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The Israeli approach to airport security doesn't sound as bad as I thought.

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LLStarks Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-16-10 07:42 PM
Original message
The Israeli approach to airport security doesn't sound as bad as I thought.
http://www.thestar.com/news/world/article/744199---isra...

Unless there's a serious catch I'm missing, even a piecemeal adoption of Ben-Gurion's policies in US airports would be a huge step up.
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babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-16-10 07:44 PM
Response to Original message
1. I think it would be impossible to do in the US. I've
been through security in Israel; they question everyone 'at length', myself included, and I was no threat. People here, because there are so many, would miss flights. I don't know how feasible it would be just because of the size of the different populations.

Now I'll go browse the article, thanks.
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avaistheone1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-16-10 07:57 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. It sounds like your experience was an anomaly per this article
"First, it's fast there's almost no line. That's because they're not looking for liquids, they're not looking at your shoes. They're not looking for everything they look for in North America. They just look at you," said Sela. "Even today with the heightened security in North America, they will check your items to death. But they will never look at you, at how you behave. They will never look into your eyes ... and that's how you figure out the bad guys from the good guys."

That's the process six layers, four hard, two soft. The goal at Ben-Gurion is to move fliers from the parking lot to the airport lounge in a maximum of 25 minutes.





K&R


It appears that the Israeli system is based on astute observations, good listening skills and critical thinking on the part of their screeners. Seems we could do that here. Of the course the Terror Industrial Complex then can not spend hundreds of millions of dollars on useless equipment.
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riderinthestorm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-16-10 08:46 PM
Response to Reply #4
10. They do a LOT of racial profiling. Would anyone in the US agree to that? No way, imho. nt
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A HERETIC I AM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-16-10 08:46 PM
Response to Reply #4
11. "WHAP" (The sound of a nail being hit on the head)
Seems we could do that here. Of the course the Terror Industrial Complex then can not spend hundreds of millions of dollars on useless equipment.


BINGO! We've got fucking Bingo, here.

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sally cat Donating Member (544 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-16-10 09:37 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. That's a cool image.
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sally cat Donating Member (544 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-16-10 08:37 PM
Response to Reply #1
8. "I was no threat" And they found that out using their techniques. Their equivalent of TSA's STOP
personnel actually interact with passengers, versus the TSA's method of having the trained STOP folks merely observe from a distance.
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MattBaggins Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-10 12:11 PM
Response to Reply #8
17. Because muslims and others are used to having no rights in Israel
Profiling would go over in America like a lead ballon.
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sally cat Donating Member (544 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-10 12:15 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. The outrage over security theater makes me wonder if passengers would want to try the Israeli model.
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MattBaggins Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-10 12:18 PM
Response to Reply #18
21. White people would love that model. Others not so much.
Edited on Wed Nov-17-10 12:22 PM by MattBaggins
We need a third model it would seem.
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proteus_lives Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-10 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #17
20. Muslims have rights in Israel.
Try and keep up.
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MattBaggins Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-10 12:21 PM
Response to Reply #20
24. Yes your precious Israel was criticised.
Just as America has Driving while Black, Israel has Traveling while Muslim.
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proteus_lives Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-10 12:25 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. Ask any Israeli Muslim if they would rather live in Israel...
Or Jordan, or Syria, or Lebanon.

You would be surprised with the answer.
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MattBaggins Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-10 12:35 PM
Response to Reply #25
28. That's a rather silly request.
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sally cat Donating Member (544 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-10 02:02 PM
Response to Reply #25
32. Interesting point.
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bluestateguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-16-10 07:45 PM
Response to Original message
2. They do racial and ethno-religious profiling
If you are an Israeli Jew then yes I imagine its not so bad, but for anyone else it can be very invasive.

Arab Muslims, as you might imagine, get the full over from security people.
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-16-10 07:48 PM
Response to Original message
3. Mexico city has adopted most of this
Due to US requirements they do some of the theater, but El Al advised Mexico after 9.11.

Usual excuse takes too long... Well AICM handles the same traffic as JFK and it is damn efficient. Knowing security I much prefer to fly out of there than oh Lindberg Field.
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BlueCheese Donating Member (897 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-16-10 08:07 PM
Response to Original message
5. Interesting ideas.
Some of them are easy--bomb-proof rooms so you don't evacuate the entire terminal.

Others are harder. For example, the article says they have people question you benignly as you arrive, and stare into your eyes later on to see if you betray nervousness or other suspicious behavior. That would probably require a lot of training for a lot of people.
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Gin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-16-10 08:17 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. do they screen the cargo under the plane? we can be felt up...
profiled....stared at...whatever...but until cargo is checked
it really is theater.
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-16-10 08:18 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. They do
Edited on Tue Nov-16-10 08:19 PM by nadinbrzezinski
We mostly usevprefferred shippers status.

