The Dismantlement of the American Middle Class

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

Interesting to watch, isn't it? Kind of sucks to be an unwilling participant.

You could say that the rise of a prosperous, stable, educated, American middle class was one of the defining achievements of the last century. It's dismantlement will be a defining moment of this century for most Americans.

Education is out of reach for many now, or comes with an absolutely crushing debt burden.

Healthcare was and will remain unaffordable to many even AFTER reform.There will still be medical bankruptcies due to co-pays and deductibles.

The unemployment rate is higher than we know, since once people drop off the unemployment rolls or "stop looking"(how would they even know that?) they are not counted in our statistics.

Whole cities and towns are decimated as their employment bases are outsourced never to return.

Some amusing things have come to light recently. How cool is it that the life insurance of peasants is used to fund executive bonuses? You have to love the perverse minds that come up with that one and ran it by their boards with no problem. I imagine the mid-level moron in accounting who came up with the initial idea lost his job in a merge, ended up losing everything, but died with the comfort of knowing that at minimum his worthless life enabled his former bosses to have a house in the Hamptons and ski in Aspen every year. "At least I had that, " he murmurs, before drifting off to eternal slumber.

A directive has apparently been issued - it is officially open season on the American citizen. Pluck them, plunder them, overwork them, underpay them, poison them, tax them, monitor them, mandate them. They won't mind. Really.

Or, perhaps at some point, they will mind. They might even get angry. The Tea Baggers are the first wave of incoherent rage that is slowly wafting over the populace and percolating down to previously untapped levels. There is some unity within the discordance - Tea Baggers, Liberals, Republicans, Democrats, Independents, Libertarians can all come together and agree on one thing - our entire government has been co-opted and does not work for the common good of the American citizen.

A movement that surpasses Party is needed. This mess is bigger than Party confines and Platforms. There is too much free -floating energy out there - nature abhors a vacuum and this energy is looking for a channel. I think that a new social or political movement will arise in the near future - history demands it. In my personal opinion, this country is at a historical tipping point.

[cap]

1. absolutely correct... I do strategic planning and this is what I am telling my clients

in more couched language.

[Name removed]

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[Name removed]

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[Craftsman]

2. And the democratic party has been voted for to help the middle class

Is the one doing the damage now.

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

4. I agree. And they have lost credibility as the Party of the People

as we used to recognize them. They were for labor, civil rights, etc against Repubs who were always for Business and the Haves.

We don't have those distinctions anymore. The Dems got in with sweeping victories for people hungering for that old vision and some real reforms and we are left pretty much high and dry.

Everyone is trying to figure out, what next? Who can I support that will support me? Liberals have been told to STFU and sit at the back of the bus while they nurse their soon to disappear "angst", only it ain't disappearing.

[Craftsman]

6. The dems now are like the reps, party of the Wall Street people

Main Street is gettign the shaft from both sides.

[tbyg52]

43. >>sit at the back of the bus

No, *under* the bus.

[arthritisR_US]

109. damn, I want to disagree with you all and alas I can't :( n/t

[icee]

44. And Barack Obama is leading the charge against it. Amazing.

[Betsy Ross]

60. When I was a child, I asked my mother what the Democrats stood for.

She replied "human rights and the working class." I continue to live with this notion no matter how much evidence I see to the contrary.

[KharmaTrain]

3. The Middle Class Never Made It To This Century...

I look at the statistics that show that the average income has either stagnated or decreased over the past 30 years. I look at the need for two incomes to provide for a family compared to only one in the 50s and 60s. I look at the costs for my first year in college in 1973 ($2,000 for the entire year, including room and board) vs. $25-30,000 a year today. This isn't new...it's been going on for years. The middle class only existed as a marketing tool...since many who were supposedly in that classification were pushed further and further into debt.

The sad story is the rise of the middle class was short-lived...from about 1946 to 1980. Since that time we've seen a rise in poverty and the majority have had to squeeze more and more month out of every paycheck. There's many reason for the collapse of the middle class...but greed ranks at the top of the list. It does go beyond party and politics and to the soul of this country...one that values material possessions over a person's dignity or self-worth. It's a society that was enamoured with greed and consumption, not shared sacrafice or mutual respect. And we're far away from seeing this trend reverse.

The sad truth is while people are outraged, they're either too lazy or numbed to do much but bitch. A new "social" movement is a wonderful concept, but it requires a mindset that doesn't exist. When more people are concerned about a golfer's sex life or the latest crap from TMZ and couldn't be bothered with a political system they have no faith in...it's a matter of self survival. I don't see the teabaggers as a vanguard in any "movement" either as the astroturfed wind in their sails has faded...less people at their hatefests and no electoral victories to their credit.

As one whose worked campaigns and spoke with voters and "average citizens" for the past 20 years, its easy to see this tune-out and cynicism...and it's directed at both parties and political persuassions. The Paulbot and Teabaggers (part and parcel) may go off on their own...try the third party route in 2012 on their way to joining Ross Perot on history's ash heap.

Yes, a revolution is needed, but inside the existing walls not outside...to take advantage of that power vacuum by organizing and mobilizing progressives and liberals to do what the rushpublicans have done for the past 30 years...build influence through votes and numbers. It means re-organizing and rejuvenating a labor movement that let the workers down and stood idly by as the middle class vanished. Most important, it means reinventing a society that isn't selfish...and that's going to take a long time. Good luck...

[Vinca]

9. The big slide downward began with Reagan's 1980 victory.

His trickle down theory finally worked, but it's not money that's pooling around my feet.

[havbrush]

68. Never made it to this Century

Love your comments. You are absolutely right about the selfishness and greed that has taken over. A shared feeling of unity and sacrifice never really developed completely in the country because the evils of racism and classism were exploited by many unscrupulous rich, and too many poor, middle and working class whites bought into it and did the dirty work of dividing and being conquered by our system as they excluded blacks, latins, native Americans and many Asians from sharing in the bounty of the country. It goes back throughout our history but now middle and working class whites are as expendable as blacks, latins, native Americans and many Asians used to be as capitalism finds lower wage costs in other countries. Who cares if middle and working class people have decent wages anymore? They'll soon be poor, and you only need poor people now to fight wars.

