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CoffeeCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 03:21 PM
Original message
I will always believe in Barack Obama...
Edited on Fri Dec-11-09 03:34 PM by CoffeeCat
...but I no longer believe in the Presidency.

When Barack Obama ran for President, it's true that he didn't run as a Progressive. However, the linchpins of Obama's
campaign were "change" and "hope". Everyone clearly understood that a vote for Obama was a vote to eradicate corruption
and corporatism; and end the shameless war-for-profit cycle and the destruction of our U.S. Constitution and our democracy.

Social issues aside--we all were fighting to get our country back.

I'm conceding. There's something bigger than the Presidency and that something looms over the Presidency and our entire
government--dictating how the game is played.

I believe Barack Obama is a good and decent man. He truly loves his children and his wife. He's the real deal. I also believe
that he was appalled by what he saw in our government during his short time in Congress. A lengthy Time article written Obama, during
the general campaign, revealed that he didn't run the DC cocktail-party circuit. He worked out a lot and stayed above the fray.
I believe that Obama ran to change things. I also believe that Kennedy and Kerry strongly urged him to run because they believed
he was one of the few electable politicians who could break the crime syndicate that has its talons in our government.

I was a precinct captain for Obama. I had the pleasure of speaking to Obama on the phone, and I heard honesty and integrity
in his voice. I told Obama that I was voting for him because he was a constitutional scholar. I wanted government to follow
the Constitution, not ignore it. I told Obama that I was impressed that his "Blueprint for America" included his plan to restore
Habeas Corpus. Such an obscure issue, but very important--and it was in Obama's plan. Corrupt, entrenched politicians don't
think like that.

Obama ensured me that Habeas would be restored.

After absorbing recent events--the torture issue, the continued escalation of a Middle East war-for-profit, the failure to secure
true health care reform, continued (and exacerbated) corporate corruption--I no longer have faith in any politician to change
things because the system is completely broken. A corrupt system isn't going to be changed from within, it must be changed from
without.

Or, as Barack Obama told us many times, "Change happens from the bottom up."

If a good and decent man like Barack Obama can't become President break the choke hold of corporatism that has gripped our
democracy--then blaming one person is pure denial. Our entire government--not just one person or one party--is broken. Both
parties are in on the fix. When the Republicans were in power--it was easy to blame them, because we understand they're corporatist, corrupt
tendencies. The face of corruption was Bush and we could rationalize that the Dems were trying to fight Bush.

Now the Democrats have the White House and majorities in the House and Senate. Yet, the corruption and corporate hijacking of
our democracy continues in seamless fashion. It's obvious now, that both parties are aligned against "We The People" and fighting
to ensure continued corruption.

So many political arguments have become about President Obama. That's a distraction and a ruse--just as much as Democrats arguing
with Republicans. While we're at the corner pub arguing about one person--a crime syndicate is efficiently looting our houses
and destroying our neighborhoods. The distraction is by design.

It's time to look beyond political personalities and parties--and to face our the problem--that our government no longer
belongs to "We The People."

When we face this reality--only then will we begin to take this country back and restore our democracy.






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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 03:23 PM
Response to Original message
1. The..."time to look beyond political personalities..." has, sadly passed us by.
It seems , to some here, that is all that matters.
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sui generis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 03:30 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Obama isn't commenting on any of this in any meaningful way
The guy in the executive office needs to be a thought leader, not a follower, and not a wallflower.

It's not about "personality" for me. It's about the Audacity of Nope at this point.

Here's the deal, if we didn't have higher expectations (and by higher, I mean reasonable), then we wouldn't be disappointed by this unreasonable failure to deliver anything significantly different than the prior incumbent.

For me, I expect that when I vote for a democrat it is because we are ideologically different than republicans, and that means I vote for ideals that align more with populist sentiment than with big business.

It's not unreasonable for us to be disappointed at this point.
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 03:37 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. You are , quite correct.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 03:43 PM
Response to Reply #2
10. We have seen change....about 10 months' worth.....
to expect to see a total turn around, and most of the Democratic agenda realized,
after being out in the wilderness for 8 years, and before that having a Democratic
President enacting the Republican's wet dream (in many instances), and before that, 12 years of Republican consistent rule, is what is disappointing to me.

