Honestly, as an African-American. . . .

[daligirl519]

I am very encouraged to see the boil of racism finally erupt, Mount Krakatoa-like, in this country. I think that it will eventually result in some healing down the road. I hate it when people talk about this being a post-racist society. Racism simply went underground after the Civil Rights Movement. I am not saying that there were not lots of gains for blacks since the Civil Rights Act, but there were a lot of things left to fester deep down. We are seeing that deep infection oozing its way out right now.

[sandnsea]

1. Somebody unrecommended this

:wow:

I agree with you completely. I'm disappointed in the ugliness of the racism that is "oozing its way out", but not completely surprised.

[CatWoman]

17. well

I rec'd to counteract it.

[daligirl519]

24. Thanks! I will post some pics of my kitties as well! /eom

[DesertFlower]

30. so did i.

:toast:

[ZombieHorde]

36. Sometimes unrecs and recs happen on accident.

I know I have accidentally recommended or unrecommended threads before, but not this one.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

51. And the unrec is proof that racism is alive and well right here on DU. n/t

[Enthusiast]

149. It is. nt

[awoke_in_2003]

121. believe it or not...

the world is full of assholes, and some of them post here. Stop getting twisted up about unrecs- they usually get buried and no one notices (unless someone complains about it)

[rury]

134. I recced it to cancel out the senseless unrec

K&R for speaking the truth!!

[Number23]

153. There were 20 unrecs actually. I don't understand what was said in this OP that warranted ONE unrec

let alone 20.

[nadinbrzezinski]

2. NOt only do I fully agree with you

but the history goes back a long way.

Now in order to address it, one of the things I've learned in full detail in the recent past, is just how much more in common whites and blacks actually have. Yes, that includes the scourge of slavery, even if we use a nicer term for white slavery (which was not permanent, but African slavery wasn't either in the beginning, and that is indentured labor.)

If we went back to the future as it were, we'd find just how much more in common people have, and that includes a slave rebellion or two, and the underground railroad.

And as an Immigrant, I am happy with you that it is exploding in all it's glory. But first it needs to explode, and ooze and go off spectacularly.

[daligirl519]

5. In the words of my great-great aunt (now 96)

on the the election of Obama, "These folks is goin' to clown."

[Raschel]

94. I dedicate this thread to all of the 'firsts'.

The first to walk into an all-White school, the first to sit at a Whites only soda fountain, the first to sit in front of the bus, the first to be elected President of the United States.

Your auntie has been alive a long time, and knows that all of these events were met with resistance, protest, and hatred.

As someone else put it, President Obama was handed the Titanic wheel after it hit the iceberg. In addition he has weightiness of being elected the first Black President.

He knew exactly what he would have to deal with being the first, and I admire his dignity, steadfastness, courage, and thoughtfulness.

[Karenina]

108. Thank you. We call it , "the bleeding edge."

[Butch350]

131. President Obama was handed the Titanic wheel after it hit the iceberg.

I love that sentence!

[goclark]

144. Think it was Van Jones that talked about that ~

There is a link at DU do an excellent interview with Van Jones.

[Frank Booth]

3. I understand what you're saying, but the current economic plight and the other massive

problems we're having don't seem conducive to eventual healing.

Sometimes I wonder if there can ever be true equality or compatibility in a country built on the blood of so many.

[defendandprotect]

95. "if there can ever be true equality or compatibility in a country built on the blood of so many"...

I think many of us wonder about that along with you --

Unfortunately, we're still in that same gene pool!!

And racism is really only another avenue for exploitation by elites --

based on another myth of inferiority -- as taught by elites!



:)

[Triana]

4. the media is a problem also - one everyone is ignoring

and it has been a major issue for years.

Not that I disagree at all with what you said - I fully agree. Racism didn't go away. Neither did sexism. It just moved underground & became more 'subtle' for a while. But now, they don't much even bother with the 'subtle' anymore.

I just wish people would realize the media's role in this and that this is the way the lame$tream media operates, largely - ALL of them, not just Faux Noose. How much does Fox pay Breitbart for his 'work'? I've known them to pay hundreds of thousands for 'dirt' on people - just like that - and that was 10-15 years ago. And it wasn't Fox. This is a HUGE media issue that has been uncovered - but it certainly isn't new.

A wiser government that wasn't owned by the same corporations that own the media would use this as an opportunity to enact media ethics laws. But, they wont. . . . and people who rely on the media for their news and believe all they see, read and hear -- well read my sigline.

All the media has become tabloid. There is no longer tabloid media and then separately, news media. They've all become one in the name of "infotainment", which is mostly MIS-info-assassination - just like we witnessed in the past 2-3 days and previously - whole list of names. I've seen tabloid stories virtually copied and pasted onto CNN in a matter of 24 hours or less. It's crap, the majority of it. This time, one of them got caught. But all the while, the other lame$tream media networks, magazines, papers and websites are doing the same and continued to do the same the very next day. Guaranteed. They'll do or pay damn near anything for a story - whatever gets the ratings, headlines, and the MONEY for them. Doesn't have to be true, just has to get those ratings and sales. If it destroys someone's life or career. Pfft. They don't care because they're making tons of profit off of it. And they operate this way with complete impunity and they have for decades now.

WHO is gonna stop 'em? Nobody. Then there's Rachel's question again: Who's next?

[daligirl519]

8. I hear ya. . .

It is frustating, but I feel that there is a breaking point. It will come. History illustrates this to us.

[bobbolink]

83. Classism never went away, either. The difference is, we don't have many advocates.

[JDPriestly]

124. And, believe me, ageism is also alive and well and being used

for political advantage by the same folks who use racism, sexism and anti-gay propaganda to scare ignorant people and get their votes.

[Enthusiast]

147. I agree. Our differences are

being exploited like never before. We knew it was true but now it's in our face.

[Jackpine Radical]

6. My impression is that younger generations are much less racist

than the old farts. I'm 65, and I don't recall a time in my life when overt racism was presented to me as OK, but I know that a lot of people in my generation harbor some thoroughly screwed-up attitudes and values. The kids--by which I guess I mean people under 40--seem much less loaded down with this destructive shit.

[HowHasItComeToThis]

13. BINGO

[misanthrope]

18. I hear plenty of racism expressed by those under 40...

...In some families it is a legacy.

[Lilyeye]

25. Same here and I am 23. Kids just learn it from their disgusting parents

[Hepburn]

49. I am 62...and I hear you.

Thankfully, those younger than us seem to be much better at accepting people as people and not looking at heritage and/or skin color. Things have improved, but there is a lot of room for improvement.

[oldhippydude]

155. agreed

I'm your age also..im betting i haven't heard the n word in a couple of decades now..likewise the ethnic jokes.. but its just under the surface..

[WCGreen]

7. But some of my best friends are negroes....

Remember that hoary old comment from the 60's and 70's.

I grew up in a bigoted household. It took me years to get rid of all that.

And I'm still not sure it is all gone. But I do know that when I was the Treasurer of the Democratic Party here in Cleveland, I loved going to places most white suburban members of the party would never go. It gave me an opportunity to go to churches that I would never have gone to on my own, meetings where I was the minority, many times the only white guy in the room.

But I did it and I am better for it.

[daligirl519]

11. LOL. . .

Most of my friends are white. I am very tolerant and patient with them. Can I be your best friend? /snark/ Let's get together and have dinner.;)

[WCGreen]

19. The first day I showed up to work as a page in the Ohio House...

I went up to the first black guy that was introduced to me and asked him to be part of my liberal college experience. He laughed out loud and then said but I'm a republican and I quickly retorted Two minorities at once...

