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Atticus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-30-10 08:32 PM
Original message
Let's review, shall we?
It is seldom mentioned by the supposed "expert political commentators" who regularly "commentate" for pay on our MSM, but the White House was occupied during the 8 long years preceding the Obama Adminstration.

George W. Bush, Richard Cheney and a collection of morally-challenged wealthy bastards were at the helm during that long dark night and, with the unblinking support of the GOP Congressional "Me too, sir!" chorus, very nearly destroyed the America that most people presumed was cherished by ALL Americas.

Bush dropped the ball and allowed us to be blind-sided on 9-11-01.

That is a damn fact and no amount of historical revision should be allowed to obscure or soften it.

The smirking frat-boy ignored those who warned him of Bin Laden's intentions, but did take time to ridicule them for "covering their ass". The ONLY reason our initial military actions were successful---or even posssible---is that the Clinton administration had left Bush a blue-print for "rolling up" the growing threat called Al Qaeda: names, locations, contacts, maps and recommended strategy. They had developed this plan after the USS Cole was attacked, but thought it inappropriate to saddle the next administration, whoever that turned out to be, with prosecuting a war started in the closing weeks of the Clinton Adminisration. So, the detailed plan was left for Clinton's successor to use. Of course, Bush shelved it until 9-11-01.

But, the effort to kill or capture Osama was abandoned and he was allowed to escape through the mountains of Tora Bora to Pakistan. This was because Rummy and the other PNAC pinheads had decided that, hell, Iraq was a MUCH better place to start a war. It was ruled by a certified monster, it was "target rich" and---it had LOTS of OIL!!!

After several months of orchestrated bullshit, the lying SOBs succeeded in "catapulting the propaganda" and the addled, inattentive and frightened were primed for the beginning of "shock and awe". Remember that bullshit?

I could go on ad nauseum, but suffice it to say that not ONE of the two dozen or so stated excuses for launching a war have proven true or, in some cases, feasible. There were NO "Weapons of Mass Destruction"; NO "unmanned drones that could reach our East Coast in 45 minutes"; NO "yellow cake"; NO evidence of cooperation with the 9-11 suicide bombers; NO LEGALLY SUFFICIENT BASIS TO INVADE IRAQ---PERIOD, Goddammit!

In furtherance of this illegal war, the war criminals that comprised most of the Bush "inner circle", engaged in crimes against the American people: illegally searching their homes, reading their mail and emails and, in some cases, imprisoning and torturing them without so much as a nod in the direction of the Constitution.

We were introduced to "free speech zones" which were necessary to insure that the lapdog media didn't accidentally show those of us carrying decidedly uncomplimentary signs and shouting appropriately obscene slogans at the Boy Who Would Be King".

Oil and coal companies were essentially told to do whatever the hell they decided was most profitable without regard to worker safety or our environment.

Banks and insurance companies were encouraged to invest real money (mostly borrowed or belonging to investors) in outlandish, fictional, never-heard-of-it-before-I-bought-some "assets".

"What could possibly go wrong?" became our unspoken national economic policy, just as "Yee-haw" became the template for our foreign policy.

All of this happened BEFORE Barack Hussein Obama kicked John McCain's ass in November, 2008 and stepped in to try to pull us back from the brink of international disgrace, domestic meltdown and---I will say it, without apology to Godwin or anyone else---fascism.

The best characterization I've read of the bitching and moaning going on now among the pissants who LOST the last THREE elections is still this: The same kids who filled the house with old newspapers, robbed the batteries out of the smoke detectors, neglected to recharge the fire extinguishers, filled their squirt guns with gasoline and then played with matches are now complaining that Obama's fire department should have arrived before it was called and is using way too much water in its efforts to save the house.

We should not only remember the above, we should make damn sure no one else is allowed to forget it.

I'm done.
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babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-30-10 08:37 PM
Response to Original message
1. Rec'd, and this supports your point...
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

snip//

we are now confronted with an entire army of people running for office who seem rather unserious when it comes to the whole "making laws" thing. They seem to be so intensely ideological that they haven't bothered to think about policy. When you start asking them questions, they very quickly reveal themselves to have a shockingly superficial understanding of things. So after Rand Paul reveals his own ignorance and disturbing views, Sharron Angle just decides that she'll only talk to reporters who will give her softballs. (Though she just emerged. The resulting interview included this gem: When asked about her prior assertion that unemployment benefits just spoiled people, she said, "I said it has spoiled our citizenry; that's a little different. They're not spoiled. What has happened is the system of entitlement has caused us to have a spoilage with our ability to go out and get a job." Um ... OK.)

To a degree, this is an old Republican story -- if you believe government can't do anything right, then what's the point of understanding how government works?
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-30-10 08:39 PM
Response to Original message
2. Deleted sub-thread
Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Robb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-30-10 08:41 PM
Response to Original message
3. Worth every word.
Well done. :thumbsup:
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underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-30-10 08:46 PM
Response to Original message
4. I remember that bullshit
I heard a report about TARP on NPR today and it featured W speechifyin'

Jesus what dark days those were.

