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Interesting. Joe Wilson is a member of Sons of Confederate Veterans

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Trocadero Donating Member (892 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-16-09 10:39 PM
Original message
Interesting. Joe Wilson is a member of Sons of Confederate Veterans
Edited on Wed Sep-16-09 10:53 PM by Trocadero
http://www.votesmart.org/bio.php?can_id=3985


The citizen-soldiers who fought for the Confederacy personified the best qualities of America. The preservation of liberty and freedom was the motivating factor in the South's decision to fight the Second American Revolution. The tenacity with which Confederate soldiers fought underscored their belief in the rights guaranteed by the Constitution. These attributes are the underpinning of our democratic society and represent the foundation on which this nation was built.
Today, the Sons of Confederate Veterans is preserving the history and legacy of these heroes, so future generations can understand the motives that animated the Southern Cause.

The SCV is the direct heir of the United Confederate Veterans, and the oldest hereditary organization for male descendents of Confederate soldiers...

http://www.scv.org /
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Tangerine LaBamba Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-16-09 10:41 PM
Response to Original message
1. And his claim to have been an
"immigration attorney" has proven to be false.

The guy's just a total joy, isn't he?
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Louisiana1976 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-16-09 10:41 PM
Response to Original message
2. "Things that make you go hmm...."
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PM Martin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-16-09 10:43 PM
Response to Original message
3. So does
Trace Adkins
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doc03 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-16-09 10:49 PM
Response to Original message
4. A co-worker of mine is a member of that
one. On week ends he dresses up like a Confederate soldier and he is also as racist as you can get. He leaves his Civil War Veterans magazine in the office, after all these decades they are still fighting the Civil War.
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Mari333 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-16-09 10:55 PM
Response to Original message
5. check out their online store
https://scv.secure-sites.us/store.php?mode=04&offset=30...


I was intrigued by this one



that says a mouthful.
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-16-09 11:09 PM
Response to Reply #5
8. Actually this bumper sticker speaks even more
Bumper Sticker; 'The South Was Right'
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Ramulux Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-16-09 11:02 PM
Response to Original message
6. How can an elected official be apart of this group?
If the confederates personified the best qualities of America, then it must be really "American" to hate black people.
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Trocadero Donating Member (892 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-16-09 11:04 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. this is seriously f'd up
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RoyGBiv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-16-09 11:22 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. If that's a serious question ...
Edited on Wed Sep-16-09 11:23 PM by RoyGBiv
The SCV is technically a genealogical group.

In practice it's highly decentralized, and different camps have different areas of focus. Some concentrate almost solely on historical preservation and genealogical study, much like their United Daughter's of the Confederacy (UDC) counterparts. There's nothing at all wrong with that bit of it.

I actually know of an SCV camp (a small one) that voted as a bloc for both Kerry and Obama.

However, certain camps, divisions, and even state level governing bodies are highly politicized, staunchly right-wing (I won't say "conservative" because they are very radical) and align themselves with the League of the South (LoS), a white protestant separatist group that models itself largely on their idealized version of the Old South and the Confederacy. Likely Joe Wilson is a part of one of these sub-groups, and it would be interesting to know whether he is directly associated with the LoS. (They're LoSers, get it?) The LoS actively seeks the secession of some Southern states and has, since issuing its guiding principles back in the 90s, been actively working toward influencing government policy by backing elected officials sympathetic to their cause. I've made note before on DU of certain political personalities with LoS ties, suggesting the culmination of the LoS strategy is coming to fruition.

I saw a lot about how the SCV functions from the inside a decade or so ago, not as a member but in cooperation with some camps and individuals in the area of historical preservation. These same factions of the SCV worked closely with the Sons of Union Veterans of the Civil War (SUVCW) for the same purpose. I got to know a few people high up in the organization and was subscribed to several mailing lists. What I saw stunned me. The infighting was ferocious as members of the organization back then did fall all across the political and social spectrum. Unfortunately, the hardcore Confederate apologists got the upper hand, partly due to larger numbers, and weeded out the "grannies," as they were called, which described those who dared believe things such as slavery was a cause of the war and that the organization should stay out of politics and focus on historical preservation and genealogy.

The SCV today is, mostly, a cover for a right-wing hate group, but it still maintains the veneer of a historical group.