We became fast friends.

[DesertFlower]

31. i'm thankful that i was not raised by

bigoted parents. i never heard anyone in the family (aunts, uncles, cousins) ever talk against minorities.

[midnight]

9. K&R. When W was finishing his first term, Milwaukee had about

40 % unemployment for the black population. And the state had just ended three terms of a Republican Gov. and Republican legislature. There is so much work to be done in terms of creating trust/jobs for those left out of generations of recovery.

[Dyedinthewoolliberal]

10. I agree

and wish to add that racism is learned behavior and is used to divide us. The real issue is 'haves' vs 'have-nots'. Most ALL of us are 'have-nots'. What better way to keep us distracted than to encourage people to believe skin color/religion/country of birth are things to be afraid of?
:shrug:

[Cresent City Kid]

20. The economic aspect is piled on top of racism

I'm not saying you're wrong, but it seems to me there's more racism than just the kind that is deliberately stoked to divide us, though surely that exists. The issue of the haves and have-nots is key, as you suggest. From the outside looking in, it appears to me that African Americans get hit from both sides if they are poor. I hope I'm making sense here. None of this bad shit is mutually exclusive, in fact it's all happening simultaneously.

[bobbolink]

85. Thank you! Nobody here (I sincerely hope!) is going to deny racism is alive and well,

and how destructive it is, but the class divide is deeper and more invisible, which makes it more insideous.

Going by the reaction from most "progressives", not only is the class divide not going to be addressed, the resistance is HUGE.

We poor folks know we are on our own.

So, therefore, don't continue to expect our support for *your* causes.

[Booster]

12. As a white person, I'm glad it's coming to a boil also. Some

white people ALWAYS take it just a little too far and totally embarrass the rest of us and that is a good thing. I still hang on to the belief that most people, deep inside, are good and when they see something happen like what happened to someone like Ms. Sherrod, they say to themselves "ok, that's enough" and we start banding together again. I just wish this Administration and Congress would take the bull by the horns and bring back a revised form (because of the internet) of the Fairness Doctrine. In the old days people on radio and TV couldn't say just anything they wanted (read blatant lies) unless they could back it up with facts. Now there's no difference between news and entertainment - both deal in fictional stories, and that's just wrong. People like Rush, Hannity & Beck aren't going to be happy until someone kills someone else because they suggested that person should be killed. That makes our country a dangerous place to live in and it's just wrong.

[daligirl519]

14. I'm glad to get a positive response to my post. . . .

I wasn't sure what to expect.

[Booster]

16. It was a good post. I forgot to say welcome to DU.

:hug:

[daligirl519]

23. Thank you! /eom

[Karenina]

54. Another welcome! You've jumped in with both feet and more power to you!

:bounce::bounce::bounce: This board probably has less than 5% AA participation as over the years MANY thoughtful, passionate, engaged, educated, "articulate" AAs have been driven out AS HAVE Europeans, Middle Easterners and other various and sundry "furriners." I'm happy to see a fresh face here because ich kann einfach nicht mehr.

I'm an o'lady who integrated the school in my area at 7. My parents both had advanced degrees and were active community members. My family is multiculti to the max. We count among our number many firsts, onlys, and I consider myself "privileged" and am grateful I "chose" the "right parents." My world view, exponentially expanded by globe-trotting, has cemented a deep understanding of the "lucky sperm club."

Before I say anything more publicly, I would encourage you to watch this. It will help you navigate these waters.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b0Ti-gkJiXc&feature=PlayList&p=D8D73FDF91E1001A&playnext=1&index=17

[unapatriciated]

117. I agree it's a good post and we need real dialog so we can start the healing.

Bo is also correct we need to address poverty and the huge divide that exist between the haves and the have nots..

[cynatnite]

15. My grandmother is 87 years old and grew up in North Carolina...

Before Obama was elected, she swore that if he's elected all the blacks were going to take over. It was as if every fear she had been taught as a child just erupted. I honestly didn't know what to say. I love her, but it disturbed me so much that I decided to never say anything. She had never spoken like that before.

You are absolutely right.

[NOLALady]

110. I have often wondered

what was the fear of "blacks taking over". Southern whites have lived with and near blacks long enough to know that have nothing to fear.

We've been driven over the cliff. How could they believe a black person could make matters worse?

I've always suspected when I hear the "blacks taking over fear" is they are really afraid that blacks may start acting more like the white folk who are racist.

[Edweird]

21. I find people's naive shock at the imagined 'de-evolution' perversely amusing.

People are still the same. The dreamers, for whatever reason, managed to avoid being confronted with it so they called it dead.

Your analogy if fitting - we are seeing the symptoms not the the actual infection.

[Matariki]

22. I gotta admit being amused seeing Fox News lady's clutch their pearls

in indignation over racism toward caucasians. That was a real laugh. I'm sure each one of them has really suffered the effects of that :eyes:

Seriously, I look forward to a time when ethnicity doesn't matter, or rather is treated like any another interesting fact about a person. I really hope that happens in my lifetime.

thanks for your post. part of the problem, I think, is that a lot of people aren't comfortable with the topic and so it gets buried and festers, as you said.

[Number23]

26. Beautifully said

I am very encouraged to see the boil of racism finally erupt, Mount Krakatoa-like, in this country.

You have a nice way with words. :) And I completely agree. It took the election of a black President and the non-stop Grade A foolishness that's been flung around this country ever since before alot of people realized that racism had not in any way shape or form "gone away." It simply hid itself in such a way that when black and brown people noted it, alot of people could pretend that they were simply being too "sensitive" or wanted "political correctness."

If anyone still thinks that racism is dead after all of the idiocy we've seen over the last 19 months, they are truly blind.

[akbacchus_BC]

27. Wonderful observation, thank you. The KKK in full force since

President Obama got elected!

It's shame but it is their shame, not ours!

[akbacchus_BC]

28. I rec to counter that unrec

[Skip Intro]

29. Do you believe racism is only from whites, toward blacks?

Being honest, I think there is a two-way street there. Present day. And I find it hard to call either of them right or wrong. That's a bad thing to say, isn't it?

What I mean is, there are some blacks who hate whites for being white, aren't there? As well as some whites who hate blacks for being black.

Is that not true?

I think it is, I live in SC and come into contact with both races on a regular basis, and have seen the "superiority" thing from both. So I ask.

I've done something wrong here, haven't I?

[EFerrari]

33. You seem to be agreeing with Breitbart that "they both do it".

That is the Breitbart position. What do you think?

[Skip Intro]

34. Yes, yes. Label me and ignore my comment.

Why talk about reality when we can go around and around this tree?

Maybe I'm asking too much...

[Mr. Mustard]

45. I will address your comment

I was born and lived in Atlanta, GA until I was 41 years old. I now live in Oregon.

The direct answer to your question is "yes". I have encountered African Americans who are racists.

However, that does not negate nor excuse racism of any kind.

Futhermore, white people enslaved African Americans, then segregation and Jim Crow. They (we) have also had all privileges, and advantages and still go beserk when a minority receives a break.

Look at the tea party right now. If they were African American, they would be in jail.

So the fact that there are African American racists means nothing and changes nothing.

The very mention that a minority might have privilige causes the white racists to organize and threaten to kill people. Imagine living with that. You can't because it does not exist in your world, and no one in your family was enslaved, or lynched or denied access to opportunities, or shunned or had people running around in sheets to initimidate you.

