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Time: Obama Pushed for ‘Fight Your Way Out’ Option in bin Laden Raid

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Pirate Smile Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-03-11 04:40 PM
Original message
Time: Obama Pushed for ‘Fight Your Way Out’ Option in bin Laden Raid
Obama Pushed for ‘Fight Your Way Out’ Option in bin Laden Raid

A senior U.S. military official Monday credited President Obama for having a prominent role in pushing and shaping the plan to get Osama bin Laden. “In the final weeks and really months of this, his personal interest and direction and attention pushed the case to a new level that enabled real action,” the official told reporters. “And I think that role is quite important.”

On Tuesday, White House officials began to offer more details on exactly how Obama had shaped the final assault plan. In particular, the President, they said, urged the Pentagon to revisit the number of helicopters it planned to bring into Pakistani airspace on the mission. One of those extra helicopters later played a role in the mission.
The president made his concerns known in a briefing about 10 days before the assault on the bin Laden compound. According to senior aides, Obama felt that the special operations COA, or course of action, was too risky. Under the COA at that time, only two helicopters would enter Pakistani airspace, leaving little backup if something went wrong. “I don’t want you to plan for an option that doesn’t allow you to fight your way out,” the President told operational planners at the meeting, according to the notes of one participant.

So the plan was revised. Ultimately, four helicopters flew into Pakistani airspace, including two refueling helicopters that carried additional personnel. In the end, the extra forces didn’t need to fight their way out of the compound, but a backup helicopter did play a key role in the operation. One of the two primary assault helicopters, an HH-60 Pave Hawk lost its lift, landed hard and had to be destroyed. The backup landed to lift its passengers to safety. “The President created the ‘fight your way out’ option,” explained an administration official.

Read more: http://swampland.time.com/2011/05/03/obama-pushed-for-f...
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warrior1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-03-11 04:43 PM
Response to Original message
1. this needs to be shouted out loud and often
kr
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Parker CA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-03-11 04:47 PM
Response to Original message
2. Pretty much destroys the "Obama had no involvement" line popping up online. nt
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damntexdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-03-11 04:47 PM
Response to Original message
3. What a difference it makes when a prez cares about most of the troops.
Very unlike the Bushistas.

Too bad the Prez doesn't care about Bradley Manning, however.
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paparush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 08:14 AM
Response to Reply #3
21. THIS x 1000
To this day, I do not believe Bush, Cheney, Rove, Rumsfeld, Rice, Wolfowitz, et al, gave a rat's ass about US troops or their families.
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alfredo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 12:17 PM
Response to Reply #21
37. Remember bush cut military pay on the day he invaded Iraq.
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janet118 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 11:17 AM
Response to Reply #3
32. Exactly . . .
and uses clear thinking and common sense to think about a Plan B. He has the ability to put himself in the boots of the soldier on the ground.
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Safetykitten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-03-11 04:47 PM
Response to Original message
4. Nice!
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Thrill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-03-11 04:49 PM
Response to Original message
5. Competence has returned to the White House
You know this is true when Military Officials say this about a Democrat.
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BREMPRO Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 07:52 AM
Response to Reply #5
20. witness same competence with FEMA quick response to tornado's.. getting good marks from residents
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jpak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-03-11 04:57 PM
Response to Original message
6. Barack Hussein Obama - Commander in Chief
yup
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DrToast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-03-11 05:00 PM
Response to Original message
7. Not bad for an arugula-eating professor.*
*
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OKNancy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-03-11 05:02 PM
Response to Original message
8. I've finally gave in and decided to use the Facebook "like" choice
I've never liked to put much politics on my Facebook. Maybe a funny photochop once in a while.
However, I am just getting all wound up with all the bs that has been popping up on my Facebook in the past few days.

Now, I'm posting funny Trump pictures, the Bush quote about how he wasn't interested, and then a link to this story.
I'm also going to respond to any idiotic remark from now on. I used to let it go...no more.
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fujiyama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-03-11 07:16 PM
Response to Reply #8
16. Same here
I'm tired of talking points going unanswered. People need to know the truth. And even if I don't convince die hard nut jobs, maybe a word or two will get out to those that aren't paying attention to much, but aren't drinking RW kool aid.
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Pirate Smile Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-03-11 08:19 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. I think people let a lot of the garbage thrown at Bill Clinton go - and there was a lot of it - and
just rolled their eyes & kept their mouth shut.

We need to never do that again. If we hear any RW'er spewing BS, we need to counter it. The Republicans are so willing to just talk crap, just lie and say anything to push their narrative. We have to counter it and not let them feel like they can just make any verbal attacks on the President and people will either agree or be cowed into silence. Never again.
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DinahMoeHum Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-03-11 05:19 PM
Response to Original message
9. The "Jimmy Carter Syndrome" has bitten the dust, big time
thanks to President Obama.

