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gscraig Donating Member (11 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-23-10 10:47 PM
Original message
How tolerant do we need to be of othersí beliefs?
So Iím new to the site, but I have a request to make. In my graduate studies, I am studying how people evaluate others who disagree with them about beliefs. I came here because one of our expectations is that people at different ends of the political spectrum may have different takes on the issue. Itís online, and it would be great if youíd take part. It takes about 10 minutes and youíll get some feedback on your responses at the end.


the study
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Ozymanithrax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-23-10 11:13 PM
Response to Original message
1. Interesting study...
Your responses indicate that you think that beliefs are a matter of personal concern, and that each person ought to be able to believe whatever they want. You may think that one set of beliefs is not necessarily better than any other. You are more accepting of differing beliefs than most respondents.

As to the doctor part. A doctor that did not believe in scientific method or evolution would not be acceptable.

Nobody should be ridiculed for their beliefs. Disagreeing about beliefs isn't ridicule.
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Igel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 11:10 AM
Response to Reply #1
43. Nah.
My endocrinologist, when presented with data that doesn't comport with published research or what she teaches simply says the data have to be wrong and moves on. No attempt to find the problem, even though if the data are accurate then there's likely to be a rather serious problem with my health.

At the same time, I really don't care if she believes in evolution. I'm not evolving, and creationists I've known--even at the PhD level in biology--come to the same kinds of decisions and conclusions on pretty much everything that evolutionists have. Whether it's the results of a cladistic analysis of genetic variation, dealing with the distribution of variation and features, or numerous other things. It was important in making some hypotheses, but they actually accepted evolution as a working hypothesis even if they considered it fundamentally flawed.

My roommate once told me that the theory of biological evolution was crucial in all sciences. His brother, in a PhD biology program and an evolutionist, disagreed, and basically said I what I wrote in the previous paragraph. My roommate was displeased with his brother, turned to me for support, and I asked him how it was crucial for the science he was studying--he was in graduate program in astrophysics--and he just scowled, got up and left. (Yes, I've known creationists who would chuck stellar evolution and cosmogony, but I've known far more that simply carved out a special little niche for biology on Earth.)
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XOKCowboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-23-10 11:13 PM
Response to Original message
2. I tolerate all beliefs until they start proselytizing
Then I walk away. I treat all people the same. Period.
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Zoeisright Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 01:30 AM
Response to Reply #2
33. Exactly. I don't really care what people believe or don't believe. But when they
try to force those beliefs on others, either through proselytizing or through trying to enact laws based on theology, I am not tolerant at all. At that point I tell them to STFU.
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virginia mountainman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-23-10 11:14 PM
Response to Original message
3. hmmm, Evidently I am pretty tolerant..
Your responses indicate that you think that beliefs that one person holds are only occasionally a matter of concern for others. Though people should mostly be allowed to believe whatever they want, there are times when one belief is actually better than others.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In all honesty, I really don't care what anyone believes, it is when they ACT on their "wrong headed beliefs", that the problems arise.
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caledesi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-23-10 11:23 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. agree. nt
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Liquorice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-23-10 11:58 PM
Response to Reply #3
17. That was my result too. nt
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 01:22 AM
Response to Reply #3
29. I got the same! eom
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frazzled Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-23-10 11:14 PM
Response to Original message
4. What is a "factual belief"?
I realize it's a term used (arcanely) in philosophy, but I think people here would have a lot of problems with it. In the general population, there are facts (provable) and beliefs (not). One may believe something to be the case--that is, believe something to be a fact (that the capital of Slovenia is Wichita). That is (technically) a "factual belief", but it is not factual.

Most people here are going to tell you that if someone believes global warming does not exist, their belief is not "factual."

My suggestion is that you define your terms and rewrite the question.
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Posteritatis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-23-10 11:15 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. I was parsing it as "something I 'know' to be true." (nt)
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Zhade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 01:26 AM
Response to Reply #5
32. That's a flawed definition, though.
A religious believer can "know" that their god exists, but lacking any verifiable evidence to support that "knowledge", they don't actually know.

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Posteritatis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 02:12 AM
Response to Reply #32
40. That's why I put "know" in quotes. (nt)
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Rhiannon12866 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-23-10 11:17 PM
Response to Original message
6. K&R. Done and welcome to DU.
This was pretty interesting... :hi:
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Posteritatis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-23-10 11:22 PM
Response to Original message
7. I cracked up at the food one.
Why yes, I imagine new evidence could change one of the characters' views on that one!
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Quantess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-23-10 11:27 PM
Response to Original message
9. What do you mean by "even number of stars in the Milky Way"?
Edited on Thu Sep-23-10 11:38 PM by Quantess
Even / odd? Or some other reference to "even"?
Some reference would be helpful.