I have an Aunt who is a "Democrat" until 2009, now suddenly she just "does not like Obama", "can't put her finger on it".

Imagine living with that every single day. Hell let a white person live without a television and they are ready for revolution.

[Honeycombe8]

55. Wow. Sorta right, but sorta distorted view, IMO.

I agree that yes, there are racists within every race against other races. Every race.

Can anyone NOT think of a Jewish, "oriental," black, white, Native American, or whatever, joke that is stereotypical?

But to say that "whites" alone enslaved blacks is not quite correct, factually. It's true, as far as I know, that the whites in America owned slaves. But it was black countrymen and black leaders in Africa who played a major part in kidnapping and selling their countrymen as slaves to whoever wanted to buy them. So both races participated in that abomination. And let's not forget that not ALL whites in America owned slaves or agreed with the concept, and many worked against it. Then, of course, we had a war in part over it. A war waged by whites against whites. Before the war, many whites participated in helping free slaves in an underground network. As did many Af. Americans.

The segregation in our country afterwards was also an abomination. Whites were totally responsible for that. Not all whites, but who knows how many.

I think it's fair to remind people that when they lump all whites together as "evil," that is racism, as well. That is the essence of racism. Blaming an entire race for the behavior or characteristics of some.

As far as whites enjoying all the privileges, while Af. Americans did not, in years past, I think you are looking at history through your white male glasses. Women did not enjoy all the privileges. In fact, conditions did not improve much for female Af. Americans after they were freed. As women, they could not vote, own property, inherit property, get publicly educated past a certain level (except for the very wealthy...I think there may have been one higher level school for rich girls), get a good job, get paid decent wages, etc., etc. All the "privileges" you were speaking of: they didn't exist for anyone except the white male. (Of course, married women fared better, if they were lucky enough to be married to a man who didn't beat her. Once married, she could not get divorced, although her husband could divorce her. No alimony in the old days.) Women could be legally beaten or killed. Wives had no legal recourse for physical or sexual abuse. I'm not saying that Af. Am. women were not better off in being free. We are all better off having freedom. Slavery is evil, no doubt about it. But for the women, they (white women, too, but particularly black women) didn't see their circumstances improve much. If married, they were pretty much owned by their husbands. (But not as bad as Afghanistan is now.)

Lincoln in a way foresaw the racial problems coming. He wrote that after slavery ended, he thought the Africans should be sent back to Africa...not because he didn't want them here. But he thought that the resentment between the two races would be so bad, that it would be unworkable, and probably best to avoid the conflict. That's what I recall reading, anyway.

I don't know why you think Tea Partiers would have been arrested if they were Af. Americans. Any Tea Partier would be arrested if s/he broke the law. If not, s/he wouldn't be arrested. I disagree that race would be a factor in that. (Don't get me wrong...the Tea Partiers are wacky, hateful people. And I DO think they hate minorities. But I don't think they'd be arrested if they were black, unless they broke the law.)

As a white woman, I personally have experienced discrimination because of my gender and race. It doesn't equate to what I would have experienced if I were black. But still, I've experienced it. I know how it feels. So don't blame me, as a white person, for things I haven't done. It would be racism to blame me for something, just because of my race.

[hay rick]

62. What if the tea party was black?

video for you here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZtH7vH4yRcY

[butterfly77]

76. I wonder what would have happened if..

a black man or men would have shown up to protest during the bush or any other admin with an ak47 ????

The black man who stood so proudly with the TEABAGGERS during their protest with an ak47 was designed to send a message, what do you think that message was?

[Honeycombe8]

163. A black man showed up at a Tea Party rally, and was not arrested.

I'm not sure why he was there. That's not the point. He was not arrested.

[EFerrari]

127. Well, black protesters with guns ALREADY HAVE been arrested.

It happened in the 80s at the CA capitol building when the Panthers were insisting on their right to bear arms just as the tea klan is doing now.

And calling out racism is not racism.

[Honeycombe8]

164. The Tea Partiers don't show up on the capitol steps with guns protesting.

I think you're getting events confused.

To my understanding, there is a general gun belief among Tea Partiers, but rarely do gun toters show up at rallies (which are not protests). When they "protested" at the capitol recently, they did vile things, but they were not toting guns.

I try to focus on facts. That makes me less susceptible to propoganda. If someone says that blacks are always arrested for doing something that whites are not, I notice the word "always," and then I look for proof. I don't take such statements at their face value. That's what Tea Party believers do...they believe any silly e-mail that they are sent about Obama being born in Kenya or whatever. Facts and proof are important, IMO.

I watch about 20 hours of news every week and am a political junkie of sorts. I've been watching current events for a few decades now...sometimes more than other times. I can say that based on my observation, blacks are not arrested at protests more than other races for carrying guns. I've never seen that. That's not to say that hasn't happened a time or two. And I'm not talking about the all-out war on blacks in the '60's. It just doesn't help to calm the waters to spread generalities that enforce hatred, if they aren't really true.

That's not to say that blacks aren't arrested or killed more often than other races, when toting guns (or not toting guns). I do think that policemen are more apt to shoot first and ask questions later, when the person they are confronting is Af. American (and maybe hispanic, in some areas).

[EFerrari]

165. Well, no, I'm not getting my events confused but thanks. nt

[butterfly77]

72. Lol!

You said it all. A lot of people can't seem to put their finger on it but when it comes to the President being a racist they seem to think they are right on target..

[jhow]

160. .

i have to disagree, when was the last time you saw a black man
get in trouble for doing something racist ..? black panther
voting scandal. what happened with that? thrown under the
table media never talked of it!!! not that whites haven't done
there share of racism!! but we need to keep the punishment
equal no matter what race.. also people who think a place is
racist just cause they have all white workers or all black
workers or whatever race! what if those people were the most
qualified! you cant give special privileges to minorities and
call this a equal country!!!    

[EFerrari]

126. You "ask" the same question every time this topic comes up.

The reality is that when the NAACP asked the Tea Party to disown racism, Breitbart tried to prove that they "do it, too" and that Shirley "did it, too".

That is Breitbart's position. When he is confronted with racism in the Tea Party ranks, instead of addressing the topic, he flips the blame -- as you just did, twice.

[ZombieHorde]

37. Breitbart wears clothes when he goes outside. Do act just like Breitbart?

I am just trying to illustrate the logical fallacy in your post. Each concept and action should be judged on its own merits and flaws, not by others who may believe or act similarly.

[EFerrari]

125. Well, Breitbart's whole point was the NAACP "does it, too"

So, no, it's not a fallacy. It's actually the #1 response in the denial playbook. Tim Wise talks about this very well. I just saw him this morning on Book TV. From last month at City Lights, talking about "Color Blind":

http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/id/227960

No transcript for this one.

[ZombieHorde]

128. The fallacy is not about what Breitbart did or did not do, the fallacy is about

guilt by association. Ideas are not good or bad because Breitbart may or may not have the same idea, ideas are good or bad because of their own merits and flaws.

For example, trickle down economics is not bad because President Reagan liked trickle down economics, trickle down economics are bad because that system does not work. Even if President Reagan hated trickle down economics and Kucinich loved trickle down economics, trickle down economics would still suck.

[EFerrari]

129. Except guilt by association isn't the point. The illustration is the point.

He's given us the clearest possible example this very week of what this "they do it, too" argument looks like, what it's grounded it and how destructive it is.

