Obama talk about Public Option.

[NewLIfeArea]

The public option, he said, "is an area that has just become symbolic of a lot of ideological fights." But, Obama added: "As a practical matter, this is not the most important aspect of this bill — the House bill or the Senate bill."

Only "a few million people" who buy into the insurance exchange set up in the bill would have benefited from the public option, he said.

"So it wasn’t like suddenly everybody would just go out there and buy a government-run plan," Obama said. "Most people will still get health insurance from their employers."

http://www.politico.com/politico44/perm/1209/obama_watched_the_vote_3dac2d12-13ff-416b-9394-16cf24e21c02.html

[Skittles]

1. gawd, the man is fucking clueless

[Unvanguard]

2. He's exactly right. The public option, at least in its final form,

was never going to make much difference. A good thing, but a small good thing compared to the rest of the bill.

[kirby]

5. Most people dont seem to get that...

Even though Obama lied and said he would veto any bill without a ROBUST public option, both the House and Senate Bill has a suck public option.
The CBO said the House bill would have only covered 6 million and the Senate version would have only covered 3 million. Only a very small pool of people were even going to be allowed into the so called public option.

So Obama is correct in that respect. The huge distraction concerning the public option was a joke. It was two camps arguing over the merits of an utterly weak public option.

[BP2]

11. HUH - The huge distraction concerning the public option was a joke?! So are you trying to say that

this was all part of some master plan of subterfuge in the negotiation process, for Obama to drop something he never intended in the first place?!

If that's true, a lot of Obama supporters are going to feel very USED that they were pawns in his little scheme to support Big Pharma and Big Insurance!

A LOT OF OBAMA SUPPORTERS.

[kirby]

15. Kinda...

I'm not saying it was a master plan of subterfuge, but it was something that he did not care about. Not only did he not fight for it, but he gave up on it before the negotiations even began. And yes, this Obama supporter feels USED.

[Unvanguard]

18. Obama didn't make it a non-entity. Congress did.

What Obama did was leave Congress pretty much alone, as long as it produced legislation that expanded coverage and didn't increase the deficit. We can debate whether or not this was a good idea. But it is not the same as direct responsibility.

[BP2]

24. Direct responsibility will occur when Obama elects to

use his VETO power and says, "Congress, do it again and do it right with the items I outlined in the beginning."

Conversely, direct responsibility will also occur if he elects to sign it.

One of those two options is correct. The other is politically expedient.

[Unvanguard]

29. Vetoing or signing is a package deal. He can't amend the legislation.

So, no, he wouldn't be directly responsible then either.

The most you can say is that it's possible, in some counterfactual, things might have turned out differently: if Obama had fought harder, etc. But that's very far from a sure thing--we needed sixty votes, it's far from clear that there would have been enough whatever Obama had did--and even if it were, it would be the incidental consequence of a certain political tactic, one that bears on the merit of the tactic but that does not show that Obama never "really" supported the public option in the first place.

[ima_sinnic]

26. that is exactly what is being said

first he talks about some vague, nebulous "public option" (he called it a "government option" this summer, which was real helpful while the teabaggers were screaming about "socialism" and "a government plan"--just a subtle way to help along the confusion and distortions)--never explaining how it could work, what it would be in any detail---then he hands the whole subject of "health care reform" it to Max Baucus after a fake "promise" that "everybody would have a seat at the table"--expressed no concern about the fact that doctors and nurses (the Baucus 13) were arrested for trying to get a place at that table for single-payer advocates--single-payer was treated like some circus freak show, something he glanced at with disdain and amusement (the same way he regarded the topic of legalization of marijuana on about Day 2, even though it was voted #1 most popular topic for "change" by his own website's survey)--so anyway, I'm tired and don't feel like typing out the chronology again, you can look it up. I'm done with the phony. He didn't do jack to push a "public option" (which just became weak and distorted as the process dragged on), and he made no complaint, expressed no concern that it was finally dropped. He'll apparently sign anything, it doesn't matter.

He had no great expectations, and that's what he got: nothing great.

[DJ13]

6. Well, even a weak version would have given future reform something

to work with in the future.

Its always easier to reform and improve a government ran program than it will be to try and change anything in the future relating to private insurance.

[Unvanguard]

10. That's a fair point; from an incrementalist perspective it would have been better.

But, then, you could reverse that reasoning and point out that precisely for that reason it wasn't going to happen politically: conservative Democrats were too unwilling to countenance the idea of anything that could lead to single-payer, or any approximation thereof.

[mdmc]

3. I currently get my insurance through my employer

for me the status quo isn't working. I can't afford health care right now and it will only increase in cost in the future.

But I am glad that Obama will get a major victory.

[frazzled]

12. Well, you wouldn't be able to get the Public Option plan if you're employed, either

Unless you work for an extremely small employer. Did everybody think they would be able to buy this Public Option plan? Because honestly, only 2-3 million people out of the 300 million people in America were going to be eligible anyway. And let's say you were eligible to buy into it: did you realize it would cost you slightly more than a private plan? That's what the CBO said. It had been weakened to the point of being completely immaterial. We fought for the public option (and that includes me: I actually rallied with signs for it and went to a few public meetings) as a foot-in-the-door measure. And I'm sorry it's gone. But it probably wasn't going to help YOU at all.

But I am getting really tired of how everyone thinks this is about them. (think: Carly Simon).

[mdmc]

13. point taken

well met.

