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FUCK FIREDOGLAKE and its racially patronzing attitude about education Black people FUCK THEM!

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wndycty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 12:06 PM
Original message
FUCK FIREDOGLAKE and its racially patronzing attitude about education Black people FUCK THEM!
I cannot believe this shit. FUCK THEM, FUCK THEM HARD, I am so sick of so called progressives whose opinions of Black folks is no different than conservative racists.

-snip-
The recent dustup due to Hedges article on Cornel West could be a real God send. While some of what West said was probably ill-advised, he also touched on many things that the NPA (New Progressive Alliance) could enthusiastically back him on.

Im a little afraid that West will back down, overall, out of fear of becoming a pariah. See http://my.firedoglake.com/kgosztola/2011/05/18/cornel-w... /

Much better would be to go on the offensive, IMO. I.e., exploit this dustup (with Wests blessings, of course), to take things to a higher level. Specifically, West, with the NPAs backing, could undertake an education program, with the initial target the US black community, of teaching them about, say, Obamas Top 10 betrayals, and Obamas Top 5 betrayals of Afro-Americans.
-snip-
http://my.firedoglake.com/metamars/2011/05/18/a-serious...
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Enrique Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 12:13 PM
Response to Original message
1. i agree, but don't say fuck firedoglake
any more than you would say "fuck DU" for similar condescending posts.
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NYCGirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 12:14 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. Like Lenny Bruce used to say, wishing someone
"Fuck You" is a good thing, because fucking is wonderful. The worst thing you can say to someone is "Unfuck You," wishing them that they never ever get that kind of pleasure again.
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JuniperLea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 12:37 PM
Response to Reply #4
12. I remember that bit...
Brilliant!
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NYCGirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 12:13 PM
Response to Original message
2. Jeezus, that article is offensive! NT
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:32 PM
Response to Reply #2
31. Deleted message
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NYCGirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:49 PM
Response to Reply #31
42. This one:
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DevonRex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 12:13 PM
Response to Original message
3. OMG. That is sickening. KnR
Thanks for pointing it out.
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dionysus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:47 PM
Response to Reply #3
40. FDL really is a den of douchebags, is it not?
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DevonRex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:50 PM
Response to Reply #40
44. Yes it is.
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dionysus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:55 PM
Response to Reply #44
48. somewhere the hamster lady is laughing maniacally ;)
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DevonRex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 02:00 PM
Response to Reply #48
55. Apparently they're broke and need teabagger cash to stay afloat.
That's what they get for courting folks who want everything without paying for it
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pnwmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 12:16 PM
Original message
What, you don't think West should "teach" the US black community
about Obama's betrayals of "Afro-Americans"? I mean, what kind of good black progressive are you? Don't you know the only intelligent thing to do is to despise Obama?

:sarcasm:
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ecstatic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 12:16 PM
Response to Original message
5. And that sums up the attitude of the people supporting West's comments
Edited on Fri May-20-11 12:19 PM by ecstatic
Blacks must be taught to despise Obama because it's the only way a primary challenger will have a shot in hell of replacing Obama, and ultimately, handing the election to the republicans next fall.
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DevonRex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 12:17 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. Exactly. Nt
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Blue-Jay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 12:19 PM
Response to Original message
7. We need to teach you darkies how to hate on Obama more.
Like many racist comments, the writer probably doesn't even know that it's a racist comment.

Good thing us white people are here to help y'all out.
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stevenleser Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 12:22 PM
Response to Original message
8. These articles might as well be titled "Take up the White man's burden of showing how bad Obama is"
awful
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Luminous Animal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:20 PM
Response to Reply #8
27. Where in Kevin's article did he even insinuate that? The OP misattributed a snip to him that
belonged solely to metamar.

http://my.firedoglake.com/kgosztola/2011/05/18/cornel-w... /

Please point out the part where Kevin advised taking "up the White man's burden?

