Why do southern state reps fight the hardest against Health Care?

[nadinbrzezinski]

For the same reason they fought the Wagner Act or for that matter the civil rights movement.

This is about social control, and if we have a good medical system that releases the population from that worry, that means LESS social control.

This is also why they are fighting EFCA... it goes against Free to Work state ethos.

It is not just the South... they are just more vocal, but this is why the Republicans are fighting this.

[Captain Hilts]

1. Poor people w/o health ins. enlist in the military and leave the state. nt

[SammyWinstonJack]

44. And then they attain socialized health care and vote against others having access to the same.

Nice!

[nadinbrzezinski]

47. Actually many of these kids, epecially if they do a career

never return to the South and their values are changed by the military experience.

[gravity]

2. They are the most racists

[nadinbrzezinski]

4. Race is just ONE component

it is about social control... and race is a component of it

[gravity]

11. I really don't think they are that smart

Their logic is government is bad, and doesn't go much deeper than that.

[nadinbrzezinski]

18. The leadership is, and why it willfully embraced the Southern

Strategy. Now somebody like Joe Wilson, son of the COnfederacy... it is that simple

And that yell was YOU LIE... BOY.

But for the leadership, they know exactly what they are doing. And short term, it led to victories. Long term... I think 2010 will be telling... if the RNC does not take any gains... we may be going the way of the Whigs. If they loose more ground, that is where we are going.

[onehandle]

3. We hate America.

Well not me, of course.

[nadinbrzezinski]

7. Careful there a RWer might take that

as an admission of guilt

[Bigmack]

5. One small amendment...

They just have a hard time imagining that black people might get health care....

[Donnachaidh]

6. well both my reps are Doctors

And Tom Price has dealings with one of the wealthiest surgical groups in the area. I'm sure Gingrey has the same or better connections.

Social control yes, but it's ALL about the money honey. These two get most of their bucks from former colleagues. And I'll bet they (or family members) own stock in the COMPANIES they represent.

[nadinbrzezinski]

Money is part of that social control

if you got it, and they don't, well fear of starvation is a strong inhibitor to social revolt.

[pitohui]

8. you know why, because a black man might get a dollar in his pocket

there is a large loud minority and maybe even in some parishes/counties it's a majority of redneck bigots who would be happy to go bankrupt and lose their house and die at age 50 as long as a black man never gets a dollar

seriously

that's how deep the hate goes

you see it not just with health care but w. the dismantling of the public schools, the best public school system in the world (or it used to be) systematically under attack for 30 years because, you know, they let black kids go there

these people are sincere, they would give their lives and their family's future just so that their hate can triumph

it makes you sick about human nature, that's for sure

as for the politicians who play to that, honestly, they must not have a soul or a conscience, they are simply sociopaths, they must know what they're playing to and they simply don't care

let tens of thousands DIE every year and hundreds of thousands if not millions suffer in pain, they don't care, all that matters is being called the honorable representative blah de blah

[nadinbrzezinski]

10. As I said race is part of the toxic stew

and for some it is the only response, but it is not just race.

Also that hate that the politicos use is also a mean of social control, keep them divided. The poor white is more malleable as long as he has a poor black...

Sick indeed.

[BlooInBloo]

14. "and for some it is the only response"...

[TxRider]

9. Because they want to get re-elected.

If their constituents were pro health care they would elect someone else.

[nadinbrzezinski]

13. You are aware how you can propagandaize a population right?

that is also part of your answer, and the RW in this country has been waging a war against the middle class for fifty years or so.

The first strike was the Right to Work stete doctrine, which weakened, some might argue, destroyed the power of the Wagner act. The effect, states where the union movement was strong... are the most anti union states these days.

[TxRider]

20. Of course

But it doesn't change the fact that if they voted for public health care this month they would be tossed out of office..

Health care needs to be sold to their constituents... big time. Then they will change their tune.

[nadinbrzezinski]

23. They are the ones attacking it

this is about ideology and social control. This is about the tenth amendment, aka code for states rights, which is code to we can do whatever we want INSIDE our state.

And the voters are propagandized enough to vote for this shit.

[TxRider]

30. It's about propagandized voters..

Break through that propaganda, educate them, and they will elect someone else.

Until then we deal with assholes like Wilson forever...


I assumed that was obvious in my first post, and wouldn't have to be spelled out.

[nadinbrzezinski]

35. Well the spelled out part is that labor organizers

have died trying.

[TxRider]

36. The job isn't done yet then.

The question was asked why they fight against it, I just answered.

[nadinbrzezinski]

38. And it is more complex than your answer

just like blaming race (one aspect of this) is not the whole answer.

By the way, I wish it was that simple.

[TxRider]

41. It always is

It would take a book to explain, and this is not a place where that is possible.

Fortunately Texas public health care isn't as bad as most of the south.

Counties have to provide at least a minimum standard of health care to everyone.

[depakid]

17. Yep. Texans don't need health care or education

Which is fine by me. Let them rot.

