New Scientist: Most Common Climate Myths Reviewed

[nam78_two]

Lurking Freepers please try reading this. DUers-here is how to respond to climate change deniers:


http://environment.newscientist.com/channel/earth/dn11462


>>
Climate change: A guide for the perplexed
17:00 16 May 2007
NewScientist.com news service
Michael Le Page
Our planet's climate is anything but simple. All kinds of factors influence it, from massive events on the Sun to the growth of microscopic creatures in the oceans, and there are subtle interactions between many of these factors.

There is also a guide to assessing the evidence. In the articles we've included lots of links to primary research and major reports for those who want to follow through to the original sources.

• Human CO2 emissions are too tiny to matter

• We can't do anything about climate change

• The 'hockey stick' graph has been proven wrong

• Chaotic systems are not predictable

• We can't trust computer models of climate

• They predicted global cooling in the 1970s

• It's been far warmer in the past, what's the big deal?

• It's too cold where I live - warming will be great

• Global warming is down to the Sun, not humans

• It’s all down to cosmic rays

• CO2 isn't the most important greenhouse gas

• The lower atmosphere is cooling, not warming

• Antarctica is getting cooler, not warmer, disproving global warming

• The oceans are cooling

• The cooling after 1940 shows CO2 does not cause warming

• It was warmer during the Medieval period, with vineyards in England

• We are simply recovering from the Little Ice Age

• Warming will cause an ice age in Europe

• Ice cores show CO2 increases lag behind temperature rises, disproving the link to global warming

• Ice cores show CO2 rising as temperatures fell

• Mars and Pluto are warming too

• Many leading scientists question climate change

• It's all a conspiracy

• Hurricane Katrina was caused by global warming

• Higher CO2 levels will boost plant growth and food production

• Polar bear numbers are increasing

>>




Check it out.

[Deja Q]

1. Funny how only 1900 onward do the charts blossom

Before 1900 (thermometers) they've extrapolated from fossilized remains of things. Given how little the car, electric power, et cetera, was in use in the time - the first half of the 20th century I'd put in dispute.

The 1950s onward would suggest another story.

[muriel_volestrangler]

6. As the lower one says, the instrumental record dates back to 1859, not 1900

and in some areas (eg England), a couple of centuries before that.

[Warpy]

8. The industrial revolution was largely water powered

going into steam power fueled by first wood and then fossil fuels. 1900 seems to be right on schedule.

Coal was used for heating all along, but that doesn't seem to be sufficient to cause the warming.

Electrical generation and the internal combustion engine used for transportation seem to be the culprits, both of which came in around the turn of the last century.

[BushOut06]

2. Freepers are stupid people

You can give them all the facts in the world, they'll simply stare at you with that dumb look in their eyes, and keep repeating their same old talking points.

[nam78_two]

3. True that

Hopefully though, if a sufficient no. of people talk back it would have some effect. I was at a party one time where this one guy was making the pushing out the most outrageous nonsense and saying the most inaccurate rubbish and he had his 17 yo son with him, who looked as though he was capable of reason unlike his Freeper dad and I wished I had the courage to rebut the guy point by point. But the Freeper was very drunk and very feisty and I am fairly timid in real life and shrank away from taking this guy on :blush:. He seemed like the sort of person that might punch one or something of that sort.

[Warpy]

9. It's like some sort of perverted mantra, isn't it?

They remind me of true believer Catholics I used to know saying LOUD Hail Marys as they passed the dirty book store, some collection of verbiage that was supposed to protect them from the harm emanating from within.

I've given up telling the backwash anything. These are hard core believers who will need their faith in Stupid and Pox News buried in contrary experiences that the rest of us have prepared for.

[Iris]

14. And what's worse, they ENJOY being stupid!

I was listening to talk radio in Atlanta last Sunday in Atlanta and 2 idiots were on talking about global warning. They actually enjoyed being dumb asses. It was sickening.

[nam78_two]

15. Funny story on those lines

I was listening to this right wing radio speshull on global warming to see what they trot out and the host who seemed like a hugh series moran went on some rant about how when he was a kid, he went to parties where there would be a witch and they were using CO2 to create the "mist" coming out of her cauldron.

And then he said: "Now this stuff was rising out of the cauldron and falling straight on the ground. Now I would like these scientists to explain how they are expecting us to believe that this CO2 is rising up and going into the atmosphere. CO2 is heavy and it drops to the ground as far as I can tell."

:yoiks:.

He was completely serious and the guy with him agreed. I tried to find a link to it to post here but couldn't. The moran's name is Phil Valentine.

[Iris]

16. Yes! It's like some bizarre desire to adhere to "homespun wisdom" even when the

"spun" part has been clearly exposed!