[olegramps]

92. The working class abandoned organized labor and fucked themselves.

The only force that can deal with corporations is labor unions. The only force that can make the working class' concerns of primary importance to politicans are unions. Following WWII 36% of the work force was unionized and it was during this period that working class people enjoyed good standard of living. Today only 6% of the work force is unionized and the workers wonder how their jobs got out-sourced, their pensions cut and health insurance cancelled. The Democratic Party will represent the working class only when the workers are united in their demands. The working class screwed themselves when they bought the corporate line that management would take good care of them. I worked during the period in which I saw younger workers refusing to join the union, but of course eagerly accepting all the benefits that the union had won. These are the scabs that brought it upon themselves and now are crying that their jobs has been outsourced.

[PassingFair]

95. +1

I don't know HOW many times I have listened to
a "middle class" person trash unions, and
I LIVE IN MICHIGAN! Flabbergasting!

They don't know ANY history.

The unions did little to stop the bleeding,
only rarely showing up for PR opportunities
and political activities.

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

96. I think everyone should distribute copies of John Sayles' " Matewan"

I'd love to run it on a double bill with Oliver Stone's "Wall Street".

On another note, the cubiclization of America was an ironic little side class war. White collar workers in cubicle cities do not identify themselves as "labor" and are divorced from the issues of blue collar workers, or so they think (wrongly)

I identify the working class, whether blue or white collar as anyone whose income is almost entirely derived from a paycheck as opposed to stock options, bonuses, or 1099 DIV/INTEREST income (I know that many sale professions are independent contractors paid on 1099s - to me another scam, perpetrated in order to deny these workers benefits, in my opinion.

[arthritisR_US]

110. yep, yep and yep..you're all dead on IMHO. n/t

[clear eye]

104. I think you may be reading folks wrong.

They are very angry, but they are cynical of anything beginning from w/i the existing political structure. They would be much more likely to respond to an umbrella group of NGOs united around restoring responsive gov't, than they would to something from either of the two parties or even a 3rd party. Do you recall the Nuclear Disarmament mobilizations? Of course the coalition would have to have more specific demands and be willing to take things further than they were, but the point is they mobilized millions of "regular" people.

[ParkieDem]

114. You may be right ...

... but what scares me is the idea that the bulk of our economic success from 1946 to the early 1980s was due to the fact that there was virtually no capacity for industrial production anywhere else in the world after WWII.

I think we oftentimes lose sight of that fact. After WWII, Europe was devastated. The only country with any semblance of an industrial plant was the UK, and that was severely damaged, as were the finances in the exchequer. The Soviet Union was virtually bulldozed as well. Japan was destroyed. China was a poor backwater, as was India. Places like Canada and Australia were unharmed, but they had very small populations.

The United States, on the other hand, saw a ramp-up in wartime production that didn't stop after V-J day. We were simply able to convert our military plants to civilian use (of course, many of them were civilian to start with). The rest of the world needed cars, steel, and all sorts of other equipment, but had no means to produce it themselves. This lack of supply elsewhere allowed our labor unions to negotiate great deals for American workers, providing them with jobs, health care, vacations, retirement, and a standard of living that resulted in great social stability.

What people don't realize, though, is that a large portion of our economy back then was export-oriented, just like it is today. As Europe and Japan redeveloped, they naturally came to realize that they could make formerly US-produced goods at home. All of a sudden, we weren't the only game in town anymore. In the 1990s, China and India began to develop in earnest, further exacerbating this trend. It's no wonder our jobs have gone abroad.

Of course, the solution to this is to abandon free trade agreements that ship jobs overseas. But what about the other countries? They will just follow suit, closing those export markets ot American producers. I'm not sure this is the answer.

Bottom line, we desperately need ideas to foster American competitiveness in the post-postwar era.

[HughBeaumont]

5. Recommended, except . . .

. . . do we really have commonalities with TeaBirthers? It's a little less than coincidental that this movement, rightfully one that should have commenced when Bewsh was, you know, DOUBLING the NATIONAL DEBT, started the minute it was apparent that Mc/Failin wasn't headed to the White House to continue the Bewsh hostage situation. It was started because the newly elected president was a) black and b) a Democrat.

I'd like to think I don't have anything in common with laissez-fail idiots who think we're in the situation we're in because the markets "aren't free enough". I don't think taxes need to be lowered even further, that corporations deserve their breaks, that the Bewsh occupations are morally justified and the correct thing to do, that wealthy people earn what they do because they're "smarter" and "more talented", that America is going to survive another decade with unbridled corporatism as the standard bearer.

These people are wrong. Their anger has nothing to do with the corporate co-opting of government (primarily because many of them foolishly don't even believe such a phenomenon exists) and everything to do with the fact that our president is a) black and b) a Democrat.

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

7. What we have in common is anger and the sense that government is failing us.

They think Federal government does too much, while speaking for myself, I feel it does too little.

We all identify the same problems, but we see vastly different solutions.

If the Supreme Court throws all campaign finance reforms out the window, the game is pretty much over unless and until we actually have citizens in the streets demanding the representation they deserve above and beyond the pervasive corruption and we reform campaign finance laws.

[lunatica]

11. I agree. Teabaggers are also organized by their (and our) enemy.

But there is a ray of light. Fewer and fewer teabaggers are going to the protests.

[Name removed]

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[Caretha]

64. Well put n/t

[Name removed]

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[stuart68]

89. unfortunately

this is exactly what politicians want you to believe. It keeps tv ratigns up and people divided. While divided, they justifiably say "I am listening to my constituents" while not really listening to anyone.