The thing that really gets any sober adult is that their only credit - the only thing they had to hang their hat on- was the WORST SECURITY FAILURE SINCE ORGANIZED GOVERNMENT BEGAN (was I clear enough with that?)

I can't find the link now but CNN's Amanpour report that 40-50 Army Rangers were requested in Tora Bora and they never were sent. There is a lot that 40-50 Army Rangers can accomplish in pretty much any area.

Incompetence, complicity, and failure of duty
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annabanana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-30-10 08:53 PM
Response to Original message
5. Most Righteous Rant, Atticus!
This is history as I experienced it. We must make sure that this true account isn't wiped from national memory by our corporate masters.
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thetonka Donating Member (192 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-30-10 09:58 PM
Response to Original message
6. And another point I am sick of hearing about
Obama did NOT kick McCains ass. 7% is not an ass kicking, especially when barely a majority of the people in this country even bothered to vote.

This winner takes all party attitude, which we got to enjoy under W, was the kind of stuff I was hoping would disappear with the change.
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Atticus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-30-10 10:21 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. "7% is not an ass kicking"
What color is the sky in the world you live in?
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thetonka Donating Member (192 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-30-10 10:57 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Blue, yours?
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Atticus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-01-10 12:15 AM
Response to Reply #8
11. In my blue-skyed world, the 2000 election featured Bush becoming president even though he lost the
popular vote by half a percent.

In 2004, Bush prevailed, amid more vote counting irregularities, by about two and one half percent.

Barack Obama beat John McCain by over 7% of the popular vote in 2008. While "kicking ass" is a widely used but rather subjective term, it is clear that Obama's win over McCain was clear, convincing and damned emphatic. I'm sorry you are "sick of hearing about it."

I'm also sorry you feel compelled to defend John McCain and that you are uncomfortable with my partisan attitude. This is a partisan site, hence the name.

Maybe you'd be happier at Kumbaya.com.

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SunsetDreams Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-01-10 12:24 AM
Response to Reply #11
12. OMG Atticus!!!!
Must you have put that song in my head????? :mad:
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thetonka Donating Member (192 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-01-10 12:14 PM
Response to Reply #11
17. Never defended McCain
The problem I have with it is the attitude it creates from one side of the other. A 7% popular victory does NOT give one party or the other a mandate to do whatever the hell they want to. That attitude is what drove W and his followers to think they could run this country like their own little club house. I did not like it when the Republicans did it and I do not like it when the Democrats do it. This is supposed to be a country for the people run by the people. The attitude we see on almost a daily basis sends the clear message that the politicians think this is a country of the party, for the party. And what's best for the party is to do everything in their power to protect and support the special interests that own them.

That assumption you made about me being a McCain supporter is a perfect example of why the party loyalty has gone to far. I bring up a point of fact that contradicts the party stance that Obama kicked McCains ass and I am labeled a McCain support, and I am sure many assumed first and foremost that I am a conservative republican troll. WRONG. We have gotten to a point in our politics where people feel a need to assign EVERYONE to one party or the other. We are defining the masses by only two labels.

I personally think for myself, and feel anyone who blindly follows either party is either too lazy, too apathetic, or too stupid to pay attention and think for themselves.

As an example, I remember back when W was pushing for the War in Iraq(which I NEVER supported given the reasons they promoted, even it's why I have a paycheck), there was a LOT of support from both parties. There was also a lot of support from both parties when Congress pushed for the regulation chances that resulted in the down fall of our economy. In the end both parties are guilty to some degree in ALL the major problems this country faces today. What scares me is that now that the Democrats are in power they refuse to accept responsibility, instead blame EVERYTHING on the Republicans. They will eventually lose power and the Republicans will do the same thing. In the end the scapegoats will be blamed, and many of those who helped cause the problems will stay in power and never be held accountable.

But that's just me, and I am sure there are plenty who will read this and label me a conservative Republican.

:eyes:
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-01-10 02:50 PM
Response to Reply #17
24. The winner takes all goes back to the US Constitition of 1789
and I noticed that you have not even adressed that little point.

In US Politics a 7& is seen as an overwhelming victory, that is political science, and yes a mandate.

Now to compare the way the Democrats to the Republicans, you are making a very serious mistake. If the Democrats, with the mandate, behaved as the republicans we would have single payer health care, not this watered down bill, and be out of Afghanistan (That is the logic of empire so it don't matter what party controls what)

Now what you are correct in is the level of rancor and partisanship... which we have seen in the past and once led to a hot shooting civil war.

But the winner takes all, we would have to REWRITE the US Constitution or amend it. Good luck on either of them. And by the way, that is one of the weaknesses in it... and yes the US might benefit from a parliamentary system, with proportional representation, but that one also has it's major problems.
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thetonka Donating Member (192 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-01-10 03:17 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. Not talking about the consitution
I am talking about the attitude, you would know this if you had read my post.