So long as they leave the saner folks in more responsible states alone.

[TxRider]

25. Great attitude there...

Why not try to educate their constituents instead, so they will elect someone else? So a good health care bill can be passed?

Nahh Fuck em..

[nadinbrzezinski]

32. i fear that if we have the equivalent of the Bus Riders of the Sixties

today going to the south, the same will happen again, for the same social reasons.

This is the way it is... oh and some labor organizers have tried.

[Frustratedlady]

12. If Obama gets healthcare passed and it works without many problems...

it would be considered a huge success by everyone except Repugs. They don't want Obama to win at anything.

[nadinbrzezinski]

19. If it doesn't work very well like SS didn't in the begginging

or Medicare, it will still be a defeat to the RNC. They need to STOP IT at any cost.

[eleny]

15. Those states probably have the most Republicans in the Congress

And since the Rs are against just about anything Obama initiates.... you get the picture.

[nadinbrzezinski]

26. Yes, the Southern Strategy has rippened into a regional Southern Party

indeed...

[depakid]

16. Basically because they want to hoist their third world model on the entire United States

[nadinbrzezinski]

21. That is part of it and that involves quite a bit of social engineering

and population control

It is authoritarian in nature...

[depakid]

28. Fantasies of the Antebellum South

They think they'll be the ones in the mansions- when in reality, the vast majority were dirt farmers and struggling merchants.

[nadinbrzezinski]

31. Of course, but that has been

the propaganda fed as a steady diet

[customerserviceguy]

22. I'd have to say that Reconstruction

left a bad taste in Southern mouths for a strong Federal government.

[nadinbrzezinski]

24. And I fully agree wiht you

in my view they should have left it alone, or gone all the way. They didn't.

Also losing the war left a bad taste in the mouth of many states rights fans, and not just in the South either.

[izquierdista]

27. The teabaggers aren't more vocal

They speak at the same volume as other people, but it just sounds louder because there are no teeth in the way to block the sound.

[nadinbrzezinski]

29. The tea baggers are the marionets

I am talking of the men behind the curtain... the ones who actually have the power to say in Congress... NAY... Mr Wilson says NAY.

[Jackpine Radical]

33. I think you're half right.

The other half is that they're trying to keep mental health care away from their supporters, knowing they couldn't be elected if a majority of the voters were sane.

[nadinbrzezinski]

34. Of course, their voters woudl realize the devil

is not the one in DC but the ones they keep electing, and perhaps have a moment of sanity about those who literally control them using fear and other tactics.

[Jackpine Radical]

37. What a wonderful fantasy--they all wake up one morning with the scales

fallen from their eyes, look around them, and see the world as it really is. I wonder how many of them could handle it?

[nadinbrzezinski]

39. A few will have that experience

but reality is that this is a very complex problem going back 200 years, to a very specific, and very insular culture... that does rely on social control. All societies do, but the manner it is exercised on this one is particularly nasty.

[Jackpine Radical]

40. BTW, Nadin, I wanted to ask you about your Kindle.

You got the big one or the little one? How long you had it? Is my fear realistic--the one about how easy it is to keep buying books? Doe sit tend to bankrupt you? My physicist stepson has one, and he's always walking around with it, bumping into walls & whatnot.

[nadinbrzezinski]

45. I got the kindle reader on the IPOD Touch

been thinking of splurging, but I can do fine with the IPOD.

And I love it. Right now readying Shaeffer's autobio... Crazy for God... GREAT read... and now I get it why he is so well spoken... mom was the wife of a preacher, but she read the kids all kinds of classics, so the kids learned to appreciate letters, the arts and all that. She gave them a liberal education and I am sure she didn't mean to.

[Jackpine Radical]

48. Wow. Hey, I've got an iTouch too.

It was simply the best available PDA to replace my dying Palm TX. I've got a lot of clinical junk on it like Epocrates and some brainwave entrainment CDs. I think I actually put the Kindle reader on it but haven't used it, mostly out of kindness to my old eyes. If I were to get a Kindle, I think I'd go for the big one, even though it's $$$.

[area51]

42. Agreed about the social control factor.

I've wondered a long time why, since businesses keep complaining about the cost of getting healthcare for their employees, why they didn't spend some of their money & hire lobbyists & scream to congress that we need single-payer in order to become competitive. But despite their griping, they don't want to lose control over their employees, if the employee can just go elsewhere and not have to worry about healthcare in general, a pre-existing condition, or their age being a factor in getting another job.

[Ardent15]

43. The original reason was because of integrated hospitals...

Now, there are several reasons. Social control as you point out, the insurance companies, and the general rural fear of "big government." (unless it's military).

[nadinbrzezinski]

46. Been doing a lot of thinking about this

as I look seriously at different regions of the country. and to be honest some of this scares me. Not because southern rural society is that different, or for that matter rural society in general. But how different this plays out. Let's not kid ourselves as all sections do have a need for social control, but the way it plays in some regions goes back to an almost caste system.