[frazzled]

17. Your honest response is a kind of xmas present to me

I stayed away from here for a few weeks, because it was getting to be such a madhouse. And since I've returned the last day or two, I've gotten nothing but blank stares or hostility when I try to put forth an argument. I was just about to give up and go away again, thinking it's kind of useless: everyone (and I guess that includes me) is so set in their position, there is really no chance to have a rational discussion.

So your gesture of saying "point taken" has restored my faith! We can have a discussion! (Even if we may disagree.)

I truly appreciate your little gift! :)

[mdmc]

21. Peace and low stress my friend

I love DU but tend to stay in the small groups as GD is too fast and furious for me..
peace and hang in there..

[xchrom]

4. Why did he bother? Nt

[FormerDittoHead]

9. Silly. Because we wouldn't have contributed all that money, sent those emails, etc.

He's not STUPID!

If they told us that he'd support a mandate to buy private insurance, with no public option and the chance to break free of the private shackles, we would have NEVER donated all that money, wrote all those emails, signed all those petitions, etc.

Give him a little credit, will you?

He can't ask for more money NOW...

[BP2]

7. And under the bus we

GO!

[Blasphemer]

8. So, you water the public option down to the point where it's virtually useless and then say it's no

great loss. That wasn't intentional or anything was it?

[GreenArrow]

34. as something purely symbolic

it's pretty clear that the "PO" was never part of the plan.

[Captain Hilts]

14. Access to health insurance should NOT be through employers. nt

[bigwillq]

16. ....

:thumbsup:

[rudy23]

19. Sure, the public option is just a symbol--for the elite whose healthcare is taken care of.

He's really showing an amazing lack of empathy that rivals the last occupant of the Oval Office.

[NewLIfeArea]

20. pass new Health Care bill

As baby step.. later they will add some new bills.. possible public option or single payer..
just baby step for all of us..

[DebbieCDC]

22. blah blah blah

When this BS piece of crap legislation comes back and bites the Dems in the ass in 2010 and 2012, remember where you heard it.

[paulk]

23. both my wife and I would have qualified for the public option

it wasn't "symbolic" at all.

And quite frankly, tying insurance to your employer is a dumb fucking idea. This whole process has been one giant clusterfuck, where the powers that be got a seat at the table while the rest of us - well, it's just not "practical" to include us in this discussion.

[treestar]

30. Tell Lieberdork

Since it's all about you, maybe Lieberman just didn't understand that!

[paulk]

33. all about me, huh?

another of your stock insults

fuck you

fuck you and the whole lot of pom pom assholes who have infested this website

[janx]

25. Where is NewLifeArea?

Where did NewLifeArea go? :shrug:

[NewLIfeArea]

27. i'm here

Hello?

[PBS Poll-435]

28. ..

:rofl:

I think that this one has been called many different things this week.

[treestar]

31. I don't get why he changed his mind on it

OTOH, I'm not sure why it would be so much better. It would still have to charge enough to pay for health care costs. DU is attached to it as if it were a magical thing right now, yet it would just be "insurance" which is not "health care" and it an idea invented by those horrid insurance companies.

But candidate Obama seemed to think it was important at the time. Then again, whatever he said, he didn't know what Congress he would get.

[Armstead]

32. Well yeah -- Since you allowed it to become a meaningless public option

[Beacool]

35. "Obama talk"

Ahhhh, there's the one area he's good at.

Remember the soaring speeches about platitudes? "We are the ones we've been waiting for".......change......hope.....blah, blah, blah........

He struck me then as a bullshit artist who was deft about talking about nothing much, but who thanks to his oratory and Axelrod & Plouffe was able to sell a bill of goods to his supporters. The young were all fired up for him, AAs finally had a viable candidate and the upwardly mobile whites felt good about themselves.

Interesting that two out of these three groups are the ones faring the worst in this recession. The young and AAs are the ones with the highest unemployment numbers.

:eyes:

[Baltoman991]

36. Yeah, and the AAs and the

young are laying it all on Obama right? I mean hell, after 11 months on the job he should have been able to put every young person and every AA back to work right? Those past 8 years never really happened. They had shit to do with the way we are today. Damn you Obama for not cleaning up 8 years of bullshit in a week. You're a horrible horrible person who will not get my support in 2012.

How did I do? Do I qualify as an official Obama hater now?

[Beacool]

37. Hmmmm, not really.

But keep trying, it's a start........

:7

[Baltoman991]

39. Won't happen!!

See, I'm not one who wants it all my way and will stomp my feet and spread BS because I don't get it all my way. He is the President of the United States, not the President of Liberals only. Our side becomes no better than their side when we start acting the way we're acting now.

I voted for him in 2008, I will vote for him in 2012. He's done nothing that those who listened to him didn't think he would do. Those showing disgust now have proven themselves the ones who didn't listen to a damn word the man said.

And no one here who slams Obama holds Congress responsible for anything. Oh sure, when they're called on it they'll say they do, but finding a post showing Congress being blamed isn't easy on this board.

[freddie mertz]

38. Yeah, it sucked after you weakened it and and torpedoed it after lying about it.

Honestly Mr. President, the less you say about this, the better.

We know now that this was just a boondoggle you used to get us on board.

Happy Xmas.

[uponit7771]

40. More "blame Obama first" hatred, he can't control Lieberman or Nelson...

[freddie mertz]

41. He can't control anything. He's just the president.

A powerless position with no powers.

Got it.