HC is a perfect example - politicians take the universal (I believe) notion that no one should loose all they have due to catastrophic illness. I would speculate if you polled this you would see 99% support. The paths diverge as you move from there, but the point is that we now have a complete POS bill that frankly serves no one other than the politicians. No universal coverage, now no elimination of pre-existing conditions - I am not really sure what is still in there of any value, other than the name HC which they believe will put them in the history books.

Ask them if they will be participating in the plan and you realize that, dem or repub, they have complete disregard for the rest of us.

[Vinnie From Indy]

8. Bravo!

I couldn't agree more!

The deluge of propaganda raining down on Americans from our corrupt media will become less and less effective. People will start believeing their lying eyes more than the TV eventually and they will get angry.

[Blue Meany]

10. The Disposable Middle-Class

I've long suspected that a large middle-class and relatively prosperous working-class were viewed by capitalist leaders as essential during the Cold War. After all, if the Soviet Union were able to deliver better living standards to the masses, then maybe socialism would be viewed as superior; moreover social scientists from that time period argued that a large middle class was the bulwark of a stable society, so a strong middle class innoculated the US from the socialist revolutions that were occuring elsewhere in the world. Thus, there were numerous federal subsidies to expand the middle class: the GI bill, highways to newly built suburbs; subsidies to colleges, subsidized housing loans, etc. During the early post-World War II these were paid for by taxes on corporations (which paid living wages to employees and offered retirement programs and health benifits) and by high income taxes on the wealth. To the World War II generation, the American Dream seemed tangibly real: if you worked hard, you could get ahead, own a home, and have financial security.

Once the Cold War was over, the dismantling of the middle-class began rather quickly: unions were busted; subsidies to education were dimished; jobs were outsourced, wages pushed down, and defined benifit retirement plans eliminated; taxes on the wealthy and corporations were decreased, leading to deficits, decreased government spending, and increased taxes on working people. For a time, the entry of women into the workforce hid what was happening, since with two incomes families could still maintain a middle-class life-style. But the trend is clear and it is continuing. The only thing that is likely to change it is an organized social movement among working people of all stripes.

[lunatica]

12. Interesting thoughts

I've wondered what the solution could be. I haven't found it pleasant to live with the American way of life since Reagan was elected and I perceived the deadly trap meant to bleed the middle class while we weren't looking. So I'm not for restoring or rebuilding anything because it was all only an empty illusion in the first place.

In my mind we (the US) were 'too big to fail'. After 9/11 I scoffed at the idea that an attack on some buildings thousands of miles away would affect the rest of the country. Then came post 9/11 and we found out that even Bin Laden probably didn't dare to dream of such a success. He wanted to effectively destroy us economically fully understanding the domino effect of terrorism and I say he has. Of course, that is, if he even had anything to do with that attack.

[izquierdista]

17. The Soviet experience

They did deliver a better living standard to the masses -- up until 1964. If you examine the devastation that was common all over the Soviet Union in 1945, and compare it to 1960, when everyone had an apartment and they were ahead in the space race, they DID deliver. But where we had Reagan, they had Brezhnev, a kleptocrat who let progress grind to a halt while only party members got the fruits of the society's labor. He ruined the Soviet Union in much the same way as Reagan: unions represented the Party and not the rank and file, higher education became for Party member's children, wages were kept down, pensions allowed to wither in value, etc.

Back in 1960, there was a growing middle-class in the Soviet Union, yet today, countries of the former Soviet Union have lots and lots of poor people, with a few billionaires living in castles. Kind of where the US is headed.

[Blue Meany]

28. Of course socialism increased the living standards

of the masses in Russia, just as it has done elsewhere, but, of course, a second-rate industrial power could not bring them up to American middle-class standards. There also used to be frequent comparisons of the economies of West and East Germany, which neglected to mention that West German idustry benifited from the Marshall Plan and reduced all differences to the economic systems. The Marshall Plan was explicit in its goal to create a bulwark against communism, so it is not so far out of line to suppose that there might have been a similar plan for America.

[nvme]

84. werent 44 million lives extinguish under the noble pursuit

of socialism?

[newspeak]

107. no, and it wasn't actually communism

even though Stalin espoused ideals of communism, I'd say he was actually a tyrannical dictator and Russia was rule by an agrarian oligarchy.

[whathehell]

49. You make an interesting point regarding the "need" for the middle class during the Cold War.

[Demeter]

54. Verrry Interesting!

Perhaps, or maybe those who rose out of the Middle Class have forgotten their roots, and bought into the Exceptionalism delusion, not to mention the Entitlement Delusion.

Shirtsleeves to shirtsleeves: they got it coming. Let's see that they get it.

[havbrush]

65. Exceptionalism and Entitlement

Your comments are so on-point. So many Americans bought into the fiction that we were living in the exceptional land of the free and the home of the brave, defending democracy and human rights throughout the world -- we're number one, we're number one -- and all of that, while our government was really a well disguised form of, God, I hate to say it, fascism, with the corporations and their CEOs and Chairmen actual calling the shots as they bought more and more senators and congressmen with campaign donations. The definition of fascism is when government, the military and corporations meld to dominate the society. Just think of all the troop deployments we've had and continue to have over the last century. Those troops were protecting American interests, it's even stated that way. That's fascism. Those interests are the interest of corporations -- Big Oil and the lot. It's just become more evident now that they have no need for the middle class anymore and people are waking up. Communism bit the dust so there's no need for a middle class now that there is no competition between ideologies anymore -- capitalism 'won' and communism, a form of socialism, lost. Or so the capitalists want everyone to believe as they ship our jobs overseas. Who really lost is the middle and working class and our country. Capitalism, because of it's nature, can't sustain itself without higher and higher profits and 'growth.' We gotten to the point that the 'growth' and profits can only come now by seeking lower and lower wage costs. And that means screw middle class families here and their sense of entitlement to a decent wage, home and education. That's not necessary anymore for capitalism to thrive. The fat cats only need our transitional 'service economy' where we don't really manufacture much anymore, and more and more of us shop at Walmart and eat and work at fast food joints. That is while we still have some change in our pockets because we're transitioning into a society with the rich and 'not rich', poor really. Soon the larger economies of China and India will be the dominant markets where capitalism finds its middle class consumers. I wonder then will the 'not rich' take to the street, ala the French Revolution. Not the American one which was a rebellion of land owning white gentry where blacks, native Americans and women need not apply.