[ZombieHorde]

132. No, he did not. "They do it, too" arguments are as numerous as our imagination allows.

He has only demonstrated one type of "they do it, too" argument. His "they do it, too" argument neither adds nor subtracts any merits or flaws from any other "they do it, too" argument.

Almost anyone can do what he did. If someone made a deceitfully edited tape to make BP look bad, other arguments against BP should still be judged on their own merits and flaws. Don't you agree?

[EFerrari]

136. Nope. In order to make that argument you have to discount the obvious,

which is that both Breitbart's and SI's argment were made in the same very specific context.

[ZombieHorde]

150. Breitarts's argument was bad because he falsified evidence and

these lies hurt a lot of people.

Why do you think Skipp Intro's claim/questions are bad?

[naaman fletcher]

112. both?

All do it.

[Karenina]

38. No, you've just called yourself out.

Nothing wrong with that. Nothing new.

[Quantess]

39. Yeah, I wish that is what the OP was saying, that racism is only from whites.

I think you must be a total moron if that is what you got out of the Original Post. Sorry for being so blunt. And no, I did not recommend the OP, either.

[Kind of Blue]

42. No, you haven't done anything wrong - but ignore

the point of the OP. Your statements are valid but doesn't really address what the OP is saying about eventual healing, in what I'm sure is referencing the Sherrod case where she (a black woman) admitted her own racism against whites and enlightenment.

It seems you've missed the eruption from someone clearly black admitting to her own racist feelings against whites and then you stating the obvious "two-way street" argument is just weird. The few days should have fully illustrated this "two-way street." But the twist is how did this woman raised in racism come to transcendence.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

44. Stopped reading after post title.

No real need to go further.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

52. Where is the moral equivalency? If you can prove it, please do...

[hay rick]

66. Two way street is the autobahn in one direction

and a hiking trail in the other.

There is no discrimination-against-whites remotely comparable to the disparate incarceration rates for blacks and young black males in particular.

Meanwhile, white folks are wrestling with the trauma of not being able to say the n-word while the homeboys can do it all day long.

[Karenina]

74. BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

:rofl::rofl::rofl:

[bobbolink]

86. Excellent analogy!

I know from dealing with poverty how deeply angry I am with ignorant affluent people (including "progressives").

Given that, I can't imagine living daily with discrimination, PLUS having that horrible history, and NOT having rage.

I simply can't imagine it.

My Indian friends exemplify people who have been through hell for hundreds of years and yet are loving, accepting people. I admire them for it. I don't know that I could do the same. I just really don't know.

[fishwax]

133. .

:thumbsup:

[Number23]

142. The most perfect post I've seen all week.

:thumbsup:

[TheDebbieDee]

146. This is a nation of "white privilege" - plain and simple!

It's the same thing as racism but it may be easier for those with the "privilege" to acknowledge that they are, in fact, "privileged".

[ecstatic]

67. Do you have any studies or statistics that show how whites

are adversely affected by black on white racism? Thanks!

[Karenina]

82. Why is being accused of racism SUCH a hot button?

It is because forward thinking WHITE PEOPLE made it declasse. It's NOT about what minorities think, who cares if a n***** calls you a racist or points out such behaviour, what's he gonna DO except talk and WHO they gonna believe, you or HIM? It's about how WHITE PEOPLE THINK AND FEEL.

[Politicub]

92. It's not all about criticism of others, racism is about power

Maybe I'm old school, but I believe racism, homophobia, etc. require an institutionalized power structure.

Hence, people say negative things about others, but the racist is the one who holds the most power -- and can hold others back. It's not a one-off thing. It's more about society.

You can't be a racist if you are not part of the elite who have power conferred upon them by laws and backward societal norms. The Fox/Brietbart ordeal brought this dichotomy into sharp relief.

[defendandprotect]

97. You're denying that "racism" as practiced by "whites" has the power to oppress . . .

no matter how many "blacks" might feel animosity for "whites" . . . they

DO NOT HAVE THE POWER TO OPPRESS WHITES.

And that oppression is what is under discussion --

otherwise we'd just be saying some people don't like other people -- !!

In fact, as a "white" myself I am often disgusted with other "white" people -- !!

And -- let me also suggest that we STOP discussing people as COLORS . . .

in fact, anyone who considers themselves "white" should check their skin against a

piece of white paper!! We are ALL people of color!!

[daligirl519]

157. There is a difference that is frequently ignored by many. . .

"Racism" occurs when there is a built-in systematic bias towards a certain race. It depends on who is in control of that system. Blacks and other minorities in this country can certainly be "bigoted," but it is unlikely that they fulfill the definition of "racist.

[JohnnyLib2]

32. I see it the same way, with emphasis on the "eventually...."

It's a long, long, long road.

K & R and welcome to DU

[costahawk1987]

35. Good Point!

I don't know how I'd feel or act if my parents or grandparents had to deal with Jim Crow-type bullshit. I might still want to beat the hell out of a white dude--any white dude. We might as well get it all out in the open now. Some (like my forefathers) risked their lives freeing slaves though. It never truly was black versus white. It was (and remains) right versus wrong.

[Cherchez la Femme]

40. I was in a DU discussion the other day

(of which link I now lost)

in which at least a couple people didn't think that discussion would be helpful, that there would be violence :(

It's my opinion that if approached in the same manner that the aftermath of the Rwandan genocide (hearings) and after apartheid in South Africa (South Africa's Truth and Reconciliation Commission) could be discussed without violence then we in the U.S. can too.


But then I'm an optimist


usually :>

[defendandprotect]

99. In fact, evidence over time shows that "whites" have conspired to create

the appearance of a "black" uprising vs whites --

That's been uncovered many times in our nation's history --

Nice post -- agree!

:)

[OneGrassRoot]

41. As a white person, I am so grateful for this post...

I grew up around racists, and they still surround me. It doesn't matter where one lives nowadays, they're there.

Like you, I want the "boil of racism" to erupt so all the ugliness can come out, to see the light of day and hopefully lead to some sort of healing.

People not admitting racism exists -- even more so since President Obama was elected -- is naive and, in my view, harmful.

Yet I see other African-Americans say to leave it alone...and I try to understand that perspective as well. But all I can do is try to understand, because it's not my life experience.

It's my nature to call out racism and confront them, but lately I've wondered if that's what is best for those who end up getting the full brunt of the hatefulness (granted, I had death threats and such during the campaign because of Obama signs, but I don't encounter the hatefulness otherwise, simply because of the color of my skin). And I realize racism comes in all forms, but we're witnessing KKK racism growing in our lifetime.

K&R

[Kind of Blue]

43. Welcome to DU, daligirl519.

Good OP! I agree with healing coming down the road. I just wish it could be in my lifetime.
KnR

[Hepburn]

46. I have to agree with this very much:

"Racism went underground after the Civil Rights movement."

It's not over ~~ just hidden away like a rotting infection.

I am white and if I can see it, I can bet that minorities see it a hell of a lot more than the times I become aware of the bullshit that goes on toward them.

Example: I have dear friends, a married couple with a teenage daughter ~~ she is from Puerto Rico and he is AA. They are like my children and I love them dearly. Thankfully most of my close friends are color blind, too. However, I forget that when we are out in public, that some still think that everyone should stick to his/her own racial/ethnic group.

Sad, isn't it...

[Historic NY]

47. We all have some built in bias but out & out racism is just hard to comprehend sometimes.

It has become almost like bullying. I wonder how some can look in the mirror at themselves. I agree that I seem to see it less with the youth of today.

