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gateley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-09-10 08:39 PM
Original message
I need math help.
Edited on Fri Jul-09-10 08:41 PM by gateley
My nephew was busted for a DUI. Minors (he's 20) can actually have a .02 and not get cited. Anyway, he told me he had a .1 and I thought that meant he 'passed' -- he said no, a .1, not a .01.

I can never "get" that stuff. Same as I can't tell which can of cat food has the higher amount of taurine :)

So can you explain it to me?

And -- an adult is cited at .08 -- is that less or more than .1?

This breaks my heart because he's such a good kid, but seriously, I hope he learns a lesson.

Thanks for any clarification.
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PatSeg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-10-10 12:04 PM
Response to Original message
1. I don't really understand
the DUI numbers, but .08 should be less than .1.
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gateley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-10-10 01:02 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Jim doesn't understand decimals either and I don't want to ask my brother because
we don't talk openly about things like this. :eyes:

But it's kind of coming back to me now, and I think you're right. I'm going to see if I can find a little remedial tutorial on the internets.

So I wonder if that means he was shit faced?

Wonder if I should be concerned (because his parents will feel he's 'learned his lesson' and not even think it might indicate a future problem).

Thanks! I swear this is the first time in all my years since school that I needed to know this stuff so it really WAS a waste of time! :7
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PatSeg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-10-10 01:17 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. It would be like
comparing 8 cents to 10 cents.

Yeah, sounds like he was "shit faced". Its hard to know whether you should be concerned. Most young guys are prone to getting in trouble driving in the early years, but hopefully a DUI will be a wake up call for him.
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gateley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-10-10 06:48 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. My brother was talking about some classes or tests "they" can take to get a
gentler 'sentence'. Apparently many of his friends have already gone through this. The ones with money had attorneys specializing in DUIs, and some had Public Defenders.

He's getting lots of input which is good, and what made me perk up my ears is that some evaluation as to whether the person was just drinking, or if that drinking might indicate a potential problem with alcohol. That's what's most important, I think. I'm hopeful he's learned his lesson and at least won't drive again, but that really doesn't help him if he's an alcoholic in the making.

My brother and sister-in-law said he's not taking his car back to school regardless of whether or not his license is restored. I like that, and it's not as though it'll be a hardship for him. They live in a house that used to be the university president's, right across the street from campus, and he has 4 roommates who all have cars, so... But II DO hope it inconveniences him a little. :7

He's a really good kid, really sweet. I hate the group he's hanging with because they lean Right. :scared: He's not a bigot though (to my knowledge), or at least he wasn't raised that way and my niece's first boyfriend was Black, but he was going to vote for McCain because he thought we should be at war to "help those people".

Anyway, the 8 - 10 cent comparison helps -- thanks!
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PatSeg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-12-10 05:05 PM
Response to Reply #5
8. Most young guys go through something like this
It is important that there are consequences that really affect their lives. Sounds like your brother and sister-in-law are handling this very well. Too many guys end up losing their licenses before they are 25 and it can be a huge setback for them.
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PatSeg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-12-10 05:07 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. P.S.
I also found that kids who don't get their driver's licenses until they are 17 or preferably 18, tend to be much more responsible, mature drivers. A year or two at that age can make a huge difference. Most kids are not mature enough to drive at sixteen, especially the guys.
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jillan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-10-10 04:17 PM
Response to Original message
4. Do not
ask me for math help :rofl:
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livvy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-12-10 06:09 AM
Response to Original message
6. See if this helps...
Imagine two pies, or two cakes. One is cut into 100 pieces, and the other cut into 10. .08 means 8/100 or eight pieces out of 100 pieces. .1 means 1/10 or one piece out of ten pieces. Obviously the pieces are much smaller in the first pie/cake, right, so even though you get 8 of the pieces, since they are so small, you get less than you would with only one of the bigger pieces.

Decimals are really fractions of a whole. .02 is 2/100, .1 is 1/10, .35 is 35/100 and so forth.

Another name for .1 would be .10 (10/100). If you are trying to compare .01 to .1, thinking of .1 as .10 makes it easier to see the difference. .01=1/100 .10=10/100

You can also think of the decimals as a part of a group. There are 100 cupcakes (although we know there is only one true cupcake). Anyway, your nephew ate 10 of the cupcakes (.1 = .10 = 10/100). To be under the limit, he should have eaten less than two of them (.02 = 2/100).

