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Conservative Ted Olson on Gay Marriage...it's not what you think...

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CaliforniaPeggy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 02:24 AM
Original message
Conservative Ted Olson on Gay Marriage...it's not what you think...
From this week's Newsweek:

Together with my good friend and occasional courtroom adversary David Boies, I am attempting to persuade a federal court to invalidate California's Proposition 8the voter-approved measure that overturned California's constitutional right to marry a person of the same sex.

My involvement in this case has generated a certain degree of consternation among conservatives. How could a politically active, lifelong Republican, a veteran of the Ronald Reagan and George W. Bush administrations, challenge the "traditional" definition of marriage and press for an "activist" interpretation of the Constitution to create another "new" constitutional right?

My answer to this seeming conundrum rests on a lifetime of exposure to persons of different backgrounds, histories, viewpoints, and intrinsic characteristics, and on my rejection of what I see as superficially appealing but ultimately false perceptions about our Constitution and its protection of equality and fundamental rights.

Many of my fellow conservatives have an almost knee-jerk hostility toward gay marriage. This does not make sense, because same-sex unions promote the values conservatives prize. Marriage is one of the basic building blocks of our neighborhoods and our nation. At its best, it is a stable bond between two individuals who work to create a loving household and a social and economic partnership. We encourage couples to marry because the commitments they make to one another provide benefits not only to themselves but also to their families and communities. Marriage requires thinking beyond one's own needs. It transforms two individuals into a union based on shared aspirations, and in doing so establishes a formal investment in the well-being of society. The fact that individuals who happen to be gay want to share in this vital social institution is evidence that conservative ideals enjoy widespread acceptance. Conservatives should celebrate this, rather than lament it.


The whole article at link:

http://www.newsweek.com/id/229957

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MrModerate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 02:30 AM
Response to Original message
1. Well, color me gobsmacked . . .
A conservative who has a genuinely conservative view of marriage -- i.e., a social institution that strengthens us all when extended to those who sincerely wish to participate.
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CaliforniaPeggy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 02:35 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. I also felt gobsmacked.
I wanted all of DU to see this too.

He's quite persuasive...

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nosmokes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 02:35 AM
Response to Original message
3. See, the concept ain't that hard to get aholt of. K&R
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regnaD kciN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 03:34 AM
Response to Original message
4. The problem is, for most conservatives...
...the issue isn't "gay marriage," but "gay sex." Legalizing gay marriage would mean granting approved legal sanction to a situation where one guy was allowed to put his thing in another man's thing. And we simply can't allow that!!!

:wow:

Seriously, if someone could come up with a new category of "gay marriage," in which two individuals of the same sex were allowed to marry and have all the rights and responsibilities of heterosexual married couples, but were required by law (with draconian penalties for its violation) to live a celibate life within that marriage, never once having any sort of genital contact between the two partners, conservatives would be all for it.

It's not the marriage, it's the sex...which is why all the good legal, philosophical, or theological reasons for allowing same-sex marriage will make no headway at all with most conservatives, because all the logic in the world won't overcome their horror at the mental image of two men doing that...and their determination that everything possible under the law be done to prevent it from happening. :eyes:

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eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 05:43 AM
Response to Reply #4
6. +10 n/t
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kevinbgoode Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 06:50 AM
Response to Reply #4
9. Hell, I thought con-artist con-servatives already believed
that there was only one acceptable form of heterosexual sex allowed, even within a marriage. Well, except for the elites - who, being conservatives, have the divine right to engage in sexual activities with anything and anyone else they choose - preferably outside of marriage.
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CaliforniaPeggy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 10:41 AM
Response to Reply #4
11. I'm sure you noticed...
He did not talk about "gay sex" at all.

I kept waiting for him to do that, but he didn't.

And BTW, you're not married until that marriage has been consummated; and that requires sex...

Just sayin.


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distantearlywarning Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 05:29 AM
Response to Original message
5. Fantastic article!
:applause:
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zbdent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 05:55 AM
Response to Original message
7. was looking at his page, and Barbara's ... no mention of children ...
maybe she was his beard? Could that be why he is for this issue?
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marshall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 06:44 AM
Response to Original message
8. This does point out a convergence between political ideology and social policy
I haven't heard it voice in a while, but a few years ago many in the gay community rejected the notion of marriage because of its conservative nature and its sexist baggage. It's interesting to see an evolution that involves both sides of the political spectrum.
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Bluenorthwest Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 07:24 AM
Response to Reply #8
10. Well many still do. As do many straight people.
This would never mean that the law should reject marriage for them. One can not in fact reject that which one is not allowed to take, you know?
I personally would not join the military, and when I heard of those gay people wanting in equally, I thought they were nuts to want this. But equal is equal. It does not have to be what I want. It just has to be what is right.
I offer some terms. We are shaking up, this is my old man, my baby's daddy, we don't need a piece of paper. VS saving 'it' for marriage, this is my one soul mate, my forever spouse, we can prove that with a piece of paper. So I'd just say that among straight people I see a range of views on marriage, a range of ways and means for marriage, from Mormons to Liz Taylor. From RCC to Jolie.
So why do you assume that many in the gay community do not continue to reject marriage, just as many in the straight community always have? Again, most people understand that a thing which is denied you is not a thing you have the power to reject or embrace. And I know no one that supported the idea of equality denied. Never heard 'we should not be able to marry' although I have heard 'marriage is not for me' from both straight and gay people.
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tk2kewl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 01:47 PM
Response to Original message
12. This is a great quote:
"And, while our Constitution guarantees the freedom to exercise our individual religious convictions, it equally prohibits us from forcing our beliefs on others."

so obvious, yet so many don't get it.
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CaliforniaPeggy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 02:13 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. It IS a great quote.
It needs to be shouted from the rooftops.

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