[lunatica]

48. I think Rachel Maddow is right. Racism is based on fear

She's pointed out that politically the issue of race being used as a wedge issue is to make white's fear blacks and what they would do if they aren't kept suppressed. This is the same with Hispanics but without the dark history of societal violence that's the case with the white/black historical relationship of slavery and all its accompanying fallout. After the Civil War black men had to be persecuted and lynched because all they ever thought about was raping white women. Now with a black man in the Whitehouse their worst fears are getting closer to manifesting. Obama is going to come and get them in a fit of vengeful murder.

Sarah Palin's 'death panels' talk was a thinly veiled reference to this idea and was heard loud and clear by the teabaggers (sorry, they haven't risen to the level of legitimacy for me) who through the McCain/Palin candidacy have felt they were given permission to voice their racist swill. The woman who told McCain that she was afraid of Obama because he was a Muslim was the person who voiced that fear, not hatred, of what the teabaggers believe deep down. The fact that they insist he's a Muslim is also telling. Fear of another attack by Muslims is prevalent now. They are the enemy right now. They've taken the place of the Evil Empire, the Soviet Union. They've seamlessly substituted Obama for the Evil Empire, who were also out to get the US and it was only through military might and aggression and superiority given to the US by God that Reagan 'defeated' them.

So what sounds like total idiocy to our ears is heard loud and clear by those who fear black people. Obama is here to take everything away from them and give it to black people and reverse the roles so white people will be oppressed and relegated to grinding poverty and servitude. Deep down they believe that the races are divided into those who are righteous and favored by God and those who are inferior and that they are Good and all other races are Evil because that's how God created the races. So naturally they feel this is a fight to the death between good and evil. Evil being, of course, the other races. And if Evil wins, then Good will be punished because they simply can't grasp that the world could be a place of equality among the races. It isn't within their ability to understand that concept. The only way life can be is the division of Good and Evil and the never ending struggle of who has the most power. It's survival on a deep sub-conscious level.

[Hepburn]

50. I have to agree with Rachel's latest comments on this subject totally.

Her discussion of how many whites see advancements for minorities as being a threat, that they lose something ~~ exactly so. I am white and I have never seen it this way. If someone is bound for success, his/her skin color or ethnicity has nothing to do with brains, talent and skill.

[Honeycombe8]

57. I don't think racism is based on fear at all.

I grew up in KKK territory, although most of my family was not racist, that I could tell....well, for the most part. There were a few, more subtle comments over the years, but never any out and out racist remarks. As a white growing up in KKK territory, I became pretty familiar with the thought processes of those who hate others because of race or whatever.

Racism by whites against blacks is based on a true belief that whites are superior to blacks. It is not fear at all. A true white racist simply doesn't believe that those inferior people should have the same rights, or use the same bathrooms, etc., as white people. Slavery was a natural thing, they think, since blacks are inferior and really incapable of taking care of themselves, anyway.

A teacher of mine once said in history class, that slavery wasn't so bad. After all, the blacks got free room and board, and were cared for their entire lives. (I was so shocked that I still remember the instance when she said that, even though that was over 40 years ago.)

When whites settled America, they felt the same way about the "savages" they encountered here. The Native Americans were considered savages, heathens, and inferior.

Also, where there is racism, other "isms" are not too far behind. Racists usually are gender-biased, hate gays, hate non-Christians, possibly hate Christians if they belong to a faith other than their own, hate Jews (who can say Mel Gibson the fastest?), etc. In short, they are TOTALLY about themselves being superior to everyone who doesn't fall into their own small group. Phew. It must be so tiring to go around hating so many people all the time!

[OneGrassRoot]

73. The hatred is palpable...

disgust, hatred...so much ignorance.

I hear what you're saying. I grew up around it -- and am still surrounded by it. I grew up in a very racist family and can often spot it immediately. They've largely gone underground since Obama took office, given the directive by Limbaugh and company to deny, deny, deny, even though you and I know they want to shout it from the rooftops.

I do, however, believe it's based in fear.

Shit, they live their lives based in fear. Fear of SOMETHING being taken away from them: the blacks, the Mexicans, the women, the poor, the treehuggers...they're terrified these people and these causes are going to take something FROM them.

They're selfish beyond belief.

But they're small-minded, pathetic souls who are easily preyed upon, though they act out bullying behavior.

I do believe hatred is based in fear, and this fear is why they're so easily manipulated by Limbaugh, Beck, religious leaders, political leaders...all playing into this fear, though it's disguised in hatred and false indignation.

:hi:

[NOLALady]

116. I agree with you.

I was born and raised in the South. I've lived around white folk all my life. I have never seen whites exhibit fear of any kind towards any non white.

I saw their hatred and rage during the 60s. But that rage was based on their belief that blacks should not have equal rights, because they really believed blacks were not equal.

The whites I encountered loved black folk, as long as they knew their place. They were not afraid of anything other than losing their status as the "superior" beings.

[sufrommich]

58. Very good post. lunatica. Sarah Palin's dog whistle words

like "real Americans" was heard loud and clear by those white people who fear all who don't look and act like them .Fear is a strong force in this world.

[nicky187]

71. Partly based on fear, but there are other reasons.

Best source I've ever read is given at this link: http://www.amazon.com/Nature-Prejudice-25th-Anniversary/dp/0201001799

Others have done research after the fact, but no one has really done better than Allport.

[butterfly77]

77. They love palin..

because she said what a lot of them were itching to say with their so called coded words and phrase that are so obvious but they continue to deny,deny,deny...

[Major Hogwash]

90. Rachel did a great job the other night explaining "the Southern Strategy"

"Fear the Negro".
Of all the segments that she has done this last month, that one was the best because she explained it at an 8th grader's level.

She wasn't smarmy, or extra cutesy, or wiggling in her chair when she was talking about it, either, the way she does at other times.
And I appreciated that.

Because this is a serious problem down in the South.
They need to learn to get along with the blacks much better than they do.

There's nothing to fear but fear itself.

[defendandprotect]

101. Agree . . . but also think they got a lot of help from

the voting computers -- including the large computers used by MSM --

all of which began coming in during the mid-late-1960's --

just about the time that America was passing "The Voting Rights Act" --

I'd question every election back to Nixon/Humphrey -- which was a squeaker!


MSM pre-the-large computer could only report ACTUAL vote tallies -- they could

discuss the likelihood of this or that -- but that was it.

The large computers gave them the ability to PREDICT and CALL elections --

electoral colleges votes -- CALL the presidential election!

We simply saw that power reversed in 2000 --

[defendandprotect]

100. Agree that it is simply more rw propaganda pushing FEAR-based reasoning . . .

and sadly it succeeds --

[Sebastian Doyle]

109. It's a blend of fear & ignorance.

People fear what they don't understand. I know there are a lot of Rush haters on this board (and yeah I'm talking the guys from Toronto, not the windbag from Palm Beach) but they summed it up really well back in 1981.....

Quick to judge
Quick to anger
Slow to understand
Ignorance and prejudice
And fear walk hand in hand...

[LWolf]

53. I agree.

I'm uneasy, to say the least, to see some actually "coming out" and blatantly trying to legitimize their racism, but I think that may be an opening to clean that infection out.