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Ramulux Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-16-09 11:24 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. Thx
Thanks for the info, I would be interested to find out exactly which sub-group he belongs to also.
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Zomby Woof Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-16-09 11:55 PM
Response to Reply #9
14. The SCV is a 501(c)3 organization
Members of the military and employees of the federal government can donate to them from their paychecks through the Combined Federal Campaign. Anyone can donate to them and deduct it as a charitable contribution on their 1040 Schedule A. Technically, they are an historical/educational veterans' descendants organization, and officially apolitical. Their rules specifically prohibit racism, religious discrimination, political activism, or using it to recruit for supremacist organizations. But as you said, they are only as good as their local camps, and some do better than others, because of the hostile takeover of some camps by partisans. Although there are members of the low caliber and questionable character of Joe Wilson, and many even worse - honorable members past and present have included President Harry S Truman, who integrated the armed forces, the late "Civil War" author Shelby Foote, and Clint Eastwood - not a liberal, but most certainly not racist. They have Jewish, African-American, and Asian-American members. Judging them by racist members who get away with it due to power grabs and whatnot would be like judging DU by the flakes and tinfoilers who overrun GD - not fair to the organization as a whole, nor representative of its rank-and-file.

This is an example of the good works a local camp can do:

Link: http://www.somdnews.com/stories/03262008/indyfea114220_...

Excerpt:

The Rev. Edward P. OConnell, a Bronx native, had been trying to get a grave marker for George Brown a black farmer who fought for the Union since the 1950s.

No one was all that interested in helping the history buff priest.

He tracked down every lead only to be turned down.

Then, the Sons of Confederate Veterans said they would help.

OConnell was a guest speaker at a meeting of the Maryland chapters of Confederate Sons when he mentioned Browns unmarked grave. Brown, buried beside his second wife, Sarah, in the St. Catherines cemetery made sure his wife had a headstone while he was buried in an unmarked grave.

A group of descendants of Confederate soldiers were funding a grave marker for a Union soldier, simply because, We like any veterans with unmarked graves to be taken care of, said Jim Dunbar, commander of Sons of Confederate Soldiers Pvt. Wallace Bowling Camp 1400, in 2006.

On Saturday at the cemetery of what was Browns familys parish, the groups will hold a dedication ceremony honoring the Union corporals service.

This isnt a black thing, this isnt a white thing, said Ben Hawley, one of the programs organizers and a member of B Company, 54th Massachusetts Volunteer Infantry Regiment, a re-enactment group out of Washington, D.C. This is a historical thing.
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RoyGBiv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-17-09 12:28 AM
Response to Reply #14
16. Precisely ...
Edited on Thu Sep-17-09 12:30 AM by RoyGBiv
This is precisely the kind of thing in which I was involved and would be glad to be involved again.

I have dear friends in the SCV. I personally know an esteemed historian who is a member. The SCV, in and of itself, isn't the problem.

The problem is some (many) of its members who have chosen to use the SCV as a vehicle to promote their perverse political views. As I unfortunately witnessed during a lengthy period of time during which I was directly involved with the organization, this faction browbeat and otherwise worked to purge the group of individuals who had loftier goals in mind than those espoused by some of those in charge today.

On a personal note, I find it all very sad. I stood over a mass grave of a Union soldiers with members of the SCV, SUVCW, UDC, and a high ranking member of the Military Order of the Stars and Bars, the SCV's sister organization for descendants of Confederate officers. One Union soldier buried there had fought and died against a Confederate regiment commanded by a relative who had died at the same battle. We placed a wreath and a marker on the grave at the behest of one of the soldier's descendants who was too infirm to make the trip but who had recently discovered the existence of this ancestor.

For other work I did, I have a citation that I proudly display on my wall from the North Carolina Division of the SCV. Unfortunately, the person whose signature adorns it is no longer with the SCV. He was a "grannie" who thought the political leanings of so many of its members was antithetical to his personal principles. He *refused* to support the idea that SCV members should not salute the American flag at the onset of its meetings, and he had the audacity to suggest that a certain Confederate general who after the war had had the audacity to suggest the South had lost and needed to get over it was not a traitor.