Does the other guy believe there are an odd number of stars, or what? You could change the wording to clarify.

Because, if somebody was such an oddball as to be obsessed about whether the number of stars in the Milky Way was an even or an odd number... then I think s/he needs mental health counseling.

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Sapphocrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 12:44 AM
Response to Reply #9
22. LOL @ your last sentence -- that was my thought, too. n/t
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 01:18 AM
Response to Reply #9
27. Mr. Monk wrote that scenario
:rofl:
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FedUpWithIt All Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-23-10 11:29 PM
Response to Original message
10. Done.
Welcome to DU

:hi:
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Warpy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-23-10 11:41 PM
Response to Original message
11. Yeah, about what I expected
"Your responses indicate that you think that beliefs that one person holds are only occasionally a matter of concern for others. Though people should mostly be allowed to believe whatever they want, there are times when one belief is actually better than others."

In other words, good people can believe a whole lot of stuff I think is really, really stupid, but that's their problem. I'm usually not rude enough to giggle at them unless they're ranting stuff off their AM radios.
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hlthe2b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-23-10 11:47 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. You and I came back the same...
Tolerant and believe most of these issues really don't matter. I do expect a physician to be trained and accepting of scientific method and evolution, but otherwise, I can't say I really care what others believe as long as they don't force it on others.
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Warpy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-23-10 11:52 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. Well, I wanted the real idiots out of medicine, government and teaching
but most of the beliefs were harmless enough that it really didn't make a difference.
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blondeatlast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 12:39 AM
Response to Reply #15
20. My response was virtually the same. nt
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handmade34 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-23-10 11:45 PM
Response to Original message
12. done
I guess I'm pretty tolerant of others beliefs
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gateley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-23-10 11:50 PM
Response to Original message
14. That was interesting. Welcome to DU!
:hi:
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salvorhardin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-23-10 11:53 PM
Response to Original message
16. Doesn't your Story Background section bias the responses?
All of the people in these stories are well educated adult Americans, who went to good colleges and work at professional jobs.


People tend to judge other socioeconomic classes differently from their own. By specifying well-educated adult professionals, you might be biasing your respondents to think more or less favorably of the people portrayed in the stories than they would independent of the information presented in the stories.
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Sapphocrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 12:41 AM
Response to Reply #16
21. Good point.
Although any benefit of the doubt I gave the Story Background flew right out the window when I got to Mister "I Don't Believe A Person Needs Food to Survive," who wouldn't have lived long enough to get through college. LOL

Kinda interesting, 'though.

To the OP: Is there a reason the "close personal friend" question was duplicated in every single scenario? I could see it as a sort of "check" if it were worded differently, and buried under more questions.

Sorry, I'm such a critic.

Oh, and I got:

"Your responses indicate that you think that beliefs are often a matter of concern for others. People really ought to believe certain things and not others, especially on some topics."

Not true; I answered (quite honestly) that I "strongly agree" everyone should be able to believe whatever they want about absolutely anything, from dogs-v-cats to slavery. I just wouldn't want a slavery advocate running my country or teaching his beliefs in school. Ditto something as relatively innocuous as not believing in Mozart (which makes me wonder how good a college education that guy got) -- believe whatever you want, but don't let such an idiot anywhere near a classroom.

So, it's dead wrong that I "think that beliefs are often a matter of concern for others." I just don't want to associate with anyone, say, completely close-minded to evolution (which would indicate to me that s/he's an "intelligent design" young-earther) -- and I certainly wouldn't want such a person teaching such things in school. Ditto the embryo question; I don't care what anyone thinks, but heaven forbid a teacher be allowed to state embryo "rights" as fact.

So, big difference between that and anyone's beliefs being "a matter of concern for others." They become "a matter of concern" only when they're forced on me -- or on children who haven't developed a full sense of discrimination between logic and lunacy).

As for "People really ought to believe certain things and not others, especially on some topics" -- uh, yeah, when it comes to issues like slavery, and yep, I believe anyone who would believe slavery is a good thing needs to be convinced otherwise (and that his belief may one day make him do things with very bad consequences).
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Quantess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 12:53 AM
Response to Reply #21
23. That was just a funny questionnaire, overall.
Edited on Fri Sep-24-10 12:54 AM by Quantess
I'm so glad I took the quiz before giving it a Rec, because I don't think it deserves a recommendation, honestly. I went to Marquette University in WI, and I created a questionnaire as part of my Masters level Evaluation and Research class. I got an A, but... this one needs work.
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Quantess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 01:12 AM
Response to Reply #21
25. I got the same score:
Edited on Fri Sep-24-10 01:13 AM by Quantess
Your responses indicate that you think that beliefs are often a matter of concern for others. People really ought to believe certain things and not others, especially on some topics.