Meanwhile, here's the hoping the GOoPers like the taste of bitter lemons in their mouths.

It's great to be a Democrat these days. Even under these circumstances.

:patriot:
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ieoeja Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 11:00 AM
Response to Reply #9
29. That is such an unfortunate meme.

Cruise missile - developed under Carter

Stealth aircraft - begun under Carter

Delta Force - developed under Carter

Israel - not invaded by Arab countries since Carter negotiated peace with Egypt

South Yemen - rebellion backed by US Marines, IN THE MIDST OF THE IRAN CRISIS, following a communist military coup a few weeks earlier, kept southern entrance of Red Sea out of full communist control

Kuwait - Muslim leaders (except Libya) supported US citing Carter's actions as the reason they trusted the United States


Carter may have been the most successful leader the United States has had regarding the Mideast since Arab independance. And he gets lambasted for it.


But, hey, if Kerry can be called a coward over his military service, Gore can be ridiculed for getting the Internet off the ground, and we are supposed to be happy the guy who mocked the notion of terrorism being a threat was president on 9-11, then I guess we can expect this up-is-down, black-is-white thinking to continue.


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trud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 03:48 PM
Response to Reply #29
48. unfortunate meme
"Israel - not invaded by Arab countries since Carter negotiated peace with Egypt"

Too bad we can't say the opposite.
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high density Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-03-11 05:26 PM
Response to Original message
10. Great job here
I do hope that Obama can now extend his "personal interest and direction and attention" to matters beyond war items.
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dionysus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-03-11 07:03 PM
Response to Reply #10
15. your problem is that you believe he hasn't. n/t
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MasonJar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-03-11 05:28 PM
Response to Original message
11. Glad to read this explanation. I had wondered how one helicopter
had gotten everyone out.
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lucca18 Donating Member (149 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-03-11 05:41 PM
Response to Original message
12. I am so glad Obama is our president.
The way Obama handled this..... I am truly impressed!!
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louis-t Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-03-11 05:45 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. You KNOW bush and rummy would have screwed it up.
Often Wrong Rumsfeld.
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 01:48 PM
Response to Reply #13
43. They would have bombed the house next door. nt
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Cognitive_Resonance Donating Member (733 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-03-11 06:30 PM
Response to Original message
14. K&R nt
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Pirate Smile Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-03-11 11:27 PM
Response to Original message
18. kick
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Pirate Smile Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 07:50 AM
Response to Original message
19. Kick
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truebrit71 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 08:16 AM
Response to Original message
22. K&R
..
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 09:29 AM
Response to Original message
23. What I don't understand in this story is why the military didn't have a "fight your way out"
scenario on its own. I would think, given the Desert I disaster, that this option would be incorporated into any plan's operation...
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Kdillard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 09:39 AM
Response to Reply #23
25. Honestly I am not surprised. There have been too many examples of the military brass
having plans that are not fully thought out and leading to screw ups. I am glad that President Obama saw the problem before it came back to bite everyone in the butt.
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 09:43 AM
Response to Reply #25
26. The only thing I could think of is that the brass might have felt that they couldn't
get away with flying 4 helicopters in and getting them out safely. They might have considered that 4 copters would be too noticeable by the Pakis.

But you make a good point. Obama was considering the political implication of failure and the brass might have viewed this thing more narrowly.
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ieoeja Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 11:03 AM
Response to Reply #26
30. That or overconfidence. You will recall there was no contingency plan in Somalia either.

Which is why our main support (Pakistan, ironically) was unprepared.


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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 11:09 AM
Response to Reply #30
31. So after Desert I and Somalia, nobody got the DUH and prepared a contingency plan?
That's disturbing.
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ieoeja Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 11:31 AM
Response to Reply #31
34. I believe they widely view Desert I as being the result of inexperience.

After Somalia, it does seem somewhat odd.

On the other hand, the incident in Somalia was worsened by their rescue efforts after the first helicopter went down. So the lesson they took from that might have been, if something goes wrong, we're better off negotiating after the fact. They did, after all, return our captured pilot immediately after Clinton threatened to send in the Marines.

Furthermore, in this instance the raid was in a sort-of-friendly country. If they gave up the CIA guy who killed a couple of minor figures, it's a pretty good bet Pakistan would have returned uniformed military personnel who got Bin Laden with even less effort. Uniforms make a difference under international law.

But there is no arguing that it ultimately did turn out a lot better because of Obama's contingency plans.


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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 02:22 PM
Response to Reply #34
45. I've always wondered who screwed up the Somalia incident.
RWingers were all pointing fingers at Clinton, but did he have final say or make some judgment that the military opposed?
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ieoeja Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-05-11 10:56 AM
Response to Reply #45
49. The military would take exception to "screwed up".