Too many of the reasonable people in the SCV have been chased out of it. Granted, some remain. I doubt Joe Wilson is among them or would appreciate them.

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Zomby Woof Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-17-09 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #16
19. Great story about that ceremony
And a sickening shame that these League of the South yahoos are poisoning the SCV. Some of the Florida camps (naturally, being Florida) make the SCV look like clowns for obsessing over flying the giant Confederate flag over the interstate exit. They need to work more on battlefield preservation, gravestone restoration/preservation, and doing local community service, a la the Lions or Masons. That's the SCV at its best.

At its worst, it is allowing the bottom-feeding ultra-right scumbags to politicize it, one camp at a time, as you described. Which is a direct violation of the SCV constitution. In fact, the SCV constitution (available as a .pdf on its website - anyone can access it) specifically requires that as a U.S. Veterans organization (per federal law, Confederate veterans are U.S. veterans, hence President Obama's decision to send the wreath to the Confederate memorial at Arlington recently), members uphold the constitution and flag of the United States.

The Commander-in-Chief of the SCV, Charles E. McMichael, actually wrote a very cordial thank you letter to President Obama for his decision. I don't know his leanings - I suspect he is a solid conservative - but at least he was polite and respectful by acknowledging Obama's gesture. At the very least, not a birther type, who could never bring themselves to say anything positive about him, or accept his legitimacy to hold the office.

As for that citation you mentioned, both Presidents Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton received similar honors during their terms in office. Carter, because he signed into law a measure restoring Jefferson Davis's citizenship, and Clinton, for working with an Arkansas camp regarding some preservation efforts. Clearly, the organization has declined since those days.
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misanthrope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-17-09 02:06 AM
Response to Reply #14
17. Check out Shelby Foote's reasons for departing the SCV**nm
**
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Zomby Woof Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-17-09 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. Yep
Edited on Thu Sep-17-09 11:33 AM by Zomby Woof
Because his local camp was taken over by idiots who invited George Wallace to speak. I know the story.

But nothing precluded him from being a member before that - which was for decades.

I think some DUers would be surprised to learn that Foote supported South Carolina's government flying the Confederate battle flag above the state capital. He was a liberal southerner, but did not meet standards of DU Orthodoxy.
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RoyGBiv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-17-09 08:25 PM
Response to Reply #18
20. Foote was a great guy ...

A friend of mine in Memphis was a personal friend of Foote before the latter's death. They tromped Shiloh many times together, so many that my friend had actually grown bored with the place. I got to meet him once, shortly before his death. A more gracious, intelligent, and charming individual I could not hope to meet again in my lifetime.

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BlooInBloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-16-09 11:56 PM
Response to Reply #6
15. Never been to South Carolina, I take it.
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Shallah Kali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-16-09 11:29 PM
Response to Original message
11. One segment of that group are frank secessionists. SPLC did a piece on them - link
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RoyGBiv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-16-09 11:37 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. Yup ...

"For almost four years now, the SCV has been embroiled in an increasingly nasty civil war, as racial extremists battle moderates for control of what is certainly the largest Southern heritage organization in America. In the last year and a half, under the leadership of a new national chief whose politics have become clearer as his term of office unfolded, the ascendancy of the radicals has become undeniable."

This is precisely what I saw.

What bothers me (or one of the things that bothers me) is that this all started taking place years before anyone really knew of it. Some people, historians mostly, knew of it and commented upon it in various ways, but most people interested in such things thought it was ridiculous. People not interested in such things -- that would be most people -- didn't think of it at all. When a group with which I was affiliated, for example, suggested we might want to keep an eye on the members of the League of the South, which was at that time infiltrating the SCV, people called us paranoid or flatly stupid. "None of those people could ever get elected."

Well, I don't know if Joe Wilson is a League of the South member, nor do I know if he has ever been directly associated with them. I do, however, know he is an elected official. I know he is a member of a group that came to be dominated by those sympathetic to or actively pursuing League of the South goals. And, I know that he has acted in a way identical to the way the LoS would want him to act. Now, he's a nationally known figure with a sizable following.

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RoyGBiv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-16-09 11:42 PM
Response to Original message
13. A good article on SCV/LoS/CCC ...

... and the relationship between them.

http://www.tampabay.com/news/humaninterest/article62325...

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