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stevenleser Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:33 PM
Response to Reply #27
32. Here
"Numerous liberals or progressives, like Harris-Perry, continue to wait for Obama to address some of the ongoing crises and developments in America that deeply disturb West. They choose to cope and rationalize their discontent. They note the limited options the citizenry has to beat back corporate power and choose pragmatism instead of boldly buying into an idealistic vision for the future."
-------------

Translation: Blacks that support Obama 'rationalize'

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Luminous Animal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:41 PM
Response to Reply #32
38. So all liberals and progressives are black?
You are really reaching here.
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wndycty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:33 PM
Response to Reply #27
33. I didn't misattribute shit. . .
. . .I excerpted as posted. . .
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:44 PM
Response to Reply #33
39. Deleted message
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wndycty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:49 PM
Response to Reply #39
41. Answer this question. . .did that link appear in the post I linked to? YES. . .
. . .I am not guilty of what you accuse me of. I posted that excerpt verbatim from the Firedoglake post. You can now shut the fuck up with your false allegation against me.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:57 PM
Response to Reply #41
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SidDithers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 02:07 PM
Response to Reply #52
57. You're still wrong...
the OP posted a snip by metamar that contained a snip from Kevin.

Sid
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LoZoccolo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 02:11 PM
Response to Reply #57
58. metamar was obviously attributing the Kevin Gosztola quote to himself!
:crazy:
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Luminous Animal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 03:14 PM
Response to Reply #58
72. Yep. I misread the OP. My apology is here:
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DevonRex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:52 PM
Response to Reply #39
45. There are TWO fucking links. You might wanna click on both n
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dionysus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:54 PM
Response to Reply #39
46. he posted 2 seperate links, which were two seperate posts written by two seperate blithering idiots.
Edited on Fri May-20-11 01:54 PM by dionysus
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DevonRex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:57 PM
Response to Reply #46
51. Wonder why that poster keeps claiming otherwise. Everybody can SEE the links
Which lead to the blithering idiots.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 02:00 PM
Response to Reply #51
54. Deleted message
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Luminous Animal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 02:48 PM
Response to Reply #51
62. And if you don't click on the links, it looks like Kevin wrote the 1st sentence of the snip
which he did not.

Did you read Kevin's article? Do you think it is racist?
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SidDithers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 12:23 PM
Response to Original message
9. +1...
:thumbsup:

Sid
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KamaAina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 12:27 PM
Response to Original message
10. "Afro-Americans"?
Dude. 1972 called. It wants its lingo back. :eyes:
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 12:31 PM
Response to Original message
11. Deleted message
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DevonRex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 12:40 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. Yet racism doesn't exist here or in anyone on the "left" or
Edited on Fri May-20-11 12:41 PM by DevonRex
so we're told.

Edited to change he to the
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 12:41 PM
Response to Reply #11
14. Deleted sub-thread
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Enrique Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:06 PM
Original message
so this is flamebait?
I'm sorry I agreed with you in my post #1, you obviously wanted a fight from people that like FDL.

Good luck with that!
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:12 PM
Response to Reply #11
23. Deleted message
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DevonRex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:15 PM
Response to Reply #23
25. Bro? Really?
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:20 PM
Response to Reply #11
26. Deleted message
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DevonRex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:23 PM
Response to Reply #26
29. "normal people" and "your group"???? Good grief.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 02:54 PM
Response to Reply #29
63. Deleted message
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LoZoccolo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 02:58 PM
Response to Reply #63
64. It's funny that people have been talking about a conspiracy of Obama supporters for a few years.
Edited on Fri May-20-11 02:59 PM by LoZoccolo
Yes, it must take an organized secret coordination effort to get people to defend our Democratic president against mendacious and/or outrageous attacks on Democratic Underground. There's really no other explanation for it.
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PassingFair Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 03:15 PM
Response to Reply #64
74. Not organized, just a bunch of like-minded "folks"...
who cluster.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:22 PM
Response to Reply #11
28. Deleted message
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wndycty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:36 PM
Response to Reply #28
35. I didn't attribute shit to anyone, I attributed to the post on FDL. . .
. . .get the fuck over yourself.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 12:43 PM
Response to Original message
15. Deleted message
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. Deleted sub-thread
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 02:01 PM
Response to Reply #15
56. Deleted sub-thread
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 02:21 PM
Response to Reply #15
60. Deleted message
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 12:49 PM
Response to Original message
17. No surprise. The PUMAs over at Firedoglake are racist Obama-hating sore loser assholes.
Edited on Fri May-20-11 12:55 PM by ClarkUSA
The goal of media whore Jane "Kill The Bill/teabagger ally" Hamsher's & her fans' whole internet existence is to tear down Pres. Obama. Liberals they are not. They merely attack Pres. Obama from the left because it gives voice to their PUMA bile.

