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Note to Bachmann: You do NOT have a "post doctoral" degree in taxation

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spooky3 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-06-11 06:34 PM
Original message
Note to Bachmann: You do NOT have a "post doctoral" degree in taxation
Edited on Wed Apr-06-11 06:37 PM by spooky3
A "juris doctor" is earned in 3 years of full time work (or less) beyond a bachelor's degree in the US. MDs and PhDs spend many more years than that--at a minimum, 5 years full time beyond a bachelor's degree, including qualifying exams (plural) after coursework and a dissertation, which lawyers do not have to design, research or write, nor a residency and internship requiring incredible hours and expertise.

And having degrees does not make one a person of substance.

(Tweety just showed an excerpt of a response Michelle Bachmann made to an MSNBC reporter asking whether she was being more careful about what she says to show she is a person of substance.)
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Eumenides Donating Member (143 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-06-11 07:25 PM
Response to Original message
1. No, but she's qualified for a degree...
In bat shit craziness -- she's been working on it for years.
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spooky3 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-06-11 08:04 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. I'm sure one of the Koch boys will buy it for her soon.
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spooky3 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 11:35 AM
Response to Original message
3. And, the JD degree is from Oral Roberts U and Regent University.
Edited on Thu Apr-07-11 11:40 AM by spooky3
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michele_Bachmann

Interesting that she didn't brag about that. Could it have anything to do with the ideological bent and low academic standards of those places?
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JoePhilly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 11:37 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. I hear the certificates have Jesus' actual signature on them.
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AlinPA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #3
6. It's crazy: people like her are actually leading one of America's two politcal parties. nt
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ElsewheresDaughter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 04:21 PM
Response to Reply #3
12. are they even credentialed universities?
Edited on Thu Apr-07-11 04:22 PM by ElsewheresDaughter
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huskerlaw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 11:54 AM
Response to Original message
5. Actually, she does.
She has a juris doctorate, which is a law degree, and she has an LLM in tax. The LLM is a masters degree which she got AFTER the law degree. So, yes, she has a post-doctoral degree in tax. That doesn't mean it's worth the paper it's written on, but technically she is correct.

I'm also not real sure how you figure that a law degree can take less than 3 years. I suppose if you're some kind of genius and/or insane individual, you could do it in 2 1/2. However, 3 years is the standard for a law degree. The LLM is another 2. So if you're going on years alone (which is ridiculous, by the way...the word "doctorate" is right in the JD title), she did do 5 years post-undergrad.

I can't believe I'm defending Michele Bachmann. But in this case, you are incorrect.
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spooky3 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. Sorry - I AM correct. As per this Wiki link, most scholarly bodies do NOT
Edited on Thu Apr-07-11 12:21 PM by spooky3
recognize the JD as a "doctorate degree" comparable to a PhD. The American Bar Association promotes the alternative view, for obvious self-interest.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juris_Doctor

"Although the American Bar Association has issued a Council Statement<127> advising that the J.D. be considered as being equivalent to the Ph.D. for employment and educational purposes,<128> the United States Department of Education, the National Science Foundation, and the European Research Council do not include the J.D. or other professional doctorates among the degrees that are equivalent to research doctorates.<129><130><131>"

The word "doctor" in the title of the JD degree is about as meaningful as the word "philosophy" in "Doctor of Philosophy" (PhD). Even in law schools, faculty are not addressed as "doctor", nor are they addressed as such in practice, for good reason.

There is NO comparison in the amount of work required for the JD versus true doctoral degrees. The JD takes only one year more than an MBA at most universities. It's not "ridiculous" to compare years - it's one basic metric that accreditation agencies use for determining whether degrees meet standards.

You are also comparing apples to oranges in your counting the time for BOTH the JD degree and the masters' degree in taxation, in making a comparison with the PhD and medical degrees. PhDs with post doc work, or a master's degree in another or specialized field, which would be more comparable, could involve 8-10 years beyond the undergraduate degree.
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huskerlaw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:33 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. You're seriously citing Wikipedia?
That's amusing. Wikipedia is a reliable source, but the American Bar Association isn't? Hilarious.

And unless you've gone to law school, you have absolutely no basis for claiming that the amount of work required isn't comparable. Also, I'm not comparing apples to oranges. The LLM is 2 years in addition to the 3 required for law school. While you can work on the LLM while still in law school, the number of credits required to complete both degrees will mean that you're in school for 5 years beyond the undergrad.

You clearly have no idea what you're talking about, as evidenced by your attempt to compare a Ph.D. with an M.D...speaking of apples and oranges.

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JuniperLea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 02:58 PM
Response to Reply #8
11. Where did you link to the ABA info?
Oh, wait, you didn't. Perhaps you should if you want your argument to fly.
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xocet Donating Member (699 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 02:58 PM
Response to Reply #5
10. ?
Isn't the doctoral degree for law the LL.D. and isn't the J.D. merely a professional degree?
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Phx_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 02:18 PM
Response to Original message
9. She made it sound like she has a doctorate degree and then some. ROLF.
Paging Dr. Bachman! Loser.
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