Hope this helps, and I also wish your nephew the best. A DUI is not fun, but he'll get through it. The most important thing for him to remember is not to repeat the mistake which will be hard for someone as young as him to do. It really doesn't take much to be over the limit. More than about a beer every hour or so will do it. He and his buds will need to agree to set up a designated driver routine. Not drinking one night out of every three or four outings sure beats a DUI.
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PatSeg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-12-10 05:03 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. I always taught my kids with money,
something they could identify with - 10 dimes make 1 dollar, 4 quarters (.25) make 1 dollar, etc. My daughter went to a Montessori school when she was young and they had some great learning materials for math. She's been a math whiz ever since.
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gateley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-12-10 10:07 PM
Response to Reply #6
11. Now why didn't they teach it like that when I was in school? That's a big help
livvy. Or maybe it's just because I like envisioning pies and cakes! Seriously, this really makes it easy to understand - thanks!

He's a good kid. The next day he and his girlfriend asked me if I'd take him to get is car. I said of course, but just curious, why wasn't Sophia just bringing him to it? He said "I can't drive, so she's going to drive it back". When I was his age, I'd have driven it anyway. I wasn't a good kid. :7

Thanks for your best wishes and for the education!! :hi:
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WheelWalker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-12-10 06:36 PM
Response to Original message
10. Not shit faced, probably. One sheet to the wind, so to speak, as opposed to three sheets.
The confusing thing is usually that we tend to equate .08 (eight hundredths)as representing 8 percent. Except in this case, we are talking eight hundredths of a percent - a much less amount. That's BAC (blood alcohol content). At a BAC of .08, your blood is .08 percent alcohol. Doesn't sound like much, but at that level a person is usually impaired in reaction time, motor skills, judgment, etc.).

The law for DUI in most states reflects the federal standard for impaired driving (to receive federal highway funds, states also have to meet federal speed laws on the interstates). That federal standard is .08 percent BAC. That's less than a tenth of a percent. Now, the .08 standard in the law generally means that if a person blows .08, they are presumptively impaired and driving under the influence. To convict, that would be all the prosecution would have to establish...that the person blew a .08 percent BAC or greater. However, it is a rebuttable presumption. In other words, the defense lawyer might be able to show that the machine wasn't calibrated correctly, or something like that. That being said, a person can also be impaired with a BAC of less than .08 percent. It is just usually a little harder for the prosecution to prove impairment, and they will rely on field sobriety tests, video cams, etc.

In most jurisdictions, for first time DUI offenders, there is a program called "diversion" where they plead guilty but the a judgment of conviction isn't entered at that time. They are "diverted" into an educational treatment program (or rehab if they have previously had an arrest for DUI but, say, that was 20 years ago. Those programs last from 12 weeks to 6 months, and are generally outpatient; after which the person has to have no alcohol offenses for 12 months and can have NO alcohol and drive). After that year, if they have successfully completed their diversion program and period, the case is dismissed and their prior guilty plea is of no effect. If they fail to complete diversion successfully, the guilty plea is entered and they have a DUI conviction.

For young adults the presumptive impairment level is often less than .08 percent BAC, in your example, it is .02 percent. That means to prove presumptive impairment the DA only has to have a breathalyzer result of .02 percent or higher. Society has less tolerance for teenagers who drink, as they have less judgment to impair to begin with, I suppose. In Oregon, a teenager can get a drivers license at 16, but the alcohol limit is zero. If they blow even a .01, they are presumptively impaired. Don't know if this helps any. Hope so. Blessings.
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gateley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-12-10 10:14 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. Interesting stuff -- thanks! I think the allowance of .02 is probably because
it's so low it could be considered a faulty reading?

I don't know what route he's going to take regarding this, getting a DUI attorney or just a public defender, but it sure wouldn't hurt for him to get some education about alcohol -- it wouldn't hurt anyone who drinks.

I'm assuming and hopeful that the options they offer especially young offenders are ones that will educate them to make better choices in the future. Blessings back at ya! :pals:

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