Good grief, if those are the canned answers, that's a pretty lame scientific study!
Does this mean that taking a Cospomopolitan Quiz about how slutty you are in comparison to your girlfriends is about as definitive as this poll?

Edited to remove smilie
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 02:14 AM
Response to Reply #21
41. I think I voted against all of them being taught in school
not that it matters, but I really don't want somebody teaching that the Milky Way has an even number of stars in it or that cats make better pets than dogs. I was judged as "more tolerant than most". I sorta tolerated them all, except the slavery one, and even there I voted against shame and ridicule, because I don't think those are effective strategies at getting people to change their minds. Plus, I figure that people cannot help what they are taught.
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salvorhardin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 02:25 AM
Response to Reply #21
42. Believe it or not, I know someone who is a Breatharian
She doesn't think she needs to eat in order to live. Of course, she believes a great many things such as that she's a 1,500 year old alien princess with superpowers sent to Earth to prepare us to join the galactic union.

Now, you might think her insane, but she's very well educated and is pursuing a PhD in one of the hard sciences. She's a perfectly normal, lovely young woman with no problem functioning in her day to day life and good social skills... who just happens to have a good many beliefs that totally contradict reality.

I honestly don't know how she reconciles her field of study with her extraordinary beliefs.
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jobycom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 12:13 AM
Response to Original message
18. Fascinating questions. Good luck with it. nt
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ibegurpard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 12:28 AM
Response to Original message
19. depends on the belief
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 12:54 AM
Response to Original message
24. darn ..it is hanging up on me!! I keep trying to do the reponses but it won't work!
I tried..
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 01:20 AM
Response to Reply #24
28. ok i finally got it to work! interesting!
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 01:17 AM
Response to Original message
26. that was interesting
Thank you for participating!

Your responses indicate that you think that beliefs that one person holds are only occasionally a matter of concern for others. Though people should mostly be allowed to believe whatever they want, there are times when one belief is actually better than others.

This study is not meant to judge one approach to beliefs as better than others, and this study is not a diagnostic test. Rather, we are simply trying to identify the range that people express for how important it is that people hold the right beliefs. We expect to find a great range for attitudes towards beliefs between different people, different groups, and different cultures.
For more information on beliefs and moral psychology, please look at the following pages:
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struggle4progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 01:24 AM
Response to Original message
30. I was shocked and horrified by your propaganda about the Milky Way!
I really do hope it does not mislead too many innocent people! :D
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Zhade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 01:24 AM
Response to Original message
31. Of the beliefs themselves? There is no such requirement.
Edited on Fri Sep-24-10 01:24 AM by Zhade
Now, we are expected in civil society to tolerate and respect their RIGHT to hold whatever beliefs they wish. But there is no concurrent expectation (or at least, logically there shouldn't be) to tolerate any belief, period.

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Contrary1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 01:38 AM
Response to Original message
34. Interesting...
Edited on Fri Sep-24-10 01:41 AM by Contrary1
"Your responses indicate that you think that beliefs are a matter of personal concern, and that each person ought to be able to believe whatever they want. You may think that one set of beliefs is not necessarily better than any other. You are more accepting of differing beliefs than most respondents."

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lovemydog Donating Member (414 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 01:57 AM
Response to Original message
35. Welcome to DU
That was interesting.

The result for me is: 'Your responses indicate that you think that beliefs that one person holds are only occasionally a matter of concern for others. Though people should mostly be allowed to believe whatever they want, there are times when one belief is actually better than others.'

Good luck in your studies. I'd love to hear the results and anything else you can share about the study.

I'd also love to know how right wing folks generally fare.
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cherokeeprogressive Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 02:00 AM
Response to Original message
36. AS TOLERANT AS WE WOULD WANT OTHERS TO BE OF OURS. Nuff said? n/t
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 02:03 AM
Response to Original message
37. Maybe there should be one more question in the survey.
Tammy believes that people should be tolerant of other people's beliefs.

Sue believes that is absolutely wrong ...
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DFLforever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 02:08 AM
Response to Original message
38. This fits me well:
"Your responses indicate that you think that beliefs that one person holds are only occasionally a matter of concern for others. Though people should mostly be allowed to believe whatever they want, there are times when one belief is actually better than others."

Interesting project. Thanks for putting it on DU. I would be interested in seeing your total results when complete.

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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-24-10 02:10 AM
Response to Original message
39. Hi there, gscraig. It keeps timing out.
Maybe you're just getting a lot of responses right now?
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