Seriously, where is the REFORM in this?

[Sebastian Doyle]

Corporations still control the show. American citizens threatened with fines and intimidation if they refuse to "voluntarily" pay a greedy billionaire's salary. "Public option" that maybe three people might be able to get in 2015.

Where is the REFORM? Somebody tell me.

[niyad]

1. the insurance companies are going to get even richer--that's the reform

[dflprincess]

28. "Health Insurance Company Profit and Campaign Donation Protection Act"

that's what it should be called.

[Autumn]

2. Insurance Finance REFORM. There it is. n/t

[mmonk]

3. Good one.

[Autumn]

5. I really liked it when

the President called it that. It just stuck with me.

[Warren DeMontague]

4. Will they still be allowed to deny coverage for pre-existing conditions?

No?

Well, there's one piece of reform, right there.

[lumberjack_jeff]

6. Read something about it first, then get back to us.

It's 2000 of pages of reform which will prevent people from dying because they can't get insurance.

[Sebastian Doyle]

15. And that should be your first clue that it's a crock

Nobody needs 2000 pages. Hell, you don't even need two pages. All that would take for REAL reform is one line.....

All citizens of the United States of America shall be eligible for Medicare

See how easy that is?

[earth mom]

39. Ya gotta wonder about people that need 2000 pages to explain something so basic.

Too much hope & change Kool Aid from the sound of it.

[niyad]

37. and it won't take effect for three years--by which time, according to the harvard study,

another ONE HUNDRED ThIRTY FIVE THOUSAND people will die due to lack of insurance.

[babylonsister]

7. Jeebus, you don't quit. Reform for me spells no pre-existing

conditions to determine whether I can even get health care. That's reform.

BUT! This is still far from a done deal, so chill out. We have miles to go, and I'll bet you'll complain all the way.

[proud2BlibKansan]

10. I can be satisfied for now with insurance reform

Watched SiCKO again today. It's nice knowing that crap is history now.

[patrice]

23. I AM going to be real disappointed if it doesn't develop a way to make Preventative &

Complimentary Medical Service coverages at least possible.

[Atticus]

8. After refusing to even discuss single payer, gelding the public option and dealing a severe setback

to women's right to choose, we just squeak through with 39 "Democrats" voting "NO".

It is NOT a proud moment to be a Democrat.

[patrice]

9. The Long-Term Care provision will make it possible for many to obtain LTC without spending down in

order to qualify for Medicare.

[Hello_Kitty]

16. That's a very good provision and I hope it stays in the final bill.

It'll put a bunch of Elder Law attorneys out of work but who cares?

[patrice]

20. That's going to be real popular, because it will make LTC insurance cheaper AND

it will allow people to protect whatever assets they have.

[tblue]

11. It's far from perfect, but a Republican victory would have been unthinkable.

This way we have at least something to build on. If it had failed, the Dems would be at a tremendous psychological disadvantage.

[Hello_Kitty]

22. I feel the same way.

Not thrilled about the bill but I was disgusted by the rhetoric by the Thugs on the House floor.

[patrice]

25. a bitter pill indeed! They ALL will be lookin' for work if it doesn't get stripped out in conference

[emulatorloo]

12. Sounds like the freepers could use some cheering up, they are very unhappy apparently

[babylonsister]

13. There are freepers among us!

[Sebastian Doyle]

14. If you're calling me a freeper, then go fuck yourself.

God damn it's a sad fucking day when a lifelong Democrat can't stand up for Democratic principles on Democratic Underground without some fucking cheerleader calling them a "freeper"

[emulatorloo]

19. I am not calling you a freeper. The freepers think "America is Fucked" because HCR is SOCIALIST

You claim "Corporations control the Show"

That is a sentiment that would cheer up the freepers if it were true.

Yet they are very very depressed.

Because your mischaracterization of HCR isn't true, and that is depressing to them.


Keep your vomit to yourself.

[Sebastian Doyle]

24. Freepers have always believed the exact opposite of reality

Didn't used to be the case here though. Democrats used to remember that we're supposed to be for the PEOPLE, not the corporations.

[emulatorloo]

26. So do many DU'ers - I trust the assessment of Anthony Weiner, Bernie Saunders,

Alan Grayson and Dr. Howard Dean about this bill more than I do you or other DU'ers who use hyperbole to totally mischaracterize it. They say it isn't perfect, but it is a good bill that is going help people (NOT CORPORATIONS)

The insurance companies are frigging terrified of it, they are spending huge amounts of money to kill it.

[patrice]

27. I think most of us are. The differences are over how to get there. & Howard Dean wanted this one to

succeed.

[mullard12ax7]

21. Sure is, but remember how important it is to let war criminals go free

so it can happen all over again. Learning from history is so passe now, we're supposed to let propaganda tell us what to believe.

[LatteLibertine]

17. IMO

it opens the door and gets the ball rolling. Hell yes it needs a lot of work. Passage makes further future reforms that much easier. Having the bill fail would just throw power to the Republicans and would make it hard for President Obama to get anything meaningful done for the rest of his entire term.

[geek tragedy]

18. Millions of Americans getting access to care they never had

before. An end to the insurance companies' antitrust exemption. No more rescission or pre-existing condition exclusions.

[patrice]

29. AND we can see much more clearly now who owns whom. nt

[geek tragedy]

35. Apparently AHIP owns all the purists around here.

The purists threw in with AHIP and the Teabaggers.

[emulatorloo]

30. I get the feeling that some DU'ers have never been sick, or had a loved one who was denied coverage

because of a pre-existing condition.

[dflprincess]

31. Thanks to the large premiums and deductibles this bill allows

many Americans will still not have access to care. The numbers of uninsured may drop, but the number of underinsured will continue to climb.

[Hello_Kitty]

36. [phone] eom.

[mullard12ax7]

32. How much will a person's pre-existing condition cost them?

Plus, you think criminal banks will obey insurance company anti-trust laws? They won't. Finally, how much will it a cost a person who's policy isn't canceled? Will government subsidies actually cover their costs?

[GreenArrow]

33. We get to go from something that was "uniquely American"

to something that's even more "uniquely American!"

[brentspeak]

34. No reform, only deform.

The whole bill is a sick joke on all but insurance companies, Wall St., the DLC, and Obama cheerleaders.

[earth mom]

38. I hear ya and totally agree. The truth is being drowned out by the same old cheerleaders here.

The truth is that we've been totally punked.