[DesertDiamond]

56. You are so wise! There's a Buddhist saying, "Great good follows great evil." *Because* it has become

a crisis, the catalyst has been created for an uprising of those of us who will work to heal it with a philosophy of respect for all. This is happening right now, as we speak. The change we dream of will come, starting with ourselves first. Dailgirl519, thank you for your wisdom! :-)

[Bluenorthwest]

59. Good post

What Shirley Sherrod said in her speech, that honest personal truth, that story of redemption and growth, that is dangerous stuff in the eyes of the racist and bigoted right wing. If all Americans were able to do what Sherrod did, what a nation we would be, what greatness we would be once again capable of bringing to the world. She is a great example to us all.
This thread, I like the way your OP started things. Healing, I say, this is it right now, even this part. Healing is not the same as healed. Healing is itchy, painful, annoying and often takes work and constant effort. So yes, the good part is to come, but as you say, this is the lancing of the boil period, ugly, wet and highly human. The early, uncomfortable portion of the healing process, or so I hope.

[bobbolink]

87. If we can move to the redemption part, it will probably be worth this agony.

However, as I see the ongoing friction and hatefulness of DU, I see how unlikely that road to redemption is, unless we finally have another brilliant leader.

Maybe Ms. Sherrod herself will be that leader.

But left to our own divices, given what I see right here, I don't have a big lot of hope.

[jobycom]

60. Well said. nt

[Faygo Kid]

61. Interesting perspective. The truth is coming out, but I can't fully agree.

Right-wing sites now obsessed with race. The problem with this thesis is determining how much is organic and how much is being whipped into a frenzy by Fox News and the reich-wing machine, which are used to having their bidding done by the dittoheads. Probably some of both.

This is going to get far uglier before any "healing" takes place, if it does. I don't think any healing is on the horizon - the Repukes want a return to power and this is just one more lever that they are using.

Rachel is right in her analysis.

[Fire1]

64. Totally agree and anyone who thinks differently is naive. n/t

[bobbolink]

89. That's a nice division of the camps.

:eyes:

[fascisthunter]

63. the big bang was pretty violent

things cooled down considerably after that finding a bit of order after all the chaos... it's a long road but Obama's election with be remembered as a HUGE step in the direction of healing this nation in regards to race relations. Mark my words...

[av8rdave]

65. Agreed

Racism is alive and well in this country, unfortunately. It's just not as starkly visible to those who claim to not be racist but are. This helps these people stay comfortable in their delusional world where the only racism is "reverse racism" against them.

Thanks to my job, I am often surrounded by right wingers. The political right is where most racism in this country resides. I can't tell you how often I hear, "I'm no racist, but _______________."

One thing I've learned over the years: Anyone who has to start any sentence with "I'm no racist, but..." is a racist.

I have always expected that Obama's election would ultimately help the situation with racism in America, but I also expected that whatever progress was made would NOT be a pretty process.

[niceypoo]

68. You cannot control how people think

You can, however, educate

A persons level of bigotry is inversely proportional to his/her parents education level.

[Dappleganger]

69. "Nothing comes out of the mouth of a drunk which wasn't there already."

Words of truth from my mother, acknowledging the reality that people of all kinds push down their true thoughts and feelings in civilized society but a few stokes of alcohol (or electing a black man to the presidency, etc.) allow all of that garbage to re-surface.

It's like people fooling themselves they are christians by going to church every week, then hating on their neighbor and the poor as soon as they get into the car to go home.

[nicky187]

70. Pervasive racism ...

... exists everywhere. Every society has abused minority groups. I'm just stating facts, not trying to justify what I consider to be irrational, sick behavior. Instead, I'd like to break the chain of children being taught prejudiced beliefs and attitudes, so that they are not carried forward without end. America is supposed to be better than this.

Change in behavior is never fast, and never easy. All the more reason to begin now at the personal level.

[bobbolink]

75. Sweeping the dirt out from *under* the rug is always a good thing.

The character of this country will be shown by what we do about it NOW.

[alfredo]

78. The Reps used the post racial meme to justify the dismantling

of the Civil Rights act and Voting Rights Act.

[deaniac21]

79. Somehow what is happening today doesn't seem to be quite as

intense as what I experienced in Little Rock in 1957.

[wryter2000]

80. I hope you're right

I'm cheered by the fact that the few bastards who are bleating "Well, she still said some racist stuff" aren't getting anywhere with that. People are not buying it.

[Karenina]

102. About this "reverse racism" thang

2 questions I'd like to pose

1. Have black people as a group ever done ANYTHING to white people as a group that would explain their mistrust and fear?

2. Have white people as a group ever done ANYTHING to black people as a group that would explain their mistrust and fear?

[wryter2000]

81. Oh, hey

Welcome to DU! I didn't notice you were new. :hi:

[Crystal Clarity]

84. I think you are right

We in America are long overdue for a serious discussion about this. If there is anything good to come from Shirley Sherrod's horrible ordeal, I hope it will serve as a catalyst for addressing what still remains a serious problem.

[azureblue]

91. no more "discussion"

"Discussing" has been going on for decades, and all it leads to is more yapping and yapping. The GOP is blowing every dog whistle is has to stir up race hate, and it is working. The GOP's thing is death by a thousand cuts- no overt racist statement, no huge public act of prejudice, just a little nudge and wink here, a little innuendo there, a lie, a joke, a code word, a rumor, a half truth, which all adds up to "Negros are scary and they are coming to get YOU!!" (Then they go after the Latinos, then the Asians, then the -- etc.)

I say give them what they are afraid of- a black march on Washington (and I as a white man will be there too because I am sick of this crap), picket the racist pundits, boycott the companies and broadcast stations.

What racists rely on is no push back. They think that there scare tactics will be proven if the scary "other" race does get up and push back. So be it. This country, all races combined, must take public action against these racists. Sue them. Whatever it takes, but the hydra of racism will not be killed by reason and words. What kills racism is light- the glare of exposure and publicity. And push back.

My criticism of the NAACP is that they seem to not want to use the tactics of the 60's- the marches, the speeches, the confrontation, but that is exactly what is needed. If the NAACP fears that the rest of the country will stand by and let them march alone, they need to think again. There will be plenty of people from other races standing shoulder to shoulder with them.

The people that are promoting racism are the same ones who are tearing this country apart. The more they can fracture the people the more they can control the people - united we stand, divided we fall, is never truer than right now.Uniting against them and stopping them once and for all, will go a long way to restoring healing and rejuvenating this country. Ms. Sherrod is the focal point of change- the straw that, I hope, will turn this country against racism.

[NOLALady]

114. The front line is scary and dangerous.

"My criticism of the NAACP is that they seem to not want to use the tactics of the 60's- the marches, the speeches, the confrontation,"

Many died at the hands of law enforcement as well as others during the '60s confrontations. There were assassinations, beatings, and much blood was shed. Many people who challenged the power structure lost their livelihood if their lives were spared.

Maybe the NAACP will stand shoulder to shoulder with the other races if the other races decide on a March to Washington to end racism. The poison of racism is harmful to everyone, not just blacks and browns.

[donal dubh]

88. this poison will ooze for decades...

but I agree that the time is overdue for this to happen. And it has been festering for centuries. It will take time correct it.

Racism and classism and ageism and sexism... I tend to link them all together in power relationships. Those with power will not cede it readily; they will use whatever tactics available to deny the lesser (in their estimation) people access. - turn the poor white against any and all who might threaten the white male power bloc. The poor whites are set up to provide cover for the rich and oppress the challengers to established order. Men are turned against women... children against the aged...