And yes, it is unreasonable to be disappointed at this point,
although those who are certainly are welcomed to it.

It's kind of like being disappointed on how the new house look,
midway through the demo of the old house.

So yeah...the work completed thus far doesn't look good,
but in fact, there has been improvements already,
and if nothing else, the foundation has been laid and that was part of the
structural problems with the old house to begin with.

So what one "sees" is just not enough to give one a vision of the completed renovated house.

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sui generis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 03:54 PM
Response to Reply #10
13. but that's an interpretation, second hand
See, Obama could be addressing these issues himself, without requiring an interpreter. That would be leadership.

The turnaround of eight years has nothing to do with public options, real healthcare reform, voluntary DOJ filings, or poorly executed federal spending.

So, if indeed the house is being "demo'd" at all, it would be nice to know if it's even happening at this point.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 04:41 PM
Response to Reply #13
17. I think that Obama has been communicating well all along......
I just think because of the media that we have,
his message isn't always what the public gets.

I still don't think that pounding fist on the table
gets one anywhere....unless one is a Republican...
because the MSM can and will use a leader pounding on the table,
as a fist in same leader's face.

And again, I have seen many changes take place with this administration....
but perhaps it serves your interest better to claim that there isn't any that you've.
That could also be what is happening....because you want more, and so till
there is a torrential downpour in a town where everything happens very slowly,
you will not be satisfied...which I am guessing is how you will feel forever,
and ever, and ever....
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sui generis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 04:47 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. that was premature extrapolation pusscat
I'm sorry - I think there's medicine for that.

Your commentary was perfectly acceptable discourse until you turned it into a personal judgement of me there at the end.

Just an observation.
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CoffeeCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 05:31 PM
Response to Reply #2
21. I agree...I am disappointed and devastated, frankly.
I thought Obama would be the one to turn the ship around. I still held out hope that the Republicans
were the party of corruption and crime--and that the Dems were the good guys. I always fell for the
Democrats playing the "wounded ducks"--totally overwhelmed by the power of Bush and ham-handed Republicans
in Congress.

But we have a majority now. We are in power and we can't get the change we need. We can't eliminate
the corruption. We can no longer rationalize that the Democrats are trying--but it's just so hard.
We're in on the fix.

I am disappointed in Obama, of course. However, I believe in the man--and I believe that the lack of
change and the prevalence of corruption is due to the fact that the Presidency is controlled by more
than the President.

Makes you wonder about the people surrounding Obama. Was Rahm installed by the powers that be, or did Obama
select him? What about Robert Gates, Geithner and Bernanke? Were those appointments made freely? Those
appointments allowed the seamless continuation of corruption. Coincidence?

It just all feels unnatural.
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OHdem10 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 03:33 PM
Response to Original message
3. When some say there are forces afoot which render the situation
such that it matters not who is the President. The Same
Right Wing Policies will dictate. A Democratic President
will do the same things but in a kinder and gentler way.

It is beginning to be hard to dismiss this as some crazed
conspiratorial thinking.
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Echo In Light Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 03:35 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. Which is quite odd given how it was dead obvious even decades ago
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goldcanyonaz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 03:36 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. It's like they get elected and are immediately rushed into a debriefing room
and told how it's going to be.


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amborin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 03:37 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. maybe not
all pretty shocking, but explains a lot:

"the "smoking gun" that links Barack Obama with Bob Rubin-Goldman Sachs, free trade
and cuts in entitlements. It’s the young Senator Barack Obama’s little commented on
and little-known speech to the Hamilton Project in April, 2006, well before he
became president.

Obama stated:
"I think that if you polled many of the people in
this room, most of us are strong free traders and most of us
believe in markets. …So, hopefully, this is not just going
to be all of us preaching to the choir. Hopefully, part of
what we are going to be doing is challenging our own conventional
wisdom and pushing out the boundaries and testing these ideas
in a vigorous and aggressive way."

snip<

Senator Barack Obama ran a stealth campaign for the presidency in which he took
positions on issues that he obviously didn’t believe which explains why he
jettisoned them early on (FISA; NAFTA renegotiation; DADT; DOMA etc.). But
the REAL, unvarnished Obama was unveiled in a speech he gave as a Senator
from Illinois in 2006. He spoke at the request of "my friend" Bob Rubin
whose Goldman Sachs had just funded the Hamilton Project, a free trade
think tank embedded in the Brookings Institution..."