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

57. Labor is starting to stir.

The American working class is a sleeping giant tired of working for shit wages while the upper tier takes it all.

I agree with others that the real diminishment of the middle class in general and labor in particular began in earnest with Ronald Reagan.

[arthritisR_US]

111. +1. n/t

[Robeson]

78. Excellent points. We never did get that "Peace Dividend"...

...did we?

[mod mom]

13. My husband heard that 40% of architects are out of work in Ohio. Just one field

but indicative of this dismantlement of which you speak. I agree this is beyond party-especially when the party is supporting the ones who caused this mess in the first place. :mad:

rec'd.

[coyote]

14. Here is a great video lecture by law scholar Elizabeth Warren

The Coming Collapse of the Middle Class

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=akVL7QY0S8A

Distinguished law scholar Elizabeth Warren teaches contract law, bankruptcy, and commercial law at Harvard Law School. She is an outspoken critic of America's credit economy, which she has linked to the continuing rise in bankruptcy among the middle-class. Series: "UC Berkeley Graduate Council Lectures

[snot]

67. Glad you mentioned that -- it's GREAT.

[bertman]

70. Just coincidentally, she's the chair of the Congressional Oversight Panel for the banking

bailout, and one of the few people in D.C. who appears to be trying to look out for Americans who are not of the ruling class.

Thanks for posting that, coyote.

[tularetom]

15. If the middle class goes down it will take the entire American economy with it

Consumer spending is what makes our economy go. With more and more middle class Americans losing their jobs and means of spending, the corporations who now import crap from China will find they have no market here for their crap.

[Craftsman]

16. That maybe their idea.

It is a power and money grab, TPTB do not care if we live in card board as long as they get richer.

[tularetom]

19. Yabbut, if we live in cardboard we will not buy the crap they produce

and if we don't buy their crap they will not get very much richer.

For all his xenophobia and anti semitism, Henry Ford did as much to create the American middle class as FDR. He paid his workers enough that they could afford to buy the automobiles they produced. This was a radical concept at the time and one that seems to be ignored by today's corporatists.

What good will it do them to have all the money in the world if they have to spend it all on security to protect them from us?

[Craftsman]

22. The serfs in the middle ages did not buy much either but the nobles lived

well in their estates.

[bertman]

71. Exactly, Craftsman. And they paid their protective services well enough to keep them from

rising against them.

[femrap]

25. China which has an

enormous population is seeing a large Middle Class formation that is ready and willing to buy, buy, buy and keep up with the Jones. They pollute their environment and eventually bottom out just like us someday...it's all cyclical.

But they don't need no f*cking US markets.

WASF.

[Caretha]

66. Think China & India

that's the next consumer base.

[newspeak]

108. corporatists of today do not care of America goes down

since most are global, in a global market--they could give a shite about Americans or communities here. I'd say that some of these corporations, that feed off of our money, like vampires are sociopathic in nature. Nothing counts but the bottom line and power. It's the NWO baby, just like Poppy and Kissenger stated. What do you think the NWO is and who does it benefit? Definitely not the plebes--it's actually the old world order who have global takeover thinking. Imagine a corporation being so big that it does not abide by laws or is accountable to any government or people in the world.

Now there are some on the extreme right who are so afraid of the UN--afraid that the UN is going to take over the country--but they're free market, anti-union corporate loving sheep. Afraid of the UN, but not afraid of a corporation like GE, Monsanto or XE taking over their country.

Over five years ago, I asked are we purposely being dismantled? Some here said they didn't think it was by design--I'm thinking it is.

[WeCanWorkItOut]

18. But I would suggest that it began (sorry to say this) with Medicare

Suddenly the price of health care began to rise,
and doctors began to get much, much more wealthy.
Far better paid that scientists.
Hospitals began to make much more money.
And it began to hurt workers and communities.
That was the era, in the seventies,
described by Uwe Reinhardt (one our best health economists)
as "the Health Care Feast."
But somehow, most people didn't notice that something
was fundamentally wrong.

Later, other problems. NAFTA, the various
subsidized bubbles. All the union-busting,
partly paid for by communities (factories import
half-paid labor, let the communities to pay the rest
of their costs). Huge corporate abuses, and more.

But it's important to realize, I suggest, that we have
two sides to the tragedy of the Middle Class.
And one side is the severe limitations on learning,
training and working.

[rhett o rick]

20. For profit insurance for primary care is the culprit. Without welfare our seniors would live in the

emergency rooms. For profit insurance companies would never cover the high risk citizens over 65.

[laughingliberal]

30. Interesting

I'm wondering, however, how other countries who provide health care to all their citizens managed to avoid this problem. Perhaps the fact that we bought into the solution in the 80's that the free markets would fix healthcare by lowering costs and improving quality has something to do with all this. I'm not bashing your theory. I'm just asking how it is that providing health care for our seniors started us on the path of destroying our working class and other developed nations covered their entire citizenry without those dire consequences?

[kenny blankenship]

37. how other countries who provide health care to all their citizens managed to avoid this problem

Because they don't listen to miserable assholes like Uwe Rheinhardt. He has to come here to spread his elitist, death-to-the-workers filth.

