West Point grads exit service at high rate

[babylonsister]

http://www.boston.com/news/nation/washington/articles/2007/04/11/west_point_grads_exit_service_at_high_rate/?p1=MEWell_Pos3

West Point grads exit service at high rate
War's redeployments thought a major factor

By Bryan Bender, Globe Staff | April 11, 2007

WASHINGTON -- Recent graduates of the US Military Academy at West Point are choosing to leave active duty at the highest rate in more than three decades, a sign to many military specialists that repeated tours in Iraq are prematurely driving out some of the Army's top young officers.

According to statistics compiled by West Point, of the 903 Army officers commissioned upon graduation in 2001, nearly 46 percent left the service last year -- 35 percent at the conclusion of their five years of required service, and another 11 percent over the next six months. And more than 54 percent of the 935 graduates in the class of 2000 had left active duty by this January, the statistics show.

The figures mark the lowest retention rate of graduates after the completion of their mandatory duty since at least 1977, with the exception of members of three classes in the late 1980s who were encouraged to leave as the military downsized following the end of the Cold War.

In most years during the last three decades, the period for which West Point released statistics, the numbers of graduates opting out at the five-year mark were between 10 percent and 30 percent, according to the data.

The rising exodus is blamed on a number of factors, including the economic lure of the private sector. But interviews with former West Point superintendents, graduates, and retired officers pointed to another reason: the wear and tear on officers and their families from multiple deployments.

"Iraq is exerting very strong influence on the career intentions of junior officers," said retired Lieutenant General Daniel Christman, a former superintendent of West Point, who recently outlined the war's toll on young officers in a speech to West Point alumni in North Carolina.

more...

[coco77]

1. What happen to the rah, rahs...

[Deja Q]

3. Well, whomever decided it was better to say "We are not a society, we are indivial men, women, and

families" kinda set the trend.

Oops.

[Monkeyman]

4. Bush

[MADem]

2. A hundred grand, per, at least--makes you wonder if the Academy system gives much in the way of bang

for the buck.

That said, I don't blame them. Take the education and run.

[TahitiNut]

8. I'd say it's more like 2-4 times that.

As a former cadet (at the USCGA), I can say that little expense is spared in offering outstanding facilities and equipment ... and they get PAID on top of that.

[MADem]

14. Think your estimate is a bit high. The USNA runs about $136,000 for the full educational experience

That isn't counting the Midshipman (basic E-5, in essence) pay, mind you or board, which is mandated. That works about to about thirty some odd grand a year, which is lower than Harvard ($44K) and closer to MIT (around $33K per annum). Of course, that's not including room and board, which seems to be running between seven and nine in many schools, but then the Academies aren't Harvard or MIT either.

Recently, a midshipman acquitted of rape but convicted of misconduct was directed to reimburse his tuition--they gave him a slight discount for 'honorable service.' It's caused a bit of a brouhaha there:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/04/13/AR2007041301124.html?hpid=moreheadlines

Since the jury verdict in July, Owens has been assigned to the Washington Navy Yard, hoping he would eventually serve as an officer. Winter rejected that idea and ordered Owens to pay back $90,797.75 of the $136,196.62 it cost to educate him, waiving one-third of the cost "in recognition of his noteworthy professional conduct" in the past year.

Students attend the academy tuition free but can be asked to reimburse costs in misconduct cases and other instances.

[Captain Angry]

5. Any of these people get their service involuntarily extended?

These guys get to choose to leave on time? The grunts get 90-365 days added on to their enlistments and they have no say in the matter.

I'm not talking about this recent 90 day more in Iraq thing. I'm talking about how they are due to be out in January 2007 and get told, nope, it's 2008 now. See you next year when we might do it again.

[wakeme2008]

6. When the Ring Knockers are leaving

Things are bad... :shrug:

[TahitiNut]

9. The prospect of a higher ratio of ROTC types is scary.

:scared: Say what you will, the ring-knockers were far better than the Rambo-wannabes.

[wakeme2008]

10. I would bet if the Ring Knockers are leaving in high numbers

the Rambo-wannabes would be leaving in higher numbers. :shrug:

[Squatch]

12. I'm an ROTC grad...

and I've been serving for 10 years now. Never knew I was a Rambo-wannabe.

In that time, I've seen that the best officers are OCS graduates. I joined ROTC not to be a Rambo-wannabe, I joined and graduated from ROTC because I wanted to serve in the military as an officer. This Animal House perception of ROTC is ridiculous, as I've seen quite a few West Pointers who not only had terrible attitudes toward military service, but also had horrible tactical decision-making abilities.

[MADem]

15. I'll be honest with you, from a Navy perspective.

I've found that OCS grads are generally good to excellent. I've rarely had a bad one work for me. They're mature when you get them, they know why they're serving, and they are self-motivated. ROTC grads are, as you note, slightly less focused as a rule--at least in MY personal experience. As for the ring knockers, either they're great or they stink on ice, and there's a paucity of critical and independent thinking in no small number of them. They either get it (and have always gotten it), or they're just good at taking direction, poor at thinking for themselves.

I think it has to do with the absurdity of their college experience. ROTC has to 'toe the line' to a lesser extent than the Academy types, but nonetheless, they aren't allowed to make those mistakes that every kid makes when they move away from home and whoop it up at university.

An "Academy fresh" asset can be a worst nightmare--they've spent four years in an insulated, false environment, not doing all of the idiotic things that college students do as a rite of passage, or doing them furtively for fear of being caught and 'punished' by a system that punishes behavior that isn't illegal in the real world, and it creates a cadre of infantile junior officers.

I don't think it's the best system for this century, myself. I also think if we're going to persist in a "war without end" scenario, we need to raise the age of accession for ENLISTED personnel to 21. Never mind the "Old enough to die, old enough to vote," these poor hapless bastards shouldn't be going off to die without being able to have a farewell beer with Paw before they go.

[TahitiNut]

16. In my experience, OCS grads are, on average, quite decent.

I think it probably has to do with the "mustang" background - NCOs often make the best officers at the tactical level. My experience with ROTC grads (and I DID take ROTC for a while) is that the WORST I met were ROTC ... and they drag down the average. Ring Knockers have the greatest long term potential, imho. When still wet behind the ears, there are good ones and there are robots ... but they really do learn and quite quickly. (Yes, I was also a cadet at the USCGA ... and that applied even there.)

By far, the two biggest jackasses we (me, personally) had in Nam were both ROTC. One was a Captain who literally carried war comic books in his back pocket and was a joke in my company. The other was a LtC who abused the troops - bringing garrison Mickey Mouse attitudes to a combat zone. (It was rumored he got fragged.)

[muntrv]

7. Shrub told the military in 2000 "Help is on the way." He should have said

PSYCHE!!!!

[fujiyama]

11. .

.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

13. So the Army is losing their best and their brightest and on the other side, bringing in felons and

sub par recruits.

Thanks Shrub for continuing to break our military.