snip

Wall Street Dems Unveil Plan to Undermine Progressives

Here’s a big shocker – the Wall Street wing of the Democratic Party
today announced it would be beginning its new war in earnest on the
grassroots elements of the party that are demanding serious public
policy changes. As the Financial Times reports, Citigroup Chairman
Bob Rubin held a press conference at the Brookings Institution to
announce the formation of the so-called "Hamilton Project." After
paying lip service to various economic problems afflicting the country,
Rubin and his former Treasury colleague Roger Altman quickly let it be
known exactly what they are up to.

snip

<http://seminal.firedoglake.com/diary/17981>

<http://seminal.firedoglake.com/diary/17984>
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inna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 06:10 PM
Response to Reply #7
24. wow, thanks for the links.
Edited on Fri Dec-11-09 06:41 PM by inna

Because make no mistake about it – this move today is nothing more than the beginning of a frontal attack by Corporate America on the progressive movement, using the Democratic Party as an all-too-transparent cloak of legitimacy.


(from the linked article by David Sirota from April 2006, Wall Street Dems Unveil Plan to Undermine Progressives: http://www.davidsirota.com/2006/04/wall-street-dems-unveil-plan-to.html )
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inna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 06:28 PM
Response to Reply #7
25. related:
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amborin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 06:31 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. thanks for the link!
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Echo In Light Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 03:38 PM
Response to Reply #5
8. The late Bill Hicks did a routine on that re the JFK/Zapruder film...
as in, they're shown footage from an angle no one has every seen. The film ends, the lights come back on, and the pres is asked, "Any questions?"
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CoffeeCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 06:04 PM
Response to Reply #5
23. It's all very interesting...
...because I think the powers-that-be figured they had no problems. Hillary would be the Dem candidate
and McCain would be the Republican candidate.

But then something unexpected happened on the way to the primary...Obama gained ground and he won the
Iowa caucuses.

You just have to wonder what all went on behind the scenes. Will we EVER know?
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chimpymustgo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 01:16 PM
Response to Reply #23
37. Don't forget, Obama had MASSIVE Wall Street and Chicago finance funding from the start.
It was a true primary that Obama barely won. Both candidates were prepared to do the bidding of this nation's moneyed interests.

I do think Hillary would have done better with health care.
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LatteLibertine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 03:40 PM
Response to Original message
9. I truly like President Obama as a person too
Edited on Fri Dec-11-09 03:42 PM by LatteLibertine
Blaming him for the condition of our United States political system is indeed like blaming a hood ornament on a truck when you get run over by one. The overwhelming majority of our politicians and our corrupt corporatist system is the truck, not President Obama.

It's true it will take a very long time to reform the system and it may not be possible because there aren't enough folks about within and without of the system to get it done. We've got a flawed system that attracts, retains and encourages too many bad apples.
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AspenRose Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 03:45 PM
Response to Original message
11. Proud, even giddy to kick and rec.
These are the kinds of posts I miss on DU.

Thank you.
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CoffeeCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 06:02 PM
Response to Reply #11
22. I think the time is now...
...to face these facts--and to join hands with those who really want
to rid the government of corruption and break the corporate stranglehold.

We're not going to get there if we're focused on fighting within our own
party OR fighting with the Republicans.

There are fundamental tenants on which all Americans can agree. We
should focus on those things, before our country is totally lost.

We all want our Constitution followed. We don't want corporations dictating
public policy, at the expense of the American people. We want our votes
to count.

We need to start there...
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Shagbark Hickory Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 03:51 PM
Response to Original message
12. He delegates too many important things. Shame that made him a 1 term president.
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whatchamacallit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 04:03 PM
Response to Original message
14. Basically, I agree with you
Edited on Fri Dec-11-09 04:05 PM by whatchamacallit
It may well be that the stranglehold the elite have on the country is more than Obama can overcome. I can understand if his agenda is blocked and his hands are tied, but he seems to be actively promoting *their* agenda. And for that, I am beginning to have reservations about him.
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jobycom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 04:17 PM
Response to Original message
15. Meh. He was and is a politician. The only real lie he told was that he wasn't.
His political history shows a very shrewd politician who no doubt cares and wants to make things better, but who still played the game. He won his first election to the state senate by technicality trickery, getting the front-runner knocked off the ballot because of signature irregularities on her ballot petitions. He ran a hardball campaign in the primaries that pretended it was clean, but that was as hard-hitting beneath the surface as any that's ever been run. You were a precinct captain for him, so you only saw him. I talked to a lot of people in different campaigns, and I saw how things were happening. He played hardball, he bent some rules, he ran assassin campaigns under the boards will smiling above the boards.