[bertman]

72. If you're responding to WeCanWorkItOut, you're making the wrong assumption based on his

erroneous premise. WE didn't buy into the "free market" concept of medical care. It was foisted upon us as another profit-making venture by the same folks who kept Truman's "Socialist" efforts at medical care at bay and who have fought off reform for over 50 years.

The idea that Medicare was the beginning of the problem of middle-class disenfranchisement is absurd. The folks who have been pulling the strings since WWII (the financial elites) have gradually been tightening the noose on the middle class as part of their plan to control the world economy and dominate anyone who stands in their way. President Eisenhower tried to warn us in his MIC speech which he changed from "Military-Industrial-Congressional Complex" to Military -Industrial Complex at the urging of his top advisors.

Use the American taxpayers to fund the global hegemony of the new Corporate States of America while lowering taxes on the richest Americans. Turn the American representative form of government into a Corporate patronage proxy government. Undermine workers rights and reduce social welfare programs. Dismantle social security and Medicare and Medicaid (currently underway) and beef up the corporate-controlled police state and prisons-for-profit industry. But do it all slowly and blame it on the "socialists" and liberals.

Just sayin'.

[Raster]

81. Thank you!

This is THE post to recommend in this thread in addition to the OP!

[bertman]

116. It was my pleasure, Raster. nt

[rhett o rick]

21. "A movement that surpasses Party is needed." Hits it on the nose. How do we get this

movement started?

[Vidar]

23. K&R.

[femrap]

24. I believe that

TPTB have set up this Dem/Rep or Left/Right paradigm as a total DISTRACTION.

As we can see, there isn't much difference between them. They both uphold the Corporations and Greed.

We need to look at the US's situation as one of Have and Have Nots. Working people are being pitted against each other. If only working people were to unite.....

Good post...thanks.

[autorank]

26. Their big adventure is paying off

This has to be intentional since all of the subordinate acts creating it are intentional.

They used to see us as "suckers," but now we're serfs.

[bvar22]

27. Look to the south.....

No, not the South as in the Southern States, but the "south" as in Latin America.

Populist Reforms have swept across an entire continent.
These reforms have been nothing short of a bloodless revolution.
The local people have organized and voted out the oligarchs.

We CAN do the same here as soon as we realize that the lower 99% of Americans share a common enemy.

I have MORE in common with the Teabaggers than I have in common with someone in the Ownership Class.

I fear things will have to get a lot worse before they start getting better.


"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable."
John F. Kennedy, In a speech at the White House, 1962

[laughingliberal]

32. Yes, I've been watching the situation in South America with interest

Of course, it pisses me off that the US continues to support or ignore the deposing of democratically elected leaders by right wing fascists but, nonetheless, the people of South and Central America have, obviously, figured out who stands for their interests.

The teabaggers are an interesting question. Their problems are, obviously, being caused by the same corporate control of our government that ours are caused by but they are unaware of the source of the problems. I have been communicating with a friend of ours who borders on teabagger nuttery. He believes it is all about government-the Reagan crap and thinks it is about restrictive regulations on business and taxes and the whole nine yards. Buys into the whole thing about how we can all prosper if the government gets out of the way. Hates unions cause, "I can go in and stand up for my own raise based on my hard work. And if they don't give me a raise, I can move on." I think I am finally getting through to him, somewhat, by painstakingly, explaining how the corporations have grown in influence and bought the government-that the problem is not government but the control of government by corporate interests. It has been necessary to show him how the tax structure changed from falling more on those who could afford more to the workers carrying more of the burden to pay for the tax breaks the wealthy and the corporations have been getting for 30 years. He held with the "SS and Medicare haven't worked cause they're going broke," meme. I, then, explained that Medicare and SS would be fine if the government hadn't been taking his payroll taxes out of the trust fund and using it to fund military spending and other priorities and that now that the money they owe back to the fund is coming due they seek to get out of paying their debt to us. I said the reason SS and Medicare are going broke is that your government has been stealing your money and channeling it to defense contractors who are charging us outrageous amounts of money to do jobs the military once did for a fraction of the cost. That seemed to make sense to him. I told him anytime he hears anyone talk about entitlement reform he needs to know he is hearing someone advocate for stealing our SS and Medicare money so they can spend it on something else.

It has been an enormous amount of talking but the light is starting to dawn. This is the 2nd one who is starting to see what I've been saying. One good thing is we don't really have to get into the 'government good or bad,' discussion cause the bottom line is the government's collusion with the corporations to the exclusion of standing for average people is the problem. It is a little easier to educate them at this point cause everybody is pissed at Wall Street and not likely to defend them at this point. One person at a time who will, in turn, talk to others of their persuasion will get a few on board.

[leftstreet]

36. +1

:applause:

[fascisthunter]

52. it's why we have so many detractors of South American Leaders here

to poison the info well, that DU is.

[Mimosa]

55. " MORE in common with the Teabaggers than in common with someone in the Ownership Class"

Same here, BVar.

I'm angry, disappointed and feel powerless.

[bertman]

74. It is much easier to organize and vote out the oligarchs if the ballots aren't counted on the

oligarch's voting machines.

We can vote all day and all night, but when the tally comes up that our interests have lost AGAIN it will require more than "Voting them out".

[upi402]

29. There's no opposition party to corporate rule

This is sad but predictable. We're making other plans again. After Obama and the Dem majority proved to be 'more of the same' but less insane, there is no hope. America is gone. Even here at DU, there are ardent D vs R folks that foolishly think there's a significant difference between parties.

The media succesfuly painted Obama as a socialist- :cough:
He is spent and has sold his soul anyway. Too bad.

[laughingliberal]

34. Yeah, I see no real solutions except to keep telling the truth and sounding the alarms

My advice to those young enough is to do whatever it takes at this point to get training in an occupation of preference and emigrate.

[amborin]

31. K&R

[librechik]

33. What kills me is all these reforms, 40 hr work wk, women's vote, desegregation, Medicare

all were fought for over decades with major sacrifices, including lives. Now they just go away.