Fortunately, the majority of real liberals don't give a shit what these bitter whiners think of Pres. Obama. We will be voting to re-elect him in 2012 without a qualm. :)
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jefferson_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 12:56 PM
Response to Original message
18. Consider the source...
I haven't trolled over to FDL in a few months. I see they aren't even pretending anymore. True colors...
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jefferson_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:06 PM
Response to Original message
19. Just saw this tweet, which made me smile...
:)

"The Anti-Obama Communists at FireDogLake having some fund raising problems. Only 123 members and new donors..........whoaaaa EPIC FAIL #p2"
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DevonRex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:09 PM
Response to Reply #19
21. Hahaha! Maybe they're going after racists' money now.
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tammywammy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:08 PM
Response to Original message
20. +1 n/t
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Enrique Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:11 PM
Response to Original message
22. FDL commenter criticizes that post
Who the phook are a buncha white wanna bes to think they should be re-educating black people about Obama, or anything else?

(some devils advocate there, some of my feelings)

There is a semblance of something in here thats just a bit too, um, too, condescending in a racial context.

I get trying to change hearts and minds to draw people to yer cause . . . . but theres something fundamentally, weird to me, about this language to do so in the African American community.

Its sounds so . . . paternalistic, which is code for racist . . . whether its intended or not.

I dont know how else I would have phrased yer diary Meta, but to me it seems a bit, naive at the best, and ignorant of racial issues, at the worst.

N no, Im not black so I guess I shouldnt be speaking about MY apparent criticism of YOUR writings, either.

But I did.

At yer best intent, I concur, we the people need to reach out to everyone to affect change.

On the other hand, change under these circumstances we face is not gonna happen without great pain and suffering and chaos amongst we the people, far beyond what we face now (en masse, many are facing horror daily in our country).

So, in the meantime . . . language and intent is everything.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:15 PM
Response to Original message
24. Deleted message
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SidDithers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:58 PM
Response to Reply #24
53. You're wrong. The OP didn't combine anything...nt
Sid
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xphile Donating Member (565 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 03:08 PM
Response to Reply #53
69. Something is not right because I have not seen part of the quoted blurb
Edited on Fri May-20-11 03:10 PM by xphile
in the article I read. But I have no interest in the comments.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:28 PM
Response to Original message
30. Deleted sub-thread
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MellowDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:36 PM
Response to Original message
34. While certainly a very cynical piece...
I don't see the evidence that their opinion of blacks is any different from their opinion of the electorate as a whole. Rather, I see a very cynical strategy in identity politics, namely trying to undermine a traditional stronghold of the Democratic Party through Cornel West. I could see where it could be interpreted that only blacks need education, but it definitely just seems like a strategy of going after Obama's strength to undermine him.

Regardless, given the racial history of the US, the piece definitely would come across as paternalistic, but it is no different from many of the anti-Obama progressive screeds against the "enablers" and moderates, which all seem quite "elitist" and condescending enough in some respects, if not a bit naive and idealistic.

So, chalk it up to a rather poorly written, cynical article that tries to dabble in identity politics. It's why I hate identity politics.

If you are a progressive that finds Obama to be a conservative, then you should try to educate everyone about that, not single out certain groups as part of a very cynical strategy to draw more attention and focus to an issue. But that's just me. Unfortunately, this is not unheard of in politics, and both parties do it. We saw plenty of it in the last Democratic primaries (if I ever hear the words "working-class whites" again while standing around a pickup truck I just may puke), and we will see it again.


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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:38 PM
Response to Reply #34
37. Deleted sub-thread
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MellowDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:37 PM
Response to Original message
36. Dupe
Edited on Fri May-20-11 01:38 PM by MellowDem
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:50 PM
Response to Original message
43. Deleted message
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:55 PM
Response to Original message
47. Deleted message
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dionysus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:56 PM
Response to Reply #47
49. why?
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 01:57 PM
Response to Original message
50. Deleted message
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Enrique Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 02:11 PM
Response to Original message
59. another FDLer agrees with you, OP
(and as I said in my post #1, I agree also)

IvanIvanovichRenko May 20th, 2011 at 9:39 am

It is terribly frustrating to over and over run up against this belief that black people are incapable of reading, analyzing, understanding, and taking decisions based on that understanding.

