Obama is not on the conservative side of the Democratic Party, IMO

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

To my thinking Obama is center dem on domestic policy -- not on the conservative side of the Democratic Party, or the liberal side.

And the location of the center is more a comment on the Party than on Obama.

Almost all the Party delegates went to two people. Obama is not, taken all together, to the right of Hillary Clinton. The Party sure as heck voted for some range between Obama and Clinton and that's a mighty narrow range.

The combined Democratic Congressional delegation isn't really to Obama's left. One cmight say Obama is to the right of the Dem House and left of the Dem Senate, but pretty vanilla either way. (Domestic, not Afghanistan.) If Tom Harkin wrote the HCR bill Obama wouldn't veto it. If Max Baucus wrote it Obama wouldn't veto it. Obama will pretty much go along with whatever the Party in Congress sees fit to put on his desk.

One can certainly say that the Party should be aligned in such a way that Obama would be on the right side of it, but we're not there, IMO. And if we were there Obama would probably drift a few notches to the left.

This just is not, as an overall national deal, a very left-leaning Party. When you add a bunch of seats you do so by poaching the middle so this may not be the Party we're used to. Deeds, the Dem gubanatorial candidate in Virginia, was making noises about opting Virginia out of any public option... and Obama won Virginia only a year earlier.

(If, God forbid, Congress is forced to vote on whether DC can kept its just passed same-sex marriage law we may be reminded where the center of the Party really is.)

[ind_thinker2]

1. If that is the case we have a Pres with no opinion, thats a shame...

Whatever he signs, he owns it, I am not going to fight he has no spine to take sides.

[rockymountaindem]

2. If that is true, then why did the House, the more representative institution,

vote for the most liberal bill, with a public option in it? I would say that places Obama to the right of the House majority Dems.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

4. A valid point, though he would sign the House bill

He will sign any bill Congress spits out.

I believe that if we were negotiating with Bernie Sanders instead of Joe Lieberman (on some strange planet) then we could end up with a bill somewhat to the left of where Obama might like to be... but he would still sign it.

Every action and non-action he has made regarding HCR appears to be just to get some bill passed, in terms of however he understood the situation. I don't know that he wanted the bill to be so weak, but he's not going to make waves.

I am not saying he is to the LEFT. I think he is seeking to be dead center.

If we chatted with him he'd be sincerely enthusiastic about a lot of lefty stuff, but wouldn't necessarily fight much for it.

Is that left, right or just something else?

Maybe agnostic?

[rockymountaindem]

9. I think I understand you better now

There's not much to argue with in your post. However, I would answer your question by saying the belief in "lefty stuff" without being willing to fight for it doesn't make him agnostic, it makes him one of two other things. 1) desperate for approval by the largest number of his contemporaries possible or 2) weak.

[Ildem09]

11. Bingo!

I seriously think it's his damn desire to be seen as everything to everybody. I honestly don't think he can stand to not be liked. He was my Senator for a few years and I knew of him in the State Senate the same was true back then he hated not being liked. he would say general platitudes to whatever group he was in front of. He desire to be liked is going to be the downfall of his administration.

[Clio the Leo]

3. Agreeing with you AND Krugman in ONE day....

... is almost TOO much for my ego. ;)

[Armstead]

5. It should be a left=leaning party to have an actual center in the system

We have one right leaning party, the Republkicans.

The only way there will actually be a true government of gthe center is if that is counterbalanced by a left leaning Democratic Party.

Instead we have two parties steadily pulling to the right.

This rightward political system is not reflective of the population. The country, and most individuals, are also a balance of liberal and conservative instincts. The problem is that the liberal half has been unrepresented by the Democrats.

The cumulative result is that things that would have been considered immoral and indecently exploitative and outrageously stupid when I was young are now considered business as usual.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

6. Agreed. I wonder whether it is a force of nature that the two parties must

meet at some point at all times... that they must fill the center spectrum.

Since most elections are decided by independents that makes sense to me.

So if a Party goes nut-right then the other party drifts naturally rightward to fill in the abandoned middle-ground.

Also--scary thought--the electorate probably does the same thing... drifting to a perceived center even if a center between Mary Landrieu and Generalissimo Franco.

[Armstead]

8. IMO the nut right Re[ublicans ctreated a huge opening for Dem liberalism

Take your dead center independent voter (a mythical creature I realize).

Given a choice between a Democratic party that is reasonable but clearly liberal, and a caterwauling bunch of crazed wingnut Republicans, I believe the independent is likely to think "I don't totally agree with the Democratic party but i like some of their ideas, and those other guys scare the bejeezus out of me."

That is especially true if that Independent voter has been beaten up by the cumulative results of right wing policies, as happened last year. If the Democrats were to make a clear case for liberalism, I believe they could win that independent over.

That was pretty much the scenario in 08. A golden opportunity. Alas.....we didn't catch that wave and ride it after that.

[VMI Dem]

7. He sure as hell ain't no progressive or liberal.

He is a right leaning centrist. Through and through.

[grantcart]

10. He's a pragmatist

Working as a community organizer instructed him that vaulted rhetoric that fails to actual meet the objective doesn't do anything for the poor.

He's also a persevering workaholic. He believes that if he will outlast everyone else. I am sure that the believe they have a second and third act with the health care bill. He may be right.

[JCMach1]

12. It doesn't matter what he IS... He is governing somewhere to the right of Bill Clinton

Not too many years ago we used to call that REPUBLICAN!