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debbierlus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 01:11 AM
Original message
High Premiums in Senate Democrats Health Plan - Shocking Numbers!

WASHINGTON — Senate Democrats have provided few details about their latest health care proposal, but this much seems clear: Anyone who wants to buy the same health benefits as members of Congress, or to buy coverage through Medicare, should be prepared to fork over a large chunk of cash.


Senate Tied in Knots Over Proposal to Allow Imported Drugs (December 11, 2009) According to the Congressional Budget Office, a family of four earning $54,000 in 2016, when the health legislation is fully in effect, would be eligible for a subsidy of $10,100 to help defray the cost of insurance under the health legislation being debated by the Senate. By then, one of the most popular federal plans, a nationwide Blue Cross and Blue Shield policy, is projected to cost more than $20,000.

That could leave the family earning $54,000, slightly more than the current median household income, with monthly premium costs of more than $825.

The Democrats’ proposal would also allow some people ages 55 to 64 to “buy in” to Medicare, starting in 2011. That could cost about $7,600 a year per person or $15,200 for a couple, according to a budget office analysis of an earlier version of the concept. No subsidies would be available until 2014.

Senate Democrats have been careful to say that their proposal is not intended to offer exactly the same benefits that members of Congress have. In many cases, federal subsidies would cover a smaller share of the premium than what the government contributes to the cost of health insurance for federal employees.

The Medicare buy-in proposal is intended to fill a gap in the social safety net for millions of people nearing retirement who are unable to obtain or afford insurance. In general, the new Medicare option would be available only to people who are uninsured. People 55 to 64 who have employer-sponsored insurance would be expected to keep it.

Preliminary back-of-the-envelope calculations reflect the steep challenges that Senate Democrats face as they await a new cost analysis of their plan. The numbers also reflect potential pitfalls in the politically appealing message to constituents that they might get benefits similar to those of federal lawmakers.

Affordability for individuals and families, however, is hardly the only challenge facing Senate Democrats as they struggle to put together a proposal that can win the 60 votes needed for passage of the broader health care bill.

Senators from rural states voiced deep reservations on Thursday about the Medicare buy-in plan, which they said would hurt hospitals, doctors and other health care providers back home.

In addition to allowing people to buy in to Medicare, the Democrats’ latest plan would designate the federal Office of Personnel Management to oversee at least two new nonprofit national insurance plans.

The plans would be administered by private companies, but the personnel office would negotiate prices as it does now for the Federal Employees Health Benefits Program.

Federal employee unions and retiree groups expressed apprehension about asking the agency to take on the task of supervising health plans for millions more people.

Margaret L. Baptiste, the president of the National Active and Retired Federal Employees Association, said: “O.P.M. should be in the business of attracting the best and brightest to federal service.” The agency’s mission, she said, is “is too important to dilute with the massive undertaking of creating and administering a new health care system.”

Some insurance experts said that creating a menu of national plans could provide consumers with an array of interesting new choices that could meet their personal health care needs.

“It’s more choice for consumers, and it’s more good choice for consumers,” said Walton J. Francis, an insurance consultant and expert on the program for federal employees.

But Mr. Francis warned against the Medicare buy-in proposal, which he said would undermine the new national plans and would leave people nearing retirement with insufficient coverage.

“Medicare is not a good health plan,” Mr. Francis said. Even with coverage of prescription drugs, he said, “it still doesn’t have catastrophic protection.”

In response to questions from the Congressional Budget Office, Senate leaders provided additional details of the proposal announced hastily on Tuesday by the Senate majority leader, Harry Reid, Democrat of Nevada:

¶The new Medicare option would be available only to individuals, not to families. In a household consisting of a 60-year-old man, his 50-year-old wife and their 18-year-old daughter, only the man would be eligible for Medicare.

¶People 55 to 64 would receive the same benefits as people in the traditional Medicare program. The Democrats’ bill would limit out-of-pocket spending on health care by people in private plans ($5,000 a year for individuals and $10,000 for families). Medicare does not have such limits.

¶Medicare premiums for people under 65 would differ from those paid by people 65 and older, and the two parts of the program would be financed separately.

Marilyn Moon, a health economist and former public trustee of Medicare, said that for people 55 to 64, Medicare premiums could be higher than premiums charged by private health plans.

Health policy experts said that the people who chose to enroll in Medicare were likely to be heavy users of health care, with higher-than-average costs.

Moreover, Ms. Moon noted, private plans would have large numbers of healthy people under the age of 55, whose premiums could help cover costs for those 55 to 64. “Such cross-subsidies would not be available under the new Medicare option,” she said.

Democratic senators generally shied away from explaining or defending their Medicare proposal, on the ground that it was being analyzed by the budget office.

Republicans denounced the proposal, saying it would add new financial obligations to a program that could not afford its existing commitments.

“If the Titanic is sinking, the last thing you want to do is to put Grandma and more of your family on the boat,” said Senator Charles E. Grassley, Republican of Iowa.