Really, the lecturing is, at the very least, counter-productive. At worst, youll get a lot of black people hoisting the middle finger in your direction.
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Denzil_DC Donating Member (268 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 03:01 PM
Response to Reply #59
65. An FDL member who has only two comments on record,
as checking out the member's activity will show.

A good deal of the pushback can be attributed to this Balloon Juice thread: http://www.balloon-juice.com/2011/05/20/dear-firedoglak... / with commenters there signing up to express their disagreement/disgust.

I don't think you can make excuses for this tripe. It may not reflect an FDL corporate viewpoint, but it's hosted and tolerated there (note that moderators have in the past intervened on diaries at FDL that have been held to be beyond the pale for some reason).
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 03:06 PM
Response to Reply #65
68. Deleted message
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Denzil_DC Donating Member (268 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 03:12 PM
Response to Reply #68
71. I don't think it's as prevalent,
so why were you calling out the OP - which focused on the post, not the comments, snarkily as you did? Overdefensive much?

If you agree that FDL post's condescending, we're on the same page. Cherrypicking quotes from the comments over there is pretty irrelevant. I could do the same with access to vastly more material if I chose to quote everyone over there who defended the post.
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Enrique Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 02:32 PM
Response to Original message
61. FDL loves you, OP
and there's nothing you can do about it!

here's another FDLer that agrees with you:


I got that feeling (as expressed by Larue above) as well, metamars, even if you didnt intend it. To my mind, the meeting of minds which the interview represents, and which our vote for Obama represented, is far too important to be concerned about racial divisions. Professor West is that kind of figure, and that, friend, is the stronghold you want to promote. We all have the struggle of overcoming our joyful pride at having elected a mixed race candidate (many of us being in that condition ourselves to some degree) and admittedly for the black population thats much more of a hurdle. But let them work it out for themselves as they will have to do.

When I critiqued the Hedges interview on another thread, it wasnt in any way with reference to the race of the participants; it was with reference to what each stands for in the political arena. Thats where the message has resonance.
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Denzil_DC Donating Member (268 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 03:03 PM
Response to Reply #61
67. Not so much, judging by the replies that follow it
You're not doing anyone any favors by excusing this.
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Luminous Animal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 03:01 PM
Response to Original message
66. Please see my apology here for misreading the structure of your post.
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pnwmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 03:10 PM
Response to Reply #66
70. Wow. A true "gentleperson." I'm impressed. n/t
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DevonRex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 03:14 PM
Response to Reply #66
73. Everyone should read this. Luminous has done a wonderful thing.
And some of us need to apologize for things we said and thought about the situation - myself included.
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Wait Wut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 03:27 PM
Response to Original message
75. People still visit FDL??
I get less irritated watching FOX. But, I like comedies better than melodramas, so that would explain that.

I haven't been back there in way over a year. Got sick of the fact-twisting and pedestal posing.
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 03:33 PM
Response to Reply #75
76. Apparently enough do to still drive some DUers nuts.
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Enrique Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 03:36 PM
Response to Reply #75
77. I do, but I missed this post
the OP must read FDL more thoroughly than I do.
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Number23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-21-11 07:20 PM
Response to Original message
78. This thread is gold
The folks deliberately misinterpreting wndycyt's point ("wow, people still visit FDL?!one!") or trying to minimize or even excuse the diarists' racist perspective are exactly why so many blacks are as skeptical of liberals as we are conservatives.

Props to those who recognized wndycty's point -- which is that this type of racism (that only whites "understand" how detrimental Obama is and it's their job to "educate" poor, stupid black people on how he's screwing us over) is inexcusable and unacceptable whether it comes from the left or right side of the spectrum.
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pnwmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-21-11 07:25 PM
Response to Reply #78
79. I'm not sure I've ever seen so many deleted messages
in a non-locked thread.

Kind of sad.
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