Lydia Leftcoast (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 05:08 PM Response to Reply #67 |
115. The more I hear about what's happening in workplaces, both |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 02:36 AM Response to Reply #66 |
78. I see it a little differently |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 03:15 AM Response to Reply #78 |
92. You're far too accepting of management's right to be petty tyrants. |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 09:26 AM Response to Reply #92 |
101. Everyone has the right to act like a petty tyrant, including you and me |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 12:03 AM Response to Original message |
69. And I shouldn't have to say this, but I will |
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jberryhill (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 01:42 AM Response to Original message |
73. And a law requiring muggers to say "please" would be good |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 02:14 AM Response to Reply #73 |
75. I'm not calling for corporations that downsize to be let off the hook FOR downsizing |
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Vinee (421 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 04:57 PM Response to Original message |
108. I saw a guy get fired and then he proceeded to beat the living shit out of the guy that fired him. |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 05:02 PM Response to Reply #108 |
110. You could have security people standing unobtrusively in the back of the room |
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HipChick (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 05:03 PM Response to Original message |
111. In my line of work, people are not even allowed to clean out their desks, they are escorted out the |
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kentuck (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 05:04 PM Response to Original message |
112. Why is this topic getting so many "unrecs"?? |
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Harmony Blue (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 05:08 PM Response to Reply #112 |
114. Because most people are not willing to fight back |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jun-04-11 03:18 AM Response to Reply #112 |
120. And why do so many "liberals" see the power of the almighty boss as something that can never |
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supernova (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 05:08 PM Response to Original message |
113. Ken, I applaud your sensitivity |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jun-04-11 03:16 AM Response to Reply #113 |
119. Thank you for that post |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jun-04-11 03:45 AM Response to Reply #113 |
121. self-delete. |
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Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jun-04-11 03:45 AM Response to Reply #113 |
122. In another sense, I think those who are dismissing this are kind of saying |
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Lydia Leftcoast (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 05:10 PM Response to Original message |
116. It's not a major issue, but it is an issue |
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supernova (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 05:17 PM Response to Reply #116 |
117. This thread is perfect proof |
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Lydia Leftcoast (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jun-03-11 05:46 PM Response to Reply #117 |
118. Well, it isn't easy to be self-employed, and I've been on the economic edge |
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B Calm (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jun-04-11 04:44 AM Response to Original message |
123. They walked out our plant manager the other day. LOL |
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Hamlette (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jun-05-11 04:00 AM Response to Original message |
125. armed guards? How often does that happen? |
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