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Toyota KNEW of sticky-throttle problem late last year

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DainBramaged Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-25-10 11:40 AM
Original message
Toyota KNEW of sticky-throttle problem late last year
Edited on Mon Jan-25-10 11:41 AM by DainBramaged
Toyota says it knew there were problems with accelerator-pedal assemblies from supplier CTS late last year, but not enough to warrant a recall.
The automaker says it hurriedly announced last Thursday a planned recall of 2.3 million Toyotas, back to 2005 models, because the defect trend had picked up. "The quickness that this all came together is one reason why I don't have numbers" of complaints, the automaker's U.S. safety spokesman, John Hanson, says. "And why we don't have a fix."


The recall includes an unspecified number of 2009-10 Pontiac Vibes, designed and built by Toyota for General Motors' now- discontinued Pontiac brand. Vibe is similar to the Toyota Matrix that's part of the recall.

Toyota did not identify Vibe in its announcement of the recall. GM made no announcement, but confirmed Vibe is included.

GM spokesman Alan Adler says: "We do not typically do pre-recall announcements. We tend to wait until there is something that can be done," before notifying owners.

Hanson has said it could be weeks before Toyota determines a remedy and gets it approved by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA).

Toyota (TM) says it has no direct reports of injuries or deaths. But the day Toyota announced the recall, ABC News broadcast a report, prepared before the recall announcement, linking the problem to four deaths (http://abcnews.go.com/blotter ).

The car company says that the latest sticking-throttle recall is separate from one it announced in November. That one involved 4.3 million Toyota and Lexus models. Their gas pedals might get caught under floor mats and send the cars out of control.

http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/2010-01-25-toyotalo...


Yup Toyota, god of all things good in cars........ :eyes:
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wilt the stilt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-25-10 11:41 AM
Response to Original message
1. only 19 deaths
no big deal
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HopeHoops Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-25-10 11:42 AM
Response to Original message
2. And this shocks you coming from the sleaziest car manufacturer?
I won't even RIDE in one of their products.

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CanonRay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-25-10 11:44 AM
Response to Original message
3. Another soulless, greedy corporation
Charge Toyota with the murder of the 19 people, and make the officers serve the sentence. Corporate personhood my ass.
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MindPilot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-25-10 12:03 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. Might be kind of difficult to do since Toyota is Japanese company.
which actually raises a question. Do US corporations now have the same freedom to openly meddle in politics of other countries as they do here, and is the reverse true?
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flvegan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-25-10 11:48 AM
Response to Original message
4. I think that it sucks that the Vibe wasn't announced as part of it.
It's not GM's fault that Toyota contracted some crappy part from some supplier, but they should have mentioned it at least for the safety of their customers.
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MindPilot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-25-10 11:51 AM
Response to Original message
5. The very sad thing is it wasn't a problem until a cop got killed.
Edited on Mon Jan-25-10 12:00 PM by MindPilot
Had it been Joe A. Workingman whose car suddenly accelerated out of control, it would have been just another crash.

But since it was a cop--and we all know they are special people, just plain more deserving than us mere civilians--the incident got international media, an NHTSA investigation and the attention of the car company.

"...because the defect trend had picked up. "The quickness that this all came together is one reason why I don't have numbers" of complaints, the automaker's U.S. safety spokesman, John Hanson, says. "And why we don't have a fix.""

The San Diego CHP crash happened in late August, and with that publicity, came the all the reports from other people who experienced sudden acceleration problems but hadn't said anything because they thought it was just them. That's why the "defect trend has picked up".

Reporting a sudden acceleration problem is roughly equivalent to a UFO sighting.
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MissMillie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-25-10 12:33 PM
Response to Original message
7. I traded in my '98 corolla in '06
sometime before I traded it, I had a stuck accelerator pedal problem.

There's no way ANY of this is "news" to them.

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madrchsod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-25-10 01:21 PM
Response to Original message
8. i never had a "sticking throttle problem" with any car i`ve had
i did have a problem with the rubber boot connection on my 3cyl two cycle saab...it would fall off when it was really hot.
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aikoaiko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-25-10 01:48 PM
Response to Original message
9. Do you think Toyota's response is better, worse, or about the same as US car makers

For example, to the Ford truck fire issues.
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DainBramaged Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-25-10 03:28 PM
Response to Reply #9
14. For example, this is 2010, why not go back to something relevant say
Toyota frame rusting issues or Toyota engine sludge issues of just a few short years ago. In BOTH of those instances they literally prevented massive class-action suits by recalling the vehicles at the 11th hour.


Your example is simply ignorant.
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aikoaiko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-25-10 04:50 PM
Response to Reply #14
17. Wow, such defensiveness.


I wonder why?
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FarCenter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-25-10 01:55 PM
Response to Original message
10. Toyota should know better than to buy parts from an American company in Elkhart, Indiana
http://www.ctscorp.com/investor_relations/annual_report...