Exposure and education. Keep that wound open and draining. And teach your children well... I think I should link to that classic Gahan Wilson 'toon - the one where the father unties his child's head and stuffs it full of racist phrases and labels... and as he does you see the child's face sour.

yeah, long overdue. good discussion in this thread.

[autorank]

93. k*r Great post, great point

Yep, it's better but not close to being where it should be. The anti-Obama tone, much of it, is obviously race driven. The Dept of Ag affair is another example. Ongoing disparities in sentencing and imprisonment, economic disparities, etc. are all not close to being addressed, let alone fixed.

You said a lot in a few sentences but it's powerful stuff. Thanks.

[AllyCat]

96. Your first sentence put the picture of a zit in my mind. lol

It is kind of a festering infection that needs to be let out. Volcano is probably more appropriate though :)

[glitch]

106. Did it look like this?

[AllyCat]

137. Yes!!!

[glitch]

138. Mine too. :) or maybe I should say :( nt

[TBF]

98. I participated in a session on "diversity training" - from the staff side of course.

We were actually split into groups - the diversity training for partners was in another room.

We came to the fast conclusion that race was a big problem in our law firm (one example was a white partner calling the police on the weekend because he saw a black man in the hallway - who it turned out was working on his duplicating project on overtime so it would get done!). But we also determined that class was an enormous problem, as evidenced by the fact that the partners would not even attend the same training session as staff but insisted that it be split into two different groups.

[defendandprotect]

103. Interesting comments -- thank you --

Right wing always wants to point to a "post-racist" or "post-feminist" period --

You can pretty much reverse anything they are telling you --

Also agree that the right wing "coded" their messages after Civil Rights era --

and that they seem to be in a frenzy right now in letting their racism rise to the open air!!

O'Keefe scam vs ACORN, IMO, was also a racist scheme -- against an organization

which worked to politically empower the poor and minorities -- and with personnel and leadership

comprised of minorities -- lawyers, etal. IMO, in what O'Keefe did we get an excellent view

into the minds and spirits of those who conspired in ACORN -- and it's a very ugly picture.

I don't know if you remember this -- but quite a few years back -- maybe 15? or more --

Republican National Committee Headquarters had a scandal when some videos they produced right

out of their offices hit the TV and played for a week or more. They had actually created

sexist, racist, anti-seminitic, homophobic videos -- USING THEIR OWN EMPLOYEES AS THE SUBJECTS --!!

So even though much of what they did has been coded -- much of it does surface from time to time.

PLUS, didn't the Senate Repugs also refuse to apologize for slavery even just a few years ago?

The Founders compromise with slavery led to the Civil War from which we still haven't recovered.

And though Segregation ended -- not that long ago, really -- we have a frightening new

prison industrial complex seemingly built upon imprisonment of minorities!

And -- unemployment in AA communities is also horrendous.


Basically, I'd like to see people talk more about the "exploitation" of racism -

it makes it a great deal clearer what is really going on --

This exploitation is always about the profit of the few -- based on myths of inferiority

of others -- Women, Native Americans, African Americans, Latinos -- not only here in the US

but all over the world.


I'd also guess that as with women, the backlash by the elites against the Civil Rights Era

has probably keep many advancements from happening -- and we need to continue to fight for

justice, as always.





:)

[glitch]

104. As an anglo-american I agree with you. What's important now is to clean the wound and not cover it

back up, it needs to be allowed to heal and not turn gangrenous (again).

[Jade Fox]

105. agree completely....

tho I confess to being shocked at the puerile, stupid, unsophisticated nature of the racists who are shamelessly revealing themselves. I knew those racists were around and that the election of Obama would bring them out of the closet, but I actually thought they had a little better sense of their own problem.

No real healing is possible until all the cards are on the table. I fear many white Americans will never get over their racism, but at it's better that we know who they are and what their true agenda is.

[Joe Bacon]

107. I don't know how to stop it.

My girlfriend made the fatal mistake of answering the phone when my bigoted aunt called me. I heard my girlfriend crying and I grabbed the phone. My aunt then shot her mouth off about why a black girl was answering my phone. My aunt then started quoting bible verses about the "curse of Ham" and how blacks are inferior to whites. She asked why I wasn't seeking a "christian white woman" as God intended.

That was enough. I left that old witch have it with both barrels. Told her to shut the fuck up and take her Bible and stick it up her bigoted ass and then I hung up.

She called back telling me she would do whatever it takes to break me up with my girlfriend because God commands it. I told her to go to hell and never call back. I blocked her phone number. She sends me letters filled with verses from her book of fractured fairy tales that justify her racism. And the sad truth is that the rest of my family is just as bigoted as her. And they go to church every Sunday to pray Obama out of the White House.

Yes, they send me the chain e-mails that spread the racist shit about Obama. Telling me he is a committed Muslim Marxist. In reality he is a moderate conservative since he's been giving Republicans everything they want. Yet they still believe he is turning America into a communist state. As for me, I reject them and the garbage that they call Christianity.

And I still love my girlfriend. She loves me, but she thinks my family is insane. And they are.

[T Wolf]

111. The major and significant advancements have come from demanding and forcibly taking them,

not politely and weakly begging others.

The principle of squeaky wheel is true - and the model that should be followed if the goal really is to bring about change.

You cannot just hope that the bully will decide not to take your lunch. Our party will never (or refuses to) learn that lesson.

[Scurrilous]

113. Indeed.

K & R :thumbsup:

[onethatcares]

115. jeez, women can't get a break in this country

just look at the ERA ratification. I can't even imagine being a black woman.

[ismnotwasm]

118. Hope so

It seems like to me is many feel they've been given some sort of bizarre 'permission' to be openly racist. They use prettier words--in public---usually---to describe it than pre-civil rights era, act indignant when called on it (Hey! I'm no racist but...) But like you say, at least they've becoming visible.


Around 5 or 10 years ago, I used to(snottily)say I would just stop talking to anybody who used the term 'politically correct' or PC' in a smarmy or derogatory way more than 3 times during the course of a conversation. Not being 'PC' was like a freedom flag for being any kind of asshole. Well that particular term is so homogenized now I'd end up not talking to anybody if I held to that, but the same principle is there with this racist-- call it-- dialog, that is going around the country. Only instead of not talking about it, it's time to open the conversation up and take it wide

[bobburgster]

119. Couldn't agree with you more!

That whole post-racist society talk is such b.s. Well, maybe some honest to goodness wishful thinking too.

Edit for spelling

[Alcibiades]

120. Senator Webb proved this is not a post-racist society

And some folks at DU fell for it without realizing they are attracted to a dog whistle.

[ColesCountyDem]

122. I agree 100%

We failed to have an honest debate about race in this country after the Civil Rights Act so how could anyone expect us to have a true resolution to the problem? ANY time 'race' came up, it was met by the predictable "yes you did/no I didn't" sort of shouting match that has NEVER resolved anything. If anyone from either 'camp' had the temerity to leave the political 'reservation' from either side, they could usually expect scathing denunciation from BOTH sides!

As the Book of Isaiah says, "Come now, let us reason together."

:hi:

[JDPriestly]

123. I live in California. Our neighborhood, my world and my family are very diverse

not just in terms of race and ethnicity, but also religion, sexual orientation, political viewpoint. We live pretty much in harmony.

So, until recently, I really thought that we were entering not just a post-racist, but a post-prejudice, post-intolerance world -- just maybe. The passage of Prop. 8 in California was the first shock for me.