What are we going to have to do to get them back? Will we ever even try?

That was the miracle of the American Experiment. And our leaders are just willingly throwing it all away. Is it greed? Or the lust for power? Or is it just too hard to fight for something you don't really use and don't value.

I don't know. But to stand here and watch it happen helplessly is excruciating. I'm screaming at them to stop. But they don't. Are we supposed to throw ourselves on the tracks of this train to stop it?
We demonstrate in the millions and they just hush it up, like nothing happened. Meanwhile they obsess over trivialities.

Why are our leaders so stupid and cowardly?

[Name removed]

46. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[inna]

35. KR. Great post.

:kick:

[DisgustedInMN]

38. K&R

[flyarm]

39. K&R great thread!! Thanks! eom

[Joe the Liberal]

40. K&R n/t

[MichiganVote]

41. Interesting? Kinda sucks? Man you must have a warped sense of humor.

Kids are hungry. Men and women searching for work are demoralized. Seniors are scared to death and in the meantime the goddamn banks that have picked our pockets for years are rolling in tax payer funded bail outs and Wall Street bozo's are fucking screaming in laughter.

Yeah..interesting, kinda sucks. Talk about an understatement.

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

42. Well, it's sort of like a dissociative disorder after you've been traumatized -

the ironic detachment is a protective mechanism.

God knows I have written my share of all but truly hysterical cries for help for the many many people who fall behinder every day while pundits, commentators and pols speak, write and act like they truly have no idea what it is like to not have healthcare, a fat bank account, 2 kids in prep school and a summer house on Nantucket.

I have exhausted myself constantly thinking that the rescue ship was on the horizon, that this time the cavalry was really coming, if we could just hang on a little longer. I BELIEVED in the last election that this time it was for real - that we had actually elected a person who would fulfill the mandate of the people who elected him and all the other Dems in BOTH 2006 AND 2008 to bring the people JUSTICE and the government they want, need and deserve.

And this is where we are today. After the bank bailouts - no financial regulation or oversight anywhere in evidence, health reform mutated into a preservation society of all that is horrible with our existing system, and so on and so on.

When hope evaporates, what is left in the cup is cynicism. That is what you see in my OP.

[MichiganVote]

63. Yeah, I know. Hope my response didn't add to it. I feel the same way.

Guess you live long enough the shit sammich just gets bigger.

[amborin]

45. latest Orwellian double speak? Obama's new plan to tax banks:

"With its talk of new taxes on banks, is Team Obama reverting to its now well established pattern of crony capitalist giveaways with the occasional phony populist reform as an increasingly ineffective disguise? The extraordinarily unenthusiastic, perhaps inept by design, discussion of its plans to tax banks in some yet undetermined manner certainly says so. ....."

snip

http://www.commondreams.org/view/2010/01/12-8

[scentopine]

47. Attributed to a Sociopathic Corporate Mentality Endorsed by the "Center" -nt

[salguine]

48. The CEO/Banker class needs to be fed to the guillotines. It's that simple. Nothing else is

going to get you your country back.

[hay rick]

56. Sounds like a plan. nt

[scentopine]

58. Agree - we need a war against Wall Street -nt

[HughBeaumont]

98. MY POINT!

Stick 'em in 2 at a time. America is never going to survive another Friedmanite economy.

[BreweryYardRat]

113. No, just the CEO/CFO/Board of Directors of MAJOR national banks.

The guys who run JP Morgan, Goldman Sachs, Bank of America, etc...

Whole lot of low/mid-level bank employees are middle class. Lot of small local/regional banks have CEOs/CFOs/BoDs that don't screw over their clients, and a lot of those (there are a few exceptions) don't pay obscene salaries to their C-Level executives.

You advocate taking out a few top guys who collectively screwed over millions of people, you'll be listened to. You talk about killing people just because they (shock! horror!) work for a bank, and you'll be lucky if you don't get shot yourself.

[theFrankFactor]

50. We're With You!

[Goldstein1984]

51. The Mask of Anarchy

The last stanza of Percy Bysshe Shelley's "The Mask of Anarchy"

Written on the occasion of the massacre carried out by the British Government at Peterloo, Manchester 1819.

"Rise like Lions after slumber
In unvanquishable number -
Shake your chains to earth like dew
Which in sleep had fallen on you -
Ye are many - they are few."

The entire poem at: http://www.artofeurope.com/shelley/she5.htm

[riverbendviewgal]

53. Why can't America be like the Danes?

I watched Oprah last week and she had a show on about women around the world. One part of the show was on Denmark. Danish people have been voted the happiest people in the world.


http://www.oprah.com/article/oprahshow/20091021-tows-women-world

"For the past 30 years, scientific researchers and survey results have all reached the same conclusion—Danes are consistently happier than the rest of the world. On the "world map of happiness"—a map created by a social psychologist in England—Switzerland, Austria and Iceland rank just below Denmark on the happiness scale. Canada comes in at number 10, while the United States is a distant 23rd."

I was struck by how the Danes live...no opulence, they don't have a lot of "stuff". Their system is socialist as Oprah brought up with free health care, paid college, lose your job and get 90 percent of your wages till you find a new one.
One of the women she was talking with said, they don't think of it as socialism but rather civilized.

Wow! They seem to have no class....everyone is pretty much on an even keel. they pay high taxes but don't seem to mind it as they have no worries.

[HughBeaumont]

99. Because the dopes of this country judge "happiness" one way only - by how much money one has.

Here's the double edged sword in this -

If you asked Americans what they craved aside from money, the likely answer would be "peace of mind" . . . which, in America, sad as it is to say, you can't really HAVE unless one has a giant cash store.

A large cache of money means you'll never have to worry about health coverage, retirement, security, layoffs, higher education, bad housing, bad schools for your kids, possessions, etc. Of course, if we had a tax structure and social safety net like the Europeans and Scandanavians did, we wouldn't really have to worry about MANY of these things that can only be cured by money if you're an American.