But several liberal House Democrats welcomed the Medicare proposal.

“Extending this successful program to those between 55 and 64 would be the largest expansion of Medicare in 44 years and would perhaps get us on the path to a single-payer model,” said Representative Anthony Weiner, Democrat of New York.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/11/health/policy/11insure.html?_r=2&nl=us&emc=politicsemailema3
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Desertrose Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 01:20 AM
Response to Original message
1. "help get us on the path to single payer...."
Good lord, we should already be there.


How in the world are people ever going to be able to pay for their mandated health insurance??
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leftstreet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 01:25 AM
Response to Original message
2. These assholes have NO IDEA what a working class paycheck looks like
:banghead:

Drop the whole fucking HCR now!
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 12:28 PM
Response to Reply #2
16. These assholes don't give a damn about what a working class paycheck looks like
just as long as they can make sure they never have to live on a working class paycheck.
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Nite Owl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 01:27 AM
Response to Original message
3. What world do these idiots
live in? They need a dose of reality in their lives.
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Cessna Invesco Palin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 01:29 AM
Response to Original message
4. That's pretty much what I paid in the UK. n/t
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alcibiades_mystery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 01:32 AM
Response to Original message
5. COPYRIGHT VIOLATION
Why do you consistently put this board at risk by violating the simple rule on 4 paragraphs of content?
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druidity33 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 07:51 AM
Response to Reply #5
11. i wonder that too...
i've seen her do it several times.

:shrug:

are we supposed to alert on that?

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nemo137 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 08:31 AM
Response to Reply #11
12. I think a PM and a quote from the rules to the author would be more polite? Maybe?
Curse this new-fangled internet etiquette!
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Digit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 01:33 AM
Response to Original message
6. I would be toast under these proposals
That's all I can say. I don't know what I'll do and I know I am not the only one.
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Daphne08 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 05:00 AM
Response to Reply #6
10. No, you're not the only one.
Edited on Sat Dec-12-09 05:02 AM by Daphne08
One of my brothers is a truck driver with no benefits, and he's barely making ends meet as it is.

He's worked for 33 years, and the normal health problems of aging and hard work are already starting to show up with him.

There is no way my brother could pay several hundred dollars a month. No way. And this IRS thing is just scary. He's very depressed about all this.

What are these Senators thinking? They're supposed to be Democrats.

Are they so far-removed from working people that they don't realize even $100 can mean the difference between proper eating and not?? I'm beginning to think most just don't give a damn!

I don't know what my husband and I would do if we didn't have coverage with his job.

Democrats will be voted out of office when people learn of this.

It's insanity.

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debbierlus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #6
14. People are going to be furious, if this passes and they are confronted with the true bill

This whole thing needs to be shelved.
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OHdem10 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 01:37 AM
Response to Original message
7. Of course, Congress does not pay those high prices. They have
little subsidy from US taxpayers.

I am curious--The reason people do not have health insurance
is because they cannot afford it. How are they suddenly
going to pay for 7K or 15K Policy?? Some grand subsidy
will be required. If Congress thinks we can afford these
high priced subsidies--why do they not pay Doctors and Hospitals?
Doctors are no longer taking Medicare or Nedicaid patients in
many states.

Whew---eee??more questions than I can get listed?

Will await the official plan if we ever get one.



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debbierlus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 12:27 PM
Response to Reply #7
15. They won't be able to pay it.

Health insurance reform has never been health CARE reform.

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ThomCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 01:44 AM
Response to Original message
8. These costs are BEFORE copays and deductibles and patient's
portion's of expenses. This is just the cost of the Premiums.

I already pay $600 per month for my premiums. My additional costs add several hundred more per month on top of that.

With my disability and health problems, when I go off COBRA and onto private insurance my costs will skyrocket upward. This bullshit our party is negotiating will allow me to give insurance companies lots of money for a play, but it won't guarantee that they will cover the services I need. it won't guarantee that they won't drop me. It won't guarantee that there won't be caps. (they are still fighting over that with some of our party trying to make sure there are caps.)

No matter how you look at it, this bill will Not do what the goal was to do. It will not provide affordable guaranteed access to health care to all Americans. The results won't be Affordable. Won't be guaranteed, won't necessarily be access to health care (only access to insurance plans), and won't be available to more than a small portion of Americans.

Worse, this is almost certainly going to RAISE COSTS instead of cutting them, because cutting costs for consumers has never been a goal. They are only trying to cut costs for the government and for insurance companies. From the very beginning the stated goal for us has been merely to have costs continue to rise, but at a slower rate.

:grr:

What a total fuck up!
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tblue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 02:38 AM
Response to Original message
9. What a ridiculous mess. Was Hillary's 1990's plan this onerous?
I confess I didn't pay that close attention because I generally trusted that she and Bill were doing the right thing. Was her plan anywhere near this messed up?

I feel like we're on a roller coaster headed for a cliff.
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a kennedy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 09:10 AM
Response to Original message
13. I am so confused........
:crazy: :argh: :cry:
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