That's just politics.

I don't really mind that he did that. I didn't like him, and went through just about every other primary candidate before supporting him in the general. Next to Edwards, he was the one I trusted least--not so much because I thought he was corrupt, as that I didn't think he had the experience to know what to do. I think that's his problem now--he doesn't have the experience to understand that he's the leader, that he can order his advisors to change things, and that he doesn't have to make everyone happy. Legislators are trained to seek compromise, and that's one reason they aren't usually good executives. Executives have to make people angry, and they take the full blame on themselves for doing it. Obama knows that, but he still has no experience doing it, and it's something you have to learn to do.

An example that might not seem relevant is LBJ. He was a fantastic leader in the senate. As president, he couldn't understand Viet Nam. He opposed the buildup, but his advisors convinced him it had to be done for the rest of the world, and for America's safety, and for the good of the Viet Namese. If we just left, they would be massacred and would fall to tyrants. He believed them, but more than that, he believed that there was a middle ground he could reach with them and with the Viet Nameese. He once told a friend "If I could just sit down with Ho Chi Minh, we could settle this in an hour." He really couldn't understand the mindset of someone who would rather slash and burn everything than yield one inch. Intellectually, maybe he could, but in all other ways he couldn't.

That's the experience and wisdom Obama lacks. He doesn't want troops in Afghanistan, but he's afraid to do what he believes. He thinks if he pulls out, women and children will be massacred by the Taliban and it will be his fault. Hell, even Code Pink changed their minds on immediate withdrawal over that issue, and even us staunchest anti-war folk heistate over that issue.

That's the biggest reason I didn't want him in office. I saw that in him when he was campaigning, in the way he misrepresented other candidates' votes and positions, in the way he played politics. I can't explain, so you can reject it if you want, but I saw a candidate who thought he was doing what others were, but wasn't. It's like someone who tries to tell a joke and gets all the words right, but doesn't understand the punchline, so the joke fails, and they don't understand why.


The part of the presidency that forces politicians to compromise and yield and all that is easy to explain. It's the institutionalization of it. There are thousands and millions of agreements and arrangements made that are hard to break, and they are made by both parties, and changing one thing changes a hundred others, so there is always resistance. Take Clinton, for instance. One of his first actions was to overturn the ban on gays in the military. That's a good, bold stroke and seemed to be completely in his power, since there was no law banning gays in the military, only a military rule he could overturn with an executive decision.

As soon as he tried, though, the public, military, and Congress rose against him. Led by Sam Nunn, a Democrat, Congress told him if he overturned the rule, they would pass a Congressional ban against it, not only negating his decision, but making it a federal law that would then require a new vote and a presidential signature to overcome. It was clear Congress had the votes to override a veto, since the opposition was led by his own party.

Meanwhile, the Pentagon told him they would ignore his ruling and find other ways to enforce the ban if necessary. He had high ranking officers and advisors tell him they would resign over it. He had military groups promise lawsuits against it that would tie up the Justice Department. On and on.

So in other words, his executive order had no chance of changing anything, and likely would result in worse conditions. That's why he worked out the "Don't Ask Don't Tell" policy, which was an improvement, but not a good policy. It was supportable by just enough in Congress to break the veto override on Nunn's proposed bill, so that he turned the problem back on Nunn. If Nunn didn't compromise, then Nunn could lose everything. That's how you compromise in politics. Neither side gets what it wants, but both avoids what it fears the most.

The president can't change the system. Obama did know this going in. He used absolute rhetoric in his campaign, but knew it wouldn't be that easy. Clinton tried a different approach, trying to show her understanding of the system by being more direct, but that was too negative (if more honest) and no one wanted to hear it.

So Obama won. The problem is, he won by creating expectations that he knew he couldn't meet, and that's the situation he's in now. No big deal, politicians do it all the time, but it makes reelection harder, and it makes accomplishing anything harder, since he angered a lot of people he has to work with with unfair accusations, so they are less eager to help him now.