Now, I'm really disappointed at how wrong I was, and I worry for my family, my community and my country. I have relatives from different religions and different races and we love and care about each other. Why can't other people look beyond all the differences and see what we all have in common? There is no reason for the racism and hate. No reason at all.

[1776Forever]

130. When I think of prejudice it isn't just in race but social justice and certainly the AA community

has had more then their share of problems in both areas and I feel that a lot of the issues are because after the Civil War the African American slaves weren't given the opportunity for schooling and a fresh start that some talked about but never delivered. The land owners were given their properties back and the slaves were turned out to try and survive on their own without any support.

Now the pockets of large cities where poverty is centered is still fighting back and have never really been given the backing that they should have to reach the same level as whites. This is what I think of when I see GOP ideologues trying to keep the black communities down and "in their place" like the Tea Party blogger did when he commented on Ms. Sherrod.

This is shown in these facts:

Job-Trends Report: Black Employment Remains Bleak
By Gail Zoppo - Jul 6, 2010

http://www.diversityinc.com/article/7846/JobTrends-Report-Black-Employment-Remains-Bleak/

The jobless rate for Blacks ages 16 and older hovered at 15.4 percent last month, according to new data from the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics, nearly the same as May when Black unemployment hit an all-time high of 15.5 percent....

Youth & Black Men Hardest Hit

Although teen employment rates are "extremely volatile from month to month," say the report's authors, the jump in unemployed Black teens—those between the ages of 16 and 19—is alarming. In June, the number hit a staggering 39.9 percent, up from 38 percent in May, compared with a 23.2 percent and 24.4 percent jobless rate, respectively, for whites.

When broken down by gender, Black male teens were hardest hit, with an unemployment rate of 43.2 percent, up 7.8 percentage points from 35.4 percent in May. The Black female teen unemployment rate dropped from a high of 40.1 percent in May to 36.5 percent in June.

(more at link)

.................

To me this shows that there is still much prejudice against the black community and it will take an inserted effort to move on from that point. As the NYT said today:

Race: Still Too Hot to Touch
By MATT BAI
Published: July 24, 2010

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/25/weekinreview/25bai.html

"Perhaps the president’s reluctance reflects the particular perils faced by any president who represents an American minority — the reasonable fear that he will be perceived, however unfairly, as chauvinist or parochial.

The historian Robert Dallek, a biographer of John F. Kennedy, posits that whatever effect Mr. Kennedy might have had on American attitudes about Catholicism was cemented not by his election in 1960, but by the Cuban missile crisis of 1962. It wasn’t until that moment, Mr. Dallek says, when Mr. Kennedy proved that he could be relied on to protect the national interest as a whole — a judgment that extended, perhaps, to American Catholics generally.

Looked at this way, perhaps Mr. Obama is not just a president in the thrall of economic crisis, but a black leader in search of his defining moment, as well. The conflagrations continue, while we wait."

............

Let's hope that something constructive comes out of all of this!

[KT2000]

135. Me too - because

after Obama was elected, the subject of race has been verboten. The RW took that as a signal they could do and say horrible things and for too long it has been "allowed."
This country needs a correction and that requires discussion and calling out the underground racism.

One of the best things about the 60s and 70s was the fact that everything was under discussion and so many were aiming for the best in all of us.
We need that again because right now there is no shame in being a horrible, mean, racist person.

[activa8tr]

139. Yes, this week taught us a lot about the racism still present in the USA

How Fox News fans it! How tea baggers flaunt it. How even people on the President's Cabinet are not very courageous about fighting it.

When I knew this issue was breaking on Breitbart and Fox, I had my doubts immediately. When I heard that Shirley had been fired, I was STUNNED, until I realized everything the OP says is true.

[LatteLibertine]

140. Essentially, I agree

It's sad to see so many fall for divisive racial politics though. I suppose as long as people fall for it those tactics will be employed. If the poor and middle class ever get together we will really be able to get something done.

It's is true some people think there's more racism now and I disagree. A small vocal minority have come out into the open and are making a lot of noise. I'm glad it's happening too because eventually we will purge the white supremacist mindset.

It's been being ignored for far too long. Eventually most people will start having honest discussions about race.

As far as racism and bigotry go I feel they are rooted in plain ignorance.

[WillyT]

141. Big K & R !!!

:kick:

[nevergiveup]

143. I really like this post.

It is so spot on. The oozing of racial hatred today is a direct result of having elected an African American as president. It is very painful watching this but it is a necessary step toward healing this awful disease we call racism.

[cwydro]

145. Recced

and totally agree.

BOTH white and black need to search their soul though, not just one or the other.

[Enthusiast]

148. K&R. Nice post, daligirl519

We have the single advantage in that racists are now embarrassed to be called racists, you know, to be found out.

[joeybee12]

151. I agree however, what is disturbing is the MSM covering up the most recent episode of such blatantly

obvious racism.

[Deep13]

152. Agreed. nt

[peacetalksforall]

154. When I heard the story of Sherrod, I thought Rosa Parks. The circumstances are

vastly different and it could be said that nothing surpasses the milestone of Parks, but consider this - all the seven major corporate tv networks played, enabled, facilitated, led the ultra major role in this character assassination and never apologized. The only republican on all seven corporate war networks who expressed regret was Shep Smith (memory failing) from what I have read here. (No tv.)

These seven corporate networks are equivalent to the Wallaces and John Birchers and of that other era of Rosa Parks and all the other heroes and heroines..

The hate exploded when those corporate war machine networks picked up on this and went through their talking points, employee after employee, with no proof, no doubt, no balance, no sourcing of any kind.

If anything comes of this in the form of an improvement, we can say that Sherrod was a flash player in something that could be another milestone if WE put the pressure on the truth of what those networks did.

Please don't forget the essential role those seven corporate networks played and are playing in the march to hate and the spreadinf of hate. This event and everything since these networks were purchased by the war and greed corporations.

Andrew Blackhater will end up in jail, but the propaganda employees of these corporations will keep on spreading it. And it will include spreading hate against Democrats, as Anderson Cooper and his assistant did the other night.

[CLANG]

156. The "post-racist society" thing was shortsighted.

It just seemed very far-fetched to me. I talk to racist white folk all the time. And why shouldn't non-white races feel the same racism toward whites? Are they supposed to always take the higher ground, when whites have been the racists in this country?

[MrMickeysMom]

158. Good analogy ... it's a rather deep wound, too.

To have the ability to look into racism requires understanding that everyone (I think) has some form of it inside of them. I know I'm not the little girl I was growing up in the 50's and 60's... I thought I was all knowing in the 70/s and 80's... I know I don't think anything like I used to then, but I struggle with it every day. And, I'm not talking about overt stuff, I'm talking about the voice that sizes people up because of color. I'm pretty sure that damned thing operates in every wakeful moment.

It's the same with homosexuality. I'm just being honest.

[daligirl519]

159. You are human. . .

So am I. We all have our shit. It's all about trying not to hurt people because of it.

[KakistocracyHater]

161. gotta give a shout-out to Aztecas in AZ too

not white not black, but still caught in the web of racism. Many Mexicans are NATIVE to AZ, CA, etc.

[yurbud]

162. yep. Robert Reich said social programs weren't evil to whites until blacks had equal access to them

then even though whites were still the overwhelming majority of users of those programs they suddenly became welfare for lazy layabouts.

Someone once said a racist would rather see his only family starve than his family be fed if it meant a black family was fed too.

That hasn't changed for some people.