Oh and I forgot, cargo going onto an El Al plane is checked as well.
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sally cat Donating Member (544 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-16-10 08:40 PM
Response to Original message
9. One potential catch: would CAIR object to El Al advising the TSA?
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somone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-16-10 09:55 PM
Response to Original message
13. But that's so low-tech. We have HIGH-TECH machines
Chertoff's scanners, plus an army of genitalia inspectors
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sally cat Donating Member (544 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-10 11:10 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. Yet the Israelis don't do security theater. They're serious. And successful.
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DirkGently Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-10 11:45 AM
Response to Original message
15. Does sound effective. It's also likely they "profile" and, non-Israelis have a different experience.
I dont want to generalize too much from a single trip through Ben Gurion Airport, but Id have to say that my experience leaving Tel Aviv was far and away the most unpleasant encounter Id ever had with airport security officials in the decade. Moscow in 1998 was worse. As best I could tell, things went pretty smoothly as long as you were (a) Israeli, (b) traveling with an Israeli, or (c) traveling with some kind of well-established tour group. I think this may be how the majority of people go through the airport, which may account for its good reputation. But it took me approximately three hours to get from the initial passport check through to the food court. I was told that I couldnt take my iPad onto the plane, and therefore would have to check a whole bag that Id been planning to carry on so that the bag could contain the forbidden device, and the same thing happened to two of the guys I was traveling with. Each individual item from the bag I was allowed to carry on had to be separately wiped down for traces of explosive residue and several items had to be wiped multiple times.

I was groped a couple of times, yelled at by surly Russian immigrants, accused of lying because Id forgotten I had a second iPod charging cord in my bag, interrogated several times about who Id talked to, etc.

What is true is that except for the Russian immigrants, who do bring the unique Russian approach to customer service, everyone is exceedingly polite ...

http://yglesias.thinkprogress.org/2010/11/israeli-airpo... /

Still, I think the emphasis on intelligent examination, as opposed to ever-more-intrusive gadgets and processes, sounds like a smarter approach. I get the distinct impression that TSA relies on people taking their shoes off, etc., more than looking for suspicious behavior.

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MattBaggins Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-10 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #15
19. "everyone is exceedingly polite"
As long as you don't fit a certain "profile" of being Muslim or "Muslim Looking".
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DirkGently Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-10 12:20 PM
Response to Reply #19
22. Not sure of the author's ethnicity. He / she did say the Russian Israelis were "surly."
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MattBaggins Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-10 12:29 PM
Response to Reply #22
26. Should we have this method of Airport security imported from Israel?
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DirkGently Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-10 12:53 PM
Response to Reply #26
30. Wow. Does seem a wee extreme, doesn't it?
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jberryhill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-10 12:05 PM
Response to Original message
16. The security perimeter is not AT the airport




http://current.com/news/89376183_humiliation-and-child-...

Israeli officials have been regularly strip-searching children for decades, some of them American citizens.

While organizations that focus on Israel-Palestine have long been aware that Israeli border officials regularly strip search men and women, If Americans Knew appears to be the first organization that has specifically investigated the policy of strip searching women. In the course of its investigation, If Americans Knew was astonished to learn that Israeli officials have also been strip searching young girls as young as seven and below.

According to interviews with women in the United States, Israel, the West Bank and Gaza, Israeli border officials periodically force Christian and Muslim females of all ages to remove their clothing and submit to searches. In some cases the children are then "felt" by Israeli officials.

Sometimes mothers and children are strip-searched together, at other times little girls are taken from their parents and strip-searched alone. Women are required to remove sanitary napkins, sometimes with small daughters at their side. Sometimes women are strip searched in the presence of their young sons.
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Xithras Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-10 12:21 PM
Response to Original message
23. I would less problem with the TSA if they adopted Israels model.
Instead, they chose a methodology based on intrusiveness, delay, and personal violation.

Your security model can't be based on THINGS, because the bad guys are always coming up with NEW THINGS that your security guys aren't looking for. Aviation security should be based on analyzing PEOPLE, because they are the only constant in these crimes.
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DirkGently Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-10 01:26 PM
Response to Reply #23
31. Well said. E.g., the "Underwear bomber." Next comes the eyeball bomber and the body cavity bomber.

... and won't those new "scans" be fun?
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Subdivisions Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-10 12:34 PM
Response to Original message
27. Check out this video featuring the former head of security for El Al...
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rollin74 Donating Member (489 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-17-10 12:38 PM
Response to Original message
29. K & R
seems like a definite improvement over what we have in the U.S. these days
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