Item 1. Business
CTS Corporation (CTS, we, our, us or the Company) is a global manufacturer of electronic components and sensors
and a supplier of electronics manufacturing services. CTS was established in 1896 as a provider of high-quality telephone
products and was incorporated as an Indiana corporation in February 1929. The principal executive offices are located in
Elkhart, Indiana.

We design, manufacture, assemble, and sell a broad line of electronic components and sensors and provide electronics
manufacturing services primarily to original equipment manufacturers (OEMs), for the automotive, computer, communications,
medical, industrial, and defense and aerospace markets. We operate manufacturing facilities located throughout North America,
Asia, and Europe and serve major markets globally. Sales and marketing are accomplished through our sales engineers,
independent manufacturers representatives, and distributors.

<SNIP>

Components and sensors are products which perform specific electronic functions for a given product family and are intended
for use in customer assemblies. Components and sensors consist principally of automotive sensors and actuators used in
commercial or consumer vehicles; electronic components used in communications infrastructure and computer markets;
components used in computer and other high-speed applications, switches, resistor networks, and potentiometers used to serve
multiple markets; and fabricated piezoelectric materials and substrates used primarily in medical, industrial and defense and
aerospace markets.
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wilt the stilt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-25-10 02:52 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. they don't recall for production issues
they recall for engineering issues.
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FarCenter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-25-10 03:12 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. From the article, it is clear that it is a CTS Corporation problem
Unless there is joint detail design and production engineering between Toyota and CTS. Note that the equivalent parts from their Japanese supplier, Denso, are not faulty. It's better to get Japanese brand cars assembled in Japan to minimize the number of American parts in them.


Toyota says the potentially faulty pedals came from a CTS facility in Streetsville, Ontario. CTS has not returned calls asking for comment.

Toyota says drivers whose throttles stick open should shift into neutral, pull off the road and call a dealer. Dealers have been told to help on a "case-by-case basis," until Toyota can fix the problem.

Adler says GM dealers would do so, too. He says that no Vibe owners have reported the problem. Adler says the recall repairs will be made by GM's Buick and GMC dealers.

Toyota won't say how much leeway dealers have whether, for example, they can install new pedal assemblies, or provide long-term loaner cars until there is a recall remedy.

Toyota says the problem appears to be due to premature wear of some mechanical parts in the CTS throttle assemblies. Hanson says that means new vehicles should be risk-free, at least long enough for Toyota to come up with a fix.

Throttle-pedal assemblies from Toyota's other supplier, Denso, are not all interchangeable, eliminating that as a quick-fix solution, Toyota says.

CTS also supplies throttle assemblies to Honda, Nissan and Mitsubishi. Those companies say their designs are different and pose no risk of sticking open.

Hanson says the first symptom of the latest throttle problem is when the gas pedal feels rough, instead of smooth, when the driver presses down. The next stage: The throttle pedal doesn't return promptly when the driver lets off. Finally, the throttle sticks open even after the driver's foot is removed.

Hanson says drivers should contact dealers if they experience the first step and not wait for the gas pedal to begin working sluggishly. "We don't want that vehicle on the road, and we want to keep that owner mobile. We'll do whatever we can on a case-by-case basis," Hanson says.

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DainBramaged Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-25-10 03:21 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. So, after the day has gone by, you are exposing yourself as defending Toyota
Edited on Mon Jan-25-10 03:22 PM by DainBramaged
you have NO idea where the fault lies, and unless you're a paid Toyota shill or lawyer, why don't you stop assuming and trying to prove to us that you have a clue. The NHTSA says there is a serious problem, and the name TOYOTA is on the cars with the problem, not CTS.


CTS also supplies throttle assemblies to Honda, Nissan and Mitsubishi. Those companies say their designs are different and pose no risk of sticking open.
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FarCenter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-25-10 04:04 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. Well Toyota was clearly at fault in going with this supplier
It looks like CTS was a component supplier and contract manufacturer to the communications business. The Streetsville, Ontario factory was likely a suppier to the now-defunct Nortel. If you look up their stock chart, you see a classic dotcom bubble pattern. They were $80 / share in 1999 and are $8 now.

So they get into the automotive business, but they probably don't understand the hostile environment that automotive components have to work in.
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DainBramaged Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-25-10 04:10 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. Once again, you have NO clue as to what is wrong here
and you are simply making yourself look foolish with your spouting.....


Give it a break.
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bluecollarcharlie Donating Member (171 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-27-10 06:56 PM
Response to Reply #16
18. Amen, brother.
That last post of FarCenter's was FAROUT in left field. There are reports that Toyota knew of this as far back 2002. They only decided to do something when people started dying behind the wheel. But i guess i understand FarCenter's perscetive. If you've spent an entire life wildly and blindly bashing GM Ford or Chrysler for the tiniesr of defects this Toyota thing gives you nowhere to go.
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