[Jim__]

4. Thanks - I bookmarked that article for future reference = n/t

[nam78_two]

12. This blog is a fairly good resource too

http://blog.nodvin.net/?p=190

As well as:
http://www.realclimate.org

[Reterr]

5. k&r.eom

[Harper_is_Bush]

7. Great info, thanks. n/t

[nam78_two]

13. Dr.Nodwin's blog also has a lot of good stuff

http://blog.nodvin.net/?p=190

[YankeyMCC]

10. K & R

again ;)

[nam78_two]

11. Thanks

:)

[Matsubara]

17. The freepers' scoffing and skepticism is annoying, yes, but...

I also find many people on "our side" to be annoying as well.

I have had people tell me that

a. Sea levels WILL, as a certainty, rise by 20 meters in our lifetime. That is an extreme and unlikely hypothesis based on every single inch of ice on the planet melting completely. In the last 100 years, sea levels have risen by about 10 cm. A collapse of the Greenland ice shelf would be a problem for people in coastal areas, but I will pay any challenger $5000 if we see even 3 meters in my lifetime.


b. WITH CERTAINTY, we will have massive drought and starvation within the next ten years (of course we have already had massive starvation for the last 30 years in sub-saharan Africa, but I assume they mean in places that are being fed today. This may happen, and it may not, but why is it that panicmongers always make disaster a certainty when the scientists do not?


c. The one that gets me most is when people see a flood, tornado, hurrrican, whatever, and act as though floods, tornadoes, hurricanes, etc, are not normal. Disastrous storms are commonplace, and have always been commonplace, and as the number of people grows exponentially, so will the number killed or adversely affected by storms. Hurricanes are a good example. 100 years ago, not that many people lived on the Gulf Coast or lower Atlantic coast, but in the last 30 years, vacation homes and development have sprung up all along that hurricane-prone area, so hurricanes that might have damaged nothing but marsh 100 years ago are now taking out vast coastal developments. With more people, the odds of people being harmed is only going to rise.


That's not to say I'm a skeptic - I'm not. Warming is real and demonstrable, and it may very well lead to the scenarios we saw in "An Inconvenient Truth". We need to reduce our emissions of CO2. Even if there was no such thing as warming, it is irresponsible to waste resources and pollute in the way we do today. But the more lurid scare stories about warming that are based on speculation at best annoy me to no end. There are so many factors that come into play, who knows what we've failed to consider at this point. After all, a few years ago, nobody had ever heard of "global dimming", but now it seems likely that it has kept a lid on warming for us in the past, but will do so less in the future.


Regardless of what we do, the human race has been on this planet for only a millisecond of its overall existence. If we last another 10,000 years as a species, it will be a miracle. It's sad, but as individuals, we die, and eventually, our species will die out too, or evolve into something unrecognizeable. None of our airs of intelligence or civilization exempt us from these laws of nature. Even if our species did learn to survive in harmony with the earth, it's still highly likely it would be killed by the the sun's death before it could ever travel the incomprehensible distance to the next closest habitable planet. Our desire to somehow perpetuate this species into eternity is unrealistic and symptomatic of our insane desire as individuals to live forever, even though we are all destined to turn to dust.

And whenever the human race does finally kick it, the Earth will cleanse itself and return to equilibrium, with biodiversity flourishing again. It may take a million years, but it will happen, and to the old haggard Earth, it will seem like no time. Our silly self-importance never ceases to amaze me.

[Lisa]

22. I think my favorite was the student in my second-year geography class

... who was solemnly telling everyone that the increase in CO2 would suffocate pets and babies, "just like when you leave the car engine running". She meant well, but I had to take her aside and explain the difference between CO and CO2, and the types of concentrations of the latter that would be required (as in the Lake Nyos example in Africa) to cause health problems. I was relieved that she seemed to have gotten everything straightened out, by the time I marked her final exam in the course.

[nam78_two]

23. Yikes

Glad you put her straight.

[johnaries]

18. Thanks! Bookmarking.

I have some friends at work who use many of these myths as arguments. Although I have sent them many links before, it will be nice to have all of this in one place.

[calimary]

19. Me, too. The more ammo with which we can arm ourselves, the better.

After all, there are lots of Flat-Earth Society members (and frankly, that's how we should be referring to them, because they badly need to be discredited) still out there. At least three of them are running for president on the GOP ticket.

[nam78_two]

20. Thanks for kicking

:hi:

[Lisa]

21. useful link, thanks for posting! (n/t)

[Shoelace]

24. very useful for other science forums where the deniers hang out

in what appears to be huge numbers. Can't imagine how they sleep at night, lying through their teeth but they do get paid to astroturf from what I've found. Another useful website to clear up the brain fog of these freepers is:

http://www.desmogblog.com/