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This Just In! Religious Right Leaders Admit Atheism!

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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:02 PM
Original message
This Just In! Religious Right Leaders Admit Atheism!
We have recently discovered that many religious right leaders are actually atheists. This information comes from their lack of concern with the teachings of Jesus Christ. If they actually believed that Jesus Christ existed and was the Savior, those religious right leaders would be preaching something completely different than the messages of hatred and discord they so loudly espouse.

Clearly, anyone familiar with the teaching of Jesus, as recorded in the first four books of the New Testament, often called the Gospels, would recognize that preaching hatred of gays, non-Christians, and others is anathema to those teachings. Similarly, preaching against established governments goes directly against the teachings of Jesus.

They would understand that Jesus taught that taking care of the ill, the old, and the imprisoned was not just a good idea, but one of his direct commands. It's in His own words, in Matthew.

But, they go on with their preaching of intolerance, hatred, and yes, even murder of those they dislike. There can be only one conclusion: These religious right fundamentalist leaders are not afraid of spending an eternity in Hell. They are not afraid that Jesus will say to them, "I do not know you," after their death. It follows, then, that they do not believe in Jesus at all, or any other benevolent deities.

They are, therefore, atheists. They do not fear the consequences of their words for the simple reason that they do not believe there is a reckoning after death. They know, as do all atheists, that life is brief and begins and ends with the birth and death of an individual.

Oh, there are true Christians and true believers in the teachings of Jesus. But those who preach hatred, death, and disorder against the government are not among them. They are simply atheists who believe in nothing and are feathering their earthly nests.
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lob1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:07 PM
Response to Original message
1. Atheist don't do what you claim, only psychopaths.
I'm an atheist and I wouldn't hurt anyone except in self-defense.
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:09 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Nor would I. There are, however, atheists who can be murderers.
Atheism is simply non-belief. It doesn't describe any aspect of behavior.
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The_Commonist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:07 PM
Response to Original message
2. I think you nailed it.
I've been thinking along those lines for years.
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theoldman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:12 PM
Response to Original message
4. Most Atheists I have met were head and shoulders above religious people.
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:14 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. I am an atheist, but I know that atheism has nothing to do
with behavioral matters. There is no atheist code of morality or ethics. Atheism is nothing more than disbelief in deities. I know many wonderful people who are atheists. I also know some genuine rounders. I can say the same for Christians, too.

All squares are, indeed, rectangles. The converse is not true.
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moobu2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:17 PM
Response to Original message
6.  I think the Christian right are the real Christians
and the more liberal Christians are actually atheists and don't know it yet.
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:26 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. Actually, the RR comes closest to being Paulian.
But I stand by my analysis.
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moobu2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:29 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. Jesus wasn't a Christian either though.
But I also stand by my analysis!
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:31 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. Right. He was a Jew. He'd be shocked at all this stuff, I'm sure.
Of course, there wasn't a single person living at that time with the name Jesus, so what the heck?
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heidler1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:25 PM
Response to Original message
7. Another thing they are missing is the logical ability to see the societal advantage in what Jesus
taught. By continually creating and adding to class differences, they undermine peace, promote war, refuse to accept the nature of mankind and they fill our prisons with what they call evil people. When in reality they're not one bit better than those they lock up.
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:29 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. Why would they care what Jesus taught? They don't believe in Him
Edited on Fri Aug-21-09 03:29 PM by MineralMan
anyhow. They can find plenty of fodder for their hatreds in the rest of the Bible and not have to involve Jesus at all. So that's what they do. They know it's all bullshit, but it's useful to their money-raising and for attracting sycophants.

They're going to get theirs while they're here. Screw the rest! They know it all ends for them when they draw their last breath. Maybe that's why Cheney and Pat Robertson have been so quiet lately. It's about up for both of them. Sucks to be them.
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heidler1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 04:48 PM
Response to Reply #9
27. I'm an Atheist, but like many other Atheists I'd like to see a lot of improvement right here on
Edited on Fri Aug-21-09 04:49 PM by heidler1
earth. I'm in agreement with the OP that most religious leaders are just greedy plus I do not believe that many of these so called religious people get it. It's as if they have a functionality problem in their brains. Like there's a vast area of conceptual thinking that they can not get to.