I do not believe there is a party mandate for any victory. This suggests that the people of this country have no representation, instead it is simply an aristocracy. In my opinion this is how our government is acting, and this attitude combined with the arrogance and ignorance of so many of the politicians is why we end up with wars we should not have, economic failures, massive oil spills that are not given their due, a tax structure that causes more harm than good, and a bunch of arrogant pseudo aristocrats running around bragging about Health Care reform that actually WASN'T.

Washington said it quite well:

"All obstructions to the execution of the laws, all combinations and associations, under whatever plausible character, with the real design to direct, control, counteract, or awe the regular deliberation and action of the constituted authorities, are destructive of this fundamental principle, and of fatal tendency. They serve to organize faction, to give it an artificial and extraordinary force; to put, in the place of the delegated will of the nation the will of a party, often a small but artful and enterprising minority of the community; and, according to the alternate triumphs of different parties, to make the public administration the mirror of the ill-concerted and incongruous projects of faction, rather than the organ of consistent and wholesome plans digested by common counsels and modified by mutual interests.

However combinations or associations of the above description may now and then answer popular ends, they are likely, in the course of time and things, to become potent engines, by which cunning, ambitious, and unprincipled men will be enabled to subvert the power of the people and to usurp for themselves the reins of government, destroying afterwards the very engines which have lifted them to unjust dominion"

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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-01-10 03:33 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. I read it and the attitude goes back to 1789 as well
it was meant to avoid factions, but it created them. And this attitude comes and goes. And ONCE it already led to a civil war.

This is not the first time we have been here... and Santayana comes to mind.
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Atticus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-01-10 06:48 PM
Response to Reply #17
27. Likely a waste of time, but here goes:
"A 7% popular victory does NOT give one party or the other a mandate to do whatever the hell they want to."

Only an idiot would have said such a thing. I am not an idiot. I said no such thing. Straw men don't last long, do they?

"I bring up a point of fact that contradicts the party stance that Obama kicked McCains ass---"

If you had brought up any facts to contradict my "ass kicking" remark, we wouldn't be having this exchange. You simply stated your unsupported opinion that "7% is NOT an ass kicking". Opinions are like assholes: everybody has one and I think yours stinks.

"I am sure many assumed first and foremost that I am a conservative republican troll.

I confess it did cross my mind. And, now there is that "He who excuses himself accuses himself" thing.

"In the end both parties are guilty to some degree in ALL the major problems this country faces today."

Were you dropped on your head as a child?

"I am sure there are plenty who will read this and label me a conservative Republican."

DING! DING! DING! It took you a while, but you finally got something right.
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thetonka Donating Member (192 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-01-10 08:07 PM
Response to Reply #27
28. LOL
At least people are still predictable.
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eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-30-10 11:28 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. If all people who wanted to vote had been allowed to, and if machine hankypanky had not occurred--
--it might very well have been an asskicking.
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-30-10 11:43 PM
Response to Reply #6
10. This winner takes all party attitude...
May I recommend you read this...

http://www.archives.gov/exhibits/charters/constitution....

Concentrate on how a President is elected. We have been at this winner takes all since oh... 1787... not 2000.

You want to change that, well we either get a New Constitution or an Amendment, good luck with either.
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scheming daemons Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-01-10 01:49 PM
Response to Reply #6
19. Obama's 52.9% was the highest by a Democrat since 1964....
...the very definition of ass-kicking.


In addition, he got nearly 400 electoral votes.



He won by more than 10,000,000 votes.



ASS-KICKING
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AtomicKitten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-01-10 02:14 PM
Response to Reply #6
22. Electoral vote: O 365, M 173. Popular vote: O 63,639,738, M 56,899,510
Election 2008 was a thorough routing.


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SunsetDreams Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-01-10 12:25 AM
Response to Original message
13. Excellent rant!!! K&R
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HCE SuiGeneris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-01-10 12:30 AM
Response to Original message
14. PNAC, and their agenda, began to be implemented after JFK's untimely death.
The manipulation and abuse has escalated exponentially. Clinton's run was a reprieve, but many of the cornerstones of the PNAC agenda were strengthened at the same time... NAFTA, Telecommunications Act of 1996, repeal of GlassSteagall Act, etc.
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Dawson Leery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-01-10 12:36 AM
Response to Original message
15. k/r
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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-01-10 10:01 AM
Response to Original message
16. Well said, Atticus!
I like how you describe "Yee-haw" as our foreign policy template under Bush. Cowboy diplomacy and worse. They ruined the country. Hell, they ruined the entire world.
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wiggs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-01-10 01:12 PM
Response to Original message
18. knrnt.
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sufrommich Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-01-10 01:51 PM
Response to Original message
20. Beautiful OP. K&R>
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AtomicKitten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-01-10 01:56 PM
Response to Original message
21. K&R. Cheers.
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lunatica Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-01-10 02:33 PM
Response to Original message
23. It hurts a lot to remember.
It's like having a very bad dream induced by a high fever.
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ThomThom Donating Member (752 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-01-10 08:59 PM
Response to Original message
29. except for the free speech zones good job
they go back to before G W Bush, I first remember them at the republican convention in Houston twenty (or so) years ago.
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