So my basic opinion is the opposite of yours. I believe in the presidency, but I don't believe in many of the people who get elected to it. I never believed in Obama. But because I didn't, I'm not really upset with him and I'm still rooting for him to learn the system and get better. I feel a lot of "I told you so" towards his supporters, but I don't feel any betrayal by him. He's what I expected going in, and he's better than the other party. I will live the rest of my life absolutely sure that we missed our best chance to save this nation by electing him instead of Clinton (who wasn't my first choice in the primary, either). But Obama is what we have. He makes decisions generally that are more intelligent and better than his predecessor.

Who knows, he may wind up being all his supporters hoped for one day, too. I'd love to be proven wrong that way. :) If not, he's at least made a difference just by getting elected. So I don't dislike him, I can still pull for him, and even though I don't like all that he does, I still think it's an improvement.

That's my long, rambling response that no one will read much of.
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readmoreoften Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 04:32 PM
Response to Original message
16. I agree with you. This isn't even so much about Obama.
It's about facing the reality that we're living in an illusion, a one-party state. And it's a "totalitarian" state.
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CoffeeCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 07:21 PM
Response to Reply #16
31. and people like Beck, Limbaugh and Hannity...
...gum up the works with their lies and fearmongering.

It's virtually impossible to even have a conversation with today's conservatives. They're
rabid and their arguments are based on soundbytes from Glen Beck.

But that's what the criminals want--united we stand, divided we fall.

The joke really is on us.

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Odin2005 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 05:15 PM
Response to Original message
19. I agree.
Obama clearly said that change starts with us and it is delusional to think that he can do it himself.
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CoffeeCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 07:15 PM
Response to Reply #19
28. Yes, do you think...
...that he understood the depth of the corruption going in...or do
you think that he was schooled after he won?

I can only imagine the heavy burdens carried by those who know the truth, but
feel trapped or threatened--unable to do anything about it.

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Odin2005 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 07:16 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. Schooled after he won.
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CoffeeCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 07:19 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. Can you imagine how that feels?
Who would he talk to...John Kerry? His wife?

It's like the worst Tom Clancy movie EVER!
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Odin2005 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 07:23 PM
Response to Reply #30
32. Yep.
:scared:
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earth mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 05:19 PM
Response to Original message
20. Sorry, but Obama had a choice to lead like FDR or *. It's obvious which one Obama chose.
:thumbsdown:

p.s. UNREC.
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inna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 06:46 PM
Response to Original message
27. "Obama, As Predicted":

http://www.zmag.org/znet/viewArticle/23196

(Just found this article through a link in one of the linked articles in this thread; it's definitely worth a read.)
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 07:34 PM
Response to Original message
33. History is littered with accommodationist presidents
Edited on Fri Dec-11-09 07:41 PM by ruggerson
or "co-opting" presidents (meaning they co-op some of the other party's agenda, through compromise or initiative). Normally, they have fairly unremarkable presidencies and are often reelected by wide margins.

Hyper partisan Presidents (FDR, Truman, Andy Jackson, Reagan (in a bad way) on the other hand, have very successful tenures or miserable ones - but they at least attempt to fight for their beliefs.

I disagree, if we accept your premise that Obama has already disappointed, that the problem isn't him.

The problem lies within his nature - he is at heart a compromiser and a consensus seeker - not a partisan human being politically. Hence, we as a country are getting exactly what we voted into power, the results are directly related to his style of governance.
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CoffeeCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 09:57 PM
Response to Reply #33
34. Yes, that's true...
...that many President have had to compromise. However, never in our nation's history has
our government been so corrupt and so entrenched in corporate interests. We are torturing
people. We're starting unnecessary wars--as a gift to corporations who want a windfall.
We illegally wiretap our own citizens.

Our government meets nearly all of the tenants of Fascism--the corporations are in control.

This is beyond basic Dem/Rep politics. Our government is completely corrupt.

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R. P. McMurphy Donating Member (394 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 10:46 PM
Response to Original message
35. Spot-On CoffeeCat.
Excellent post. :applause:
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CoffeeCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 11:54 PM
Response to Reply #35
36. Thanks! (nt)
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