IMO what Jesus taught was the only part of the Bible worth knowing, but even there they label it Christianity in honor of a wish was guy that was supposed to restore Jerusalem to being a powerful nation.
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Odin2005 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:31 PM
Response to Original message
12. This post is offensive to non-beleivers. It perpetuates the "Atheist = no morals" lie.
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:36 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. I am one of those non-believers. The thread does no such thing.
Atheism has nothing whatever to do with ethics or morals. It is simply non-belief. Ethics and morality come from other places, and always have.

The bulk of atheists are good-hearted people, just as are the bulk of most other groups of people. There are, however, atheists who are not. Atheism does not imply any particular ethical model. Inferring that it does is a logical error.

Human beings are individuals. They behave as they behave on an individual basis. Religous belief or disbelief is not one of the indicators of how an individual human being will behave. One can only determine that from actual behavior, not professed belief or unbelief in deities.

I am very careful with what I write. Unless I make a connection between a belief system and behavior, I do not intend that one be drawn.
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harry_pothead Donating Member (752 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:33 PM
Response to Original message
13. I'm a proud atheist
And I believe that there are consequences for my actions.
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:38 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. So am I, and that is why I behave as I do.
That's how good people of all beliefs behave. Even the Religious Right Leaders. They believe that the consequences of their evil actions will be money, fame, and power. That is why they behave the way they do. I'm just saying that they don't believe in the deity they claim to believe in. If they did, they'd behave differently.
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SidneyCarton Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:42 PM
Response to Original message
16. Interesting.
I would argue that they are in fact, Idol worshipers. Their idol, instead of some golden Baal or Moloch, is themselves. They are God, and therefore they decide what is right and wrong, who lives and who dies, etc... etc... But saying that out loud, or even admitting that to themselves would be ruinous, just like the most RW'ers would never dare actually confront the inherent, underlying Social Darwinism in their policies. For either of them to do so would be to render themselves as anathema.
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:50 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. While they do worship themselves, that is not idolatry.
An idol is necessarily something external. The love of power, with its ancillary benefits of fame and wealth, is more than enough to drive these people. I savor the thought of their coming to an understanding of the futility of that in their last days and hours.

Every person must face himself or herself in those last days, unless he or she is killed in an accident or something like that. The Cheneys and Robertsons and Haggards of this world do have a punishment coming...one they denied for the bulk of their lives.

Even if they thought of themselves as some sort of demigod, they'll think again as they wheeze their way to their deaths, surrounded by only those who wish them to hurry so they might have what is left behind. As I said, I savor the thought of it.

Good, kind people, however, have none of this. Despite the sad fading of the light, they may reflect on their lives with some satisfaction, and will likely be surrounded by people who love them for their goodness and kindness. That's despite any beliefs or non-beliefs they may have, for it is not those that are the measure of a life, but the living of that life.
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SidneyCarton Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 04:09 PM
Response to Reply #17
24. You're right, its not idolatry, its narcissism.
And indeed the measure of one's life is not one's professed beliefs, but how one lived one's life. Actions reveal both one's true character, and the degree to which one's professed beliefs were actually integral with one's being.
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heidler1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 05:01 PM
Response to Reply #17
28. I don't buy the: "While they do worship themselves"
I submit, that those who believe that they deserve to resurrect some how and will then go on for ever, have more self worship than Atheists who see death as final.
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stopbush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:53 PM
Response to Original message
18. The fact is that everybody is an atheist when it comes to 99.9999% of the gods
man has ever invented for himself. It's just that everybody thinks THEIR chosen god is the only "real" god in the lot.

:evilgrin:
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:55 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. That's very facile, but not everybody believes in even a single deity.
Some of us simply reject them all as nonsense and superstition.
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stopbush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:57 PM
Response to Reply #19
22. As do I. I was speaking of the religious.
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charlie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:56 PM
Response to Original message
20. Then everybody's an atheist, save a few
Christians play chicken with God's disfavor all the time. Just watch your officemates and friends. Willfully straying and being forcefully righted is one of the oldest tropes in Christian testimony.

