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May I present Ladies and Gents, an Alternate Theory of Max Baucus

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Phoebe Loosinhouse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 08:55 PM
Original message
May I present Ladies and Gents, an Alternate Theory of Max Baucus
Edited on Sun Aug-23-09 09:09 PM by Phoebe Loosinhouse
It had just crystallized for me and then up popped this post from Pro Sense

Max Baucus: I Want a Public Option Too (which references a Daily Kos diary)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

and without further ado here is my revolutionary new postulation:

I had lately been finding Max Baucus a strange and mysterious man, due largely to the recent unearthing on various websites of his VERY OWN plan for Healthcare Reform - here
http://finance.senate.gov/healthreform2009/finalwhitepa...

If you read that plan, with a date of November 12 2008 attached to it, you will find it very similar to Obama's own healthcare plan and yes, it does include a Public Option on page 27, which while quite vague, is still described as "similar to Medicare".

So this man wrote and presented a healthcare plan with his name on it just a scant 9 months ago that is a completely respectable and seemingly quite sincere plan THE DAY AFTER THE ELECTION.

Here's my new theory - WHAT IF HE MEANT IT?

But, he's the head of the Senate Finance Committee. All of a sudden, he becomes the conduit for most of the business the White House wants done behind closed doors, although still under their supervision. See this thread

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph ...

Also see this thread where Robert Reich says that the distillation of the Finance Committee into the Gang of Six was done under the direction of the White House
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph ...

In summary - What if Max Baucus is Sydney Carton and he is being pilloried for the sins of Rahm Emmanuel as Charles Darnay
and what if he is just deciding that it is NOT a "far far better thing" to be hung for the sins of another?

What if he is the one leaking all the unsavory deals with Pharma because he doesn't agree with them? One of those stories I previously posted by the NYT says that he abruptly withdrew from some announcement that was supposed to announce a deal with hospitals. Why did he abruptly withdraw? The NYT asked : "Was he backing away from his end of the deal?" Of course, his end is also the White House end.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/13/health/policy/13healt...

Max Baucus may be tired of carrying the Administrations water and taking almost all the heat for it.
**********************************************************************************************************************************

Disclaimer - the above is strictly the product of my own fanciful thinking and the result of reading way too many Nancy Drew books as a child.

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Motown_Johnny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 09:03 PM
Response to Original message
1. Then the White House has more influence on that committee than I suspected.
I guess the Max Baucus plan from November should be something that is made common knowledge instead of it being something only a few know about.
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Motown_Johnny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 09:06 PM
Response to Original message
2. Hmmm.... the link to his plan does not work... may not exist anymore
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Phoebe Loosinhouse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 09:09 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Try again. I reposted it and it worked for me. nt
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dflprincess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 09:21 PM
Response to Original message
4. Then Baucus should go public
He has a duty to let us know who is more concerned with protecting the health insurance companies and keeping us from real reform.
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Phoebe Loosinhouse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 09:29 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. "Who is more concerned w/ protecting health insurance companies . . ." is a LOOONG list
There is also a loooong list of who could be ratting out the behind doors dealings of the White House. I'm just grateful that whoever they are, they exist and sense some higher responsibility to the public. Baucus doesn't have to do anything based on my idle speculations.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 09:28 PM
Response to Original message
5. So according to your theory, Max " 'No idea' how he'll vote on Sotomayor" Baucus is a hero
Edited on Sun Aug-23-09 09:33 PM by FrenchieCat
and Barack obama is a piece of shit.

Sounds like I'm gonna have to adjust my meter, as I thought Obama was the more progressive one, and Max Baucus was the one coming out of Montana, a Republican State.


Who knew? :wow:


According to OpenSecrets.org, these are the top five industries contributing to Baucus campaigns between 2003-2008:

Securities & Investment $832,918
Lawyers/Law Firms $668,004
Insurance $590,185
Health Professionals $537,141
Pharmaceuticals/Health Products $524,813
snip

His voting record certainly reflects the donations he's received. For example, Baucus was one of eighteen Democrats to support the 2005 predatory bankruptcy legislation passed by congress and signed into law by President George W. Bush. Baucus also supported the Bush administration's catastrophic tax cuts in 2001 that helped give us the deficits so called moderate Democrats like him claim to worry about today.

Indeed, it seems moderate Democrats like Baucus always promote fiscal responsibility until it gets in the way of redistributing wealth from wage earners living paycheck to paycheck to the super rich.
http://discuss.epluribusmedia.net/node/3964


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Phoebe Loosinhouse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 09:42 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. It's hard to discuss anything with someone who takes as their personal jumping off point
Does this make President Obama look good or bad?

That's your only filter. It isn't mine.

I posted all kinds of factual news articles that a lot of behind the scenes stuff is going on with the Finance Committee with the White House using Baucus as their point person. You can like that or not like that, but it does not change the reality of the situation.

If you research who is on the Pharma and Insurance Industry dole in the Senate and Congress it's a LOT of people. Baucus is definitely on that list. That's why I was personally quite surprised to read his personal white paper about healthcare reform. Maybe you should read it since I posted it. He also advocated opening up Medicare to those over 55.

I don't think the world is as simple as "Obama was the more progressive one, and Max Baucus was the one coming out of Montana, a Republican State." and that then dictates everything that follows that involves both those people. (And you left out Rahm Emmanuel)

There are a lot of re-alignments and shape-shiftings going on out there and we all have to stay on our toes. The end result and what is most important is what is delivered to the American people as healthcare reform. If we get good stuff we can all hail President Obama as a hero. I hope and pray to have that opportunity and to be able to vote him in for a second term.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 10:03 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. I was just going off of what you stated when framing your theory.....
Edited on Sun Aug-23-09 10:04 PM by FrenchieCat
"Max Baucus may be tired of carrying the Administrations water and taking almost all the heat for it."

My Interpretation of your theory: Baucus is semi unwillingly colluding with the White House against true health care reform, and he's actually the one leaking items to make the WH look bad, because he's tired of doing their dirty work, and being vilified.

Do I have that right?

When you have a chance, check out how Baucus has voted in his 5 terms in office, and then get back to me.

He's not a hero now, and he wasn't a hero in November, regardless of what he wrote.

As for me taking things personally....I think your theory is just that; a personal theory based on stuff.
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Phoebe Loosinhouse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 11:31 PM
Response to Reply #8
9.  I take do exception to you trying to put the word "hero" into my mouth
(although, since I am the one that compared him to Sydney Carton, I can understand it.)

Aside from that, I think your summation of my theory is pretty accurate except that I certainly don't know if he (Max Bauscus) is the leaker so I couldn't possibly say "he's actually the one leaking items".

I don't doubt that a look at his voting record over the last five years might be horrendous. I am not trying to make excuses for that. (I'm farther to the left than most on this board, so I am actually one of the last people you would expect to be making excuses for Max Baucus, of all people)

I guess one of the points I was trying to make, is that very few people are as simple as we make them out to be. Max Baucus may be more and deeper than the simple DLC tool he is often made out to be. Why did he wrote that health reform plan in the first place? I find that to be really, really, interesting.

And of course, you ALWAYS have the right to disagree with me.

Lastly - YES - what I wrote was a "personal theory based on stuff". I tried to be very clear that that was EXACTLY what it was.

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irislake Donating Member (967 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-24-09 09:18 AM
Response to Original message
10. Sorry, don't buy it.
He's a sleazeball.
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