Unfortunately, America is too batshit hell-bent on war and unbridled corporatism to ever make it work. Helping people doesn't result in direct profit. You can't make a fast buck off of bridge repair. Universal health care means Humana's CEO will only have two homes instead of eight. Don't even DARE ask the rich to, God FORBID, make sacrifices for the greater good.

[nicky187]

59. This time...

... there will be no FDR who fought to do the right things that turned the tide of collapse and revolution. Obama is trying, but the forces of evil & co-optation of the populace is far too advanced to reverse this mess.

Another few years, and this country will look like the end of "Johnny Mnemonic," and that will be the start of the rebuilding.

I think I'll be around to see it. At least I won't be bored.

[bvar22]

105. I disagree....Obama is NOT "trying".

He IS one of them.
not one of us.


The DLC New Team

(Screen Capped from the DLC Website)

[truedelphi]

61. Many people will never vvote again. Others will vote

AGAINST The DLC and all they control (Which is almost all of every election, unless you live in an exceptionally progressive area.)

The DLC has destroyed the party. And if there is a hell, I hope they burn there very slowly.

[dysfunctional press]

80. the thing is- there ISN'T a 'hell'...and they know it.

no heaven either- what you see is what you get. and they're taking as much as their life allows.

[scentopine]

62. This is why tea baggers and left baggers will find common gound one day

not every tea bagger is a rascist douche bag. Not every left bagger is a non-bathing communist. The centrists are working over time to keep left and right at each others throats. We need to find some common ground and go after the centrist's throats.

Centrists are the most dangerous of all the political animals with all the passion of an ice cold heart focused on one thing - quietly consolidating money and power from your pockets to theirs. Democrat, republican means nothing to centrists- we are just meat for the market.

[eridani]

90. The real difference between the two is that--

--the teabaggers are low information and we are high information.

[natrat]

69. some nasty shit could fill that vacuum, ugh

[emilyg]

73. k/r

[bertman]

75. You nailed it, Phoebe. Recommend.

I had never heard the word "dismantlement" used before, having always used "dismantling" as the noun.

[djp2]

76. Dead Peasant..

Insurance should only be allowed if the insureds family receives the same amount also..

[Dinger]

77. K & R # 116 From Me

I'm done with this shit.

[tango-tee]

79. Very well stated!

Rec # 123 from me.

[Downwinder]

82. The Capitalists version of Mao's "Cultural Revolution." n/t

[onestepforward]

87. K&R

[clear eye]

91. Coalitions {of NGOs} need to be built to organize protests

(This is the title of a post I added to my journal last May & its location in a thread)

The heart of it is:

I would encourage everyone who belongs to economic justice and/or single-payer healthcare organizations to encourage coalition-building and national protest. Younger people are more likely to be open than older, since many older leaders of organizations have spent years in turf and position wars and gotten habitually wary of other activists. "Break on through to the other side."

For the most part Americans want a wholesale redirection of public revenue to rescue it from the looters, saving life on earth through serious environmental programs, remaking our country as a world advocate for peace, and restoration of election integrity. Many groups have responded by working for little bits and pieces that fall under those general categories.

The question for the leadership of these seed groups is,"Wouldn't you be more effective as a small group, if rather than trying to tackle such an ambitious agenda as one group, even with the help of other local NGO's, you reinvented yourselves specifically as an umbrella organization whose main job would be defining a unifying set of priorities from within your main issues, and getting large organizations to sign on for mass actions demanding action on those priorities?" The coalition could be called something like United for Democracy (UFD?). It would probably help if the initiators sent a survey to a slew of NGOs and better labor unions w/ 3 - 5 possible priorities listed under each general area and asked which they see as coming first. That way groups would feel that they had input in the agenda for the first mass action. For example, under the heading "Getting our Voice Back" which could be defined as removing the de facto amendments that the Bush administration made to the constitution with their "signing statements", their corporatization of elections, and their institutionalization of domestic spying, you could list (1)a law specifying open source code for all election machines and tabulators to be made available to qualified representatives of each candidate in real time and a prohibition against sending results to county boards over any sort of lines--a la Minnesota, (2) a memorandum of understanding that when an administration stonewalls reasonable subpoenas from Congress, that Congress is obligated by the Constitution to defend the rights of the people by acknowledging this violation of Constitutional powers and appointing a special prosecutor to investigate whether an impeachable offense is being committed, and (3)undoing some of the Patriot Act provisions that make it possible to arrest leaders of legitimate political dissension as "terrorists". The same sorts of lists could be made for the economic "Just Use of Public Revenue" (health care, mortgage rescue and re-regulation of the banks, fall within this area), environmental "Saving Our Planet", and world peace "Peace in Our Time" issue areas.

Once the groups were on board, this could be started as a petition campaign including deadlines with the understanding that when Obama, following the advice of his reactionary advisers, inevitably ignored the demands except rhetorically, the coalition would progress to the weekend mass demonstration, and then, as outrage over inaction built, toward a one-day General Strike. The time is overdue for the federal government to be made to remember that this is a representative democracy, and that we, the people, can hold their feet to the fire.

I believe this more than ever. It will take an understanding that no one of these top priorities is more important than the other in restoring a truly representative democracy to our country. Re-empowering the grassroots is the only way to put the priorities of working people in front once more. The leaders of the NGOs need to risk being called a "radical fringe" as the leaders of all social movements are (while millions of the grassroots get behind them). They will have to let go of the fear that "their" particular issue won't get enough attention in a coalition, b/c no one group has an agenda that can energize a large enough base. The processes of corruption are so ascendant in our politics, and the means to cripple a third party so entrenched, that the movement can't be a political party. If successful, it will wrench the Democratic Party back into the hands of the people.