And if you're a narcissist and a good bureaucrat, you can rationalize all sorts of dispensations for yourself as God's pious instrument and tweeze out scripture to back it up. Being a bastard in the service of the Lord is pretty common, it doesn't mean you don't believe.

Also, you're asserting certainty in your interpretation of scripture, which as you know, won't match the interpretation of squintillions of Christ-professing believers who are just as certain.

From your analysis, you could just as readily deduce they're all Satanists, BTW.
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 07:16 PM
Response to Reply #20
29. Satanists, eh? Well, there's a thought...
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valerief Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:57 PM
Response to Original message
21. Hey, stop bad-mouthing atheists! We don't preach hate!!!
:spank:
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 07:17 PM
Response to Reply #21
30. I'm not bad-mouthing atheists. Read further in the thread.
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Bobbie Jo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:58 PM
Response to Original message
23. K&R
:kick:
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Fire Walk With Me Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 04:11 PM
Response to Original message
25. The Religious Right are neither.
(stealing from the "Moral Mojority are neither" bumper stickers...)
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montanto Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 04:14 PM
Response to Original message
26. "They are, therefore, atheists."
"intolerance, hatred . . . murder . . ." Therefore Atheist?

Uh, no.

I am an atheist. I don't do or say any of the above, and neither do any atheists I know. Try again.
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 07:19 PM
Response to Reply #26
31. Read the rest of the thread, please. I'm an atheist, too.
They are not atheists because they are intolerant, hate, and murder. They are atheists because they do not follow the man they profess to follow.

As for atheists, I know atheists who are good people and atheists who are very evil people. Atheism is not a description of behavior...just of disbelief.
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gmoney Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 07:32 PM
Response to Reply #31
34. no, that makes them hypocrites and evil, not atheist
Religion has never been more than a tool to control the masses by promising a reward "in the afterlife" in exchange for being sheep in this life, rather than rising up and demanding their rights.

I'm not sure what kind of atheist you are if you believe that only "believers" are good people and behave in a manner consistent with the teachings of Jesus. He's purported to have had a lot of good ideas... love thy neighbor, blessed are the peacemakers, help the poor, do unto others, etc. Basically, decent human behavior... just because I don't believe he was the son of some cloud being (if he in fact existed at all) doesn't mean I disagree with these ideas.

I'd rethink this one...
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and-justice-for-all Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 07:28 PM
Response to Original message
32. I am an Atheist and we are not exempt from wrong doing...
we know this, religious fundi nuts however think they are exempt from any wrong doing.
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DU GrovelBot  Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 07:28 PM
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 07:51 PM
Response to Reply #33
37. So, GrovelBot...did you rec my thread?
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LAGC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 07:37 PM
Response to Original message
35. I've always wondered...
What those few religious elites, at the pinnacle of their respective churches, what goes on through their heads? Do they really believe in the shit they are presiding over? With all the politics and secular organizational stuff they have to administer over? Or do they just put on the facade and get drunk off the power of being in charge of it all? What does the Pope really think about God, when he is a god to so many of his followers?

Food for thought...
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 07:50 PM
Response to Reply #35
36. Some believe, and some don't, I expect.
The Pope? Who knows? I suspect he does believe in some way or another, but...in what I couldn't say.
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MindPilot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 08:03 PM
Response to Original message
38. No they are not atheists.
Edited on Fri Aug-21-09 08:09 PM by MindPilot
First off, you are perpetuating--you come right out and say it--"atheists believe in nothing" the slur that atheists are not quite as good as people who believe in god.

Atheists do not "believe in nothing"; we don't believe in gods and other supernatural stuff. An atheist has no void just waiting to be occupied my the right kind of "spirituality" as the phrase implies.


The people you describe are Christian. By anyone's measure they are Christan; they believe in one god, that jesus rose from the dead and if you ask any one of them they will tell you "I'm a Christian."

Of course their behavior is not very Christlike, and they may not measure up to that squishy standard of a "real" christian' but please do not associate their nihilistic behavior with atheism.
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