The mission succeeded in its goal. They lost two aircraft and took some casualties which means it could have gone better. The author of Blackhawk Down found that those involved were confused, and insulted, by the perception that it was a screw up.

To address that to which you refer, who was responsible for more losses than necessary, I believe it was our commanding officer in Somalia who made the decision not to inform his Pakistani backups. Though I am not certain about that. I'm sure it is in the book, but I don't recall that particular fact.

Ultimately, Clinton was right to take the blame. He could have ordered an end to combat missions when he decided to leave Somalia. I don't even know if it was discussed with the President. The Pentagon moved forward with planning the departure while allowing the command in Somalia to continue their mission.

The only person who took a fall were the people who failed to inform Clinton when the raid turned messy. Of course, the attempted Communist military coup in Russia on that same date (a fact people always forget) was a bit more important than a small firefight in Somalia.


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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-05-11 06:57 PM
Response to Reply #49
51. Well, lessons learned...at least for now...
my guess now is that Obama read up on what happened with Clinton in Somalia and was determined that it was not going to happen to him, if he could help it. And that is probably why he ordered the back up plan. He knew that sh*t happens...and he would have been forever blamed and a one term president like Carter...
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Pirate Smile Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 09:45 AM
Response to Reply #23
27. Listening to the chatter on Morning Joe (they had talked to Biden and others the night before), it
sounds like the Military folks (Gates? Mullen?) were not really gung ho about doing it. The only person who said "Do it" was Panetta. Everyone else equivocated. They also said the person who was PUSHING IT - was Obama. He wanted more. I think maybe they didn't think he was going to say "do it".

You are right though. It does seem like the Military should have known on their own to have more contingencies prepared.

They wouldn't talk about what all they knew (off the record, I guess) but they were gushing over President Obama and saying that as more comes out, the President will be getting LOTS of credit.

I suppose there is a reason why one person in this pic looks particularly INTENSE and leaning into the action. He owned it. The blame if it didn't work would have been ENORMOUS.

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Recursion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 01:44 PM
Response to Reply #23
41. Four helicopters = twice as much noise
There's arguments on both sides.
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-05-11 01:44 PM
Response to Reply #41
50. That's a fair guess, and one that I share. It makes sense...
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AdrianInOcala Donating Member (859 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 09:37 AM
Response to Original message
24. Could you imagine if there had been an accident like
happened with the failed rescue attempt in Iran? The Wingnuts would be screaming for impeachment.... Well, they already are, but you know what I meant.

Thank goodness The President and his staff got this right, and got it done, to hell with the right wingers, they were the ones who left Bin Laden standing.
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GeorgeGist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 10:59 AM
Response to Original message
28. It's hard to believe a man who never served a minute in the military ...
outsmarted a group of elite Navy Seals.
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Muskypundit Donating Member (417 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 11:38 AM
Response to Reply #28
35. because he didnt
He out smarted their commanding officers though, and that was good enough.
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nonperson Donating Member (901 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 11:27 AM
Response to Original message
33. This is true leadership
No nonsense. Be prepared in advance for all contingencies. Get the job done.

If only President Obama and the Democratic Party would seize this type of leadership role against the Republicans. Call the fools out and set them straight like he did "the Donald". (After the way President Obama took his head off, figuratively speaking of course, Trump should change his nickname to "the Donald-DUCK").
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #33
39. There's difference. Republicans, don't take orders. n/t
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jorno67 Donating Member (906 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 12:15 PM
Response to Original message
36. AMERICA...FUCK YEAH!!!
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Myrina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 12:47 PM
Response to Original message
38. LMAO he wanted to offer OBL a bi-partisan solution??
What a surprise!!!

:rofl:
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Pirate Smile Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 01:02 PM
Response to Reply #38
40. What?
He didn't "offer" him anything. He gave OBL a bullet in the head.
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 01:47 PM
Response to Original message
42. So in other words...
this completely squelches any of the right wing half wit morons out there claiming that moron* "laid out the plans".

Thank you, President Obama. :)
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Pirate Smile Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 01:55 PM
Response to Reply #42
44. You're welcome.
:)
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RaleighNCDUer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 03:19 PM
Response to Original message
46. Why would anyone ever create an operational plan that did NOT have a
'fight your way out' option?

It's a basic concept in tactics that you plan for a 'worst case' scenario.
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JDPriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-04-11 03:41 PM
Response to Original message
47. Basically, if this story is true, Obama saved the lives of
quite a few people by choosing the more cautious plan.

Now, let's see if he can save the lives of a few American seniors by making sure that the most cautious Social Security and Medicare plans are maintained.
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