Edited to add: I encourage members of issue groups to ask the leadership to get the ball rolling on such a coalition. Or if you are an activist, to pattern your group into an umbrella organization which would start by writing and disseminating the survey I described above.

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

94. coalitions can be useful, although often fractious

During the anti-war protests, I thought it looked a little schizoid due to some of the factions that participated. I remember yelling at the TV - the Issue is WAR---- stay focused!!!

The only problem with trying to unify a lot of NGOs around common themes is that I think rivalries/power struggles would erupt - just the nature of man. I'm kind of hoping that a larger more cohesive movement comes along. It has happened before when circumstances warrented it. The Tea Baggers are a symptom of an eruption on the right - we need a good strong counter-insurgency on the left. When I say "left" - I am really referring to what used to be the stands of the old Democratic Party that we could just take for granted - labor, civil rights, living wages, social safety nets (Medicare/SS), social justice, etc. that they have abandoned in favor of their new "Republican Lite/DLC/New Democrat/Third Way" model.


This was my suggestion -- "The W2 Movement" based on economic justice for the little guy/Main Street

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/Phoebe%20Loosinhouse/14

The NGOs that I have the most respect for right now are Move On and PNHP. I think Howard Dean could get some mojo going if he felt up to it.

[clear eye]

102. Of course it's tough, but it's still better than not uniting.

I agree that we need to unite around positions we previously took for granted, but we also need to focus on reversing the structural changes put in place by the last administration--e-voting machines allowed to use proprietary software, Presidential "signing statements", the changes to FISA and the Patriot Act that enable surveillance of the leaders of dissent and their classification as "terrorists", violations of posse comitatus at demonstrations, the acceptance of unprovoked war--that have brought us this lack of responsive gov't and suppression of dissent.

No one group could possibly create enough support for all that is necessary. I'm kind of attached to my United for Democracy suggested name, because it emphasizes the underlying thread behind working for all these different issues. Of course a name is the least of tasks that would have to be accomplished. Getting leaders of different groups to acknowledge the need for such a large umbrella group, disseminating the survey and analyzing the responses, and getting them signed on, will take a Herculean effort by persons w/ superb people skills and lots of courage. There is way too much Silkwooding going on these days.

Edited to add: No one person should be "in charge" of such a coalition. It's too easy to discredit or otherwise put out of commission any one person. That's why starting w/ a wide net of existing groups would be advantageous. BTW, Dean is nowhere near progressive enough on many issues, and neither is Moveon.org which has a history of abandoning its membership with its positions, single payer healthcare financing being a prime example. Of course it would be welcome to sign on once the group was established, but they are too unreliable to want in the inner core. Just run a post asking for comments by disillusioned former members, and you'll see the extent of their problem.

[olegramps]

97. A new party: The Labor Party built on existing Unions.

If the Democratic Party continues to ignore the plight of the working class then a solution could be the formation of a Labor Party that is built from the nucleus of the existing Unions. Its sole purpose would be to represent the concerns of all working class people. These would include health care, pensions, wages, vacations, education, etc. In affect it would be a massive unionization of the working class that could crush the corporate state that has hijacked the economy and demand fair treatment and the end to excessive compensation that is leading to a have and have not economy.

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

100. Sounds like a plan to me. I would toss my fate in with Labor and Unions

Maybe we could unionize the citizens of this country - now that is quite a concept!

[clear eye]

103. The leadership of our unions are too afraid of losing what influence they have

to start a new party. They are also afraid of red-baiting, dirty tricks ranging from created scandals that will depose them, to those that would be fatal. Prime evidence is the AFL-CIO leadership's decision not to continue to call for the single-payer health financing that the delegates to their own annual convention voted for. Does that sound like material on which to base a new party?

[bvar22]

106. The new Party could use THIS as a platform:

n our day these economic truths have become accepted as self-evident. We have accepted, so to speak, a second Bill of Rights under which a new basis of security and prosperity can be established for all—regardless of station, race, or creed.

Among these are:

The right to a useful and remunerative job in the industries or shops or farms or mines of the nation;

The right to earn enough to provide adequate food and clothing and recreation;

The right of every farmer to raise and sell his products at a return which will give him and his family a decent living;

The right of every businessman, large and small, to trade in an atmosphere of freedom from unfair competition and domination by monopolies at home or abroad;

The right of every family to a decent home;

The right to adequate medical care and the opportunity to achieve and enjoy good health;

The right to adequate protection from the economic fears of old age, sickness, accident, and unemployment;

The right to a good education.

All of these rights spell security. And after this war is won we must be prepared to move forward, in the implementation of these rights, to new goals of human happiness and well-being.---FDR's Economic Bill of Rights

[Faryn Balyncd]

93. important thread. thanks.

k and r

:hi:

[freddie mertz]

101. We definitely need a new, progressive, and populist movement.

To take our government back from the banks and the multi-national criminals.

[deutsey]

112. Remember Howard Beale near the end of "Network"?

Preaching the rising, new corporatist evangel back in the '70s?




Well, the time has come to say:

is dehumanization such a bad word?

Because good or bad, that's what's

so. The whole world is becoming

humanoid, creatures that look human

but aren't. The whole world, not

just us. We're just the most

advanced country, so we're getting

there first --



-- The whole world's people are

becoming mass-produced, programmed,

wired, insensate things useful only

to produce and consume other

mass-produced things, all of them as

unnecessary and useless as we are --




-- that's the simple truth you

have to grasp, that human existence

is an utterly futile and purposeless

thing --


-- because once you've grasped that,

then the whole universe becomes

orderly and comprehensible --


-- We are right now living in what

has to be called a corporate

society, a corporate world, a

corporate universe. This world

quite simply is a vast cosmology of

small corporations orbiting around

larger corporations who, in turn,

revolve around giant corporations --

-- and this whole, endless, ultimate

cosmology is expressly designed for

the production and consumption of

useless things --

[Name removed]

115. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[mdmc]

117. $$